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[IGN] Mixer, Ninja's New Streaming Platform, Criticized for Seemingly Strict Clothing Guidelines
- Thread starter dex3108
- Start date
What content are we looking for? It's not easy to define, and attempting to do it that way would likely end up being more restrictive than the clothing guidelines.
Thanks for completely ignoring the point. By the way if you can find a mixer female streamer who is against this please let me know because all you have done is say that basically these women's voices don't count and should not be listened to.
Both of these are fine for family friendly - the ratings could be because the streamer chose teen for some reason other than her clothing.
In fantasy land where men had the same clothing industry as women there'd be a more concentrated belief that these clothing options are not inherently sexual.
But because men are unaffected low key puritanism against women is pretty present in how society perceives women.
That's not a complete requirement for the platform, though. It's a requirement to be labelled in a specific way.
Of course your idea isn't outlandish. It's been tried, but it doesn't work. You can't derive people's intention by strictly watching their content, at least not in a way that's open a huge amount of subjectivity.
It must be really hard being a tank top these days.
Also, tank tops aren't inherently relegated to 18+.
So you basically default to glibness because you have no argument.
Cool glad we're in defacto agreement that tank tops ain't scandalous
The first one WAS showing up as family friendly, and then when I clicked in there she was being harassed pretty badly. I don't know for certain that it was because she was called out here, but you probably shouldn't link to specific women in a thread like this.
I'm not saying it's targeted at Ninja. it's very clearly targeted at Mixer. I'm saying that the timing of this article and the title are incredibly transparent. That doesn't take away from the discussion going on in here, it's just an observation. So yes, I know it's an article and I'm discussing it, including the title. What is the problem?
Secondly, I agree, it isn't something that inherently requires an 18+ warning. However, knowing the nonsense that happens on Twitch I can see why Mixer is being careful with their guidelines given their audience. Plus you need to think about it in practice. If it really was a big issue in practice, do you not think we would have seen this come up sooner? The platform and these TOS are 2-3 years old and there are loads of women streamers on the platform.
We're going in circles at this point anyway, and you're more than entitled to your opinion. I see the concern for sure, but I don't agree that this is simply just sexism disguised as policy. That's all.
The implication here being there are women who have attempted streaming there but been banned or told to make their stream 18+ due to what they wear. Who are these women? Genuine question. Because of the content creators who are complaining about this specifically, who this would affect, the only ones I see taking issue with the TOS are Twitch streamers/partners who were never interested in streaming on the platform in the first place.
Likewise, the fact that there are women Mixer streamers speaking out about how these TOS manifest in practice and are being completely ignored by people in this thread is ridiculous. To your own point, these are the woman who are quite literally affected by this on a daily basis, so why are their experiences and views not valid?
I understand why people read these terms of service and are taken aback, but actually look at what is happening in the community and on the platform before jumping to conclusions of sexism etc. It's not that hard.
Jesus, Mixer is some laggy ass shit.
Well shit, I hope it wasn't folks on here, but I'll edit out the links.
That's my bad.
Well shit, I hope it wasn't folks on here, but I'll edit out the links.
That's my bad.
Ive made the argument already. But your particular argument is based on false pretense. Tank-tops aren't inherently relegated to 18+. Since MS isn't doing this, there's no point in arguing with your strawman.
If a particular tank top is particularly revealing, it would be relegated to 18+. That's not nonsense. What is nonsense is pushing for some subjective intent policing (Which is impossible) in order to avoid a false sexism label, when it's perfectly reasonable to expect family-friendly streamers to use similar family-friendly broadcast guidelines seen all over the media/entrainment industry.
Yeah let's, pretend asking people not to wear low-cut, spaghetti string camisoles on kid's shows, in response to the widespread streamer behavior of intentionally titillating children for profit, presents an undo burden to women. That's a great argument!
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Check the just chatting section of twitch and you will know who does this.
Likely the case. There are a boat load of streamers on Twitch who do sexualize their content. Some where strapless tops that show a "very" generous amount of cleavage and have the cam panned high enough to imply they aren't whering a top.
Same goes for bottoms. Longer shirts that cover very short bottoms. The implication being that there are no shorts being worn at all.
PlThis is fine in 18+ streams. However, being sexual in a teen or family friendly stream is not ok as these streams show on the Xbox dashboard.
Women streaming on the Mixer platform are not arbitrarily banned. Mixer has ToS. It is the streamer's responsibility to follow the rules.
Do the rules affect women more so than men? They certainly do, however the restrictions are equal for both men and women.
Mixer is doing it right.
Dude the guidelines
Make this
Unsuitable to be seen by children lol and might even end up 18+ because no straps.
It's a complete Annihilation of reporting ethics. I wonder what their Endgame really is.
Dude the guidelines
Make this
Unsuitable to be seen by children lol and might even end up 18+ because no straps.
Okay? You couldn't wear that at my workplace either.
As for covering the body that rule from what I've seen includes men as well. I wear a tank top all summer long, but I can't wear it to work. I'm not even allowed to wear them at a bar around other adults!
I bet you could wear that if you worked at a clothing store
And for fuck sakes streaming is not an office
You guys keep posting this pic are being disingenuous. First off, said outfit would be banned for men too. Second I could post dozens of pics of strapless attire that would be a lot more revealing/sexual. Obviously with strict guidelines some things will be banned that probably shouldn't. But the alternative is having a guy/girl sitting on the other end of the stream determining who's being sexual or not. That's worse imo.Dude the guidelines
Make this
Unsuitable to be seen by children lol and might even end up 18+ because no straps.
Dude the guidelines
Make this
Unsuitable to be seen by children lol and might even end up 18+ because no straps.
