If New Super Mario Bros. U was the only NSMB game, would it be recognized as one of the best Mario games?

[monali]

For a certain demographic, I suppose. I never really played 2D Mario for the multiplayer experience. And while 4 player simultaneous co-op is a neat novelty, it's still tethered to everything else that many have raised issues with. Plus it arguably compromises the level design of the single-player to some degree.

And by that point, Kirby's Return to Dreamland would have already introduced many to 4 player co-op the year before, lessening the impact. Of course, it's possibly it was itself inspired by NSMBW...

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I'm one of those people who vastly prefer 3d land to 3d world for the same reasons, so I understand you.
But you said "irrespective of what one may think of the quality of the games themselves" which makes what you or me think about the game quality irrelevant, the game did push boundaries and that what I meant, and didn't Kirby's Return to Dreamland released 2 years after NSMB Wii?

 

[BigTime_2018]

I don't know about one of the best Mario games, but definitely one of the best 2D Mario games.

Most criticisms for NSMBU aren't about its level design. Most are about how it borrows its presentation from past NSMB games.

Despite its very familiar presentation, NSMBU has great gameplay. I consider it one of the best 2D Mario games because of that aspect. If it were the only NSMB game in the series, I think a lot more people would regard it as highly.

 

[Poimandres]

NSMB DS had the mega mushroom and mini mushroom.

All the games are great, the criticisms are from people who wanted new 3D games like 64 and Galaxy. It wasn't that the games were bad, stale, etc, it's just that they were not what those specific people wanted. If 4 Galaxy style 3D games had been released instead, not a single one of those people would be complaining.

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I disagree. The NSMB series was about looking backwards, not moving forward. I'd be super interested in a new 2D game that has a fresh art style, has more creative level themeing, better music etc. The New games are bland, and that's why I dislike them. I also found Galaxy 2 a lot less engaging than Galaxy 1. I don't want "more of the same" from Mario. I want fresh experiences which the series as a whole has delivered several times.... Why should I lower my expectations because the game has decided to settle for less?

 

[AndreGX]

Funnily enough, NSMB Wii was itself heavily inspired by Kirby Superstar; so really, it just ended up coming full circle here.

Return To Dreamland is still the best game in the Kirby series BTW; with Robobot close behind!

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I loved Superstar so much! Tho I really need to give Robobot a go one of these days...

and didn't Kirby's Return to Dreamland released 2 years after NSMB Wii?

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It did! But we're discussing a timeline in which NSMBU is the only NSMB game :)

 

[Deleted member 21411]

Ehhhhhh..... The point of this thread is a stretch isn't it

 

[Jegriva]

I find it boring and with too much empty space in the levels. And the two Toads idea was stupid.

 

[monali]

It did! But we're discussing a timeline in NSMBU is the only NSMB game :)

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Lol, can't believe you trolled me with this one.

Spoiler

You were right all along god dammit

 

[ZeoVGM]

It's a shame that it isn't generally considered that. It is unquestionably the best in the NSMB series but also one of the best Mario games in its own right.

The NSMB series generally never reached the heights that it could have. NSMB and NSMB2 are solid. NSMB WIi is great. But U is fantastic. The squirrel suit is fun as hell and the level design is some of the best in a 2D Mario title.

The problem is that it's the fourth game that reuses the same art style and includes some of the most boring and bland music in a Mario platformer.

I'm still disappointed that the port to Switch wasn't actually New Super Mario Bros. All-Stars:

- Remakes of NSMB and NSMB2 using NSMBU assets.
- 2-player co-op added to the original NSMB. (I feel like adding 4-player multiplayer to the original and NSMB2 might not work with the original level design but I could be wrong.)
- HD remaster of NSMB Wii.
- NSMBU and New Super Luigi U.
- Online multiplayer options for all games.

Alas.

 

[Deleted member 10737]

probably yeah. the game is solid as fuck, just a joy to play. it's just that by now (and by the time it originally released) that style of mario and those world themes and enemy designs feel boring and stale, and it can feel just like a level pack for past NSMB games. comparing that to 1/2/3/world where each game has a completely distinct visual style, doing 4 games in the same style wasn't the right move.

