Is Chrono Cross fixable? (Open Spoilers)

[Deleted member 43657]

I've been re-engaging with Chrono Cross as of late for the first time since it came out some twenty years ago. I recall it was loosely connected to the original, but upon replaying it and reading about it, I find that it's much closer to the original than I initially remembered.

Chrono Trigger is obviously a great game; it's number one on several "Greatest RPGs of All Time" lists, however, its sequel is not as well received.

I'd love to see a reimagining of Chrono Cross and perhaps even a third game at some point along the line (I realize Radical Dreamers exists), but in its current form, Chrono Cross would need a lot of work in my opinion:

- the story is way too convoluted, it's very difficult to follow within the context of the game itself
- there are far too many inconsequential characters that, in my opinion, could be/should be removed
- traveling between two worlds is not as engaging as time travel in the original

Era, what are your thoughts? Would you like to see Chrono Cross remade or remastered? What are some elements you love and what are some bits you would change (or retcon)? Or is another sequel the better choice?

 

[Kain]

There's nothing to fix

 

[Gold Arsene]

Paging Ishida you're up.

 

[Garlador]

There's nothing to fix

Click to shrink...

I would like a remaster, however. This art deserves an HD treatment.

 

[Meows]

There's nothing to fix

Click to shrink...

This. It is one of the greatest games ever made.

 

[Deleted member 36578]

I loved having that many characters to find even if they weren't important to the plot. Reminded me of Suikoden.

 

[JaseMath]

Too many characters killed it for me. It's a great game, but you can't distill characters down to their essence and make the player care when there are literally dozens.

 

[Weiss]

All Cross really needs is to cut out the fight against Lavos and to shut Belthasar up whenever he speaks.

Because all the ties to Trigger weaken the game and prevent it from standing on its own merits.

 

[Shepherd]

Agreed about the too many characters thing and I dont get the Suikodenm comparison, since suikoden knows about its limitantions, so it has 100 or so characters but the main cast is really flashed out. One of the strongest points of CT was the cast and CC throws it all away. Couldnt connect with a single character, not even Serge or Kid. All the other aspects of the game are great, though.

 

[Deleted member 43657]

All Cross really needs is to cut out the fight against Lavos and to shut Belthasar up whenever he speaks.

Because all the ties to Trigger weaken the game and prevent it from standing on its own merits.

Click to shrink...

While I like the idea that Lucca is something of a catalyst for the events of this game (fearing someone may travel in time to stop her, Crono, and Marle from destroying Lavos is a really cool set up), I wonder if you're right about a sequel having nothing to do with the original at all.

It's just the characters in the original are so memorable it feels like it would be a shame not to use them again in some way.

 

[Future Gazer]

There's nothing to fix

Click to shrink...

 

[Kain]

Well, one could say the main CC characters are Serge, Kid, Lynx, Harle, Karsh, Guile and maybe Nikki. The rest are filler.

 

[Weiss]

While I like the idea that Lucca is something of a catalyst for the events of this game (fearing someone may travel in time to stop her, Crono, and Marle from destroying Lavos is a really cool set up), I wonder if you're right about a sequel having nothing to do with the original at all.

It's just the characters in the original are so memorable it feels like it would be a shame not to use them again in some way.

Click to shrink...

Like it's fine for the game to take place in the same world and all that, but it didn't need to end with "btdubs all of this was my convoluted plan to save this girl you don't know. Hop to it."

Trigger really didn't need a direct sequel because the unique building blocks that made it the legendary game it is can't be hard replicated. Cross doing its own thing was smart and it faltered when it became the direct Chrono Trigger 2 it never should have been.

 

[badcrumble]

It's a great game, but agreed that too many characters is a bad thing. The dialogue modification engine in the game is theoretically neat, but in practice it cannot possibly have as much personality as actually writing original dialogue for different characters.

It does a lot well, but the characters being less unique in battle *and* in dialogue really hurts it, IMO.

 

[Deleted member 43657]

Too many characters killed it for me. It's a great game, but you can't distill characters down to their essence and make the player care when there are literally dozens.

Click to shrink...

I agree. This aspect of the game I think takes a lot away from developing the other characters. I don't feel the same way about Serge or Kid that I do with Crono and Marle.

