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If you were in Naruto's place, at what point (if ever) do you give up on Sasuke?
- Thread starter Deleted member 52442
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When Kakashi brings the team together for icebreakers and introductions and one of the first things Sasuke says is that his goal is to kill someone....what a psychopath.
Nah, that ain't true. We saw Sasuke try to sacrifice himself for Sakura and Naruto against Gaara. He even called Naruto and Sakura dear to him and his friends.
And we saw Sasuke get worried over Naruto when he heard about Itachi facing him.
It's only after Itachi tortures him again that Sasuke loses a lot of the good character development that he's had up until that moment.
Before that, Sasuke was a pretty standard rival character.
'cause he's atoning for his sins and that's sort of his role in the village as Supporting Kage. Naruto handles the domestic issues and Sasuke handles the threats outside the village.
He's a one man CIA.
Shikamaru is Naruto's a best friend but Sasuke is Naruto's (spirit) brother. That is how it's portrayed.
Kiba, Choji and Neji? Nah. Naruto doesn't really hang out with them or have contact with them as teens or even as adults.
Kiba and Neji are closer to friendly acquaintances of Naruto.
(And Naruto doesn't even have an actual relationship with Tenten or Ino)
I think we can all agree that Sasuke did nothing wrong, and he was treated very unfairly by everyone in the series.
Regardless of what got him to that point, I think it's a good role for grown-up Sasuke
Hey, he's a good daddy to Naruto's kids at least. Actions speak louder than words.
Definitely the attempt at Sakura's life even tho
the truth is he didn't like Sakura like that but was only attracted to her cause she had eyes for Sasuke(Best bullshit excuse to say he always cared about Hinata btw).
I realized that part of why I felt that Naruto's friendship with Sasuke was so real and precious were the stupid filler that I was too young and stupid to realize were filler. Even the mini arcs like the race they did together before Orochi's crew shows up.
Naruto's unconditional love for Sasuke was infectious to me.
I didn't care about Sasuke but I cared about his redemption. I cared because Naruto cared.
and god damn Naruto's panic attack when his friends tell him "the village has decided that Sasuke needs to be put down. And we're going to carry out the order" was weirdly relatable to me.
-but the real answer is
But when you think about it, Sakura was attempting to murder Sakura both those times so ehhh.
I mean it's the exact same thing with Naruto when you really about it. Like, that nigga ain't your friend lol. Just admit that the kiss was too good.
Quoted for truth.
Tfw your son falls in love with your true love:
But she was there to kill him though, how are his actions unfogivable when she was there to try and kill him.
After the battle at the valley of the end. That's the moment he should have realized Sasuke was lost.
Yeah Part 1 definitely should have spent more time developing their friendshipI realized that part of why I felt that Naruto's friendship with Sasuke was so real and precious were the stupid filler that I was too young and stupid to realize were filler. Even the mini arcs like the race they did together before Orochi's crew shows up.
Naruto's unconditional love for Sasuke was infectious to me.
I didn't care about Sasuke but I cared about his redemption. I cared because Naruto cared.
and god damn Naruto's panic attack when his friends tell him "the village has decided that Sasuke needs to be put down. And we're going to carry out the order" was weirdly relatable to me.
-but the real answer is
This right here.
An old boyfriend of mine loved Naruto, one reason being that Naruto always found the good in everyone and could befriend even his enemies. All about empathy, etc. This is one reason that boyfriend fell for me, because I had that same mentality...
... Of course this is the reason why I kept ending up in abusive relationships (both romantic and platonic), that same boyfriend being one of those abusers.
Believing in redemption, people changing, there being good deep inside a troubled person is a good lesson, but my goodness... Sometimes I feel animated shows, in particular Naruto, go a bit too far with this lesson.
To me, that line sounds more like what a jealous boy (struggling with his orientation) who has a crush on another boy would do.
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Everything would be solved if there were therapists in the Ninja World.
A lot of that fight is anime-only. Sasuke never broke Naruto's spine for instance. Naruto enters the One Tailed State while Sasuke was holding him underwater though and it's more Naruto getting desperate to win rather than the Nine Tails giving Naruto a revival.
So here's the reason why I can't fault Naruto for not holding that against Sasuke.
If my friend went out of her way to shoot at John Wick and then John Wick shot back and almost killed her, I wouldn't really hold it against John Wick at all for that because self-defense.
There are plenty of other reasons for Naruto to drop Sasuke but that specific reasoning never really flew for me.
I feel like this property (and by extension, many shonen) have a terrible aversion to the rule of writing "show don't tell". Like we only know he considers him precious because he says it in a dramatic moment. We never actually see it.Nah, that ain't true. We saw Sasuke try to sacrifice himself for Sakura and Naruto against Gaara. He even called Naruto and Sakura dear to him and his friends.
And we saw Sasuke get worried over Naruto when he heard about Itachi facing him.
It's only after Itachi tortures him again that Sasuke loses a lot of the good character development that he's had up until that moment.
