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ThisIsBlitz21

Member
Oct 22, 2018
4,662
So Pokemon OR/AS dont ever get the same recognition as other remakes in the Pokemon series. And I sort of agree, these titles aren't as strong as remakes as HeartGold/SoulSilver were for their original games, respectively.

Though when it comes down it, I'll take OR/AS over the original R/S/E any day of the week.

First off, there's the improvements that come with the nature of being a newer game, all the advancement from generation 3 to 6.
- Physical/Special Split (significantly improves the battle system)
- Infinite TM's (Having TM's being one time use was irritating)
- PSS (The best online system
- Super Training, Pokemon Amie, Triple Battles, Horde Battles.)
- New evolutions to gen 3 pokemon such as Roserade and Gallade
- Day/Light cycle (was taken out in gen 3 after being in gen 2)
- No Safari Zone (don't @ me, it has always sucked)
Then improvements upon the original games, in my opinion:
- Characters (like May, Steven, and the evil team) have more personality, and a result the story feels better realized (still not that "good", just much better.)
- World feels richer with the abundance of more lore, especially from places like Mauville City and the Sunken ship, and even the Buzznav app. Hoenn just feels more lived in than before.
- Dexnav. One of the best features Pokemon has ever introduced. It was fun catching pokemon with egg moves or hidden abilities.
- Soaring. Flying across the region was Latios/Latias was awesome, a shame that the mechanic never returned.
- Improved Secret Bases, it's cool how you can almost turn one into your own personal gym.
- Better music. It's much more chill to listen to than the overused blaring trumpets on gen 3, which just gave me a headache after a while. This is probably the most subjective point in the entire list, so if you prefer the OG soundtrack, I understand.
- Better graphics (cheating, I know). OG Hoenn felt way too washed out and felt like it was created with pastel. OR/AS art direction I think is really good and recreates many locations beautifully, like Meteor Falls. Or I like it across the board, EXCEPT for Chibi heads.
- Better surfing, faster speed plus lowered encounter rates make the game way less annoying in the second half. And unique models for Wailmer, Kyogre, and Sharpedo/
- Mega Evolution. Better implemented in ORAS over X/Y, cause of a lot of gen 3 pokemon actually get it. Cool new designs for old gen 3 pokemon.

Let's get to the elephant in the room: Battle Frontier. Yes, I agree with most that the removal of the facility sucks. I think due to this, Emerald does have the better postgame (and the gym leader rebattles). However I think ORAS's postgame isn't all that bad. I liked the Delta Episode, and the Deoxys battle at the end is an AMAZING moment of fanservice, that I'm really surprised people dislike it. Plus Mirage Islands is cool idea as well.

But as for other reasons people say R/S/E is better, I just can't agree. I've seen people cite trivial things like the removal of the berry blender minigame, no game corner, and removing a single floor from the trick house. I didn't notice many major difficultly changes from R/S, both felt fairly easy to me. Just be sure to stash away that Latias in a PC box, I hate that they just give you one for free, even if it serves the purpose for Soaring.

I think if OR/AS were to have a single change, which is adding Battle Frontier, I think people's opinion would be much higher on the game, even if the rest of it was as-is. But in it's real state, I think it's really good remake of gen 3, and oozes with atmosphere and charm. Sure there are some features removed, but in my opinion, the ones that have been added throughout the years and in ORAS outweigh them significantly.


It also partially redeemed gen 6 for me. X/Y was really disappointing to me, but ORAS was a really good rebound that fused the generation 3 games with the cool new features of X/Y, QoL improvements throughout the years, as well as some ideas of it's own. It's not in my top echelon of Pokemon games, but it's pretty damn good none the less.
 
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Serebii

Serebii.net Webmaster
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
13,126
ORAS were the best remakes of a Pokémon game. They dealt with the problems of the base variant and added a lot to it.

I will fight this hands down. HGSS was too like-for-like and had so many of the same problems GS had
 

Zalman

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,896
They're far better than the originals. I'd also rather have the post-game in ORAS than Battle Frontier again.
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,175
ORAS are better than R/S, but not Emerald, is my stance.

