EighTEEN, nineTEEN. Christ, I'm starting to wondering about the nineteen year old you were bragging about...
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Is flirting with a 19 year old at 28 creepy?
- Thread starter Bee.Cups
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And all I was saying is OP knows what they're getting into and clearly so did you. They don't need to come on here looking for approval like they don't know what this is and what type of scrutiny comes with it. If you really don't care what people think you don't need to be in here arguing.
What about older people who haven't experienced any of that though? Lots of people in their mid-twenties nowadays don't live on their own, or pay the rent, or have a plan for the future, and have never been in a relationship before.
IMO Ops mistake is asking ERA for relationship advice.
My view is...I don't know OP or the other person, so I cannot judge. But...being 37 year old and a NCO in the navy that has to deal with alot of 18~19 year olds...I have nothing in common with those group of kids.
My view is...I don't know OP or the other person, so I cannot judge. But...being 37 year old and a NCO in the navy that has to deal with alot of 18~19 year olds...I have nothing in common with those group of kids.
She's mature and confident, she likes you, you like her, you both flirt appropriately and respect boundaries. It's completely fine. Context matters. You aren't just randomly hitting on 19 year olds at abar or party. Some people like dating older you might be the exact age range she likes. Do what makes you both happy.
The people on this forum trying to argue that a 19 year old isn't an adult are idiots. They are 100% an adult in every legal definition. Some might not be very mature, but this doesn't seem to be the case. 19 year olds can go to war, drive a car, buy a house, travel the planet, but ERA deems them children. I'd hate to ever be their kid.
Some of y'all are telling on yourselves by making the statement "If it's legal it's okay"
Also legal in a lot of places?
CHILD MARRIAGES
Also legal in a lot of places?
CHILD MARRIAGES
But people in their mid 20s are more cognitively developed even if they don't have those experiences. Besides, people start somewhere with all of those things so that's not exactly the strongest counterargument.
This is a god awful argument. You're comparing a child who cannot consent and is forced into marriage to an adult who can consent and is clearly attracted and friendly with her. She's 19, not 10.
Yea so I guess dating with a 10 year age gap is just like being a pedo. Big brain time.
I don't think anyone here is suggesting that literal child marriage is okay because there are places where it's legal.
Like I figured it was more "the law and society recognizes a 19 year old as an adult" as opposed to "the law lets you marry this literal child."
If someone in their mid 20s has never had a job, never paid any bills and doesn't have any plan for their future then I would argue the last thing they should be doing is entering a relationship.
Future planning doesn't have to be career based. Thinking about living on your own and making sure you have the safety to do so is planning for your future.
It depends on the individuals and the dynamics of the relationship. I don't think it's fair to apply a blanket stance to this question. There are 19 year olds who have their shit together more so than 29 year olds. It doesn't seem fair to automatically label it creepy.
The point that people are making is that the law isn't always a direct arbiter is what is socially or morally acceptable. So citing "well, it's legal" as a defense or refutation means nothing. No shit it's legal. The legality is not why they made this topic.
I'm defending the OP for something she shouldn't need to be even asking if it's okay. Nobody should be judging anyone who are adults who are not willingly hurting each other or have no ill intention.
Let me put it another way about age that has nothing to do with dating or relationships. I was 27 and played in a band with a kid who was 16/17. Everyone was in their mid 20's except for the 16 year old. It was actually cool. Had lots of things in common musically. we treated him no different than the rest of us and he was just one of us eventually after we got past his age. He's 30 now and he is still a good friend of mine. You can have things in common with younger people. Not in every case or situation.
I don't get what's so controversial about suggesting that your average 19-year-old with like 5 or 6 more years of mental development might not have been around the block enough times to have a grasp of all the dynamics involved in a relationship, or the nuances of manipulation/power imbalances, or the intricacies of coping with the emotions related to all of this... god forbid if mental health struggles get involved... and maybe it's best to err on the side of caution when in these situations as an older adult. Meaning, it's probably good to default to "not a good idea" re: getting involved with anyone that young unless it's just a really serendipitous thing.