 

[B4mv]

It's probably my favorite 2D Mario game, so I think so.

 

[Pancakes R Us]

NSMB DS had the mega mushroom and mini mushroom.

All the games are great, the criticisms are from people who wanted new 3D games like 64 and Galaxy. It wasn't that the games were bad, stale, etc, it's just that they were not what those specific people wanted. If 4 Galaxy style 3D games had been released instead, not a single one of those people would be complaining.

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Sorry, but you're wrong. I love 2D Mario games. I just thought that the look of the NSMB games was really boring and uninspired. Whilst I haven't played U for more than 30 mins, I've played and completed NSMB, Wii and 2. Just how many times can the same world themes be re-used?

 

[Zacmortar]

NSMB DS had the mega mushroom and mini mushroom.

All the games are great, the criticisms are from people who wanted new 3D games like 64 and Galaxy. It wasn't that the games were bad, stale, etc, it's just that they were not what those specific people wanted. If 4 Galaxy style 3D games had been released instead, not a single one of those people would be complaining.

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No, I wanta new 2D artstyle

also Galaxy 2 was already too much galaxy lol

 

[Jon God]

No, it's sterile, 'best of the past' with not enough new stuff, mediocre soundtrack... I dunno. It's not the _worst_ Mario game, but I just can't see it being anywhere near the top of 'best Mario games' list.

 

[Blackie]

NSMBU is my favorite 2d Mario. In fact it might just be my favorite Mario, period. I need to purchase it again for Switch :)

 

[Listai]

I'm not sure.

I could never get past the insipid soundtrack and soulless art design.

 

[Kazooie]

NSMB DS had the mega mushroom and mini mushroom.

All the games are great, the criticisms are from people who wanted new 3D games like 64 and Galaxy. It wasn't that the games were bad, stale, etc, it's just that they were not what those specific people wanted. If 4 Galaxy style 3D games had been released instead, not a single one of those people would be complaining.

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That's wrong, there are a lot of very visual people who do not care that much about gameplay, but a lot about presentation and the NSMB games' presentation is pretty simple. That being said, NSMBU is the best 2D Mario and I hope it is regarded as such by a significant portion of this forum.

 

[BassForever]

In this theory scenario NSMBU would have been the first 2D Mario in almost 20 years correct? Mario in HD with mechanics from the 3D titles like spin jump, ground pound, and triple jump would have blown people away. People would also be generally more receptive to "grass, sand, ice, beach, forest, sky, lava world" formula since it would have been the first time seeing that since really SMB3. Then you throw in multiplayer (a first for the series), tons of new power ups (mini mushroom, ice mushroom, propeller suit, and penguin suit would all be new), and the return of the koopalings (which was a big deal when they were announced for nsmbwii).

I think NSMBU would have had a ton more buzz around it, discussion down the road might turn into "was nsmbu as ambitious as it could have been" but it wouldn't be viewed as stale or repetitive.

 

[TheZjman]

Yes. It's the best 2D Mario game.

 

[Jimnymebob]

Absolutely. It's just behind 3 in terms of best 2D Mario's (not counting Yoshi's Island here), but people dismissed it because BAH BAH, Wii U, and the artstyle, even though it's noticeably better looking than Wii and DS.

 

[RM8]

It might be my favourite 2D Mario, actually. I never minded the New series even if I'd prefer a new art style.

 

[unicornKnight]

I say yes, part of the reason for the disdain for the series come from how samey the 4 games look at first glance, not helped because NSMB2 and NSMBU were released 4 months apart from each other

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And NSMB2 was a weak game. Fun but weak to hold the Mario name on it's title.

 

[Hieroph]

I say yes, part of the reason for the disdain for the series come from how samey the 4 games look at first glance, not helped because NSMB2 and NSMBU were released 4 months apart from each other

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That was a stupid thing from Nintendo to do. "Here's another New Super Mario Bros. game! And here's yet another New Super Mario Bros. game!" I have no idea what they were thinking with that, other than desperately needing something other than Nintendo Land to launch Wii U with.

