Is the new God of War Awards-Bait?

[bunkitz]

Nope. People copy others all the time. You learn how to walk and talk by copying your parents, math by copying the examples your teacher gave you, and so on and so forth. Games, movies, films, they all copy from each other and get better that way. Of course, that's not to say that there aren't any more new original ideas, but copying ideas to make things better isn't new nor is it wrong. As they say, competition makes things better.

God of War, Horizon, and Zelda all learned from other games and imitated them because they inspired them. They made great games because they wanted to make great games in order to fulfill their creative desires and give fans something they'll love, not for awards.

 

[Deleted member 11262]

Oscar bait as a phrase works to describe films that are made for critics instead of for mass appeal. In addition, the films cover particular controversial topics in order to provide a sense of easy to generate depth.

God of War seems to be loved by the masses, in addition to critics, and is just a very fun game that happens to be very well made. It still retains the core functions of its predecessors but has a better story that feels like a natural evolution of the character as opposed to something that is forced. Actually, everything that the game boasts seems like a trend that the series has tried to shift towards and finally executed well. I don't think anything about it feels like something that was forced to appease critics.

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Agreed, but...

I would say that Critic Bait games are more of an indie thing. Something like Journey where it's about evoking emotion / providing artsy aesthetic while not actually being a fun game.

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Hey now, don't bring Journey into this. It's a fucking fantastic game, which offered something completely different and fresh at the time. Something you can't really take inspiration from without copying it shamelessly, something unique.

 

[black070]

Lets look at the REAL picture tho.
https://gotypicks.blogspot.com/

2017 - BOTW
2016 - UC4
2015 - TW3
2014 - Inquisition
2013 - TLOU
2012 - Walking Dead
2011 - Skyrim
2010 - RDR
2009 - UC2
2008 - Fallout 4
2007 - Bioshock
2006 - Oblivion
2005 - RE4

See a trend here?

And sales? A game like Mortal Kombat,Dota 2 or Gran Turismo could sell way more than these games and even if they get a 96+ score on Metacritic. They arent going to win the majority of awards.

Again this is not meant to say these games arent worthy. Its impossible to objectively compare games across vastly different genres. But game critics do have a preference to a certain type of games. Which is again fine , since every group of people have their biases. Just like how Era Goty picks are different.

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Whats the trend ? I'm genuinely asking.

 

[Kufkah]

I think it is the general SP gamer community. I don't think MP focused gaming communities usually participate in these.

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That's hard to gauge without proper data! Someone who spend a lot of time playing the same multiplayer game might still favor another game! Multiplayer one just have more replay value! I mean, you check SFV thread sometime, how many posters there do you think would vote for SFV in a GotY competition, they enjoy shitting on the game at every apportunity yet keep playing it?! It wasn't different in Destiny, Overwatch, Dota 2, etc... Threads!
I know I played mostly fighting games last year, but I'd still pick Nier: A for my GotY!

There's also the part where the most popular multiplayer games usually slip by in their first year and aren't qualified the next! Like: Counter Strike Go and Rainbow Six Siege were both hated in their first year! Dota 2 was an old game by the time it came out of beta! Even if you loved PUBG, it's hard to not notice that it has tones of flaws! etc...

 

[Kaiser Swayze]

No. God of War is a summer blockbuster. It's a crowd-pleaser made for maximum entertainment.

If anything, The Last Guardian would be the closest, and I would prefer to call it a prestige game because awards-bait is too cynical a term to describe it.

 

[Dan Thunder]

Words have technical definitions, but they have more important colloquial uses that trump them. People don't generally call things "awards-bait" because they have insider knowledge or a crystal ball that lets them know that the makers of a film were in fact cynically aiming for awards, they call them "awards-bait" because they see external factors like theme, setting, or acting and go from there. "Oh, it's a period piece about the rise of Hollywood? Classic Oscar-bait!" Whether or not the people making the film actually care about their work (which I imagine in the majority of cases they do) the label is still applied based on how people feel about it.

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That's a fair enough thought but I don't think it applies to games. In a linear medium like film there are certain narrative avenues that are deemed more worthy than others i.e. holocaust pieces, British period films etc. Games are by definition playable so the majority of them, even linear ones, have a little flexibility in the narrative which makes it much harder to say 'games about 'X' topic are more worthy' as there's a lot of different ways that the games are played and structured that can and will affect the player.

Certainly in GoW I can't think of anything that would qualify it as 'awards bait' by the industry or even gamers. Audio/visuals are pretty subjective so a realistic looking game isn't necessarily more award worthy than one that's cell-shaded. In terms of narrative, off the top of my head I can't really think of many other titles based of north mythology that have done well because of their setting in the past few years.