It's a matter of probability. Of course, there are "mature" 19-year-olds and "immature" 35-year-olds. But most of y'all deep down probably know that the probability of finding someone who's adjusted to any number of real world struggles is gonna be lower the younger you go. If "well I know an immature 35-year-old/mature 19-year-old so anyone of legal age is fine, it's fine" is as far as Era is gonna be able to take this, then y'all probably ain't properly equipped to discuss it.
It's a matter of probability. Of course, there are "mature" 19-year-olds and "immature" 35-year-olds. But most of y'all deep down probably know that the probability of finding someone who's adjusted to any number of real world struggles is gonna be lower the younger you go. If "well I know an immature 35-year-old/mature 19-year-old so anyone of legal age is fine, it's fine" is as far as Era is gonna be able to take this, then y'all probably ain't properly equipped to discuss it.
Yeah I been wanting to say that I live in NC and if you get a 14-year-old pregnant you can legally marry them. The law looking at something as legal in no way speaks to maturity, consent, appropriateness, anything other than the opinion of those upholding the current status quo. Which is usually well behind on what we actually understand about how people function.
That's fair, im somewhat playing Devil's advocate here, however to be honest, I agree with some other posters where they say it really is a case by case basis.
I have definitely met some 19 year olds that are far and away more mature and mentally sound than some 10 years their age. It's clear the OP isn't a creep stalking around a high school counting down the days until they turn legal age, and they both sound intelligent from what they wrote. I feel like quantifying specific things like having a stable job, or living on your own, kind of misses the point. Maybe they don't *need* to be in a relationship but if it came about naturally then I don't see there being much harm.
Are...are you trying to argue against science with anecdotes?
My partner is 29 and I'm 40. We have a four year old daughter and love each other very much.
Is she mature? Are you mature? Do you get along? Then it doesn't fucking matter what anyone thinks.
And no it's not creepy. She can talk to anyone she wants. If she prefers older, who gives a shit? I use to be a milf hunter back in my day and no one questioned me ever.
And no it's not creepy. She can talk to anyone she wants. If she prefers older, who gives a shit? I use to be a milf hunter back in my day and no one questioned me ever.
The existence of irresponsible adults does not mean the AVERAGE maturity of a 19 year old is not much lower than the AVERAGE maturity of a 26-year old.
But you assume all 19 year old's are not mature enough to handle a relationship. Is that 30 yr old irresponsible or immature or a combo of both?
There are grown adults who have literally metal ball sacks hanging on the back of their trucks. Age and maturity are not mutually exclusive.
Most brains don't reach "full" maturity until 25. We going to say a 24 year old dating a 34 year old is bad? 19 vs 26? One is mature, one isn't, guess they can't date, cuz science says. Nevermind getting into the gender differences between brain dev. And older woman with a younger guy is significantly "worse" in that respect.
This entire thread reminds me about an incident at a community college photography class I took during summer. For whatever reason the program allowed high school students to take the class as well. I would say that the majority of the class looked like they were in their early 20s, but several students were visibly high school students.
This occurred about halfway through the class semester so most people were comfortable talking to one another. I would say about 7 of us (guys and girls) were gathered around the "washing station" talking about random things as we developed out photos.
I can't remember what we were talking about, but I know that some sexual themes had to have suddenly come up because one of the girls suddenly covered her ears and said, "I'm not old enough to be listening to this." Everyone at the washing station immediately stopped talking and I asked for her age. She said she was 16 and one of the girls said something to the effect of, "You'll be fine when you're older." No one in the group suspected she was one of the high school students taking the course, but we stopped talking about whatever it was and went on to make sure we knew the ages of people in the class.
