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I refuse to embrace an all Digital & Streaming future...
- Thread starter Ryengeku
- Start date
All digital would be amazing if you had an official way to safely back up your console games. But right now you are just a company's bitch and when they shut down shit and your console dies you're out of luck (Wii shop).
Streaming is just something I personally have 0 interest in when it comes to games.
Streaming is just something I personally have 0 interest in when it comes to games.
I just bought the physical version of F1 2019 last week. For PC. It came on 4 DVDs. Yes, physical PC games still exist, at least where I'm living.
Had to download a few GBs after the game was installed, but installation was still way faster than what it had been if I had to download everything (..my internet connection sucks here).
Certainly less than ideal because of the Steam DRM, but I still always prefer physical over digital even in such cases.
Had to download a few GBs after the game was installed, but installation was still way faster than what it had been if I had to download everything (..my internet connection sucks here).
Certainly less than ideal because of the Steam DRM, but I still always prefer physical over digital even in such cases.
All digital or streaming? No. I do vastly prefer digital though now, especially with VR, having to change discs is an actual hassle instead of being a lazy annoyance.
It leads to less space taken up by games, the inability to physically lose any games, easier to transport etc.
It's great
Hate streaming though, until they can get the input lag and server stability 99% I won't even entertain it.
Also on PC physical is a non-starter with the amount of discs needed for games nowadays.
It leads to less space taken up by games, the inability to physically lose any games, easier to transport etc.
It's great
Hate streaming though, until they can get the input lag and server stability 99% I won't even entertain it.
Also on PC physical is a non-starter with the amount of discs needed for games nowadays.
I really want to play Afterburner Climax in a legitimate way without having to pirate it, but the all digital future won't let me.
Same with the Scott Pilgrim side scroller and several other games. I don't want to randomly lose some of my games because some contract expired or some corporation made it impossible to get legit randomly. I shouldn't have to hoard games on external hard drives just so I don't have to worry about access being lost forever. I still replay PT with friends to this day and I love having fun with it in that way, but if I didn't back it up and transfer it to an HDD I wouldn't be able to get it onto my PS4 Pro which I replaced my original PS4 with.
Same with the Scott Pilgrim side scroller and several other games. I don't want to randomly lose some of my games because some contract expired or some corporation made it impossible to get legit randomly. I shouldn't have to hoard games on external hard drives just so I don't have to worry about access being lost forever. I still replay PT with friends to this day and I love having fun with it in that way, but if I didn't back it up and transfer it to an HDD I wouldn't be able to get it onto my PS4 Pro which I replaced my original PS4 with.
This isn't really true. Digital only became somewhat viable during the mid-2000s and most PC games were still sold at retail. Prior to this, PC games were sold on various mediums. Digital downloads have only been part of PC gaming for a portion of its existence.
I like the idea of accessing my games anywhere (hence my interest in xCloud), but I don't want streaming or even digital to replace physical media. I suppose it will happen eventually, but I'm buying 95 per cent of my games physical. Choice is fine, but I still like to have my games accessable on a disc.
Like someone noted, though, even single player games on disc requires a funtioning internet connection these days. I've had huge issues with my Xbox One lately. It's a known problem, I gather. It just won't play games, it says I'm offline, I restart, problem remains etc. That's why it's been such a relief to play on my Wii U for the past few months while collecting the games I want for it. It feels very retro, no huge updates, no fuss, just put the disc in and play.
I'll probably go more and more retro of our gaming future is about streaming.
Like someone noted, though, even single player games on disc requires a funtioning internet connection these days. I've had huge issues with my Xbox One lately. It's a known problem, I gather. It just won't play games, it says I'm offline, I restart, problem remains etc. That's why it's been such a relief to play on my Wii U for the past few months while collecting the games I want for it. It feels very retro, no huge updates, no fuss, just put the disc in and play.
I'll probably go more and more retro of our gaming future is about streaming.
Always-online is definitely a future I refuse to invest in. I do not buy always-online "live service" games, be they MMOs, "quasi-MMOs" (e.g., Anthem, Destiny), or competitive multiplayer-only games (e.g., battle royales, MOBAs, and certain games in more traditional genres & subgenres). I made the mistake of buying Destiny when it first came out, as since it was Bungie I wanted to make just one exception to my rule. It was a mistake I will never repeat. The game's minute-to-minute combat loop was satisfying enough, as was the initial act of exploring the game world, but everything surrounding that really dragged the experience down. Not only was it clearly designed first and foremost to be this endless grind for better loot, it was an always-online game, and the game went out of its way to remind me why I don't like always-online. Every time PSN was down, or Destiny's servers were down, or my own internet connection was down, I could not play the game, period. And there's also the fact that for most of these games the servers will be permanently shut down one of these days. The history of gaming is littered with the corpses of dead MMOs.