 

[Revolsin]

How did this topic not start and end on the point that Breath of the Wild is nothing like GoW in any real way and yet took rewards like they were candy?

Clearly there's no real 'award bait' present to begin with.

 

[EarthPainting]

I was listening to SuperBunnyHop's podcast this morning, and they pretty much described the new God of War as ticking boxes. While I think there is something to it, I don't know if they devs are consciously fishing for awards. Third person action games with narrative ambition that target 30-something white males play well with reviewers. A lot of devs are part of that same demographic, so it's not a shock that this overlap would exist.

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

If anything, God of War is Award Worthy.

 

[Thekiddfran]

I doubt a studio would put 5 years of their lives into a game just to win a few meaningless awards.

"lets make a game that will win a few GOTY awards"

It's embarrassing that people think this way.

 

[Fat4all]

nah

 

[Deleted member 888]

Awards bait?

Content creators create content and then want to sell it to make a living. Some bombastic/TV approved awards shows exist for a bit of fun.

This is not deep. This is supposed to be a hobby people enjoy, but then again, reading review topics on this forum rots the brain. Metacritic and approval are not the end all and be all in the world. Just try and have some fun every now and then? Why can't some of you just have fun?

 

[Shadoken]

That's hard to gauge without proper data! Someone who spend a lot of time playing the same multiplayer game might still favor another game! Multiplayer one just have more replay value! I mean, you check SFV thread sometime, how many posters there do you think would vote for SFV in a GotY competition, they enjoy shitting on the game at every apportunity yet keep playing it?! It wasn't different in Destiny, Overwatch, Dota 2, etc... Threads!
I know I played mostly fighting games last year, but I'd still pick Nier: A for my GotY!.

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I'd say SFIV deserved a lot more praise that what it got back then. But Fighting genre is quite niche. But MOBAs and some other genres are way bigger. Era and the community here isnt an accurate representation of their size. Heck id say fighting games are bigger than Mobas on Era.

Whats the trend ? I'm genuinely asking.

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Primarily western SP games with a big focus on Story or Cinematics ( though there are exceptions like Botw,RE4..etc). You dont see genres like Platformers,Racing,Fighters,Mobas,MP Shooters,Character Action.

I was listening to SuperBunnyHop's podcast this morning, and they pretty much described the new God of War as ticking boxes. While I think there is something to it, I don't know if they devs are consciously fishing for awards. Third person action games with narrative ambition that target 30-something white males play well with reviewers. A lot of devs are part of that same demographic, so it's not a shock that this overlap would exist.

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This... But yea I dont think the idea was to please critics.

 

[Deleted member 9971]

I think it has a good chance to win most this years awards unless KH3 or Red Dead 2 life up to the big hype.

And in KH3s case if it releases xd
Spiderman i can also see havin a chance.

Or one of the BR games.

 

[AerialFox]

This is silly. Are these threads even allowed?

 

[Deleted member 24550]

I doubt a studio would put 5 years of their lives into a game just to win a few meaningless awards.

"lets make a game that will win a few GOTY awards"

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Meaningless awards?

Let's spend five years of our life on a game that will definitely not win GOTY.

I'm sure no dev strives to get recognition.

Next you're telling me metacritic results are meaningless to publishers.

It's embarrassing that people think this way.

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[Thekiddfran]

Meaningless awards?

Let's spend five years of our life on a game that will definitely not win GOTY.

I'm sure no dev strives to get recognition.

Next you're telling me metacritic results are meaningless to publishers.

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Thats not what I said. Obviously devs go out with the intention to make the best game they can. They don;t go out to win made up GOTY awards from videogame websites.

What matters most are sales of the game to publishers simple as

 

[ArmsofSleep]

I don't really think that term means anything, but I do get the general gist.


In the sense that God of War is basically a pretty by the numbers AAA game with some cool aspects that people are fawning over because the games press is made up of yes men.


If anything, every journalist basically apologizing for giving Bioshock Infinite a perfect score 9 months after its release should show you to just not care about games criticism at all. Games, more than anything, are really helped by retrospectives and playing after the hype has died down.

 

[bakedpony]

Will the next open world 93+ meta score also have thread asking if it's awards-bait?

 

[Deleted member 24550]

That's a fair enough thought but I don't think it applies to games. In a linear medium like film there are certain narrative avenues that are deemed more worthy than others i.e. holocaust pieces, British period films etc. Games are by definition playable so the majority of them, even linear ones, have a little flexibility in the narrative which makes it much harder to say 'games about 'X' topic are more worthy' as there's a lot of different ways that the games are played and structured that can and will affect the player.

Certainly in GoW I can't think of anything that would qualify it as 'awards bait' by the industry or even gamers. Audio/visuals are pretty subjective so a realistic looking game isn't necessarily more award worthy than one that's cell-shaded. In terms of narrative, off the top of my head I can't really think of many other titles based of north mythology that have done well because of their setting in the past few years.

