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I know I'm probably being unreasonable, but my university is going almost entirely online only learning this year and I'm unhappy about it.
- Thread starter It’s Time To Go
- Start date
If it makes you feel better, my alma matter went full steam ahead on in-person classes. The first day of class was last Wednesday, and today they've reached 500 confirmed COVID cases.
OP
OP
OP, I feel you're not being unreasonable. You're paying full tuition and you expect to receive an academic education on par with what you're paying.
I do think you're being a bitselfish shortsighted, though. 2020 has been a shit year for everyone and everyone has something to complain about. If your main issue is that you have to stay at home to study, well, count your blessings.
I do think you're being a bit
OP
OP
I've emailed about this, and my academic advisor and head of school aren't replying to emails until the semester starts, which is the end of the month.
Well that and getting 9 grand plus maintenance loan in the hole for.... sitting at home.
Yeah I'm sure it costs $10k to pay for a zoom license on top of the work the prof. would be doing anyway, not to mention the savings you get by not having to keep the buildings in the university open. And if that's not enough these universities could dip into their endowments or cut pay for the administration.
Edit: most universities prior to the pandemic were already loaded, it's not like they couldn't bite the bullet for two semesters and cut costs for online students. People don't just go to college for the degree, it's also an experience and a chance to network. If a university doesn't have that then it might as well be a community college.
Surely you'll have assignments to do and stuff. I've been on the other side (I'm a teacher) and, trust me, distance education is not a walk in the park. I find it to be even more work than attending lessons in a physical class.
Online university sounds like shit to be honest, and for £9k a year? I'd be pissssssed if I was you.
Hey, at least you're learning on the front end the pains of being ripped off by a college education. It'll take the sting out when you're paying it off on the back end.
OP, I understand your point of view, but you should realise that unfortunately, UK unis are now businesses and the education industry is operating in the red.
My wife is a lecturer at a UK university. She's been trying to cope with the university's unwillingness to change things during the pandemic, and was only told 3 weeks ago that the entire first semester will be online-only - she now has to create videos of her lectures, edit them herself, and constantly be available to answer emails from students with poor English, instead of taking questions during the lecture and have a couple of office hours during the week,as was normal.
On top of it, the university is not paying her more for the extra work and they have not decided if they will even give her a laptop to record the videos. She's expected to use her own equipment.
icing on the cake - the university is lying to prospective students (or keeping it vague) that online classes and on-site classes will be 50-50 for the first semester, because they fear people will simply defer for next year, and the uni will struggle financially.
I'm telling you, stuff's strange af currently.
My wife is a lecturer at a UK university. She's been trying to cope with the university's unwillingness to change things during the pandemic, and was only told 3 weeks ago that the entire first semester will be online-only - she now has to create videos of her lectures, edit them herself, and constantly be available to answer emails from students with poor English, instead of taking questions during the lecture and have a couple of office hours during the week,as was normal.
On top of it, the university is not paying her more for the extra work and they have not decided if they will even give her a laptop to record the videos. She's expected to use her own equipment.
icing on the cake - the university is lying to prospective students (or keeping it vague) that online classes and on-site classes will be 50-50 for the first semester, because they fear people will simply defer for next year, and the uni will struggle financially.
I'm telling you, stuff's strange af currently.
Nothing is normal right now, and it is unreasonable to expect a university to be able to create a bubble of safety. It's just not reality. Being physically in a classroom instead of on Zoom isn't worth your life.
Yeah its for the greater good that classes are online, but I don't think being upset about how that impacts you is unreasonable... like at all. It does pretty much just suck from a personal standpoint and it would feel like you're missing out, especially if you're paying full price for half an experience. How is your country handling compensation for people during the pandemic?
Gotta make the most of the bad situation
Also this
Gotta make the most of the bad situation
Also this
Depends on how your university is structured imo. If they advertise flexible scheduling for working adults, but had to raise their tuition 3% during a pandemic. Fine. It's reasonable to be upset. Otherwise? Nah. Resources aren't coming out of nowhere to pull this off. It's a crappy situation for everyone involved to be sure.
OP
OP
That's exactly what we were told. We were told we'd have a blended mix, some stuff on campus, some online, and only today were we told it's all online for the whole year.
I don't think you're being unreasonable. It's perfectly understandable for being frustrated. I know the student government at the university here is reevaluating some of the student fees such as athletics for both the current and next semester. The only issue is a lot of those fees help cover salaries (not just athletics but across multiple departments).
Sadly, most universities are already getting devastated by the pandemic. Trying to provide the same level of education while setting up an online or mixed semester is devastating to the budget. It's understandable to be frustrated by this since this mess is no fun for anyone. However, the thing students have to keep in mind is that they aren't getting less of a higher education experience, they are getting a different experience.
