It's time for straight men to step up and support their fellow queer gamers. (see staff post)

[Hours Left]

I'm gonna try and keep this relatively short and to the point. The queer community needs our straight allies, straight men in particular, to get off the sidelines and help make some noise to help get better, and more consistent, content for queer gamers. This topic is partially inspired by the current debacle surrounding Fire Emblem: Three Houses, and their very poor handling of queer content, particularly queer male content, (there are also issues surrounding the female same sex content as well) but in reality, it's obviously a much larger issue that plagues the entire medium. It's not enough for our straight friends just to be not homophobic, you must be anti-homophobic, ie. we need you to get involved in helping us fight for fair treatment and worthwhile, not token, content in games.

Some might be thinking, "why is this such a big deal?" or "I don't even care about romantic/sexuality focused content in gaming!", and in that case, congratulations on this entirely unique and worthwhile contribution to the issue at hand. Otherwise, most people with an ounce of empathy will realize that queer gamers get shit on with routine frequency. This is not acceptable. It needs to change. Queer people deserve to experience the entire spectrum of content in gaming, from the stark and serious, to the frivolous and joyful, all without having to constantly beg, bargain, and/or blast developers for their continued failure to do right by us. The waiting is over, the being told to be content with scraps is over.

So that's about it. I know people don't need an entire dissertation on why this is important. Things must change, and we all have to do our part to make it happen. And if any other queer gamers want to use this topic to talk about your experiences, please feel free to do so.

Say something. Do something. Be a true ally.

 

[EvilChameleon]

Am I wrong in thinking it's mostly Eastern-developed games that seem reluctant or show an outright refusal to include same-sex marriage in their games?

 

[Raccoon]

Say something.

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alright.

it's unacceptable that same-sex relationships are either overlooked in video games or are relegated to largely gimmick and bordering on comedic endeavors like dream daddy.

Do something.

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if I make a narrative-oriented video game, there will be some serious and significant LGBTQ characters.

Be a true ally.

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I'll get back to you once I've made that game, but for now all I've done is make a forum post

 

[TheInfinityGauntlet]

Am I wrong in thinking it's mostly Eastern-developed games that seem reluctant or show an outright refusal to include same-sex marriage in their games?

Click to shrink...

You're not, it's not *not* a problem Westways too but it's definitely moreso a problem over there where there hasn't been nearly as much advancement

 

[Stormus]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

 

[Hours Left]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

How can someone possibly be so ignorant?

I'm guessing this is a burner account. Thanks for being an asshole.

 

[The Struggler]

I already do!

 

[Deleted member 1185]

I consider myself an ally but I dont really do anything other than vocalize my support when the topic comes up

What is a real tangible thing I can do to make a difference?

 

[Velocity:Design:Comfort]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

It's unbelievably ironic this post would have a cd project red related avatar. And incredibly totally utterly tone deaf.

 

[Chettlar]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

Really dude?

 

[MonsterMech]

I try to speak out and defend people when I can. Sometimes it's easy to ignore hate and bigotry when you yourself are not the target.

 

[Biestmann]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

You'd be hard-pressed to find many examples of homosexuality in gaming to begin with. Doubt you ever gave that much thought though.

 

[bitsykibbles]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

This really isn't contributing to the thread and almost comes across like an attack... Lol wtf?

 

[ClickyCal']

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

Obvious burner account

 

[Deleted member 48897]

27 eh

 

[apocat]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

Well that's a take.

Not a very good one, mind.

 

[Artorias]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

What is this GameFAQs tier nonsense?

 

[btkadams]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

How about Persona 5? The only gay characters are portrayed as predatory rapists.

 

[Raccoon]

imagine asking for receipts in a thread like this

 

[Stormus]

You'd be hard-pressed to find many examples of homosexuality in gaming to begin with. Doubt you ever gave that much thought though.

Click to shrink...

Dragon Age franchise, Mass Effect franchise, The Last of Us, Most of the Assassins's Creed franchise, Borderlands 2, Dragon Age franchise, GTA franchise... this is off the top of my head.

 

[KartuneDX]

Genuine question specifically re: Fire Emblem, is the issue more so the lack of parity between male and female romances? Because as far as I can tell they're not excluding any same-sex orientations, only limiting the options for guys.

I guess I can see that being an issue but when there's still representation across the board is that really an issue?