This girl clearly felt she wasn't old enough to even listen to a conversation happening around her between several adults that were only several years older than her. That class was the last time I ever remember being around high schoolers. Does anyone here think that the maturity of that girl would have changed much in 2 years when she would have been 18? How about when she was 19? She's my last impression of high school aged kids because kids at my high school acted more like college aged kids than the stereotype in my head of a "high schooler".
This occurred about halfway through the class semester so most people were comfortable talking to one another. I would say about 7 of us (guys and girls) were gathered around the "washing station" talking about random things as we developed out photos.
I can't remember what we were talking about, but I know that some sexual themes had to have suddenly come up because one of the girls suddenly covered her ears and said, "I'm not old enough to be listening to this." Everyone at the washing station immediately stopped talking and I asked for her age. She said she was 16 and one of the girls said something to the effect of, "You'll be fine when you're older." No one in the group suspected she was one of the high school students taking the course, but we stopped talking about whatever it was and went on to make sure we knew the ages of people in the class.
This girl clearly felt she wasn't old enough to even listen to a conversation happening around her between several adults that were only several years older than her. That class was the last time I ever remember being around high schoolers. Does anyone here think that the maturity of that girl would have changed much in 2 years when she would have been 18? How about when she was 19? She's my last impression of high school aged kids because kids at my high school acted more like college aged kids than the stereotype in my head of a "high schooler".
Ok but in this situation it's already established that she is mature for her age as shown in the OP. So why throw out random statistics that mean nothing to the individual?
I'm talking about you bringing up people saying a 19 year old brain isn't fully developed and then bringing up your 30 year old sister as...what? Evidence that the science is wrong?
Didn't nobody say anything about the 19 year old can't have a relationship. We are saying they shouldn't be having one with a near-30 year old person.
There has been like several people who have said why that is the case and I don't feel like repeating it to someone who has been using anecdotes since they came in here.
When I was 30, I dated a girl who was 20 from my work...
She was way out of my league when it come to looks etc... a solid 10 out of 10.
Didn't have any of this 'not old enough to drink' nonsense, as the drinking age in Australia is 18... if you're an adult, you're an adult.
I will say though, that mentally, she was all over the place... I could not figure her out... and I swore 'never again' and made a rule not to date anyone under 30 ever again.
But that's one example... I'm sure some people can make it work because they're not a lunatic like my ex was.
I think if you're both adults, go for it... do what feels right for you. It'll work or not... and you'll probably have fun....
If it doesn't work out, then no harm, right?
She was way out of my league when it come to looks etc... a solid 10 out of 10.
Didn't have any of this 'not old enough to drink' nonsense, as the drinking age in Australia is 18... if you're an adult, you're an adult.
I will say though, that mentally, she was all over the place... I could not figure her out... and I swore 'never again' and made a rule not to date anyone under 30 ever again.
But that's one example... I'm sure some people can make it work because they're not a lunatic like my ex was.
I think if you're both adults, go for it... do what feels right for you. It'll work or not... and you'll probably have fun....
If it doesn't work out, then no harm, right?
Yeah man there is a huge difference between 16 and 19 in both growth and maturity.
All of the above are mistakes people well into thier 30s do. Again, it is up to them if they want to date even though there is a bit age gap. If they can figure it out, then all good.
You dont have to make excuses because there is nothing wrong with it. It is challenging because of the age gap, but not bad.
Morality doesnot have anything to do with this. Those three years limits are arbitrary numbers people make to not hurt their own morality goals. Let people make mistakes if the want and learn from it. That 19 year old is probably very aware of issues of dating that age gap, yet it is up to them.
Well yeah, "it's legal" has never been a good defense on its own. If it were this topic wouldn't exist because the ethics are why the OP is asking about it at all. I just don't think the legality of dating someone declared an adult can share the same conversation as a child forced into marriage, but then a lot of the ideas of what makes an adult come from decades ago where you could just walk out of high school and be declared an adult with a job and a house, before a greater understanding of the brain's development occurred.
I don't really have much commentary on the general argument because, well, it's not something I care to think about. I'm with Brazil on the first post, I wouldn't want to do it myself.