They really should have delayed NSMB U and given it more time in the oven. That way they could have come up with better gimmicks than the Miiverse features and whatever they did with the Wii U Gamepad. At least the coin gimmick in NSMB2 actually makes it stand out.

 

[Gundam]

NSMB DS had the mega mushroom and mini mushroom.

All the games are great, the criticisms are from people who wanted new 3D games like 64 and Galaxy. It wasn't that the games were bad, stale, etc, it's just that they were not what those specific people wanted. If 4 Galaxy style 3D games had been released instead, not a single one of those people would be complaining.

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This is incorrect because I don't give a shit about most 3D Mario games but I still share a lot of the same criticisms with the NEW games as many others

 

[Wariobenotware]

It would still be a pale imitation of the classic 2D games. In a world where DKCR and TF exist that tried really hard to make each level standout i don't think NSMBU would ever be considered one of the best Mario games. The best Mario games are the ones that tried to push things with constantly creative level design and ambition. There isn't really anything memorable or truly exceptional about NSMBU. It just another 2D platformer that isn't anywhere near as good as the best games in the genre.

If NSMBU was the only NSMB game it would only make a tiny difference in the grand scheme of things. I'm not even convinced that it was better than the Wii entry.

 

[Molten_]

I mean, yeah. You could say this about a lot of iterative sequels, though. Doesn't really change the fact that we've already played three other very similar games in the past.

Maybe in time, history will remember NSMBU as one of the better mario games. But right now within the context of our time, it feels extremely unoriginal.

 

[giapel]

In my eyes NSMB Wii was the peak of this particular design. So if that didn't exist, then yes NSMB U would be regarded higher.

 

[Deleted member 26156]

I'd say it would be if NSMB2 simply didn't exist.

 

[Ramsay]

It would be recognised better than it is now, but definitely not as one of the best Mario games. It's overall presentation is still really bland even if you don't take NSMB's oversaturation into account, and it's level design isn't that good (World and arguably 3 is better than it in this regard).

 

[Adventureracing]

I love the NSMB games especially the DS one and i've never understood the hate. I even loved the bah bah music.

 

[FreddeGredde]

Oh absolutely.

It would be the only co-op Mario game and thus an absolutely unique and unforgettable game that everyone should play. (Still is though.)

 

[Mekanos]

In this theory scenario NSMBU would have been the first 2D Mario in almost 20 years correct? Mario in HD with mechanics from the 3D titles like spin jump, ground pound, and triple jump would have blown people away. People would also be generally more receptive to "grass, sand, ice, beach, forest, sky, lava world" formula since it would have been the first time seeing that since really SMB3. Then you throw in multiplayer (a first for the series), tons of new power ups (mini mushroom, ice mushroom, propeller suit, and penguin suit would all be new), and the return of the koopalings (which was a big deal when they were announced for nsmbwii).

I think NSMBU would have had a ton more buzz around it, discussion down the road might turn into "was nsmbu as ambitious as it could have been" but it wouldn't be viewed as stale or repetitive.

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This post I feel most accurately describes what it would be like. It's a great game but it took four games to get there.

I kinda feel like reception overall among fans would be similar to Mega Man 9, which was regarded as a great throwback title that's as good as the best of the NES games, but perhaps not quite indisputably the best and a bit too reliant on formula.

 

[Glio]

Except the music, is one of the best Mario games, not just 2D Mario.

 

[Blufunk]

It's still one of the best 2D Mario with SMB3 and SMB2USA.

 

[Z-Beat]

Sorry to bump this, but I have a question:

I haven't played a NSMB game since the first one on the DS, and this one is currently on sale for $40. Is that worth the buy or should I get Yoshi's Crafted World for the same price instead?

 

[the_wart]

Sorry to bump this, but I have a question:

I haven't played a NSMB game since the first one on the DS, and this one is currently on sale for $40. Is that worth the buy or should I get Yoshi's Crafted World for the same price instead?