If they were to re-imagine this game, maybe cut down the cast to a more manageable number and give the characters a little more personality.

 

[HadesHotgun]

I love Chrono Cross but I would probably enjoy the game a bit more if it had a more engaging magic system. Aside from that though, I think the game is outstanding.

 

[Deleted member 21709]

One of the best 32-bit JRPG's.. this is blasphemy.

 

[Deleted member 43657]

Well, one could say the main CC characters are Serge, Kid, Lynx, Harle, Karsh, Guile and maybe Nikki. The rest are filler.

Click to shrink...

Glenn?

 

[Kain]

True, Glenn too.

 

[Garlador]

Glenn?

Click to shrink...

It's weird Glenn is a character most players missed the first time you play the game because you can only recruit him if you choose NOT to try and save Kid...

... Which most players wouldn't do.

 

[Meows]

All Cross really needs is to cut out the fight against Lavos and to shut Belthasar up whenever he speaks.

Because all the ties to Trigger weaken the game and prevent it from standing on its own merits.

Click to shrink...

How does the ending work without Schala though? That is the one piece that is essential.

 

[Weiss]

Glenn?

Click to shrink...

He's optional and recruiting him leaves Razzly to get eaten by the Hydra.

So naturally I did it all the time because dual wielding dragon swords!

 

[pleaseinsertdisctwo]

We love attention-whore-y thread titles

 

[napkins]

Leave mostly everything the same, but add backstories and sidequests for every character. Flesh them out more. And *maybe* let players explore more locations from CT.

 

[Korigama]

The amount of playable characters likely could've been halved, but few would agree on who should be omitted since everyone has their favorites. The story doesn't really get convoluted until the Balthasar explanations factor in, and the two worlds deal worked fine all while not rehashing CT's time traveling (and given how CC tended to focus on the consequences of messing with time, it's not too surprising that they went with something different).

Glenn?

Click to shrink...

Glenn is significantly more important than Guile in respect to backstory for related characters, yes (IIRC, whatever plans they had for Guile went unused).

 

[Sedef122]

What a confrontational thread title. The game is great as it is.

 

[PrismStar]

I know that many CT fans were really disappointed with CC but CC is an amazing game on its own. One the best JRPGs imo. No need to be fixed.

 

[Weiss]

How does the ending work without Schala though? That is the one piece that is essential.

Click to shrink...

Obviously the finale would need some rewriting but a greater emphasis on the war between FATE and the Dragon Gods, you know the actually interesting parts of the game, would be fine.

Some massaging and you can end the game right at Terra Tower.

 

[Deleted member 43657]

I should mention that one aspect that does not require "fixing", in my opinion, is the music.

Dear god, it's so good.

 

[signal]

Fix the battle system.

 

[AzureFlame]

There's nothing to fix

Click to shrink...

This.

 

[mindsale]

We love attention-whore-y thread titles

Click to shrink...

Attention sex worker, please. I agree though.

Chrono Cross is perfect as is.

 

[hannuraina]

there will always be throw away chars in games, but the main party and most of the bosses were very memorable, even if the music did help some.



i think this fight changed the way i thought about game music. ahhhh, that soundtrack.

 

[Deleted member 4869]

Paging Ishida you're up.

Click to shrink...

Yooouuuuuu rang...?

Anyways, the only thing that needs fixing in Chrono Cross is the massive info dump at the end, caused by the team running out of time and budget (Like Xenogears, but less extreme). They could expand on the ending events a lot more instead of relying on Kid giving a speech about the Dragonians/Reptites, and other things. Maybe playable segments, or event cutscenes about the Chronopolis-Dinopolis war, instead of just showing a single picture.

The number of characters is not a problem. The main characters have great storylines already. The rest are just in for the ride and allow the player to choose whatever gameplay style fits them the most.

Also, besides the previously mentioned info dump, the story is not convoluted at all. Complicated? Perhaps. But not too much if you already played and understood Chrono Trigger.

Budget and time constraint issues aside, Chrono Cross is pretty much perfect.

 

[ProtomanNeo]

It's always amazing to me when I read threads like this how much detail people remember about games released 20 years.

