I would have enjoyed 'Knives Out' way more if it wasn't so predictable (spoilers)

[SilverX]

I loved the film's atmosphere (for that alone I will be watching it again in October) and there was a sense of fun and silliness added to the whole dreary murder mystery at hand, but the real reason for watching it just felt robbed since 95% of any twists were seen coming a mile away.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the interaction between characters and other little tidbits, but I was expecting some "Holy shit didn't expect that" kinds of revelations and that just doesn't happen in the movie. And I am not a whodunnit fiend who can't get enough of the genre, I have seen just a few oldies and some Scooby Doo episodes but that was enough to see the hints and timing/placement of events to know most of when it happened and who knew it happened.

Also, when Evan's character took such an interest in keeping close to the protagonist I was smirking since I said to my family "So they just revealed the antagonist..." and no one understood what I meant lol.

I truly went in knowing nothing about the film or its cast and I haven't read anything about it other than it was very favorably received, but is the predictability of the film a common complaint? It has a lot going for it with the performances and the decent script, but I struggle to see how a mystery that gives away so much cannot leave people a bit sour about the experience.

 

[Video Games Are Dumb]

Yeah, pretty much the same. You've got a huge cast of interesting characters and they are oh so quickly pushed off the screen for like...three people. It right around that midway point where I stopped caring about what would happen, even if I was entertained.

It's well made and well written. But the actual story and what it sacrifices along the way is a shame.

 

[pikachief]

I felt like it was obvious who did it from the start but I also felt like the movie didnt try very hard to hide it. For me the movie was more about the family and the twists and turns along the way rather than the actual mystery.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

I also cynically guessed the antagonist of the film, but that doesn't make the film bad, especially since it doesn't cheat. It works as a genuine mystery right up until the end.

 

[theme park joe]

The whodoneit wasnt about Harlan but Fran.

 

[Nose Master]

Eh, i think not having him be alive at the end was a good side step of the most obvious twist

 

[Jakenbakin]

I just watched this a couple of nights ago. I loved it but I'll agree I saw a lot of it coming, but the way the film was designed felt like it had constant twists and turns so I didn't mind. I mean the main mystery of the film isn't solved so much as just shown, which I thought was a brilliant subversion to get the audience looking for more mysteries (which there were!). There were still some good twists I hadn't expected, or a few motivations I wasn't sure on throughout as well.

 

[Pendas]

I felt like it was obvious who did it from the start but I also felt like the movie didnt try very hard to hide it. For me the movie was more about the family and the twists and turns along the way rather than the actual mystery.

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This, I had most of it figured out to the point where I second-guessed myself thinking "it can't be THAT obvious..." But yeah it was.

 

[Viewt]

I think the film's main strength is seeing the dynamic/interplay between Craig's character and the rest of the cast, and also how the film plays with the "whodunit" template. Personally, I didn't see the ending telegraphed too noticeably, but I'll finally admit to being a bit of a mark when it comes to these films. I love Sleuth for the same reasons.

If it didn't work for you, then that's totally valid, but it worked like gangbusters for me.

 

[Kain]

For all the hype the movie got I found it to be quite okish

 

[Seda]

Briefly, I felt like the 'mystery' wasn't really the point. A bit of a different take on a whodunit.

 

[Sordid Plebeian]

I predicted everything from the start, it was weird how the film tried to subvert your expectations so far only to bring it around to the most obvious conclusion in the end. The third act was really disappointing for this reason.

 

[Chivalry]

My main complaint is that Blanc's method is pretty boring. He's no Poirot or Holmes, that's for sure.

 

[Halbrand]

I watched Parasite beforehand and it was perfect because

Spoiler

I was expecting for a long time that Marta would have a downfall and frame Ranson for her crime.

Thought it played with expectations perfectly. It's a top 5 2019 movie for me.

 

[Z-Beat]

It stops being about the mystery about half an hour in.

 

[DickGrayson]

The movie is a dark farce with the wrappings of a whodunit, an excuse to explore the family interactions via murder mystery and drawling detective. You aren't supposed to be waiting with baited breath for the reveal in the parlor.