Your feelings are normal.
You're underestimating what in-person classes would bring though.
Even if they have them, it's not going to be the same college experience.
You're underestimating what in-person classes would bring though.
Even if they have them, it's not going to be the same college experience.
I had the same issues earlier this year.
Funny thing regarding cost is that the online version of my course was around 30% cheaper and was build from the ground up to be online, while us that started with on-site had to pay more for a shittier experience and had zero discount. Fuck that.
Without a vaccine ready before classes return next year I give up even trying to go back, it will go down the same way that happened everywhere else, cases will spike and they will shut down and go back to online, which I hate. I'll just go straight to the certifications and skip the bullshit.
Funny thing regarding cost is that the online version of my course was around 30% cheaper and was build from the ground up to be online, while us that started with on-site had to pay more for a shittier experience and had zero discount. Fuck that.
Without a vaccine ready before classes return next year I give up even trying to go back, it will go down the same way that happened everywhere else, cases will spike and they will shut down and go back to online, which I hate. I'll just go straight to the certifications and skip the bullshit.
OP
OP
Nah, that's reasonable. Especially the idea of having to pay in full, since at least in my school the tuition is tacked with other fees for things like the sports teams and and the recreational center. Like I just accept paying for them other years, but this time it seems kind of ridiculous.
Maybe I am using tuition the wrong way. I'm talking about like campus resources such as libraries, computers or other equipment, work space, etcetera. Not sure what those costs are bundled into. I don't think the actual education itself should be discounted per se, but are those resources not bundled into the cost of tuition? What happens to students who don't have reasonable access to those things at home?
My original post though was not necessarily saying that anything should be done about it, but that I do think it is valid emotionally for OP or any student to be angry about paying so much when you clearly aren't getting as much as you would if you were able to access campus in person.
Unfortunately that just seems to be the way it is though.
E: also I am speaking on this from a United States perspective, to be clear. I don't claim to know about the UK uni system so please correct me if I've made any wrong assumptions.
You've every right to be pissed off, especially as you're not even getting what they advertised recently. If lab work and foreign trips were part of the deal even moreso.
However it's the annoying kind of pissed off where there's no real target for your anger, except the government.
People are pissed for far more trivial reasons, the you can't be angry unless you've lost everything attitude is weird (although of course keep some perspective).
However it's the annoying kind of pissed off where there's no real target for your anger, except the government.
People are pissed for far more trivial reasons, the you can't be angry unless you've lost everything attitude is weird (although of course keep some perspective).
It's completely fine and understandable to be unhappy at this. Unfortunately, there's not much that universities can realistically cut from their budgets without significantly impacting on teaching or long-sustainability. Is the university still going to run any extracurricular events during this? That might help with the social angle.
As for a reduction in tuition fees, most students never pay off their student loans anyway. The repayment threshold is quite high and the repayment itself a fairly negligible number, so a reduction in tuition fees would be almost unnoticeable to any non-international/self-paying students.
As for a reduction in tuition fees, most students never pay off their student loans anyway. The repayment threshold is quite high and the repayment itself a fairly negligible number, so a reduction in tuition fees would be almost unnoticeable to any non-international/self-paying students.
I was worried that could be my university, as they've promised that, but then I realised that could be almost any university in the UK!
I think it's possible to understand and agree with the decision to move to remote learning while still being disappointed and upset. You can also do it while keeping things in perspective. If this is the major way the pandemic affects me, I'm ultimately pretty lucky. That's where I'm at.
I get that for some schools it's absolutely impossible to lower tuition. That's not the issue for mine, and similar schools have actually applied a discount, but my university still refuses. Instead, they raised tuition. Nor were we allowed to defer. That part it also upsetting.
I get that for some schools it's absolutely impossible to lower tuition. That's not the issue for mine, and similar schools have actually applied a discount, but my university still refuses. Instead, they raised tuition. Nor were we allowed to defer. That part it also upsetting.
I work for a State University and I completely feel your pain... Just know that our University and Universities like us are suffering as well. We are all in this together.
Im writing this list not to garner sympathy. But to provide a bit of understanding of what you may not be seeing behind the scenes.
Im writing this list not to garner sympathy. But to provide a bit of understanding of what you may not be seeing behind the scenes.
- Enrollment is down.. especially from international students.
- States are not appropriating their share of money since they're in trouble as well
- Many University employees such as food services, maintenance workers have been laid off
- All university staff have to take furlough days
- My department was asked to cut 20% of our operational budget. We are an IT department that's been more busy than before since we are helping other departments to work from home.
- Top administrators and athletic coaches took a 5% pay cut.