Do you think they genuinely believe that this is inappropriate for children or that using clothing is simply the best way to exclude the content they don't want children seeing?
Dude the guidelines
Make this
Unsuitable to be seen by children lol and might even end up 18+ because no straps.
So fucking what?
Yes, this outfit is classy. But it's impossible to have a guideline, that properly gauges every single garment on the planet.
Maybe there's a would-be, family-friendly mixer streamer somewhere, who's wardrobe consists exclusively of this dress and dresses like it. But I imagine that population that falls into that category is too small to make special considerations for.
Put that first 18+ donation towards a pack of t-shirts and the "victim" can get that family stream they always dreamed off..
Lol if Men's fashion was like this we'd living in a far less assumed sexual world.
There is no problem. I was just commenting on how your posts come across to me. End of the day do you lol.
The biggest streamer in gaming is now streaming exclusively there. Even if there was a problem before it's not like there were big enough names out there to draw the spot light like there is now and has the potential to be in the future. Is that not a valid point. There are women who will not stream on Mixer because of these policies. Again, the existence of people who will follow a policy doesn't mean that there isn't a problem with it.
You think they didn't sign Ninja specifically so they could get eyes on their platform? Now that those eyes are looking why is it a problem? The whole, this would have come out sooner angle isn't valid when they are signing a dude to get people to look at them right now.
A little healthy debate is not bad :P
I don't think this policy is poorly intentioned but it is obviously targeting women first and foremost and I find the rules around it shitty. If you want to police a behaviour I think you write policy for that. I don't think you write a policy telling women what to wear that is this restrictive because society sexualizes their bodies so much apparently seeing chest is 18+.
You think clothing restrictions in the workplace only happen in office settings? For the record I've never seen a male employee of any store wearing a tank top. You can't even wear them working at a gym.
And whether it's your home or not, you're a paid employee of Microsoft when streaming. That's what you chose to do, so you adhere to their policy.
I don't deny that generally the world is more discriminative/restrictive against the female anatomy. But I don't think it's fair to claim mixer is being sexist for attempting to navigate this world in a positive way.
Pretty much which is why I'm not sure why people are thinking these guidelines are a good thing.
Well then, Ninja is even more on-brand for Mixer than I thought.
While the spirit of these rules could very well be to avoid certain content creators from making their streams more about showing off their physical assets than actual game streaming, the unintended effect is almost Taliban-like. These rules only negatively affect women, and the letter of the rule could be enforced to scrutinize women's attire to the extreme. (EDIT: and judging from tweets ITT, it certainly is being wielded that way)
Microsoft would do well to rethink their TOS strategy, and make it more inclusive.
While the spirit of these rules could very well be to avoid certain content creators from making their streams more about showing off their physical assets than actual game streaming, the unintended effect is almost Taliban-like. These rules only negatively affect women, and the letter of the rule could be enforced to scrutinize women's attire to the extreme. (EDIT: and judging from tweets ITT, it certainly is being wielded that way)
Microsoft would do well to rethink their TOS strategy, and make it more inclusive.
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No they aren't.
Again the guidelines are not sex specific. A man could not wear that dress on mixer either.
I kinda agree with this. I'd like to see more women streamers get viewers for their content but when I see a lot of viewers on a category, jump in and it's a high angle shot of someones chest I can't help but feel that it hurts lots of other female streamers out there who are missing out viewers even though they have great content because they don't look like goddesses. Some of them have great content too but it's hard to take seriously when they bulk of viewership is there to see a chest or ass when they take a stretch.
I don't think streaming should be a body image thing. Too many things in our lives are tied up with how pretty and successful you look. Having a sort of normal guideline on how to dress I'd like to see people becoming popular who aren't defined by their looks. Lets be fair a lot of the users are going to be drawn to sex no matter what but the less blatant it is the less impact it will have I hope.
I don't think streaming should be a body image thing. Too many things in our lives are tied up with how pretty and successful you look. Having a sort of normal guideline on how to dress I'd like to see people becoming popular who aren't defined by their looks. Lets be fair a lot of the users are going to be drawn to sex no matter what but the less blatant it is the less impact it will have I hope.
If it was socially common for men to wear that dress we'd be living in a society where that dress would not even for a second be "not allowed"
Defaulting to men are also banned from xyz women targeted rule is not actually a defense to my statement
I mean by your logic no sexist dress code could ever be sexist or reinforcing the sexualization of women existing because men are banned too!!111
Men generally choose not to wear this kind of clothing. It certainly exists, and when it appears it also sexualize. That's how fashion works in general.
The problem here isnt assumed sexually. MS is creating a barrier for overt sexuality in streams labelled family-friendly.
Since the guidlines are sweeping, no judgements or assumptions need to be made at all.
Women ( and men) can continue to dress in revealing clothing... They just can't do it in streams aimed at kids, regardless of intent.
Men generally choose not to wear this kind of clothing. It certainly exists, and when it appears it also sexualize. That's how fashion works in general.
The problem here isnt assumed sexually. MS is creating a barrier for overt sexuality in streams labelled family-friendly.
Since the guidlines are sweeping, no judgements or assumptions need to be made at all.
Just so I'm clear your argument here is that by women wearing "this kind" of clothing they are choosing to he sexualized.
Shoulders and breast bone.... really? Like I get why they're doing it, Twitch has a lot of issues with vague guidelines/rules. But those two examples rule out a lot of perfectly acceptable clothes, that you regularly see on day time TV. They would be better off doing a heat map on male and female illustrations with different body types, it would make it a lot clearer and avoid certain clothes being unnecessarily banned on teen and younger streams.
EDIT: Clarifying
EDIT: Clarifying
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