Perfectly enjoyable and the best post-DS game, but could have used the more challenging rosters of Emerald at least and not have some of the dungeon designs as dumbed down as they were.
 

LazyLain

Member
Jan 17, 2019
6,498
Ruby/Sapphire's one of my least favorite gens, and the only Pokemon gen where I haven't beaten any of its games.

ORAS, conversely, are my favorite Pokemon games since Crystal.
 

Serebii

Serebii.net Webmaster
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
13,126
They're far better than the originals. I'd also rather have the post-game in ORAS than Battle Frontier again.
Battle Frontier is wanted by a very vocal but very small minority.

I can't remember where but I'm pretty sure they once said that only a small portion of the audience ever bothered with it.
 

riq

Member
Feb 21, 2019
1,687
I don't really get why I feel the way I do, but I really enjoyed OR/AS. They had no excuse to not keep the stuff Emerald introduced, but DexNav was just so much fun.
I also teared up a little with the Hi Skitty sidequest.
I think these were the last Pokemon games I really enjoyed.

It sucks it lacks the BF but I find it even more annoying that Team Magma lost their volcano base lol
 

lairo

Member
May 28, 2020
464
ORAS needed to be defended? I thought pretty much everyone liked it. No Battle Frontier is pretty much the only bad thing about it.
 

WrenchNinja

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,745
Canada
However I think ORAS's postgame isn't all that bad. I liked the Delta Episode, and the Deoxys battle at the end is an AMAZING moment of fanservice, that I'm really surprised people dislike it.
The Delta episode consists of you flying somewhere, talking to someone, battling a weak trainer, repeatedly, until you have to go to the Sky Pillar where you're forced to listen to the sob story and battle one of the worst characters in the series, then you're forced to catch Rayquaza and then you're immediately in a battle with Deoxys. I dont know if all that is worth a minute long encounter.
 

Faiyaz

Member
Nov 30, 2017
5,283
Bangladesh
ORAS is better than the original RSE in every possible way EXCEPT the exclusion of the Battle Frontier. And since the BF was such a huge, excellent feature in Emerald, it really soured a lot of people.
 

EarthPainting

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,877
Town adjacent to Silent Hill
I thought it was a good remake, but at the end of the day it remains Gen 3. I didn't really care for the original back in the day, and while I did enjoy the remake a lot more, it too ended up in the "not really caring for it" pile now that I have some distance from it. I never engage with Battle Frontier-esque content, so I didn't miss its absence. My Pokémon experiences typically end at the credits.
 

ArchedThunder

Uncle Beerus
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,067
I'd rather play ORAS than Emerald.
That being said I hope the inevitable Gen 4 remakes are based on Platinum. Unlike Emerald, Platinum was a massive improvement over the base versions.
 

ZeroX

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
21,266
Speed Force
ORAS were fine. Better than XY for sure and a solid palette cleanser. I agree that they're the best remakes and also think HGSS were the weakest remakes, and this is coming from someone who thought Crystal is probably the second best behind Platinum. HGSS barely improved on anything while feeling off the whole time. I'd rather play the originals.

also too much water is a legit complaint, sorry Gen 3.
 

aisback

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,741
I love how those games are somewhat difficult. I found later games too easy.


I just wished it had more extra content
 

King Kingo

Banned
Dec 3, 2019
7,656
Yeah, Omega Ruby/Alpha Sapphire is better than Ruby/Sapphire, but Emerald beats them all because of the wealth of content and additional challenges that are available.

HGSS barely improved on anything while feeling off the whole time. I'd rather play the originals.

Maybe it's some of the Pokemon sprites? Some of them were ugly. HG/SS is weird because the Hoenn sprites are unchanged from D/P which does present a sense of disconnect.
 

ZeroX

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
21,266
Speed Force
Maybe it's some of the Pokemon sprites? Some of them were ugly. HG/SS is weird because the Hoenn sprites are unchanged from D/P which does present a sense of disconnect.
Yeah I think a lot of the aesthetic changes weren't for the better. GSC felt like a different country from RBY, not so much here.