Before that, Sasuke was a pretty standard rival character.
RDC just did a hilarious video on this trope:
That's a really good point.
Not about Naruto being toxic/clingy, but about the series giving a harmful message that could be easily misinterpreted by younger or impressionable audience.
Naruto's empathy and love are part of why I enjoy him as a protagonist. But mimicking Naruto's self-destructive depths of forgiveness does not translate well into real-life. I too had a pattern of staying in abusive relationships and keeping abusive friends in my life. I looked at the causation for their behavior, I felt empathy and sorrow for them and I loved them for the good traits. But for a long time I struggled to exit relationships that were harmful to me. Obviously I didn't pick this up from Naruto but I could see younger viewers and readers taking this lesson away from the series.
It's actually a problem with a lot of shonen. Naruto, Dragon Ball Z and One Piece are all notorious for keeping shitheel abusive characters around "because they're my friend no matter what" or forgiving despicably evil acts just because the character becomes a convenient ally or helps win a fight--- sometimes characters are forgiven without doing anything even remotely redemptive.
It makes me appreciate when series show characters breaking ties with abusers. It's too rare.
I'm sorry for your experience by the way. That sounds painful.
OP
OP
After me and my homies almost died trying to rescue him.
He also made Shikamaru cry, fuck him.
what happened here?
I mean that very scene is him trying to sacrifice his life so Naruto and Sakura can get away. So that would be showing.
It's just being not being subtle about the fact that Sasuke cares about them by spelling it out via dialogue why Sasuke is choosing to sacrifice himself for them which makes sense since Naruto is marketed toward 12 year olds and you can't really be subtle with them.
But for the most part you are correct just not for this scene.
This. It spend more time telling us they were friends than showing us and in the fight between them in the Valley of the End they didn't seem like friends fighting each other, more like enemies trying their best to kill the other. Contrast that to the Usopp vs Luffy fight where there's a very strongly established friendship before it and the fight itself shows they're just trying to win, not kill the other (with Luffy even holding back most of it)
Funnily enough, we've been getting a lotta scenes of Naruto hanging out with Kiba, Choji and Shikamaru when he was a kid and I think even Sasuke says Shikamaru is Naruto's best friend in Boruto lol.
The Kiba, Choji and Shikamaru stuff is also all anime filler. Naruto was a loner as a kid. He never hung out with anyone. The anime undercut that by trying to make Kid Naruto into a playmate for Kiba, Choji and Shikamaru. No idea why would they would contradict the fact that Naruto was ostracized as a child.
Hell, Shikamaru, Kiba and Choji's introductions into the series is Naruto going "fuck these guys".
Sasuke doesn't say that in Boruto either. I don't think Sasuke's ever said anything about Shikamaru in either anime.
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But that's where I disagree, respectfully of course! (more on the fundamentals of children programming)
I think kids are way more perceptive than we give them credit for. I think the entire industry believes what you said, when approaching things 'for kids', but I feel like they have the capacity to pick up on a ton of nuance (and it would also help them emotionally develop faster, too!)
That's just my mini-rant on the subject. I think its a problem not just in Japan but lots of Western cartoons too.
Yeah, I think getting stabbed in the chest is a pretty good sign to cut someone off.
Naruto's desperate need to "save" Sasuke after that--and abandoning the village in the first place--never made sense to me. Which hung over all of Part 2 like a cloud. And if that wasn't enough, Sasuke trying to kill him AGAIN after they finally reunited should've sealed it.
Funnily enough, Sasuke was actually faking it in that scene since Sasuke has a no kill rule until the truth about Itachi comes out. So Sasuke was never going to kill Naruto and Sakura, he was just putting up a show for Orochimaru and to get them to fuck off.
Sasuke won't even kill random Sound Ninja or Cursed Seal Level 2 prisoners.
When Haku almost got him on that bridge. Clearly he was the weak link.
I stopped watching after 20 episodes. Not out of disinterest, just... hm. Maybe I should give it another shot.
I mean she actually did almost murder him. Just a couple more inches and Sasuke would be dead but she hesitated not that Sasuke knew that.
Not to mention that Sasuke here is literally blind and when Sakura got there, he was almost blind.
Oh shit I didn't know that. Nvm then!I mean she actually did almost murder him. Just a couple more inches and Sasuke would be dead but she hesitated not that Sasuke knew that.
Not to mention that Sasuke here is literally blind and when Sakura got there, he was almost blind.
Until the infiltration on Orochimaru's base.
Legally speaking, Sasuke was a missing-nin, a deserter, a terrorist and a criminal. In terms of Naruto's mindset, he told the Cloud nin he would hold Sasuke's deaths against them. So by that reasoning his ideals aren't consistent and completely fall apart.
Legally speaking, Sasuke was a missing-nin, a deserter, a terrorist and a criminal. In terms of Naruto's mindset, he told the Cloud nin he would hold Sasuke's deaths against them. So by that reasoning his ideals aren't consistent and completely fall apart.