 

[Fat4all]

How about Persona 5? The only gay characters are portrayed as predatory rapists.

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OH WHAT SO TWO GAMES

JEEZ ERA, STOP ACTING LIKE A VICTIM

 

[Deleted member 249]

I've been arguing for non token representation of queer romances in video games since forever. Even most of the lauded examples such as Life is Strange (female gay romance, I know, but still relevant to the topic on hand) feel like they are pandering more than anything.

Progress is being made, but it's still not anywhere close to enough. A day will come when any game depicting romance and sexuality will depict the full spectrum of it, not just the heteronormative.

 

[Deleted member 28461]

Dont let a shitty little coward burner derail the thread.

 

[Hours Left]

Genuine question specifically re: Fire Emblem, is the issue more so the lack of parity between male and female romances? Because as far as I can tell they're not excluding any same-sex orientations, only limiting the options for guys.

I guess I can see that being an issue but when there's still representation across the board is that really an issue?

Click to shrink...

You should read the topic I linked in the OP if you want further info on that. It contains spoilers, but the problem goes beyond just the amount (which is an issue itself), but also how certain aspects are handled, including baiting and hetero normative swerve endings.

 

[Yasuke]

Dragon Age franchise, Mass Effect franchise, The Last of Us, Most of the Assassins's Creed franchise, Borderlands 2, Dragon Age franchise, GTA franchise... this is off the top of my head.

Click to shrink...

Do you have any idea how many games exist?

 

[MayorSquirtle]

Genuine question specifically re: Fire Emblem, is the issue more so the lack of parity between male and female romances? Because as far as I can tell they're not excluding any same-sex orientations, only limiting the options for guys.

I guess I can see that being an issue but when there's still representation across the board is that really an issue?

Click to shrink...

Option for guys. Singular. So it's not really an option at all, is it?

 

[Siggy-P]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

Obvious burner attempt aside, I actually this is a useful post.

What we se here in this above post is a prime example of what the OP is on about.

We have a vague attempt to deflect the inference that an issue exists, yet no counter examples, rather a quick jump to parrot a cookie cutter "don't be a victim" response.

The number of homosexual male characters that don't exist in a Bioware RPG as some random side content is almost non-existant.

And in fact those games faced pushback for introducing gay male options from the same sort of people that say "don't be a victim".

What's interesting is that in most games the characters love life doesn't matter, yet is still made a point of. Usually a focus even in order to create a unique characterisation and focus point.

Now Witcher differs as it includes the romances as part of the plots. Yet, most Witcher players are factually never gonna hang as many women as Geralt. That's just the truth. Even the actor playing him in the Netflix show Mr Caville hismelf has been open about his struggles in the dating world.

And yet, players have no problem engaging in the not real and absurd romantic pursuits, or even having the characters not real pursuits presented as background lore, of the Mr Geralt of Rivia.


With that in mind, in a future hypothetical game series were Mr McSoldierman fights the aliens or corporation goons or non-descript insurgent forces, does it really make a difference to his struggle against evil what the person waiting for him at home is like physically?

No.

 

[YaBish]

I try and defend representation IRL and online whenever I can. I also try and vote with my wallet when I become aware of issues with games. But as someone who refuses to engage in most social media platforms, I'm unsure of what else I can do or what you're asking of me.

 

[Hours Left]

Do you have any idea how many games exist?

Click to shrink...

And also, the majority of those games they listed have well documented problems with their queer portrayals.

 

[BoxManLocke]

Things are getting slowly better. Keep praising and giving visibility to games that introduce realistic and relatable LGBT characters, keep calling out stereotypes and stuff that's only meant to titillate male gamers, demand frequent representation from supposedly traditional genres/developers (one example among many others being Nintendo), and most importantly support our fellow queer gamers when they want to come forward and listen to what they have to say, because their feedback is what's most important. The majority of LGBT-related content in videogames nowadays still feels like it's being made by rather ignorant straight people.

 

[Pirate Bae]

Genuine question specifically re: Fire Emblem, is the issue more so the lack of parity between male and female romances? Because as far as I can tell they're not excluding any same-sex orientations, only limiting the options for guys.

I guess I can see that being an issue but when there's still representation across the board is that really an issue?

Click to shrink...

Just because there IS representation doesn't make it positive or well-done representation.