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I enjoyed Yoshi's Crafted World quite a bit, but NSMBU is an all-time great platformer. Unless you're really tired of 2D Mario, there's no contest.

Yoshi's Crafted World is more like an adventure game. The "platforming" itself is pretty trivial, and the fun is in exploring and interacting with the beautiful environments.

 

[Z-Beat]

I enjoyed Yoshi's Crafted World quite a bit, but NSMBU is an all-time great platformer. Unless you're really tired of 2D Mario, there's no contest.

Yoshi's Crafted World is more like an adventure game. The "platforming" itself is pretty trivial, and the fun is in exploring and interacting with the beautiful environments.

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I don't remember the last time I played a Yoshi's Island game. Last Mario game was Odyssey which I enjoyed quite a bit and last 2D was NSMB on the DS. Thanks for the reply. I'll go with NSMBU Deluxe

 

[Deleted member 17092]

the music is the main issue with it but it's a fine game.

 

[cw_sasuke]

Already is one of the best games in the series.

 

[Jaded Alyx]

Yes no question, and I still think it was asinine to release (the utterly underwhelming) NSMB 2 just 5 months earlier.

Sorry to bump this, but I have a question:

I haven't played a NSMB game since the first one on the DS, and this one is currently on sale for $40. Is that worth the buy or should I get Yoshi's Crafted World for the same price instead?

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Mario. I cannot stress this enough.

There should be a Yoshi demo on the eShop.

 

[ScOULaris]

Eh, I doubt it. You can't really separate it from being a NSMB game because all of its failings are what that series is known for. Generic rehashes of concepts already done to death in better, older 2D Mario entries.

It's the best of all the NSMB games, but that's not saying much since none of them come close to stuff like SMB3 and SMW.

 

[Spinosaurus]

Challenge Mode alone makes it my favourite in the series, and NSLU was cherry on top.

What a good game.

 

[Efejota]

Would Rayman Origins or all those multiplayer 2D platformers from around that era have happened if it wasn't for NSMBWii?
Anyways, it probably would have been well regarded but not as much as NSMB. That said, if NSMBU had actually been the first game I think they'd have done something more ambitious for the character lightning and animations, essentially making a better looking game. The NSMB series basically suffered from using SMB64 as a base for years, a similar problem to what has been going on with Pokémon.

I know the levels were great because of how tighly designed they were, but I'd love to see a new game that features lots of power ups, old and new even if some feel redundant, so that you can have a different experience depending on what you managed to get. I liked how power-ups were sparse in SMB3 and gave you some different strategies for each level if you managed to keep the suits, but the newer games would always give you the key power-up for each level. Blue and Pink Baby yoshies were in the good direction in my opinion, and I wish it applied to regular yoshi as well.

Challenge Mode alone makes it my favourite in the series, and NSLU was cherry on top.

What a good game.

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I wish they expanded on this concept for the Deluxe version, instead of actually removing levels. I loved that mode, but it was over in an afternoon.

 

[Giga Man]

It only needed to be the 3rd NSMB game to be properly recognized. Like, they showed this game as a concept when they unveiled the Wii U, and that was BEFORE they announced NSMB2 for 3DS. NSMB2 was the most unnecessary Mario game in recent memory.

NSMBU actually did some significantly new shit that changed the game, what with the Baby Yoshis with unique abilities, cool new graphical aesthetics, new power-ups. NSMB2 was just coins everywhere, the music is worse because they added more BAHs, and continued the 3DS Mario trend of milking SMB3 nostalgia at every turn. (I am so damn sick of the Raccoon/Tanuki suit.)

Honestly, the music in NSMB2 bothers me the most. With how many BAHs they added to areas where there didn't need to be any (like the Castle theme from NSMBWii), I would have had way more respect for the game if it just went full A Capella.

 

[ClockworkOwl]

No it's easy, slow and just downright tedious overall imo

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Yup. I don't know why everyone on ERA likes it so much. The level design is so bland and the extremely low difficulty really hurts the game. I abandoned the game somewhere near the end because I realized I was simply forcing myself to play it.