It is going to be rough to play Switch Games at sub-30fps now that XBox and PlayStation push for 60-120fps

[HeroR]

And last year it was Fire Emblem, Link's Awakening, and Pokemon -- all which had frame dips and slowdown out the ass. Pokemon was especially egregious. If a ton of first party Sony, Xbox, or ANY publisher was consistently releasing titles in their big IPs with these issues they'd be getting flamed for it. Ubisoft already does.

AoC and XBCDE is more than just "kinks," too. Hell, ACNH isn't a looker by any stretch and still has significant FPS drops on a busy island.

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And all of them weren't made directly by Nintendo. Also for three games you had Mario Maker 2, Astral Chain, LM3, and DQ11 which Nintendo did publish.

The point is, most of Nintendo's games run fine. It isn't like Nintendo's game quality took a dip.

Have you played ACNH? The game is a looker, it just isn't as apparent as other game and the frame dips only happens after you deck your island or are online, which is common in almost all games that gives you created control.

 

[Ovvv]

And all of them weren't made directly by Nintendo. Also for three games you had Mario Maker 2, Astral Chain, LM3, and DQ11 which Nintendo did publish.

The point is, most of Nintendo's games run fine. It isn't like Nintendo's game quality took a dip.

Have you played ACNH? The game is a looker, it just isn't as apparent as other game and the frame dips only happens after you deck your island, which is common in almost all games that gives you created control.

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I'm not sure why them being made directly or indirectly matters when they published all three of the titles I listed. Astral Chain had significant FPS issues, too -- particularly in boss battles. File 8 was particularly absurd for me and many others. DQ11 literally needed a special version with reduced texture quality, among other things, in order to reach that performance, which is something I've advocated for in this very thread! That's a perfect example of a well optimized title. Reduce texture/model quality if you must. Square knocked it out of the park there. How the hell is DQ11S, a game which looks a lot better than Fire Emblem, running better than Fire Emblem or freaking Sword and Shield? That shit is unacceptable.

I'm not arguing that their game quality took a dip. I'm saying a lot of their big games run poorly. Moreover, a game's quality and it running poorly can be two independent things. They're not always tied to one another. A great game can run like shit and a bad game can run great. Games can also do both -- they do that all the time. Nintendo has accomplished it before, too. They still do sometimes.

Not gonna get into a subjective argument about whether or not ACNH is a looker or not. The game has issues on a busy island, which is what I stated in the post you quoted.

 

[HeroR]

I'm not sure why them being made directly or indirectly matters when they published all three of the titles I listed. Astral Chain had significant FPS issues, too -- particularly in boss battles. File 8 was particularly absurd for me and many others. DQ11 literally needed a special version with reduced texture quality, among other things, in order to reach that performance, which is something I've advocated for in this very thread! That's a perfect example of a well optimized title. Reduce texture/model quality if you must. Square knocked it out of the park there. How the hell is DQ11S, a game which looks a lot better than Fire Emblem, running better than Fire Emblem or freaking Sword and Shield? That shit is unacceptable.

I'm not arguing that their game quality took a dip. I'm saying a lot of their big games run poorly. Moreover, a game's quality and it running poorly can be two independent things. They're not always tied to one another. A great game can run like shit and a bad game can run great. Games can also do both -- they do that all the time. Nintendo has accomplished it before, too. They still do sometimes.

Not gonna get into a subjective argument about whether or not ACNH is a looker or not. The game has issues on a busy island, which is what I stated in the post you quoted.

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It makes a difference since it isn't 'Nintendo' making them. Game Freak has always been infamous for their subpar performance since the original Game Boy and Koei Tecmo is also infamous for their terrible frame rate where their DW games runs like crap on PS4 and Xbox One. It's no difference than blaming Sony for Bloodborne crappy frame rate when the blame is on From.

In parts Astral Chain struggled, but it was for the most part a stable experience as DF tested. DQ was a great showing of Enix willing to rebuild their game over doing a dirty port.

You named a handful of games and blanked it their games run poorly, which ignores the dozen other games Nintendo public in a year than runs fine.

You're the one who said ACNH isn't a looker, which objectively speaking isn't true. The reason why the dips happened is because ACNH is a texting game despite its simple appearance.

 

[Ovvv]

It makes a difference since it isn't 'Nintendo' making them. Game Freak has always been infamous for their subpar performance since the original Game Boy and Koei Tecmo is also infamous for their terrible frame rate where their DW games runs like crap on PS4 and Xbox One. It's no difference than blaming Sony for Bloodborne crappy frame rate when the blame is on From.