Why though? What's the exact argument? Why should a 19 year old be relegated to dating other 19-20year olds? What if they don't identify to people in that age range? Such a weird thing to think.
Uhhh...
...you're the 30 yo dating the 20 yo.
I also never, never believe a man who is quick to describe an ex-girlfriend as crazy with no further context.
Not the greatest of looks, no.
At the end of the day, it's going to come down to you two, but there is absolutely a power imbalance that's going to be at play, regardless of whatever your intentions are.
A post is not evidence of maturity.
The OP perceives or believes that this 19 year old is mature for her age, it does not mean that she is.
Furthermore, it's not like the entire thread is about JUST this situation---I was rebutting someone trying to take one example of an irresponsible adult and making that one anecdote into "proof" that there could potentially be no difference in maturity.
I mean, believe what you want. One anecdote or neuroscience. Maybe start a poll on Facebook so you can "do your own research".
What? Literally billions of teenagers/young adults on the planet and this 19 year old with Discord can't find a single person within even 5 years of range to identify with????
The OP definitely isn't a creep and should be commended for being as transparent as they are with this question. Speaking of which, the question itself was about flirting which is fine because flirting is so interpretational.
That being said, transitioning from flirting to a relationship is a whole other story especially for age gap this large. There's inevitable social stigma which can be largely ignored. What can't be ignored is the fact that this is a Gen-Z and Millennial relationship so there's already a difference in generational values and that's just pointing out the obvious issues regarding a large age gap relationship like this.
Of course, they have final say as to whether to pursue a relationship like this and it's up to them to weigh all these different opinions to come to a decision OP feels is best for them.
Okay, clearly my hypothetical about a teacher/student relationship is a bad one because as you say, a teacher would not be able to date their Highschool student. The intent was to describe that their is a big difference between where a person would be at 18-19 as someone a decade removed from highschool. So in that example the 18-year old would have graduated and then went in to date the teacher who was around 30. Still, not a very good example nonetheless.
I also do not agree with you about 21 and 18 year old being the same as a 30 year old and 18 year old when it comes to prom. In the former the two could have been dating while in school together or grew up together. There is no potential for a prior in school or out of school relationship between the latter without it being completely illegal. If my daughter went to prom with a 21 year old but I've known him and his parents for many years and they were close during school then I wouldn't be so troubled. There would be shared life experience in their teenage years. I would have to view that differently.
Now random 21 year old I've never met? Yeah that's a different discussion. However there is even a big difference between 21 and 30. I view 21 and 18 differently then I would view 18 and 30.
As for the question of "which is it?". I would say I definitely lean more towards the latter, however I also do not agree with the former because life experience of an 18 year and 28 year old is a world apart from lived experience between a 26 year old and 35 year old. As you age that line narrows even more.
Being 18-19 you are still very immature and haven't really been fully thrust into the world. I'm no brain expert nor will claim to be, so I can only go based on my experience. I didn't know anything at 18-19, even if I thought I did. Who I was at 28 was not the same as who I was in Highschool or right after graduating Highschool. In my case I was a father, had a job for years and in the process of purchasing a home. Today at 37 I've learned more as a parent, but enough to say that 37 year old me and 28 year old me would feel wrong? No, I would not. I make more money than I did back then, but outside of being a parent not much has changed with me a person from then to now. Not as much as 18 and 28.
So I guess yes, I would have to say I lean toward the latter.
I'm sure I rambled on quite a bit. Trying best to out my thoughts into words for this one.
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"Huge" difference between 16/19 but no difference between 19/28? Your position is so inconsistent.
She's over 18, and it is consensual. As long as she doesn't think it's creepy, then you have nothing to worry about, OP. She's the one you have to deal with, not us.
I agree with this.
I'm not accusing this poster of anything, but some abusers end up getting custody because the abused appears "crazy" because of the trauma they've experienced.
And even if they're mentally ill, calling them "crazy" isn't a good look either.
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