Streaming takes the problems associated with those sorts of games and applies them to gaming as a whole. Is either the streaming service or your internet is down? Then you can't play anything, period. And if a title is removed from the service for whatever reason, well, that's it. It's gone, perhaps permanently if it was delisted over some rights issue. Games get delisted for various reasons all the time, and many of them have never returned. With streaming, though, you don't even have the option of saving a local copy. Streaming is the absolute worst possible future for gaming, as it means that any title could at a moment's notice be irrevocably erased from existence.
Digital downloads are better than streaming, but they have a host of problems of their own. For one, they're still digital, with all the caveats that come with that. You own nothing. Digital downloads are, at least in the U.S., treated as "licensed, not sold." This means you're essentially leasing the copy, which still belongs to the publisher. You have no right of first-sale. This means your ability to lend, sell, gift, or trade a copy is entirely dependent on whether the publisher gives you permission to do so. And they are not legally required to do so in the U.S., meaning that if they do give you the means to do so it is purely as a courtesy. The publisher can rescind the license at any time for any reason or no reason at all. While this is rare, there is precedent for individual titles and even entire libraries of digital content being remotely nuked by the publisher or platform owner. The fact that it's even possible and legal in the first place is to me a massive red flag.
There's also the problem of long-term availability of titles. As mentioned, games get de-listed from digital storefronts all the time. This means that if you didn't get them while the getting is good, you ain't getting it, period. By the end of August, nobody will be able to buy a digital copy of Driveclub ever again until the end of time. Same for a great many other titles before it, many of which were only available digitally. And if the storefront you bought it from ceases to exist, you can no longer even re-download a digital copy you actually did purchase, so if you lose it for whatever reason it's gone forever. I had this happen with my Halo 2 DLC when MS shut down support for the OXbox (though fortunately there was a physical option, as all but the last two maps were released on a disc). The same thing could very well happen to every one of games I downloaded from the Wii Shop Channel, including Final Fantasy IV: The After Years, Gradius Rebirth, and multiple Virtual Console purchases. If that data gets corrupted or erased, those games are forever gone.
With physical, the copy is your property. You have the right to lend, sell, gift, or trade a copy at your own discretion, as per the first-sale rule. The publisher no longer owns that particular copy. If you take care of your stuff, it will last you a lifetime barring some freak accident. When a game goes out of print, the copies that were made don't simply vanish into the ether. Physical continues to benefit from a thriving second-hand market. Most commonly available games for systems long since discontinued are still obtainable today. Though the rarer ones can cost a fair amount, the popular ones are typically rather cheap to buy second-hand. If you didn't buy the game while it was still in print, there is a very high likelihood that you can still buy a copy long after the fact, and if you have an old copy and it somehow breaks, it should be relatively easy to replace for most games. While the hardware might wear out, third-party clones will become available 20 years after the system was released. And the best thing about 80s/90s console gaming: none of it was dependent on the internet to function. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said of modern online-only titles, as once the game's servers are shut down you essentially have a $60 coaster remaining. But for any offline game made today, they will still be playable no matter what happens to the system's online services. Physical not only holds up better against the ravages of time, it is (again, except for modern online-only titles) not dependent on the continued support of some third party entity.
From my perspective, my experience, and given the current state of the law, physical is the superior format. I want to own and control what I buy, which is why I don't buy multiplayer-only games or any other kind of online-only game, nor do I spend any money on downloading any new titles anymore (every digital copy I have this generation I got for free). In fact, if it weren't for Halo, I wouldn't even be paying for Xbox Live anymore.
Streaming takes the problems associated with those sorts of games and applies them to gaming as a whole. Is either the streaming service or your internet is down? Then you can't play anything, period. And if a title is removed from the service for whatever reason, well, that's it. It's gone, perhaps permanently if it was delisted over some rights issue. Games get delisted for various reasons all the time, and many of them have never returned. With streaming, though, you don't even have the option of saving a local copy. Streaming is the absolute worst possible future for gaming, as it means that any title could at a moment's notice be irrevocably erased from existence.