In parts Astral Chain struggled, but it was for the most part a stable experience as DF tested. DQ was a great showing of Enix willing to rebuild their game over doing a dirty port.

You named a handful of games and blanked it their games run poorly, which ignores the dozen other games Nintendo public in a year than runs fine.

You're the one who said ACNH isn't a looker, which objectively speaking isn't true. The reason why the dips happened is because ACNH is a texting game despite its simple appearance.

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Bloodborne's crappy frame rate is on Sony, though? Sony Japan literally worked with them on it and did a lot of the groundwork. They absolutely share blame there. That game gets a ton of shit for it, too. Certainly doesn't have people defending its poor performance the way we've seen defense of say, Breath of the Wild's performance issues.

I didn't say every single Nintendo title runs poorly. I said it's a common theme. And it is. Frequently, their large titles run poorly. There are others that run great. This is exactly what I mean. No other publisher gets this kind of slack. No one is like, "Assassin's Creed Valhalla suffers from screen tearing, but X, Y, Z Ubisoft game runs fine, so it's OK!"

A game cannot "objectively" be a looker. That doesn't even make sense lol.

 

[coconut gun]

no its not lol

 

[Twister]

Nah, most people don't care. To be honest I don't even see much of a difference between Age of Calamity and my PS5

 

[Twister]

Why would you bother buying a game on switch if you can get it on a far better console and have a better experience. If you want portability you might get away with xcloud or remote play.

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You like the ecosystem, the act of owning your games but having the portably, you like the co-op features of the joycons, etc.
Switch is my primary platform and I own a PS5 and PC. I just like it better.

 

[BasilZero]

Not a problem for me.

I've been playing games 60 FPS and higher for almost a decade now and going back to 30 FPS is no issue for me despite preferring 60 FPS.

Also I dont expect PS5/XSX to have consistent 60+ FPS support in the future.

 

[mindatlarge]

No, not really. I know what I'm gonna get when I turn on my Switch, PS4, PS5...etc.

 

[Deleted member 79517]

I've never been bothered by 30 or even sub-30 FPS. 60 is nice, but I've never had a bad experience with a game because it wasn't 60.

 

[HeroR]

Bloodborne's crappy frame rate is on Sony, though? Sony Japan literally worked with them on it and did a lot of the groundwork. They absolutely share blame there. That game gets a ton of shit for it, too. Certainly doesn't have people defending its poor performance the way we've seen defense of say, Breath of the Wild's performance issues.

I didn't say every single Nintendo title runs poorly. I said it's a common theme. And it is. Frequently, their large titles run poorly. There are others that run great. This is exactly what I mean. No other publisher gets this kind of slack. No one is like, "Assassin's Creed Valhalla suffers from screen tearing, but X, Y, Z Ubisoft game runs fine, so it's OK!"

A game cannot "objectively" be a looker. That doesn't even make sense lol.

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Actually it can. Like I hate the style of Days Gone, but it is a pretty game giving what it's doing.

And honestly, we should blame and praise the people who make the game instead of putting everything on the publisher. Also most of Breath of the Wild's performance has to do with how ambitious the game was with it building a whi new engine and it's a Wii U game that pushed that system to its limits and wasn't build with the Switch in mind. Which is why people are more forgiving with its issues.

 

[Apopheniac]

Would you say it's reasonable to expect good performance independent of any comparisons with a stationary device, particularly with titles exclusively on that battery-powered platform? Because the Switch falters plenty with that, too. What is the reasoning behind Switch exclusive titles performing like ass? Maybe the titles should be better optimized for that system so that the performance isn't so... bad?

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"optimizing" doesn't wholly compensate for the inherent limitations of the hardware and people complain regardless of whatever trade-offs are made, whether that's dynamic resolution in favor of a stable framerate or decreasing the scope of games made for the platform. if you don't like owning a portable and having to deal with these inherent limitations, there's good news: other companies produce stationary boxes that do not have the same limitations as the Switch

 

[giallo]

The struggle has been real well before the PS5 and XSX. Hyrule Warriors looks like a fun game, but the frame rate on the demo was just......ugh. Ruins the experience for me. Exclusives like Daemon X Machina, Astral Chain and TLOZ: Link's Awakening were really rough as well. For me, the biggest revelation for the Switch performance-wise has been Control, but that's all because it's streaming.

The Switch is at its best when Nintendo is making games that run at 60fps. That and all of the indie and retro games that are available on the system. I don't go near the third party AAA offerings on the Switch.