Also:

" I was smirking since I said to my family "So they just revealed the antagonist..." "

Who talks like this? lol

 

[a916]

I'm not sure if I enjoy the movie as much as I did if Daniel Craig wasn't in the film. The actual mystery was pretty decent.

 

[DarthWalden]

I mean it was obviously Chris evans character from the start. It was so obvious that I figured it was some bait and switch.

Usually these movies lead you down one direction (ie. Chris evans) and then in the end the culprit is someone you would have never expected.

Basically due to having seen a number of whodunit movies, having the culprit be the obvious choice is not the expectation.

 

[Halbrand]

I mean it was obviously Chris evans character from the start. It was so obvious that I figured it was some bait and switch.

Usually these movies lead you down one direction (ie. Chris evans) and then in the end the culprit is someone you would have never expected.

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That's why it goes against expectations.

 

[spad3]

My biggest gripe aside from being unbelievably predictable was Blanc doesn't have any symbolic style of detective work; his method has no flair. if you use Guy Ritchie's Sherlock Holmes movies as a comparison, his version of Sherlock is a quick witted detective that plans ahead, you'll see him do things or plant things or take things way ahead of time that initially they look like he's just crazy but they come into play far later and it shows how far ahead in time he thinks. He has a style, a swagger, and some flair which makes his character iconic.
Blanc is well...kinda blank.

 

[Laser Ramon]

I love to smirk when I think a character is secretly a bad guy

 

[BossAttack]

The mystery wasn't the point.

My biggest gripe aside from being unbelievably predictable was Blanc doesn't have any symbolic style of detective work; his method has no flair. if you use Guy Ritchie's Sherlock Holmes movies as a comparison, his version of Sherlock is a quick witted detective that plans ahead, you'll see him do things or plant things or take things way ahead of time that initially they look like he's just crazy but they come into play far later and it shows how far ahead in time he thinks. He has a style, a swagger, and some flair which makes his character iconic.
Blanc is well...kinda blank.

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You're comparing a different style. Blanc straight up states his method which is:

"Et voila,my method. I observe the facts without biases of the head or heart. I determine the arc's path, stroll leisurely to its terminus and the truth falls at my feet."

That's the funny part, he doesn't have to do much but follow the facts and the truth lands at his feet.

 

[DickGrayson]

Like, at the end he stabs Marta with a fake knife in a literal show of the entire facade of the whodunit conceit, it's all a show.

 

[Zygnosis]

The story is really basic and you can figure out he plot in the first 15-20 minutes if you have watched old BBC murder mysteries (couple of red herrings and always watch for the characters who doesn't have dialogue). I have no idea why the movie is so liked as those BBC shows basically destroys it. Daniel Craig is laughable, but the rest of the actors were good. That's it, an ok movie at best.

 

[Halbrand]

Daniel Craig is laughable, but the rest of the actors were good.

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You're saying Daniel Craig wasn't good?

 

[Heshinsi]

I loved the film's atmosphere (for that alone I will be watching it again in October) and there was a sense of fun and silliness added to the whole dreary murder mystery at hand, but the real reason for watching it just felt robbed since 95% of any twists were seen coming a mile away.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the interaction between characters and other little tidbits, but I was expecting some "Holy shit didn't expect that" kinds of revelations and that just doesn't happen in the movie. And I am not a whodunnit fiend who can't get enough of the genre, I have seen just a few oldies and some Scooby Doo episodes but that was enough to see the hints and timing/placement of events to know most of when it happened and who knew it happened.

Also, when Evan's character took such an interest in keeping close to the protagonist I was smirking since I said to my family "So they just revealed the antagonist..." and no one understood what I meant lol.

I truly went in knowing nothing about the film or its cast and I haven't read anything about it other than it was very favorably received, but is the predictability of the film a common complaint? It has a lot going for it with the performances and the decent script, but I struggle to see how a mystery that gives away so much cannot leave people a bit sour about the experience.

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Well you just stated that when you figured out who was the antagonist, no body you were with understood what you meant. I watched it, and It wasn't obvious to me as to what exactly happened due to almost everyone lying to Craig's character.