Digital downloads are better than streaming, but they have a host of problems of their own. For one, they're still digital, with all the caveats that come with that. You own nothing. Digital downloads are, at least in the U.S., treated as "licensed, not sold." This means you're essentially leasing the copy, which still belongs to the publisher. You have no right of first-sale. This means your ability to lend, sell, gift, or trade a copy is entirely dependent on whether the publisher gives you permission to do so. And they are not legally required to do so in the U.S., meaning that if they do give you the means to do so it is purely as a courtesy. The publisher can rescind the license at any time for any reason or no reason at all. While this is rare, there is precedent for individual titles and even entire libraries of digital content being remotely nuked by the publisher or platform owner. The fact that it's even possible and legal in the first place is to me a massive red flag.
There's also the problem of long-term availability of titles. As mentioned, games get de-listed from digital storefronts all the time. This means that if you didn't get them while the getting is good, you ain't getting it, period. By the end of August, nobody will be able to buy a digital copy of Driveclub ever again until the end of time. Same for a great many other titles before it, many of which were only available digitally. And if the storefront you bought it from ceases to exist, you can no longer even re-download a digital copy you actually did purchase, so if you lose it for whatever reason it's gone forever. I had this happen with my Halo 2 DLC when MS shut down support for the OXbox (though fortunately there was a physical option, as all but the last two maps were released on a disc). The same thing could very well happen to every one of games I downloaded from the Wii Shop Channel, including Final Fantasy IV: The After Years, Gradius Rebirth, and multiple Virtual Console purchases. If that data gets corrupted or erased, those games are forever gone.
With physical, the copy is your property. You have the right to lend, sell, gift, or trade a copy at your own discretion, as per the first-sale rule. The publisher no longer owns that particular copy. If you take care of your stuff, it will last you a lifetime barring some freak accident. When a game goes out of print, the copies that were made don't simply vanish into the ether. Physical continues to benefit from a thriving second-hand market. Most commonly available games for systems long since discontinued are still obtainable today. Though the rarer ones can cost a fair amount, the popular ones are typically rather cheap to buy second-hand. If you didn't buy the game while it was still in print, there is a very high likelihood that you can still buy a copy long after the fact, and if you have an old copy and it somehow breaks, it should be relatively easy to replace for most games. While the hardware might wear out, third-party clones will become available 20 years after the system was released. And the best thing about 80s/90s console gaming: none of it was dependent on the internet to function. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said of modern online-only titles, as once the game's servers are shut down you essentially have a $60 coaster remaining. But for any offline game made today, they will still be playable no matter what happens to the system's online services. Physical not only holds up better against the ravages of time, it is (again, except for modern online-only titles) not dependent on the continued support of some third party entity.
From my perspective, my experience, and given the current state of the law, physical is the superior format. I want to own and control what I buy, which is why I don't buy multiplayer-only games or any other kind of online-only game, nor do I spend any money on downloading any new titles anymore (every digital copy I have this generation I got for free). In fact, if it weren't for Halo, I wouldn't even be paying for Xbox Live anymore.
Been all digital across all mediums (books, music, games, etc.) for 7 or 8 years now and it's been glorious.
Having all my purchases forward-port to new hardware (iPhones, Kindles, PCs) has created a sustained library that is HUGE (i.e. I've got close to 1400 games on Steam). All available instantly, all the time.
No regrets.
Having all my purchases forward-port to new hardware (iPhones, Kindles, PCs) has created a sustained library that is HUGE (i.e. I've got close to 1400 games on Steam). All available instantly, all the time.
No regrets.
I'm totally cool with it. Especially subscription. I'll continue with phyiscal as long as I can sell them though.
I've been all digital for a long, long time now, and it's the best. Who the hell wants to get off the couch to change games? Who wants to carry a bunch of cartridges around with their Switch? Not me, and I'd imagine not most people.
I'm sure plenty of people here on Era have odd attachments to physical media, but Era is a really, really strange place (I still remember that poll where, like, 92% of people said they preferred single player games over multiplayer games).
I'm sure plenty of people here on Era have odd attachments to physical media, but Era is a really, really strange place (I still remember that poll where, like, 92% of people said they preferred single player games over multiplayer games).
I don't mind an all-digital future. I have purchased most of my PS4 games on the PS Store. However, I would completely hate an all-streaming future. Having to be online 24/7 to even play single player games would suck.
If the latter happens, I will never play videogames again.
If the latter happens, I will never play videogames again.
The problem with streaming is we dont know how the EULA will change with it.