 

[base_two]

Feelings are really going to be hurt when the cross gen games stop and most AAA titles can't lock to 60. We are seeing signs that this is exactly what's going to happen now, so I suggest people get their expectations in check.

 

[dadoes]

No but Nintendo's recent output has been horrendous in terms of performance.



Games with low framerates are less enjoyable than games at higher framerates. So it will be less enjoyable for me to go back to outdated 30fps on Switch while I'm getting used to swing through New York City at smooth 60 or roam through the Borderlands at even smoother 120.

Paper Mario is actually a good example for a recent Nintendo game with lacking performance. It only runs at 30 which is laughable considering its looks. I feel like Nintendo has given up on 60fps. Even Pikmin 3 runs at 30.

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Fully agree with you.

At one point nintendo cared about quality and performance.

Their standards have certainly dropped massively in 2020.

 

[shadow2810]

It will be fine. I have been playing 60fps+ games for years and I have no issue going back to console games

 

[Qikz]

Nah, we PC gamers played console games for generations

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This and also I remember last gen being told over and over again 60fps doesn't matter so I'm not sure why it suddenly matters now!

 

[Le Dude]

This and also I remember last gen being told over and over again 60fps doesn't matter so I'm not sure why it suddenly matters now!

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Yeah the sudden obsession with frame rates is weird to me. People said for years that 30fps was fine and 60fps . . . And especially higher frame rates, were unnoticeable.

Now there's people saying playing games at 60fps makes it feel like an entirely new game?

I've been playing games at 144hz on PC and use Switch as a side console and it's fine.

 

[PonyStation]

It's a handheld... A device that's as big as iPhone 12 Max. I don't think there's an affordable alternative in similar size that could have better better performance for those games right now. If something comes out, it'll be from Nintendo again.

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Switch is 4" longer, Switch lite is 2". That's a massive difference

You're pretty much arguing that the Regular Switch and Switch Lite are almost the same size

 

[Mukrab]

Yeah the sudden obsession with frame rates is weird to me. People said for years that 30fps was fine and 60fps . . . And especially higher frame rates, were unnoticeable.

Now there's people saying playing games at 60fps makes it feel like an entirely new game?

I've been playing games at 144hz on PC and use Switch as a side console and it's fine.

Click to shrink...

standards change? We played sub HD for decades, doesn't mean we would now.

 

[LuigiMario]

It's a handheld gaming console

 

[Cloud-Strife]

It's a handheld gaming console

Click to shrink...

 

[prodyg]

i already find Hyrule warriors unplayable. I agree op

 

[Telamon]

Luigi's Mansion 3 didn't feel in the slightest bit sluggish and I wouldn't sacrifice anything from such a near perfect game for fucking 60fps. It's not exactly twitch gameplay for christ's sake.

I'm sure Nintendo will be much more bothered about SSDs and the short load times they afford (something they've actually cared about over the years) over 30 vs 60fps. That's something I'll be interested to see how they respond to, no way they'll be happy being the slowest loading system out there.

 

[TaterTots]

Probably wont be as bad as you think. I've been playing PC for a long time now and still played on consoles that achieved 30fps. You get use to it.

 

[Ra]

30fps has been "rough to play" since the PS3 and 360 launched.

I'm glad people are finally finding salvation.

 

[qrac]

I've played games with 100fps 20 years ago on PC (CRTs were great!). Was never roguh to play whatever consoles that were released since then till today. :)

Also I'm pretty sure there will be high end exclusives that will be 30fps for the new consoles down the line.

 

[Le Dude]

standards change? We played sub HD for decades, doesn't mean we would now.

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Well, going by handheld standards switch is way ahead of previous generations.

Plus we're not even remotely far enough into the new generation to declare that standard frame rate has changed. And Switch has some 60fps games.

 

[Mukrab]

Well, going by handheld standards switch is way ahead of previous generations.

Plus we're not even remotely far enough into the new generation to declare that standard frame rate has changed. And Switch has some 60fps games.

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Not everyone uses the switch as a handheld. OP might not, and you can say whats the point of a switch if not for hanheld but its not like we have another option. If im playing a nintendo exclusives i need to play it on the switch, and im not gonna play in handheld.

 

[UltraMagnus]

There will be plenty of PS5/XBSX games that don't hit 60 fps. If you want the best performance, buy a PC with a 3080/3090.