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Of the past 6 aggregate GOTY winners

• 6 Were singleplayer epic adventure/RPGs
  
• 5 Released around April/May
• 3 Feature a badass and child duo trope where the papa wolf subtrope is looking for redemption
• 3 Are (high) fantasy with elves and dwarves and whatnot
  
• 3 Are hack and slash

GoW is clearly not award bait in the meaning that it needs awards for recognition. At the same time, Sony absolutely knows what it's doing when it's greenlighting a $100(?)M budget singleplayer game and laying out its release schedule. To think they're just doing it out of some kind of artistic merit is absolute madness. I think it's plausible that they're purposefully aiming for awards (because it makes the brand more desirable), and it is interesting to find out which boxes they're ticking to get there, as a way of better understanding the game production process. And if these boxes are enough to designate it award bait.

Now after the absurd defensiveness of the last few pages, I want to reiterate that while "award bait" can be seen as a cynical pejorative, it absolutely does not say anything about the quality of God of War. Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King and Schindler's List are both award bait in most metrics that we have for the term. That's a mighty fine list to find yourself in. If you win an award, you still win an award.

 

[Dan Thunder]

Sony absolutely knows what it's doing when it's greenlighting a $100(?)M budget singleplayer game and laying out its release schedule. To think they're just doing it out of some kind of artistic merit is absolute madness. I think it's plausible that they're purposefully aiming for awards (because it makes the brand more desirable), and it is interesting to find out which boxes they're ticking to get there, as a way of better understanding the game production process. And if these boxes are enough to designate it award bait.

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I disagree. No-one would make a game with this budget and design parts of it around receiving awards. If they're going to do anything they're going to aim for the widest possible audience to make money. Masculine central character - tick, fantasy setting - tick, adult audience - tick, lots of action - tick, proven series - tick. Awards make little difference to sales of AAA titles. Do you think the likes of GTA 5 and Skyrim sold more copies because they won best game at the Spike Awards?

 

[Shadoken]

How did this topic not start and end on the point that Breath of the Wild is nothing like GoW in any real way and yet took rewards like they were candy?
Clearly there's no real 'award bait' present to begin with.

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There are exceptions like Botw and RE4. But look at all the other titles.

 

[closer]

Another good question to ask: would another god of war game have gotten approved by higher ups if it were just another iteration of the series?

 

[Deleted member 1589]

I'm not allowed to make a thread about a subject I'm curious but undecided on?

I'll admit to making a too-inflammatory thread title, but there have been some good responses and I feel more informed now, that's not a bad thing. If some people got concerned because of miscommunication on my part, then I'm happy to step in and make up for that.

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Well, that's what OTs are for innit.

I mean you basically made a reply bait thread and title than asking people who have or are playing the game directly.

 

[Riderz1337]

Oh wow just saw OP hasn't even played the game??

Why is this thread still open again?

 

[Budi]

Primarily western SP games with a big focus on Story or Cinematics ( though there are exceptions like Botw,RE4..etc). You dont see genres like Platformers,Racing,Fighters,Mobas,MP Shooters,Character Action.

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True those are primarily SP games, but I'd say only half of them are there because of high quality story/cinematics. Bethesda RPG:s are played and loved for the gameplay possibilities, not cinematics (Not by me though). And those are western awards by critics and audiences, so it's no surprise it's western games mainly. It's not like Japanese outlets and gamers would award that much western games either.

 

[Shadoken]

True those are primarily SP games, but I'd say only half of them are there because of high quality story/cinematics. Bethesda RPG:s are played and loved for the gameplay possibilities, not cinematics (Not by me). And those are western awards so it's no surprise it's western games mainly. It's not like Japanese outlets would award that much western games either.

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Yea agreed. But it really feels like every game in that list is a western Bethesda style RPG ( all the Bethesda games,Inquistion,TW3) or ND style (UC2,4,TLOU). Its quite surprising that the only Nintendo game up there for the past 2 decades is Botw. Given how popular they are in the West.

I feel like if there were Goty awards from the 80s and 90s ( not many game journalists back then ). You would see a lot more variety in the genres. RPGs,Platformers,Racing,Fighting,FPS. But Goty awards now feel like only certain genres are eligible. When inquisition won the most in 2014 , it really justifies that. Nobody even talks about that game now. But people still speak so highly about Bayo 2,MK8,Smash.

 

[Master Chuuster]

Surprise, great games are awards worthy.

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yep

 

[Budi]

Yea agreed. But it really feels like every game in that list is a western Bethesda style RPG ( all the Bethesda games,Inquistion,TW3) or ND style (UC2,4,TLOU). Its quite shocking that the only Nintendo game up there for the past 2 decades is Botw. Given how popular they are in the West.