 

[Saucycarpdog]

While games like Saints Row, Dragon Age, and Assassins Creed give you the option to be in homosexual relationships, it isn't a substitute for real LGBTQ representation. The industry needs real LGTBQ characters who weren't created in a menu.

Here is some links to games with those themes:

Life is Strange Franchise
Night in the Woods
Read Only Memories

 

[Gradon]

Make every character ever gay. 👏👏👏

Shoutout to Gregg and Angus for being my favourite gay couple.

The Fire Emblem stuff is a huge shame after reading about it. :( I'm not really into the series too much as I've only played Fates but I was considering getting Three Houses.

 

[Titik]

So, I'm going for you to need for you to provide more than one example of what is wrong with homosexuality portrayal in gaming. It seems like you've found one example of homosexuality being botched and have cast that view over the entire gaming community. Stop being a victim.

Click to shrink...

The fact that the OP can find one example is exactly a point in itself. There's not enough representation in the first place and the few that does exist relegates me and my fellow LGBT folks into punchlines.

 

[Siggy-P]

Genuine question specifically re: Fire Emblem, is the issue more so the lack of parity between male and female romances? Because as far as I can tell they're not excluding any same-sex orientations, only limiting the options for guys.

I guess I can see that being an issue but when there's still representation across the board is that really an issue?

Click to shrink...

Yes, the issue is indeed that the gay male stuff is done bad.

 

[SweetBellic]

I'm all for queer representation in gaming. Not sure what more you would want for me as an ally as "say something" and "do something" are vague, unhelpful suggestions. I'll happily sign any petitions supporting the representation of queer romance in any game I have some interest in at least.

Not exactly romance, but I always thought it'd be cool if you could pick up male prostitutes in GTA, though that seems like a problematic thing to petition for lol.

 

[timedesk]

The industry is still struggling to really provide positive representation for lgbtq+ players. There are very few "cannon" queer leads, and in games that provide romantic options for players, there is a tendency to underserve gay and bisexual male options.

Even games that try to really provide positive options for a range of sexual preferences can wind up making thoughtless and harmful decisions. Assassin's Creed Odyssey is a great example. It was a game that gave a solid effort at representation, and then with DLC just kind of insulted everyone who had enjoyed anything other than a hetero romance.

The industry, hell the medium, could be so much better than it is. This is a narrative format that invites players to inhabit and experience the perspectives of its main characters in a way few others can. It could be used as a tool to have people see stories from different perspectives, to invite players to have empathy. Representation can only help gaming, and I want to hope that people calling out shallow and weak examples of it will only help propel it to be better.

 

[Hours Left]

I'm all for queer representation in gaming. Not sure what more you would want for me as an ally as "say something" and "do something" are vague, unhelpful suggestions. I'll happily sign any petitions supporting the representation of queer romance in any game I have some interest in at least.

Not exactly romance, but I always thought it'd be cool if you could pick up male prostitutes in GTA, though that seems like a problematic thing to petition for lol.

Click to shrink...

If you need to be told an exact action to take, you're not giving it nearly enough thought.

 

[Aske]

I try and defend representation IRL and online whenever I can. I also try and vote with my wallet when I become aware of issues with games. But as someone who refuses to engage in most social media platforms, I'm unsure of what else I can do or what you're asking of me.

Click to shrink...

I know that feel. The "I want to be a good ally, and I'll stand up to ignorance and scumbaggery, but I don't use Twitter or Instagram, and I'm painfully aware that having good opinions in my brain isn't especially helpful."

 

[BossLackey]

As someone else pointed out, it seems that Japanese game makers handle gay characters particularly poorly.

I'd say the best is western indies, but it's not something I really look out for I suppose.

 

[Deleted member 249]

If you need to be told an exact action to take, you're not giving it nearly enough thought.

Click to shrink...

I feel like people are just confused about the call to action in the OP, that's all. I would venture to guess that most people in this thread, and on this board, are sympathetic to queer representation, and obviously want to do what they can to help. Your OP is raising awareness of the problem, which is fantastic, and it is calling for action, which I think we can all agree with. But it stops short of articulating anything exact or tangible people can do to help, and they're just asking for clarity on that front.

 

[milkyway]

Unlikely to see progress in games where in the most LGBT-friendly countries it's still pretty much a coin-flip of tolerance. I do think that talking about it helps and letting developers know that both LGBT people and allies exist and care about what they put (and don't put) in their games.