 

[Keldroc]

It's not worth fixing. Chrono Trigger should have a real sequel, maybe, but Chrono Cross is a convoluted mess that is more of a sequel to Radical Dreamers and only tangentially related to Chrono Trigger. "Fixing" it would require basically rebuilding from scratch. Let it be the bad game with great music that it is, that's all it needs to be.

 

[vic viper]

There's nothing to fix

Click to shrink...

outside of the art and music there's everything to fix

 

[NeonZ]

I think most of the hate for Cross would die down if they added a few Chrono Trigger characters to the game, which wouldn't be that odd considering how it already had a bloated cast...

Glenn is significantly more important than Guile in respect to backstory for related characters, yes (IIRC, whatever plans they had for Guile went unused).

Click to shrink...

The DS version of CT goes out of its way to set up Magus becoming Guile. Cross itself basically removed any backstory for Guile or plot role for him in later in the game, without specific interactions even in the final battle.

 

[Deleted member 43657]

I'm not overly down on this game, I do enjoy it now, and I did enjoy when I played it back when it came out.

Revisiting it, however, there's just too much that I feel like I would change. That's the purpose of this thread. Just a discussion on what was great about the game (a lot), and what you wish could be better.

For me, the story is too convoluted and doesn't make much sense within the context of the game itself, which is something the original did so much better. I wish the story made a bit more sense and was told in-game in a better way.

 

[tenderbrew]

There's nothing to fix

Click to shrink...

 

[Korigama]

The DS version of CT goes out of its way to set up Magus becoming Guile though, although, yes, Cross itself basically removed any backstory for Guile or plot role for him in later in the game, without specific interactions even in the final battle.

Click to shrink...

Yeah, I thought I had read something about them officially tying the two together in that.

 

[Deleted member 14377]

Ban OP please.

 

[Weiss]

Yooouuuuuu rang...?

Anyways, the only thing that needs fixing in Chrono Cross is the massive info dump at the end, caused by the team running out of time and budget (Like Xenogears, but less extreme). They could expand on the ending events a lot more instead of relying on Kid giving a speech about the Dragonians/Reptites, and other things. Maybe playable segments, or event cutscenes about the Chronopolis-Dinopolis war, instead of just showing a single picture.

The number of characters is not a problem. The main characters have great storylines already. The rest are just in for the ride and allow the player to choose whatever gameplay style fits them the most.

Also, besides the previously mentioned info dump, the story is not convoluted at all. Complicated? Perhaps. But not too much if you already played and understood Chrono Trigger.

Budget and time constraint issues aside, Chrono Cross is pretty much perfect.

Click to shrink...

Remember that part where Kid casually reveals near the end of the game that whenever she's in peril that time itself rewinds and she wakes up completely unaware?

We love attention-whore-y thread titles

Click to shrink...

I can't believe someone doesn't enjoy The Thing I Like.

 

[Deleted member 4869]

Remember that part where Kid casually reveals near the end of the game that whenever she's in peril that time itself rewinds and she wakes up completely unaware?

Click to shrink...

Yes, I do.

 

[Syril]

I imagine there was more stuff they wanted to do but ran out of time for, considering that they answered half the story questions in an infodump at the very end of the game.

 

[Deleted member 4353]

I know it was on this site when someone called Chrono Cross bad. Chrono Cross is fantastic. Nothing to fix except a HD remake or remaster along with Xenogears.

 

[KtotheRoc]

As a game in and of itself, it has a lot going for it.

As a sequel to Chrono Trigger, it comes up short. The characters lack Akira Toriyama's style. The game lacks Yuji Horii's charm.

There's a reason people still hold up Trigger as one of the greatest games of all time, and Chross is barely referenced.

 

[Havok]

I didn't even make it far enough into the game to see any story problems.

The battle system sucks shit.

 

[Dreamboum]

Chrono Cross isn't, doesn't want to, has no interest in becoming Chrono Trigger 2 and it is an infinitely better game for it. Please leave it alone and just do what everyone does and pretend this game doesn't exist or something

 

[Thrill_house]

There really isn't much of a way to fix it...you either love it for what it was or hate it.

I thought it was ok at best, pretty as fuck but a poor sequel to CT. I think it would have been better off with no connection to CT at all.