Jesus. No one wants to post on a forum where the mods are a part of a fucking social clubhouse. I know the nature of the work will always tend that way somewhat but if you can't be consistent and serious about resisting it then you're not shit.
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Jesus. No one wants to post on a forum where the mods are a part of a fucking social clubhouse. I know the nature of the work will always tend that way somewhat but if you can't be consistent and serious about resisting it then you're not shit.
God damn. They're handling this in the worse way possible.
Sneak preview:
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Disturbing how much i am almost expecting this shit to end like this at any time. The latest developments have not been promising, not at all.
I'm suddenly flashing back to the phrase "banned for the hack reason". (Or at least, I'd thought it was "hacking".)
In any case: good to see one unban made.
Since there are some mods who still don't understand what has happened from our perspective, I'll recap:
1) A mod (potentially multiple mods) decides to post hateful content about asexual people in a Mod discord
2) Ketkat hears about it
3) Ketkat makes a post alluding that she knows this, without revealing who the individuals in question are
4) Ketkat is permabanned by the mods, for reasons ranging from "Abusing her personal relationship" to (as Royalan claimed) hacking.
Now we have a mod claiming that Ketkat hearing about these allegedly hateful comments made by staff is "snooping".
Edit: I am happy that Papa has been unbanned. They never deserved it in the first place. Now please, unban Ketkat and Brock.
Edit 2: My original post said that Ketkat heard from Robin, but I've been informed that this was wrong. I'm sorry for the confusion.
1) A mod (potentially multiple mods) decides to post hateful content about asexual people in a Mod discord
2) Ketkat hears about it
3) Ketkat makes a post alluding that she knows this, without revealing who the individuals in question are
4) Ketkat is permabanned by the mods, for reasons ranging from "Abusing her personal relationship" to (as Royalan claimed) hacking.
Now we have a mod claiming that Ketkat hearing about these allegedly hateful comments made by staff is "snooping".
Edit: I am happy that Papa has been unbanned. They never deserved it in the first place. Now please, unban Ketkat and Brock.
Edit 2: My original post said that Ketkat heard from Robin, but I've been informed that this was wrong. I'm sorry for the confusion.
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Wonder how said person who claimed it was snooping feels about a certain whistleblower case happening right now ... or Watergate <_< like seriously if ya didnt have dirty laundry ya wouldnt need to feel like you were snooped.
Do we even know (I'm asking as you seem to know more than I do?) that point 2 is true for this thing and not just a reasonable assumption? Cause at least in what's posted publicly her wording alone didn't even make it clear that this specific thing was from Robin, and I don't remember Robin saying it either, though I may have missed it.
But otherwise, yeah, that's it. Completely inconsistent claims, even after the time when staff should have discussed it. And at the start, mixing in claims that she knew other more normal moderation-related stuff as if that confirms this specific alleged privacy breach.
To my understanding, it might not even have been Robin, no, it could have been anybody that was made uncomfortable by the acephobic discourse.
I thought I remembered hearing it was Robin who told her, but I was wrong. I've edited my post to reflect that.
Yeah, that was probably some people speculating that it was a more reasonable explanation for how she heard about some stuff. Which... has included me!
So sorry if that confused anything, and thanks for keeping a clear timeline to show people.
Unbanning Papa shows that someone is listening; but Ketkat and Brock still need to be unbanned. I get that the official statement from the staff is still coming, but the lack of any answer to the simple question of "will they be unbanned?" is certainly worrying.
Was really hoping they'd both be unbanned by now, but yeah. I mean I'm not surprised, but hope rings infernal :')
Hop to it, k. Everyone here has been beyond patient...
Hop to it, k. Everyone here has been beyond patient...
Language is weird. What some people may call snooping, others may call social engineering, or social hacking. Having access (eyes-on or not) to a channel you haven't been given permission to access could be any of these three, depending upon who you ask.
Which is a roundabout way of saying "snooping" and "hacking" may refer to the same thing, just named differently.
Which is a roundabout way of saying "snooping" and "hacking" may refer to the same thing, just named differently.
ScribbleD should be allowed back too. Since he started that thread that got locked and kind of set this whole thing into motion by forcing the mods to acknowledge the situation.
Thanks. And I'm all caught upon the thread now, and hoo boy did things escalate since I asked about what I initially thought was some sort of in-joke.
Free KetKat and, as always, trans rights are human rights.
The idea that either of these are "hacking", and deserve a permanent ban, is ridiculous to me. The fact that we have a mod who still supports Ketkat being permed over this shows, at least to me, that there's some over there who still believe that their right to espouse hateful views in private is more important than our community feeling safe. That mods with a bias against members of the LGBT community should be allowed to police it. It's disappointing.
But the fact that Papa was unbanned does give me a bit of hope. Maybe they will do the right thing, and honestly work to rebuild trust and change for the better. Not all of them are bad, and I hope there are more who understand us than otherwise.
The owner of ResetEra himself, Cerium, already made a statement on KetKat about 6ish days ago. Meaning I highly doubt anyone else on staff is going to make a statement about KetKat and go against him. At this point, we're surely waiting for him.
Basically social engineering, but used by people who don't really know the term social engineering, but know it's to do with hacking (because social engineering is part of the hacking skillset). I've seen it used, though maybe it's just me on that one.
It is a real phrase, fwiw. But I don't think it's very fitting here, nor do I think anyone who said "hacking" here intended to say that!
Holy shit- I remember reading the back half of Robin's second post there, but not the first part. Huh.
Watch out, someone might take this seriously if Yukiko's ban is anything to go by.
Ah, no, I just remembered google exists and social hacking has it's own wikipedia page so yeah it's a thing. Wikipedia makes it sound like social hacking is about impersonation, while social engineering is more about manipulation.
More on topic, Ketkat doesn't seem like the type of person to do either of those things judging by her many posts on this forum.
I love myself too much to subject myself to David Cage :P
Yeah, I'll say here that I wasn't making a determination of Ketkat's character or actions, just that the changing reasons for her ban may be perfectly valid, just it's different mods talking at different times, and there's a language thing going on. :)
i almost subjected myself to it during a particular depressive episode around late august/early september, but thankfully i managed to find a job which helped to break me out of it
I just wanna say that I'm happy that these threads full of criticism were re-opened, several mods have been mediating and listening, and a couple bans have been repealed. These are the exact actions that I never saw here or the last place, which always made me feel uneasy about the moderation. There's more to be done, and I really liked what someone mentioned about how it's done at SomethingAwful with all bans and reasoning logged and a thread to discuss grievances, but it's cool that anything at all has happened.
I also totally understand those who are incredulous that there will be permanent change. Hoping for the best, in any case.
I also totally understand those who are incredulous that there will be permanent change. Hoping for the best, in any case.
The fact that Papa's been brought back but Ketkat and Brock are still banned only makes it looks worse IMO.
I agree, and in fact speaking from the angle where she were, it would make the mod silence very damning considering how much it sounds like many vulnerable forum members have told her things in confidence.