Switch Plus model will probably provide a performance boost that allows most of the games that struggle performance wise to run at 30 fps, but you can't seriously expect a system with a 11 watt roof to perform miracles every time. Lets cut the PS5 to even 100 watts and it would be in a world of trouble.

If anything I don't think it's a big deal because art style has taken more importance as technology has improved.

The Wii/DS to 360/PS3 gap felt a lot bigger to me. I don't look at the BOTW2 trailer and go "oh it's soooo dated" at all. I can play all the PS5 or PC with 3080 GPU I want, that trailer will still look very nice.

 

[60fps]

Yeah the sudden obsession with frame rates is weird to me. People said for years that 30fps was fine and 60fps . . . And especially higher frame rates, were unnoticeable.

Now there's people saying playing games at 60fps makes it feel like an entirely new game?

I've been playing games at 144hz on PC and use Switch as a side console and it's fine.

Click to shrink...

I never said 30fps was fine. And yes, 60 makes it feel like a completely new game. Look at my freaking username.

Not everyone uses the switch as a handheld. OP might not, and you can say whats the point of a switch if not for hanheld but its not like we have another option. If im playing a nintendo exclusives i need to play it on the switch, and im not gonna play in handheld.

Click to shrink...

Exactly, thank you.

Luigi's Mansion 3 didn't feel in the slightest bit sluggish and I wouldn't sacrifice anything from such a near perfect game for fucking 60fps. It's not exactly twitch gameplay for christ's sake.

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It feels very sluggish to me.

People expect their phones to run at 60Hz/fps minimum (even if they don't know the technical difference, they can *feel* it). Do they need it for twitch gameplay? No. But 30 feels sluggish. There is a reason phones settle for 60 as the baseline.

I don't think it's too much to ask for a framerate of 60 in videogames in the year 2020/21.

With this take of "less is fine" we would still be playing in 240p.

 

[Spinluck]

People with a Switch generally don't care about this.

 

[UltraMagnus]

It's going to be funny when the Switch version of Cyberpunk 2077 via cloud has ray-tracing and the PS5/XBS versions don't.

 

[darz1]

Short answer: no
Long answer: no
Actual answer: I can go back and enjoy NES games. I think I'll be fine and the portability of the switch makes it my console of choice for most of my gaming.

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But can you go back and enjoy N64 games?

 

[daninthemix]

There's good and bad 30fps. Ghost of Tsushima is responsive and fluid while Days Gone feels laggy and mired in mud, for example.

There's also bad 60fps.

 

[Vir]

I though the same but I'm having a great time playing the new Hyrule Warriors game and its all good, that said if I jump from a 120 FPS game or even a 60 FPS game it's jarring.

 

[cw_sasuke]

People with a Switch generally don't care about this.

Click to shrink...

That's not really true but at the same time the OP and some other poster are painting a picture of every Nintendo game or Switch game in general running with some subpar Framerate - which also isn't true.

Look at the top sellers on Switch physical or digital - most of them run and perform great in Switch, saying that customers don't care about good looking it perming titles is wrong. They might just not care as much as some of the so called hardcore gamer crowd on boards like ERA.

These games wouldn't perform as well they do if customers were irgendwie by their performance. Hell even Switch as Plattform wouldn't be a thing if the performance was not able to deliver what the customers expect.

 

[Footos22]

There's good and bad 30fps. Ghost of Tsushima is responsive and fluid while Days Gone feels laggy and mired in mud, for example.

There's also bad 60fps.

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Yeah def, just loaded up PS4 Spiderman just to upload the save and it felt fine.

A good motion blur and steady frametime make a huge difference. Switching from fffv lite mode to resolution mode was absolutely rough though lol

 

[Edge]

Forget the fps, I just can't see this vaseline smeared 720p docked, 540p handheld garbage anymore.

30fps, if good implemented, isn't even a problem. I play Spider-Man with that on PS5 and you can barely notice it because of their good motion blur solution.

 

[60fps]

There's good and bad 30fps. Ghost of Tsushima is responsive and fluid while Days Gone feels laggy and mired in mud, for example.

There's also bad 60fps.

Click to shrink...

Good thing I can play both at 60 on PS5.

30 never feels good to me or my eyes.

Forget the fps, I just can't see this vaseline smeared 720p docked, 540p handheld garbage anymore.

30fps, if good implemented, isn't even a problem. I play Spider-Man with that on PS5 and you can barely notice it because of their good motion blur solution.

Click to shrink...

Lmao, I notice the 30fps as soon as I start controlling the menu cursor. 30 never looks or feels good or right to me. And yes, 720p doesn't cut it anymore either. There is a reason why the rest of the industry is moving on to 4k/60/120fps.