If we are talking about subscription plans with "pay X a month to stream all these games" then no, I dont want that
But if it's more like "buying a streaming license" that is functionally the same as a digital game but streaming, I'm much less concerned by that. If a game gets delisted but i can still stream it, I think it's not such a bad value proposition even though I would still never buy it. If streaming ends up as a side benefit of buying digital console games, that's actually a value-add and I would love it
If we are talking about subscription plans with "pay X a month to stream all these games" then no, I dont want that
But if it's more like "buying a streaming license" that is functionally the same as a digital game but streaming, I'm much less concerned by that. If a game gets delisted but i can still stream it, I think it's not such a bad value proposition even though I would still never buy it. If streaming ends up as a side benefit of buying digital console games, that's actually a value-add and I would love it
Well, I only play games online with friends anyways so the moment the servers shut down (which still affects physical media anyways) the game is useless to me. Digital is wayyyyyyy more convenient and it's so much nicer on the planet. All that energy for distribution and creation, plus the plastic and packaging is a huge waste.
Streaming is meh, I don't have the internet speed for it anyways and I care about not seeing compression artifacts and don't like excessive input lag.
Streaming is meh, I don't have the internet speed for it anyways and I care about not seeing compression artifacts and don't like excessive input lag.
Digital != Streaming.
But, I'm excited for streaming so I went option 2.
Just like how when digital sales emerged ~15 years ago it didn't immediately kill off physical releases, everything will happen gradually and slowly. Digital game sales on consoles have been normal for 10+ years, and we're just getting to the point where digital sales are coming up to par with retail sales on consoles. EA Access came out 5+ years ago and it didn't kill gaming as we know it.
But, I'm excited for streaming so I went option 2.
Just like how when digital sales emerged ~15 years ago it didn't immediately kill off physical releases, everything will happen gradually and slowly. Digital game sales on consoles have been normal for 10+ years, and we're just getting to the point where digital sales are coming up to par with retail sales on consoles. EA Access came out 5+ years ago and it didn't kill gaming as we know it.
this dogshit is infuriating, theres few things in this world whose very existence is a complete enigma, this is one of them
I'm not a fan of either but streaming for sure is a big no thanks. I can live with digital if I have to but I'm not going that way 100% until I have to.
I'm easy either way. I don't particularly care about ownership so digital doesn't bother me. When the price is right I'm quite happy to go digital. Streaming is fascinating but I think there are a few barriers it needs to become first.
I'm open to having as many options to play what I want, how I want, whenever I want and with whom I want.
I've gone all digital across PC, Xbox, PS4 and Switch.
As far as streaming goes, bring it on. It won't be my go-to within the comfort of my home, but I'm absolutely open to having the option to stream my games to my mobile or tablet on the go or whenever else convenient.
I've gone all digital across PC, Xbox, PS4 and Switch.
As far as streaming goes, bring it on. It won't be my go-to within the comfort of my home, but I'm absolutely open to having the option to stream my games to my mobile or tablet on the go or whenever else convenient.
This has zero to do with digital games vs physical.
If you had the disc you're still fucked.
Physical is dying, just accept it.
If you had the disc you're still fucked.
Physical is dying, just accept it.
I really don't see streaming taking off. For it to be feasible you'd have to get the gaming industry to convince ISPs to drop data caps and I don't see that happening.
Yes, it's so horrible if you lose access to a game or two. Keep buying physical and hurt the environment instead. It's so much better.
People love to point out how Blockbuster died long time ago exactly like Gamestop is going to do in the next years, but still almost every single new movie gets released in either dvd or blueray physical format even today with no problem whatsoever.
Some gaming fans on dedicated comunities can be overly obsessive and loud about the need of embracing the supposed "future" of this media RIGHT NOW and in the most extreme, dumb and illogical way, but i think there is and will be still a place and a market for retail copies, both now and in a midly distant future.
Some gaming fans on dedicated comunities can be overly obsessive and loud about the need of embracing the supposed "future" of this media RIGHT NOW and in the most extreme, dumb and illogical way, but i think there is and will be still a place and a market for retail copies, both now and in a midly distant future.
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No, it doesn't haunt me, at least not any more than possible disc read errors or hard drive crashes. Even if something like that happens, and I absolutely have to play a game that very moment, I have a physical backlog to last me a lifetime.
In an ideal world a single player game world be 100% complete and virtually flawless, at least to the extent of not needing any patches, and would thus be fully buyable and playable offline.
