Naaah. That's been part of anime far longer than Eva has ever been around. Sexualized schoolgirls go back all the way into the 70s.
They're not even close thematically. I never understood this silly argument.
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I watched Evangelion and a certain scene really ruined it for me
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Naaah. That's been part of anime far longer than Eva has ever been around. Sexualized schoolgirls go back all the way into the 70s.
They're not even close thematically. I never understood this silly argument.
Oh course it's been but there's ton's of show's that took things wholesale from eva and there were more adult protagonists and the like in the 80's . Eva showed a very profitability way to monetize these characters and the industry never looked back.
That's fair, sorry. But I would still supply the same answer: in general, sexualized fanwork of Eva often misses the original work's point in the same way that action-hero fanwork of Rambo would miss the original work's point. I suppose it's possible that hypothetical fanworks for either (sexualized for Eva, action-hero for Rambo) could exist that still somehow respect the messages of the original works, but that definitely does not appear to be the case for the majority of what's out there.
Like I said, that was a thing way before Eva even happened.
I can see your point, OP.
On one hand the show very much is about Shinji's pubescent mind and all of the haunting things he goes through as a teenager that fill him with negative emotions.
On the other hand, it's a classic stupid anime harem setup. Possibly deconstructed a bit (in that Shinji is the one who's flustered and stammering instead of the girl), but it's still that same setup nonetheless.
On one hand the show very much is about Shinji's pubescent mind and all of the haunting things he goes through as a teenager that fill him with negative emotions.
On the other hand, it's a classic stupid anime harem setup. Possibly deconstructed a bit (in that Shinji is the one who's flustered and stammering instead of the girl), but it's still that same setup nonetheless.
Nah I'm talking about influence. It happened but it far from the only thing driving the industries late nights biggest sellers. There was a distinct shift that occured as result of the eva clones that never left. It was a very noticeable shift in what were selling in the more popular seinen.
Gain ax is rather infamous for the t&a and jiggle girl characters had going on.
that scene though is strange and the first real deconstruction of the genres tropes.
a normal anime girl would have been annoyed or embarrassed.
Rei didn't give a crap about Shinji seeing her or touching her. She only cared that he was pining her to the ground.
a later episode has Asuka complaining that until she arrived the locker room had no privacy curtain, Shinji and rei changed together.
Reid lack of concern for her well being, modesty, etc was the first hint that something wasn't right with her.
that scene though is strange and the first real deconstruction of the genres tropes.
a normal anime girl would have been annoyed or embarrassed.
Rei didn't give a crap about Shinji seeing her or touching her. She only cared that he was pining her to the ground.
a later episode has Asuka complaining that until she arrived the locker room had no privacy curtain, Shinji and rei changed together.
Reid lack of concern for her well being, modesty, etc was the first hint that something wasn't right with her.
I always think that accidentally falling on people is a weird anime trope. The hugging thing too, where one character will hug the one who doesn't really reciprocate and is just stunned or speechless.
One of the biggest selling titles on the western markets during the first anime renaissance sexualized a minor, Macross sexualizes Minors.
Evangelion plays with the trope, it didn't create the trope. What Eva started, and what Eva's main influence on Anime was, was that suddenly everyone started aping Yoshiyuki Sadamoto's art styles.
And Eva clones weren't Eva clones because of sexualized minors.
Your not understand what I'm saying, Eva helped changed the average age of MC within these show's scawny teenage shinji-like protagonists became far more common in late night anime. Those same character types are common today in isekai LN and and anime. As a result the love interests for these characters were commonly teenage girls which were obviously sexualized. That's what i'm talking about. Not that sexualized minors didn't occur or exist in popular anime but that as result of the shift in MC ages in 90's spearheaded by EVA they became more common.
this. Also a couple other scenes that are significantly more fucked up than Shinji falling on naked Rei
Granted that was really creepy, as was the waifu wars that happened long before I watched the series. I found out about it and was like "...y'all know they're like 15 right?" Sailor Moon has similar issues though not as blatant
It didn't do that either, though. Not at all. Teenage protagonists were the norm in the 80s. You're conflating Seinen OVAs you know, with actual TV shows. The characters in Devilman were pretty much the same age as the Eva cast, and that's far older.
Devilman's a shounen. By the late 80's that shift had actually occurred.
So? Evangelion isn't a Seinen either. You trying to tell me that Devilman dealt with less sexualization than Eva did?
Eva is most definitely a seinen what on earth are you on about?
Devilman had a saturday morning style cartoon and the manga was within Weekly shounen magzine. Anime and magazines purely for adults weren't a proper thing back then. In the 90's when Eva aired tehy were most definitely a thing which is why it got the time slot it did. Eva's a quintessential seinen.
Eva is not a seinen, lol. Now we're just getting incredibly silly.
But fine, I'll humour ya, find me the seinen. A PG-13 rating doesn't mean adult:
Shinseiki Evangelion
Fifteen years after a cataclysmic event known as the Second Impact, the world faces a new threat: monstrous celestial beings called Angels invade Tokyo-3 one by one. Mankind is unable to defend themselves against the Angels despite utilizing their most advanced munitions and military tactics...
myanimelist.net
Evangelion is a shonen and it was actually ared in the kids timeslot (6:30 PM) after Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles. The first episode was introduced by the TMNT themselves.
That's interesting I stand corrected, a lot of the similar types of shows ended up airing in later time slots which was why i thought eva was the same.