I don't mind LGFR or Let's Go but they also lost a lot of atmosphere from the original, notably places like Lavender Town
 

Valkerion

Member
Oct 29, 2017
7,242
ORAS were the best remakes of a Pokémon game. They dealt with the problems of the base variant and added a lot to it.

I will fight this hands down. HGSS was too like-for-like and had so many of the same problems GS had

Here here. 100% agree.

I really liked these versions way more than the original.
 
Jun 6, 2018
782
They're not wrong :P

Yeah but they were beloved due to nostalgia. GS are heavily flawed games

whats heavily flawed about GS/HGSS? Heart Gold is peak Pokémon to me but I am a Gen 2 fanboy.

ORAS just carries too much disappointment for me. Similar to complains I have with any game XY onwards the post game just severely lacks any oomph outside of online battles.

the Deoxys story was cool but it was way too short and it's basically the extent of story content you get once the game is done
 

Faiyaz

Member
Nov 30, 2017
5,283
Bangladesh
whats heavily flawed about GS/HGSS? Heart Gold is peak Pokémon to me but I am a Gen 2 fanboy.

ORAS just carries too much disappointment for me. Similar to complains I have with any game XY onwards the post game just severely lacks any oomph outside of online battles.

the Deoxys story was cool but it was way too short and it's basically the extent of story content you get once the game is done

Instead of one good region, we got two very underwhelming ones. Pokémon distribution is poor, Kanto level curve is terrible. Story is barebones and basic similar to Gen 1. Those are the main flaws.
 

Rockets

Member
Sep 12, 2018
3,011
Emerald had the ability to rematch gym leaders with better teams. ORAS didn't. Emerald had the battle frontier. ORAS didn't.

And if we're comparing remakes, HGSS gives you the gameboy player so you can choose to listen to the original soundtrack if you want to. ORAS has no such option.

Dexnav is great though and the music when you fight the Kyogre/Groudon is so good.
 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
17,550
ORAS suffers from the modern Pokémon game syndrome of having a million fucking cutscenes that are staged like ass and paced like molasses for the most unimportant minutia.

For that reason alone, it can't be as good as the Gameboy Advance originals.
 

Serebii

Serebii.net Webmaster
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
13,126
ORAS suffers from the modern Pokémon game syndrome of having a million fucking cutscenes that are staged like ass and paced like molasses for the most unimportant minutia.

For that reason alone, it can't be as good as the Gameboy Advance originals.
To be fair.

The "cutscenes" that most of the modern games have are basically the same as the originals, the difference is that due to 3D they can have differing angles than just be flat dialogue topdown
 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
17,550
To be fair.

The "cutscenes" that most of the modern games have are basically the same as the originals, the difference is that due to 3D they can have differing angles than just be flat dialogue topdown
To be fair, these changes make them much longer and therefore worse.
 

Dreamboum

Member
Oct 28, 2017
22,865
I liked the option to see how many Pokemon left to catch in an area. It's the only Pokemon since Silver that I stuck with because of this because I had an actual goal that I could look at
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,097
Battle Frontier is wanted by a very vocal but very small minority.

I can't remember where but I'm pretty sure they once said that only a small portion of the audience ever bothered with it.

I mean you could argue this for a lot of Pokemon side stuff, don't each online competitive season average around 500,000 players? Even at launch it only ever reached a million. And that number not only is singles and doubles combined, but also counting those that do one match then never touch online again (those wanting season rewards and those setting up the day skip for the shiny den exploit to make things trickier to tell). Even at beginner rank you often find net decked teams piloted by good (though not great) players.

If ever there was an argument to bring medals back, it would be if they came with a percentage of how many players got those medals, sorta like trophies and achievements giving percent rates foreach individual reward, would be fascinating to see how many people beat the game, how many did Raid Battles, how many did battle tower, how many did post-game, how many fought in Ranked, how many cooked a curry and so on and so forth

I'd Still argue that a mode should not be removed if it has a low player base though, refined, sure. But not removed or cut.
 

Serebii

Serebii.net Webmaster
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
13,126
I mean you could argue this for a lot of Pokemon side stuff, don't each online competitive season average around 500,000 players? Even at launch it only ever reached a million. And that number not only is singles and doubles combined, but also counting those that do one match then never touch online again (those wanting season rewards and those setting up the day skip for the shiny den exploit to make things trickier to tell). Even at beginner rank you often find net decked teams piloted by good (though not great) players.

