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Insomniac should try and buy back their independence.
I don't think Insomniac has nearly the leverage to pull something like that off when Sony already owns every single successful IP they've ever worked on before the purchase. Bungie made a huge risk to leave Halo behind, but they didn't have nearly the dependency that Insomniac has since Fuse and Sunset Overdrive were demonstrable failures.
 

LordofPwn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,402
I hope they rehire Jack Tretton or Shawn again. We miss those guys
I miss Shawn and would really like to know how his leaving and Jim taking over really went down cause it seemed out of nowhere at the time.
the donation matching thing is unfortunate but yeah many companies do this as hard as it is to digest.
yeah as long as the donation is going to a recognized charity that will earn a company tax credit they'll match it regardless of the mission of said charity. i also doubt much research is done when matching other than if it's eligible or not and matching employee donations isn't going to be all that much money compared to a publicized campaign or sponsorship

these large international publicly traded corps would never dare come out publicly in support of either side. it's "too risky."
The real shit is Jim being a disaster of a leader and studios not being able to speak up. Good on insomniac for at least trying. i'd encourage other studios to speak up about the matter too (at least internally) to put pressure on jim ryan to correct things.
 

Sei

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,718
LA
These big corporations are always full of people in power that are just plain sexist. When it really matters to stand up for women's rights, and it's not just for publicity, they show what they really are.

I wonder how Bungie to away with what they did now. Respect to Insomniac for standing up.
 

Carn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,923
The Netherlands
While you're not wrong on the first half, Sony could have stayed silent. They didn't. They are in this mess because of it. They could have sent no internal memo out and just buried their head like most companies out there are doing. They choose to go both sides.

Yeah true. Ryan created this mess, although I wonder if his Pr-department was actually aware given the shittyness of it all.
 

GK86

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
18,777
First off, I want to say, major kudos to Insomniac for not only supporting human rights, but also donating and trying to get other studios to speak up as well. Thank you to everyone at Insomniac.

Secondly, fuck you, Sony.
 

Glasfrut

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
3,538
Yeah I'd think so. And sadly this topic is way more divisive than other topics. This is why most companies are either silent or are just supporting those affected without coming out with a strong statement in support. And I only see that changing if shit really goes down.

Maybe that explains why there isn't even some sort of vanilla apology from Jim Ryan? My first assumption was it would have been something they would discuss internally (or he would send an apology/word/email internally) but not even that so...someone has told him to keep quiet?

I've got so many damn questions. The longer they stay quiet here makes me feel someone is making the calculation that issuing a statement now hurts them more than what his silence/stance is doing to them at the moment.
 

Alek

Games User Researcher
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
8,471
Sony are definitely in a bad spot because of Jim. I can only presume they just wanted to stay silent, but Jim has made it seem almost the other way around. That they're actively not in support of abortion rights. Not a good look. Now Sony themselves are in a position where they need to make up for this. Fire Jim? Allow their studios to issue their own statements?
 

E-bite

Member
Oct 24, 2018
932
If he doesn't resign in the next 24-48 hours then Sony is completely dead to me. Though I'm definitely not gonna buy any future first party PS games either way.
 

Lord Error

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,372
What a bizarre situation all around, what with matching the donation. I wonder if this rhetoric about "respect of opinion" is coming from somewhere above Ryan even, above Playstation. It sounded like something he'd say though. You could see hints of a brash and thoughtless and probably disrespectful person in many other things he said, although they were of no real significance compared to this.
 

AndrewDean84

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,595
Fontana, California
Sony are definitely in a bad spot because of Jim. I can only presume they just wanted to stay silent, but Jim has made it seem almost the other way around. That they're actively not in support of abortion rights. Not a good look. Now Sony themselves are in a position where they need to make up for this. Fire Jim? Allow their studios to issue their own statements?
The fact that this has to be up for discussion at all is absurd.
 

Rowsdower

Prophet of Truth - The Wise Ones
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,572
Canada
Sony are definitely in a bad spot because of Jim. I can only presume they just wanted to stay silent, but Jim has made it seem almost the other way around. That they're actively not in support of abortion rights. Not a good look. Now Sony themselves are in a position where they need to make up for this. Fire Jim? Allow their studios to issue their own statements?

Allowing their studios to issue their own statements would be #1 for me. No reason to muzzle them.
 

Glio

Member
Oct 27, 2017
24,529
Spain
It would have been so easy for Jim Ryan to just say NOTHING that is amazing that he decided to be that dumb.
 

trashbandit

Member
Dec 19, 2019
3,910
It seems weird that Sony wouldn't let Insomniac make an official statement, but then let Ted Price say, in so many words, that Sony enforced a gag order on them. Like, that just makes them look even worse, and it's pretty clear going by Price's statement that Insomniac's position would be in support of reproductive rights. Insomniac has effectively made their stance clear even if it's not an "official" statement, so Sony only lost more face by restricting Insomniac.
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
Is it just me or does it seem like gaming media / Twitter is very quiet about all of this? Not really seeing much of anything outside of these forums.
 