I'm sorry, but I haven't laughed this hard in a while. Oh gosh...
Thatsthejoke.jpg
Kinda.
The creater was extremely depressed when he made the show.
Shonen is quite broad as definition. For example Oshimi's mangas feature explicit rapes, tortures, psychological abuse, incest, suicides etc. with a very realistic and in depth look at human psycology. On the other hand there is plenty of shonen that are pretty much just kids having fun in their boring daily lives. Eva is somewhere in the middle of the spectrum.
I hope no one mentions that Jojo and Hokuto no Ken are shounen manga.
Oh, whoops.
It's worth noting that this is really where the subversion of Evangelion being "more than a mecha show" kicks in and set the tone that this was more than just a kid's show. Now, there had been adult mecha anime in the past - most notably the works by Yoshiyuki Tomino like Gundam, Ideon, and Dunbine, or Ryosuke Takahashi's stuff like Dougram and Votoms, but those were more or less war dramas based around one key ideal - war fucking sucks. At the outset, Evangelion seems like the typical mecha show that was common at the time - self-contained episodes, giant monster gets blown up by giant robot every week. But as the show scratches the surface and each character reveals their true motivations, it becomes more of a study of the human condition and how we interact with others.
Now one of the commonly held beliefs is that Anno suffered a massive depression midway through the series when TV-Tokyo rescheduled it to late nights, which caused the second half of the series to be much different from the first. I'm not sure I put much stock in that though, as Evangelion seems to have a continuous narrative the entire way through. What happened more likely was that End of Evangelion was the original intended ending for the series, but due to the aforementioned timeslot change and other real-world issues affecting Japan at the time, the shows budget was cut heavily, leading to the last two episodes being shown as they were. When the show ended up being a major success on home video and worldwide, Anno got the opportunity to create the ending he wanted, and also gave the fans who sent Gainax death threats the ending they deserved.
Now one of the commonly held beliefs is that Anno suffered a massive depression midway through the series when TV-Tokyo rescheduled it to late nights, which caused the second half of the series to be much different from the first. I'm not sure I put much stock in that though, as Evangelion seems to have a continuous narrative the entire way through. What happened more likely was that End of Evangelion was the original intended ending for the series, but due to the aforementioned timeslot change and other real-world issues affecting Japan at the time, the shows budget was cut heavily, leading to the last two episodes being shown as they were. When the show ended up being a major success on home video and worldwide, Anno got the opportunity to create the ending he wanted, and also gave the fans who sent Gainax death threats the ending they deserved.
It is sorta the end of mankind in a show about grief, depression, and loneliness in the context of war with child soldiers on the frontlines. Not exactly the context that produces winning examples of humanity.
I watched Kite over the weekend after not seeing it in like 20 years. On Tubi !(highly recommended free service. Mad shit on there)... Once I realized what was going on, I turned that shit off.
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That's a damn good cover! I had no idea depression could be so.........Classy.
Contrary to popular belief, there isn't any hint whatsoever that the original finale isn't what it was always meant to be. And it makes sense because, thematically, the original finale fits better with the idea Anno had going - it's supposed to be about learning, growing, being a better human being. It caps the series with a message of hope and redemption, trying to tell the viewership, largely formed of the otaku that the series kept excoriating, that they could be better people.
It didn't go as expected, so, EoE, that is basically a subversion of everything the otaku wanted. It's a big fuck you, really.
It's not that the original ending wasn't meant to be, it's that it was supposed to be part of a whole thing that would also have something more similar to what we see in end of evangelion. For reasons of budget and other stuff, the surreal stuff was all they could do for TV, so the rest was moved to the movie and expanded.
It's largely accepted that shinji's introspection finale from the show takes place during the part where everyone is juice in the movie, and his conclusion there is why he manages to walk out of it.
I mean for EVA in particular. There were about a million times more figures, printed goods, and promotional tie-ins that shoved rei and asuka's asses in your face.
I do think the context of the scene serves as enough subversion that it sets it apart from its "played for comedy" peers, even if the camera lingers a bit too much to not suspect more male gaze than necessary for the point. Even compared to Eva's other fanservice scenes, meeting Rei in her apartment has a different mood.
But it does feel like the point was missed by a significant portion of the audience. Like, there's been quiet, emotionless girls in media prior but I believe that character archetype was popularized by Rei herself and "Rei clones" in other shows don't examine the discomforting aspect of the character the way Eva does.
But it does feel like the point was missed by a significant portion of the audience. Like, there's been quiet, emotionless girls in media prior but I believe that character archetype was popularized by Rei herself and "Rei clones" in other shows don't examine the discomforting aspect of the character the way Eva does.
It's hard to believe that Evangelion is 25 years old, and yet we're still having same conversations about it on a loop.
Evangelion and Hideaki Anno's creative ethos in general is like the posterboy of wanting to have your cake and eat it too; claiming an intellectual high-ground via "deconstruction" but really just indulging in titillation while trying to cover it with plausible deniability. The Hideo Kojima school of fan-service, only even more arrogant and self-satisfied. Anno's an incredibly talented animator with a keen director's eye, but an absolutely insufferable man.
Evangelion originally aired at 18:30. It was meant to be a show for general audiences, although due to pushing the timeslot too far it ended up getting reruns at late night later on.
Kaji is the one of the few one aware of how fucked up the whole thing is but he still uses people as tools.