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Galaxy was close, only 2 awards less than Bioshock. Red Dead and Mass Effect dominated when Galaxy 2 came out. Western audiences seem to prefer more "gritty" than family friendly, I think that's pretty commonly shared theme with the big winners. Most of those are pretty violent games.

Edit: Well Bayonetta is way too niche, as great as it is. It's talked here, since we have a lot of fans for that type of games. But bigger audiences aren't talking about it, never have. Those big winners are million sellers.

 

[Rowsdower]

Another good question to ask: would another god of war game have gotten approved by higher ups if it were just another iteration of the series?

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Don't remember where I read it, but Cory/SSM confirmed that no, God of War as it was was never going to have another game made. Sony had ended the series after Ascension, and SSM had to prove to Sony that the new one was different enough to make.

 

[Deleted member 8408]

You know, now that some time has passed and we are in awards season in inclined to agree with the OP.

 

[Shpeshal Nick]

I mean, if you believe in Oscar bait with movies, then you'd pretty much automatically have to believe the same thing exists with games.

Not to mention, if you look at the most recent winners and nominees amongst the GOTY candidates, there's a definite pattern to their style.

Combine that with the fact that we have separate categories for "other" games like sports, racing, indie etc effectively means that despite being....games, they can't win Game of the Year.

 

[noyram23]

If we observe all the GOTY from the past 10 years there's no definite attribute for an GOTY-bait game other than being a great and polished game. Just consider last year we have Odyssey/BotW which are gameplay-first with light narrative and the past year we have Walking Dead, GoW, and TLOU which are basically the opposites.

But if you mean by GoW is an awards-bait because it's a great game, then absolutely.

 

[Angelus Errare]

Seems people just call any game "bait" now. Good games still win awards guys, and guess what? GoW was an amazing game thus...it won awards.

Novel idea.

 

[Blade Wolf]

haaaHA! I remember this thread!

 

[Philly Cheesesteak]

Would this topic have even been necrobumped if RDR2 was leading GotY awards?

 

[Francesco]

No.
Awards in videogames are not as impactful as for movies, so making one to please the specific "judging audience" is pointless. Also, game journalists are young and down to earth enough to be a good representation of most gamers, as opposed to the movie industry, where judges can be 70+.
It's an amazing game, it's overwhelmingly acclaimed.

Edit: shit that was a massive bump. What a stupid point.

 

[Ploid 6.0]

I thought RDR2 would be awards bait if anything. GOW just seems like a very solid game with a story and good concept to go with it. Can't wait to see what happens next! What new gameplay mechanic, what new awesome weapon? How will they top the Valkeries and insane challenges? Bring on the big guy and Ragnarok.

 

[Mechaplum]

It's one of the most lazy arguments out there. A vapid term that says nothing wielded only by bitter dissenters reaching into the very reserves of their downplay kit.

Just which devs would have "this game is not for winning awards" as part of their project goal? Beyond silly.

 

[TheSpaceBetween]

No. If anything it's the least "Awards Bait" of any of The Game Awards GOTY's so far. It's just an incredible video game that excels in every area of design.

 

[McScroggz]

Award bait movies are generally character driven drama pieces, but also there is this subtext that the movie isn't particularly good and that it was made to bolster the actor's resume and get nominated for awards. Granted it's a fine, unknowable line between making a good character driven drama and just making a really damn good movie with a fantastic lead performance, but you often know it when you see it.

With the cost and time it takes for video games, I don't think there is such a thing as award bait. Certainly trying to tell a more engaging, complex story is something that will potentially garner critically praise, but it's unfair to paint with that broad a brush.

Another thing about God of War is the camera that never cuts away. This could be seen as a pretentious, award baity thing to do, but to me award bait movies have a soulessbess to them and a game director being able to make an entire game with that limitation and making the cinematography work to enhance the story. It's a legitimately impressive feat.

Avant garde filmmaking certainly isn't award baity, and a game with no cuts is a mild idea of what an AG filmmaker might do.

So to me, God of War isn't award bait and I don't think such a thing is really a thing in video games, especially at the AAA level.

 

[modiz]

I know this thread is bumped to hell, but i really feel that red dead is the bigger "award bait" of the two.
In the end the game awards shown that the critics still care about fun gameplay over immersion.

 

[everyer]

I mean, great films win Oscars, but that doesn't mean Oscar-bait isn't still a thing.

Just to be clear, I'm really impressed with what I've seen of God of War and look forward to playing it, but the critical acclaim it's received raised comparisons to the way certain films are designed to receive heaps of critical acclaim.

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Huh, you haven't played it? Isn't that your problem????

Go and play it and stop such foolish question.