Trunchisholm

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,403
Sony are definitely in a bad spot because of Jim. I can only presume they just wanted to stay silent, but Jim has made it seem almost the other way around. That they're actively not in support of abortion rights. Not a good look. Now Sony themselves are in a position where they need to make up for this. Fire Jim? Allow their studios to issue their own statements?
Exactly. Those who are saying not to put the blame on Jim because this is a Sony-wide policy are missing the point. It was Jim's completely tone-deaf email that dragged the whole corporation into this mess. They should fire his ass for being a proven PR liability. At the very least, they should allow studios to speak their mind on the matter.
 

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,072
Like i don't live in USA but really companies also the reason why things get so bad in the first place .
Look at how much money some of them give Republicans but companies will do what give them the most profit .
It's like Disney or Netflix saying they support this or that then when you look closer it breaks down .
this is why corporations should be banned from political donations, they arent people. And its trash that this is now the case and this is the repurcussions of them now having to take political stances when most of the time they have been pretty much political neutral. Something will have to give unsure what though.

Maybe that explains why there isn't even some sort of vanilla apology from Jim Ryan? My first assumption was it would have been something they would discuss internally (or he would send an apology/word/email internally) but not even that so...someone has told him to keep quiet?

I've got so many damn questions. The longer they stay quiet here makes me feel someone is making the calculation that issuing a statement now hurts them more than what his silence/stance is doing to them at the moment.
The Miscalculation here was them thinking it would stay internal, and the stance shouldve been more fleshed out in terms of that we will support women affected and leave it at that and we are weighing options and waiting on a ruling to see what we (sony) will do to help workers affected or some shit. Whatever that was prob was the worst response. They pretty much could've just said nothing or support without directly supporting and called it a day And still play both sides which is what all corps do.

While id rather like a full throated stance, I understand for most companies and organizations they will never get ahead of a political issue, they will fall in line with what is the majority response to that issue and not a second sooner. While I understand the heat on how Jim conveyed shit, reality is that silence/"we will support employees affected" is pretty much the most companies will do at this juncture.
 

Terraforce

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
18,917
Who is Jimbo trying to please with this awful take? Of all situations to take the "both sides" approach, this definitely isn't it.
 

Rowsdower

Prophet of Truth - The Wise Ones
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,572
Canada
Is it just me or does it seem like gaming media / Twitter is very quiet about all of this? Not really seeing much of anything outside of these forums.

Unfortunately, abortion is still a big issue in the US. There was a poll recently, Gallup I think, where it was only 47% polled believe it is morally acceptable/allowed. I think this won't make any big splash with people because lets face it, a lot of Americans, heck, probably a lot of the world still think abortion is wrong.

news.gallup.com

Record-High 47% in U.S. Think Abortion Is Morally Acceptable

A record-high 47% of U.S. adults think abortion is morally acceptable, while 46% believe it is morally wrong. U.S. adults are also split in their self-identification as "pro-life" or "pro-choice."
 

Zep

Banned
Jul 12, 2021
1,456
It seems weird that Sony wouldn't let Insomniac make an official statement, but then let Ted Price say, in so many words, that Sony enforced a gag order on them. Like, that just makes them look even worse, and it's pretty clear going by Price's statement that Insomniac's position would be in support of reproductive rights. Insomniac has effectively made their stance clear even if it's not an "official" statement, so Sony only lost more face by restricting Insomniac.
I mean all of this stuff is internal…They didn't let Ted Price say anything from what I'm reading in the article.
 

Empty Your Head

Alt Account
Banned
Feb 1, 2022
1,579
Honestly super weak of people to say boycotting is pointless. What else should people do? Buy more Sony shit so they see our progressive bux and change their minds? People taking a personal stand against injustices is never wrong.
 

Glasfrut

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
3,538
The Miscalculation here was them thinking it would stay internal, and the stance shouldve been more fleshed out in terms of that we will support women affected and leave it at that and we are weighing options and waiting on a ruling to see what we (sony) will do to help workers affected or some shit. Whatever that was prob was the worst response. They pretty much could've just said nothing or support without directly supporting and called it a day And still play both sides which is what all corps do.

While id rather like a full throated stance, I understand for most companies and organizations they will never get ahead of a political issue, they will fall in line with what is the majority response to that issue and not a second sooner. While I understand the heat on how Jim conveyed shit, reality is that silence/"we will support employees affected" is pretty much the most companies will do at this juncture.