If ever there was an argument to bring medals back, it would be if they came with a percentage of how many players got those medals, sorta like trophies and achievements giving percent rates foreach individual reward, would be fascinating to see how many people beat the game, how many did Raid Battles, how many did battle tower, how many did post-game, how many fought in Ranked, how many cooked a curry and so on and so forth

I'd Still argue that a mode should not be removed if it has a low player base though, refined, sure. But not removed or cut.
Yeah but Battle Frontier is a much smaller minority of players
 

Scruffy8642

Member
Jan 24, 2020
2,849
They're the best Pokémon games since the DS gen, didn't even know people thought the originals were better? As someone who grew up on RSE and got ridiculously hyped over ORAS, they absolutely delivered. Delta Episode was great, loved all the legendaries they added in and the flying mechanic. I still listen to the upgraded soundtrack regularly. Not sure there's a single thing I dislike tbh.

I guess I never cared about the battle frontier either, didn't think it was that great originally and don't miss it at all.
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,097
Yeah but Battle Frontier is a much smaller minority of players

I suppose you can help a bit with this, which pages are the most popular and least popular for Sword and Shield on your site (assuming you wish to divulge that information that is)

I'd ask for older generations but I imagine getting those numbers would be hard now.
 

Serebii

Serebii.net Webmaster
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
13,126
I suppose you can help a bit with this, which pages are the most popular and least popular for Sword and Shield on your site (assuming you wish to divulge that information that is)

I'd ask for older generations but I imagine getting those numbers would be hard now.
Max Raid Battle stuff is hugely popular. People underestimate the appeal of this. It is the best and most engaging post-game of any Pokémon game.

Least viewed is hard to say as there can be many reasons why people don't check something. The Restricted Sparring pages didn't get much traction though. Battle facilities tend not to
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,097
Max Raid Battle stuff is hugely popular. People underestimate the appeal of this. It is the best and most engaging post-game of any Pokémon game.

Least viewed is hard to say as there can be many reasons why people don't check something. The Restricted Sparring pages didn't get much traction though. Battle facilities tend not to

Raids should Become a staple feature in the series, it's simple stuff to work with others and get rewards, I just hope it's fleshed out a bit more in the future than "Use type effective Pokemon, hit for super effective every turn" even Mewtwo boiled down to that. Hopefully legendary raids in Tundra fix that.

Not surprised Restrictive Sparring is low, they didn't advertise that feature at all in the buildup to Isle of Armour, it got like, one checkbox on the main Pokemon site saying it existed with one paragraph of description that didn't even say what it was about.

Anyway this is sidetracking from the thread and all this might change with the Tundra stuff later today anyway.

ORAS is my preferred way to play Gen 6 but I would probably still play Emerald on a replay instead. Mainly because of preferring the sprite over world over the Chibi models, and Emerald plays faster as well. Gen 6 could really drag on with it's swooping camera angles at times (same can be argued for 7 and 8 too)
 

YellowBara

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,072
It's the remake I spent the most time with for sure, I think it's far better than people give it credit for.

I really wish this game had Sun and Moon's artstyle for the human characters though.
 

ADM975

Member
Feb 22, 2018
275
I was looking forward to these for years, and when they were finally announced I was ecstatic... however when I realised there was no BF I was devastated. I was so looking forwarded to the BF, the Emerald frontier is still my favourite post-game area/facility in any Pokemon game. ORAS would've probably been my favourite Pokemon games ever if they had the BF included.
 

Pokemaniac

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,944
Max Raid Battle stuff is hugely popular. People underestimate the appeal of this. It is the best and most engaging post-game of any Pokémon game.

Least viewed is hard to say as there can be many reasons why people don't check something. The Restricted Sparring pages didn't get much traction though. Battle facilities tend not to
I think Max Raid pages being popular has more to do with how Max Raids are designed than their popularity. I generally find them really tedious and boring, but still end up viewing those pages a bunch because of the events, and it's the only way to actually find anything for any of the non-event spawns.