Just hoping Nintendo will follow rather sooner than later.

 

[Zafir]

I can tolerate if it manages to hold 30fps, but dropping past 30 is just frustrating at this point. I loaded up the new Hyrule Warriors in handheld mode yesterday since it arrived and between the fact it looked like a blurry mess as well as it not even managing to hold 30fps I put it down pretty quickly. Just one of them issues would have been enough to put me off, but both? yikes. I'd rather them drop some of the effects, how many characters are on screen or whatever else than dropping the resolution or FPS. :/

 

[Edge]

Good thing I can play both at 60 on PS5.

30 never feels good to me or my eyes.


Lmao, I notice the 30fps as soon as I start controlling the menu cursor. 30 never looks or feels good or right to me. And yes, 720p doesn't cut it anymore either. There is a reason why the rest of the industry is moving on to 4k/60/120fps.

Just hoping Nintendo will follow rather sooner than later.

Click to shrink...

I mean, in comparison, of course you notice it. I play a lot of 60 and 120fps stuff lately on next/current gen, but if it's really good implemented and rock solid, like here or in God of War and other games, you forget about it after a minute and never even think about that it's only 30fps because it feels so rock solid smooth. Motion blur can fool you hard if it's really good.

It's "Never good or right" is something I can't personally agree on, but that's where everyone is different I guess. I get way more pissed off with sub native res and can tell you on the spot in 10 seconds if a Switch game has native res or not.

 

[giapel]

But can you go back and enjoy N64 games?

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Ok, I thought about that as I was posting. Vast majority? Probably not. I'd play and enjoy the classics though, sub 30 and all.

 

[medyej]

Console gamers that for years replied PC gamers saying "60 fps isn't a big deal" now are going to keep saying 30 fps is unplayable.

Until games start being 30 fps again on consoles.

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What I love about console gamers is that they seem programmed to praise a feature once an ONLY once the console of choice gets it. I swear that high framerates were something unecessary or something pc gamers bragged about ust a couple of months ago.

The switch will be fine for a year or 2.

Click to shrink...

Same as it ever was.

 

[monali]

I do love me some 60fps games, yet here I am playing Pathologic 2 on PS4 with its shitty performance, and I don't feel bothered in the slightest.

 

[60fps]

I mean, in comparison, of course you notice it. I play a lot of 60 and 120fps stuff lately on next/current gen, but if it's really good implemented and rock solid, like here or in God of War and other games, you forget about it after a minute and never even think about that it's only 30fps because it feels so rock solid smooth. Motion blur can fool you hard if it's really good.

It's "Never good or right" is something I can't personally agree on, but that's where everyone is different I guess. I get way more pissed off with sub native res and can tell you on the spot in 10 seconds if a Switch game has native res or not.

Click to shrink...

I can tell you if a game is running at 30 or 60 just by navigating through its menu every single time. It's not like I have eagle eyes or anything, I just feel it.

I'm the guy who convinced Blizzard to add an "Aim Smoothing" slider to the consoles version of Overwatch over the course of multiple threads on their official forum.

There were lots of people claiming the controls were fine, but they were not, and I kept creating threads until a Blizzard engineer acknowledged the issue and finally added the option.

I just notice stuff like this.

 

[dadoes]

I don't get all the love for doom on the switch.

Yes they managed to get it running on the switch which is an achievement.

But it looks awful and at 30fps or less it doesn't feel very good either.

The only good thing about it is the gyro controls which were pretty good.

If all you have is a switch or want to play it at a hotel, its better then nothing I guess.

I'm more impressed at something like ori. Those guys really went above and beyond to get it running on the switch at 60fps. It still doesn't come close to the pc or console versions visually, but they put in a lot of effort which is to be applauded.

 

[Mars People]

The problem isn't that 30fps is bad.

The problem is that loads of games coming out on Switch are sub 30fps.
That is just not a good showing at all.

 

[Nostremitus]

Always has been, even on PS4.... New consoles don't change the fact that 30fps sucks...

 

[60fps]

I don't get all the love for doom on the switch.

Yes they managed to get it running on the switch which is an achievement.

But it looks awful and at 30fps or less it doesn't feel very good either.

The only good thing about it is the gyro controls which were pretty good.

If all you have is a switch or want to play it at a hotel, its better then nothing I guess.

Click to shrink...

Some people prefer portability over anything I guess.

Like you said, it's a case of "better than nothing".