Yeah (and Jim is probably getting all his company-wide emails vetted by PR now...if he still has emailing privileges)
 

platocplx

2020 Member Elect
Member
Oct 30, 2017
36,072
Is it just me or does it seem like gaming media / Twitter is very quiet about all of this? Not really seeing much of anything outside of these forums.
Most companies are silent. Thats why.


this activision statement was this:
Activision Blizzard, a prominent game developer facing multiple lawsuits and investigations over its corporate culture and CEO Bobby Kotick, provided a brief statement on abortion rights late Tuesday evening. "We are committed to an inclusive environment that is supportive of all of our employees," said Rich George, a spokesperson for Activision Blizzard. "As a company, providing fair and equitable health care is a top priority, and we will closely monitor developments in the coming weeks and months."

Microsoft said this:
"Microsoft will continue to do everything we can under the law to protect our employees' rights and support employees and their enrolled dependents in accessing critical health care — which already includes services like abortion and gender-affirming care — regardless of where they live across the U.S.," reads a statement issued to The Post. "This support is being extended to include travel expense assistance for these and other medical services where access to care is limited in availability in an employee's home geographic region."


What sony should have done was similar. Jims statement was stupid. And even these when you read in between the lines are not full support and just support of people affected. Which is also what should beven their stance rather than that respect each others opinions garbage.

Yeah (and Jim is probably getting all his company-wide emails vetted by PR now...if he still has emailing privileges)
If you see the two stances above. This is what shouldve been said. And probally wouldve been received well enough without having to go full " we support Reproductive rights. Etc. etc. Which I dont think most Corps will go to at this juncture without a ruling.
 

Gestault

Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,383
Sony leadership can rot in hell. I hope there's a brain drain in response to this. This is in contrast to other companies in the industry (1) supporting legal efforts to maintain those rights, (2) putting out statements in support and highlighting their own efforts, and (3) saying straight up they'll pay for travel and legal fees to make sure their employees can get those health services, even if it means leaving the state.
 

gabdeg

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,970
🐝
Sony under Jim Ryan is just constant fart and toilet flushing sounds. Get that guy out of there.

Edit: Seems like it is a company-wide guideline. Fuck the whole place then.
 
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bdbdbd

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,904
The person who tries to derail a conversation about a specific topic.

If you want to talk about Nintendo and Microsoft, make a thread about it. This thread is about what Sony has decided to do and the focus should be on them. Pretty simple.
What Sony has decided to do is pretty much the same as what a lot of other companies have decided to do so far, we just have a few insider details as corroboration. But you hardly need those details to know that the fact that most other companies and their employees are unresponsive at this time doesn't actually mean all those employees are gung-ho anti-abortionists. There is no doubt plenty of orders in place to either prohibit employees/departments from talking about it publicly at all or only doing so through "approved" channels. This is nothing new with the way companies try to control messaging internally.

We don't need to talk about all those other companies here, but it is still threadworthy for this thread why the insta-indignation is warranted towards Sony well above others when this is clearly a tact being employed by most businesses/corporations right now.

Look at how people in this thread are suddenly reacting to Sony's matching donations policy that is long-standing, bog-standard, boilerplate stuff employed across many businesses.

What exactly is the "conversation" about if it's just targeting Sony for stuff that 90% of corporations and businesses will tell you is standard policy? Going after Sony alone isn't going to make a dent in the threat to women's rights that's imminent here.
 

CorpseLight

Member
Nov 3, 2018
7,666
The bare truth is that a persons right to choose what happens to their own body when it does not effect other people shouldn't even be a conversation - full stop.

Republicans and Conservatives have twisted the whole discussion around this to fit their agenda and theirs only. It's a paradoxical situation; they believe in freedom and rights above all else, yet magically that logic is gone when it comes to a womans choice about their own body.

"A difference of opinion" would be this: I don't personally agree with abortion, however I understand that it is your right to do as you want with your life.
Not: I don't agree with abortion so I am changing the rules so no-one can have them, and also you will be thrown in jail if you try and get around it.

You can't entertain civility in discussions with Conservatives, because its a bad faith discussion. They will not come around to your point of view, because their entire reality is objectively broken.
 

Gestault

Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,383
"Sony is comfortable with healthcare and privacy rights being taken away by force from women everywhere, including our own staff. We think it's more important that people not argue than for women to have these rights, because they don't deserve them. We're going to prevent any statements from studios we own that might insinuate that we supports those rights. It's worth noting that dogs are an animal I like because they're subservient and know their place, and I'm saying this in relation to women."

- Jim Ryan, via his actions and words
 
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