 

[Deleted member 13798]

Briefly, I felt like the 'mystery' wasn't really the point. A bit of a different take on a whodunit.

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You're correct.

I know it's basically a meme level insult at this point, but his idea was to "subvert expectations" of the whodunit by not really making it a whodunit. But it's a positive thing.

See also: Brick, and how it played with detective genre cliches. It's kind of just Rian's thing.

 

[DickGrayson]

You're correct.

I know it's basically a meme level insult at this point, but his idea was to "subvert expectations" of the whodunit by not really making it a whodunit. But it's a positive thing.

See also: Brick, and how it played with detective genre cliches. It's kind of just Rian's thing.

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Man he really does do it with every movie doesn't he?

 

[wenis]

man, look at all these mensa members in here. I didnt know who did it until the end of the movie.

 

[Halbrand]

I love how the three acts play with your expectations in different ways.

First fact is about "who did it?" And it seems to obvious from the start that it's Marta. The mystery seems solved weirdly early. The second act sets you up to expect that Marta will frame Evans' character. Then the final twist comes into the third act after things feel somewhat resolved and shows that Evans was as bad (and worse) as the rest of the family.

 

[Brinbe]

As others have said, the mystery isn't why people dug it.

Just chill and have fun with it.

 

[Gernau Morat Gurgeh]

It was a fun film with some great performances, but overall left me a bit cold. As a murder mystery it failed.

 

[hurlex]

I think the lack of a twist was the twist. They were making it really obvious who the antagonist was but normally in mystery movies, they do that but later have a twist showing it wasn't that person. By not doing that, it was subverting the expectation for mystery fans.

 

[VeryHighlander]

"She pukes when she lies" was when I realized this wasn't the mystery thriller I wanted it to be. So taking it for what it was, a bunch of actors collecting a check and making the best of it made for a fun viewing experience

 

[ToTheMoon]

I'm with you, OP. It was a good movie, but it also didn't quite live up to my expectations for a modern take on a classic whodunnit.

I wanted at least one more twist at the end. And while the ensemble cast was great, they didn't have enough screentime (in the second half) to carry it home. The first half of the movie was great, but the second half was just like...that's it?

 

[SneakersSO]

I'm honestly torn on Knives Out.

On the one hand - I loved the performances, atmosphere, dialogue. The movie was well crafted, acted, directed. And even all of the online political messaging the movie saddles itself with was fine to me. Like, sure, clearly RJ has some things to say on social politics - it was obvious in TLJ and even especially moreso here. Politics that I agree with, in case anyone is going to insinuate I didn't enjoy the film because of that.

However.... the whole subverting expectation thing just killed it for me. The whole trick of the film is that its both not a murder mystery, but is still a mystery, albeit in a different sense. Unfortunately, the film telegraphs its answers so far ahead and just purely on who they chose to focus on that I never really doubted who would be the "culprit" in the end. In fact, a part of me was hoping there'd have been some Phoenix Wright-esque twist in that the victim actually was murdered later than what they portray, but that never winds up happening. And the film goes through such painstaking detail early in the film to get you to focus on these details that ultimately don't matter cause they just tell you what happened in exacts in the first 25 mins.

In the end, the film becomes a anti-capitalistic/alt-right revenge fantasy. And while i'm more than okay with that, the expectation was that we'd be getting an amazing, traditional murder mystery film, and the movie just never fully scratched that itch for me.

 

[Jeremy]

The middle section of the film, where the nurse is both playing Watson and sabotaging the investigation, is clever enough for me to forgive the predictable / underwhelming solution to the crime.

Also, the actual final scene (the "My House" mug) is great.

 

[Unknownlight]

I liked the movie's twists. My favorite was one of the last ones: "The labels on the injections were switched... but it didn't matter because a skilled nurse who has done this procedure hundreds of times doesn't actually bother to look at the labels because she already knows what's what."

That was a great true example of "subverting expectations". Loved it.

 

[gforguava]

It is a riff on the idea of the whodunit, it isn't actually one itself.