We don't live in that world. If a game needs a patch or general network connection to even be playable, a physical copy is absolutely pointless.
We don't live in that world. If a game needs a patch or general network connection to even be playable, a physical copy is absolutely pointless.
All digital on Switch due to convenience, but streaming has some real issues in relation to video games in particular due to internet speeds and data caps, so I'm not particularly into the idea when neither of those things have been fixed (at least in the US).
Already all digital. I'll stream a lot more when more content is there. I use PS Now every now and then but the library is limited. I embrace the streaming future all the way. No more waiting for downloads no more deleting stuff to make space.
I'm not opposed to digital, but if they're eliminating the retail middle man, I expect a discount.
Very true, though PC gaming has been about 99% digital for the last decade, and it doesn't seem to have hurt anyone.
I enjoy having my old game carts. There's something that connects me to my childhood when I look at an NES/SNES/Genesis/GB card that floods me with nostalgia. For modern systems though, especially something portable like the Switch, I'm all about being fully digital. Changing the game cards/discs is annoying today.
Netflix and itunes killed some jobs. My dad used to work at Sony music where they made and packaged cds. The plant shut down in the mid 2000s when itunes caught on and cd sales plummeted. I imagine the same thing happened in other places when netflix caught on.
Retail was hurt too, folks used to have to go out their local Kmart, Wal-Mart, Sam Goody or what have you to buy movies and cds (and books I should add). With media going digital, it cut into sales; and it cost jobs and businesses closed.
I work in retail, and there's nothing "weirdly endearing" about financial insecurity or outright losing my job to changing times.
I'm all digital when it comes to games (PS4 & PC) but still physical when it comes to movies and TV shows.
When buying games digitally it's the same product as the physical disc. The game runs at the same framerate and same resolution. If I had two PS4's running the same game side by side, one digital one physical, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. But if you do it with a film, there is a difference.
I find there is a big difference in both picture quality and sound quality when it comes to watching a film either via blu-ray or iTunes or Netflix.
Let's just get sound out of the way, while both Netflix and iTunes can both do standard Dolby Digital 5.1, the basic standard since DVD's came on the market in 1997, they create this sound field at a compressed bitrate of (usually) 640Kbps, which to 99% of the ears out there is fine and does the job. But with blu-ray, it's completely uncompressed with Dolby True HD and DTS-HD and averages out between 2-5Mbps. And now with the advent of Dolby Atmos and DTS:X, the sound fidelity is getting even better, while digital platforms continue to stay at the standard Dolby Digital 5.1.
With picture quality, and this is in regard to 1080p, I've noticed a big difference between the three platforms. Netflix streams at a bitrate of about 5Mbps, while iTunes streams at a rate of 8Mbps. So there is a slight bump in the image quality, it's noticeable in a few films but not every film. Physical, on the other hand, plays its media at a bitrate of 20-25 Mbps. To me, it's a night and day difference, and that's why I continue to invest and support physical media when it comes to films. Maybe it's just the film buff in me that wants to see a film with the best possible picture and sound, and try to recreate that "cinema experience" at home.
When buying games digitally it's the same product as the physical disc. The game runs at the same framerate and same resolution. If I had two PS4's running the same game side by side, one digital one physical, you wouldn't be able to tell the difference. But if you do it with a film, there is a difference.
I find there is a big difference in both picture quality and sound quality when it comes to watching a film either via blu-ray or iTunes or Netflix.
Let's just get sound out of the way, while both Netflix and iTunes can both do standard Dolby Digital 5.1, the basic standard since DVD's came on the market in 1997, they create this sound field at a compressed bitrate of (usually) 640Kbps, which to 99% of the ears out there is fine and does the job. But with blu-ray, it's completely uncompressed with Dolby True HD and DTS-HD and averages out between 2-5Mbps. And now with the advent of Dolby Atmos and DTS:X, the sound fidelity is getting even better, while digital platforms continue to stay at the standard Dolby Digital 5.1.
With picture quality, and this is in regard to 1080p, I've noticed a big difference between the three platforms. Netflix streams at a bitrate of about 5Mbps, while iTunes streams at a rate of 8Mbps. So there is a slight bump in the image quality, it's noticeable in a few films but not every film. Physical, on the other hand, plays its media at a bitrate of 20-25 Mbps. To me, it's a night and day difference, and that's why I continue to invest and support physical media when it comes to films. Maybe it's just the film buff in me that wants to see a film with the best possible picture and sound, and try to recreate that "cinema experience" at home.