 

[Apollo]

I've only known I was trans for around a year now (came out to myself last July but I don't remember the exact date). I always knew that something was very wrong before that point, but still, I feel like this queer identity I've found myself with is a new thing. Even so, it's so very important to me. Being able to be excited about myself for the first time in so long is deeply meaningful. Every day is hard, but I find myself feeling like there might be a light at the end of the tunnel.

And yet, for all of the good things this self discovery has brought me, I find myself more and more cognizant of many of the shitty things happening in games. The recent Cyberpunk trans controversy in particular was difficult for me, largely thanks to the tremendous lack of support by Era posters for the trans posters speaking out against it.

In Fire Emblem, I've been sooooo excited to finally be able to play as a girl, not feel guilty about it and also not have to be forced into yet another a het relationship that, I'm sorry, but I just can't identify with. And while my options may be okay for me (I guess...), my queer brothers have found themselves handed the most paltry of table scraps. This is not okay. I've come to know what it's like to hope against hope to be seen in games. It does not feel good.

I felt alone during the Cyberpunk deal. Please don't let people feel alone this time.

 

[Hours Left]

I feel like people are just confused about the call to action in the OP, that's all. I would venture to guess that most people in this thread, and on this board, are sympathetic to queer representation, and obviously want to do what they can to help. Your OP is raising awareness of the problem, which is fantastic, and it is calling for action, which I think we can all agree with. But it stops short of articulating anything exact or tangible people can do to help, and they're just asking for clarity on that front.

Click to shrink...

Emails, tweets, phone calls, talking to fellow gamers, contacting gaming media, using social media, voting with your wallet, etc.

If something is important to a person, they shouldn't need to have their hand held in trying to make a difference. If they can't figure out anything independently, can someone really claim they find it to be important? Apathy is not an excuse. This topic is not for excuses.

 

[Raonak]

It sucks that FE has so much ignorance around the subject. But Im doing all i realistically can.

Its a franchise i dont care about, on a platform i dont have.
Im defacto boycotting it.

 

[Omegamon]

I know there are some game journalists in this forum, maybe they could write articles about the lack of representation in FE 3H and other games

 

[Deleted member 249]

Emails, tweets, phone calls, talking to fellow gamers, contacting gaming media, using social media, voting with your wallet, etc.

If something is important to a person, they shouldn't need to have their hand held in trying to make a difference. If you can't figure out anything independently, can someone really claim they find it to be important? Apathy is not an excuse. This topic is not for excuses.

Click to shrink...

I think the bolded is what people are looking for. I would put that in the OP as well.
I don't think people are apathetic, especially not the ones who are coming into this thread to show their support (a couple of obvious trolls aside). But a lot of times, people can find an issue so big they don't know where to begin. Asking for guidance on where to start is not making excuses. They do want to help. A little nudge in the right direction, like in this post, is enough to get them started.

I 100% agree that the representation of gay romances in any media, let alone just video games, is severely lacking and ignorant, and I feel we need something more nuanced. I am sure others agree with me. But you are asking them to do something about it, they're just asking you where to begin. That answer you just articulated should be enough, I hope.

 

[Governergrimm]

Just because there IS representation doesn't make it positive or well-done representation.

Click to shrink...

See women in games.

There are so many races, religions, and sexual orientations that are represented poorly in video games. I do argue against misrepresentation where possible.

Sometimes though there are developers who have enough sway that gamers ignore their stance because reasons. Thankfully people complain about it but they are frequently drowned out.

Long and short I feel like it's getting better but moving at a glacial pace. I am a straight male and try to be morally concious when buying games.

I consider myself an ally but I dont really do anything other than vocalize my support when the topic comes up

What is a real tangible thing I can do to make a difference?

Click to shrink...

This.

I want to support you meaningfully not just passively on a message board.

 

[SweetBellic]

If you need to be told an exact action to take, you're not giving it nearly enough thought.

Click to shrink...

I don't think it's unreasonable to ask how I can help. I'm but one man with one wallet and one ERA account with limited free time and no social media presence or pull. Besides being sympathetic and occasionally chiming into threads, I'm not sure what I can reasonably and efficaciously do to combat systemic homophobia as it pertains to this medium. Sorry if that makes me useless to you as an ally.