Between us seeing Christopher Plummer killing himself in the first act, despite us knowing the truth we still watch the family lie and squirm, that we follow Marta and not the detective throughout the story, and there is even a climactic fake knife. I mean, come on.

This is like complaining that Gosford Park isn't a good mystery.

 

[SteveWinwood]

"She pukes when she lies" was when I realized this wasn't the mystery thriller I wanted it to be. So taking it for what it was, a bunch of actors collecting a check and making the best of it made for a fun viewing experience

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Yeah that was the exact moment for me too. I just threw up my hands at that point.

It's not for me. That's fine, I'm glad others liked it. I may not understand why but that's my problem.

 

[Halbrand]

You're comparing a different style. Blanc straight up states his method which is:

"Et voila,my method. I observe the facts without biases of the head or heart. I determine the arc's path, stroll leisurely to its terminus and the truth falls at my feet."

That's the funny part, he doesn't have to do much but follow the facts and the truth lands at his feet.

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Yup.

I've never seen so many hot takes about this movie.

 

[PhilosopherDirtBike]

The "holy shit didn't expect that" moment in the movie is that they show you the "murder" a third of the way into the movie. Anything on top of that is just gravy

 

[jotun?]

I said to my family "So they just revealed the antagonist..."

Click to shrink...

 

[Surfinn]

It's the journey. It was a fun movie and I don't think the point was to achieve an M Night twist ending

 

[SilverX]

For the people saying "it wasn't about the mystery" or "it stop being about the mystery half way through", like are you serious? lol. When they revealed how the protagonist was accidentally responsible for the murder and was trying to cover it up, clearly there was more than what it appeared to have happened..... when the substance was missing that would have saved Harlan was missing it was a huge clue there was fowl play given how careful she was and was sure it was in her purse. Thats like the whole point of the last 60% of the film.

It definitely has other strengths, but it carries itself on the mystery the whole way through even if it poorly hides it.

Well you just stated that when you figured out who was the antagonist, no body you were with understood what you meant. I watched it, and It wasn't obvious to me as to what exactly happened due to almost everyone lying to Craig's character.

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Sure, I know a lot of viewers were wrestling over the various suspects but there is just a point where the film makes it so obvious if you are aware of the way these things are set-up. And when Ransom becomes so involved with Marta, there is just little wiggle room to write their way out of him being the villain.

I really don't think they were cleverly aware of what they were doing and just wanted it to be "the most obvious, unlikable suspect and biggest asshole in the film" since they did try to make his character appear helpful and possibly misunderstood by viewers. But that just made it more telling if you were really looking for the right clues.

 

[Deception]

For me, it felt like the whodunnit aspect came secondary to exploring the dynamics between the different family members. Even the whole Marta can't lie stuff was super cheesy but worked because in the grand scheme it didn't matter since Craig's character knew all along.

 

[Lifejumper]

Man he really does do it with every movie doesn't he?

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Yeah a director trying to surprise his audiences is so weird right?

 

[Feep]

Bagging on Knives Out seems like a chance for people to brag about how wonderfully smart they all are.

Look, mystery stories come with the genre's expectations, and that is that often, presented evidence or information will be subverted. Anyone genre savvy should have been looking out for that, so you at no point should have been like, oh, yeah, I definitely know who it is.

Later, besides the point, the method and manner and details are far more important than the killer, so it doesn't even matter. But give me a break with this "I saw it all a mile away" bullshit.

 

[WinFonda]

it works because harlan himself is the red herring... any theory you could have guessed about his role in everything (he's the mastermind, he was killed later, he faked his death, he knew someone would try to kill him, he's working with his grandson) are all obvious conclusions to jump to and in this case also not true; and any of them being true would've made the film fairly predictable. most of the information relayed to the viewer is played straight.

the real mystery is the question you likely stop asking yourself at some point over the film, "Who hired Benoit Blanc?" which tbh there was no real way of knowing

 

[AllThingsPurple]

My film of the year. Shame it didnt work for some but I absolutely loved it. Hope we get to see Benoit Blanc again.