Yeah the 9 grand fees are simply outrageous, pandemic or no. I do feel for the undergrads though, especially with the frequency of strikes we've been on in the last few years. I would suggest maybe intercalating as an option - I've just done it for 5 months, but if I could afford to I'd take longer off.
The problem with the "take a year off" plan is some schools anticipated that and stressed that if you skipped a year you'd have to re-apply. So, yeah...
Here's my tale of woe. Parent of a Junior at a public university and a second year Masters at a private university. Both delayed their decision so late that they got leases. One is still living at the apartment but could just as easily be home, costing about $5,000 this semester. The other is living here at home, costing about $6,000 this semester on a room she'll never live in or visit (it is a rented room in D.C., we're in NC). Add on top of that his tuition ($5,000-ish including fees for gyms not being used, teams not competing, etc.) and hers at $20,000 I'm out ~$35,000 this semester with neither kid getting a great experience. It sucks, but at least we're all healthy so there's that. In the case of the Masters student it really sucks because the summer between the years was supposed to be research but they had to cancel that and do a "critical peer review" in its place. Additionally, they're having to delay Fall labs until Spring, which will make her final semester packed. Nobody is yet talking about what will happen if Spring is online only -- they'll have to figure something out because there is no way in Hell they are getting a fifth semester of tuition out of me.
Here's my tale of woe. Parent of a Junior at a public university and a second year Masters at a private university. Both delayed their decision so late that they got leases. One is still living at the apartment but could just as easily be home, costing about $5,000 this semester. The other is living here at home, costing about $6,000 this semester on a room she'll never live in or visit (it is a rented room in D.C., we're in NC). Add on top of that his tuition ($5,000-ish including fees for gyms not being used, teams not competing, etc.) and hers at $20,000 I'm out ~$35,000 this semester with neither kid getting a great experience. It sucks, but at least we're all healthy so there's that. In the case of the Masters student it really sucks because the summer between the years was supposed to be research but they had to cancel that and do a "critical peer review" in its place. Additionally, they're having to delay Fall labs until Spring, which will make her final semester packed. Nobody is yet talking about what will happen if Spring is online only -- they'll have to figure something out because there is no way in Hell they are getting a fifth semester of tuition out of me.
I'm in the exact same boat as you OP. To make matters worse my dad has completely gone off the deep end with suicidal threats and binge drinking and now I am at home stuck with all of this. But alas it is what it is.
Edit: And I'm in the Southern Hemisphere so we didn't have our summer holiday period.
Edit: And I'm in the Southern Hemisphere so we didn't have our summer holiday period.
Yup. I'm in my final year and in addition to having to reapply, I would lose all my academic scholarships.
OP
OP
I'm laughing at the number of people in this thread who think uni staff see any of the tuition money. The universities had staff when the education was free, far more than they do this upcoming academic year anyway. The financialisation of UK unis has completely fucked them and teaching staff are always first to suffer when the universities overspend.
Yea if i was still in university I'd be extremely conflicted myself. I absolutely would not want to go for in-person classes, but at the same time being away from home was a very important part about uni to me and not getting the "full" experience for the same price would feel like a scam. I feel like the best answer may be to try and see if you can work out a gap year with your university, and use that time to learn a skill, or if possible get a remote internship, which will help in your future job prospects.
It sucks but 2020 is a very different year. You are still getting your education, it will just be online instead of in person and the college stiff has costs they need to pay, even though you are currently learning online. I'd take a year off or try and deal with it the best you can.
Lots of people have had their life disrupted, my husband may loose his job soon due to Covid. I know people who have died because of Covid, it is not easy for a lot of people right now.
Lots of people have had their life disrupted, my husband may loose his job soon due to Covid. I know people who have died because of Covid, it is not easy for a lot of people right now.
Yep, I think that they are doing that is bullcrap. Is it normally like that with gap years or is this them reacting to the virus and trying to head off a mass exodus until things return to normal?
They already had one sandwich in March with half the first year being fucked. To have that likely for at least half the second year too really sucks.
My son is going back to his 2nd year in a couple of weeks -they're hoping for 1, 4 hour tutorial session face to face each week. Thats better than nothing, but I'd expect campus to be pretty empty. He's hoping he'll still be able to access sports facilities, and will be in a private house with some others on the same course so can still try to live with some independence.
Just so I'm clear, are you saying education isn't incredibly overpriced and the thousands to tens of thousands a year each student is charged are just covering operational fees?
You are not being unreasonable at all for being upset over this. They should lower your tuition cost. But the pandemic has hit some much worse than your situation. We are all in this together.
Teachers still have to get paid. They have families and lives too.
Also, online teaching or splitting online and in person is an absolute cluster. Teachers are working insane hours.
My wife has taught for 10 years, she's now an instructional coach starting this year. She puts in 60-90 hours a week (average the last 3 weeks). She's even working on Saturdays and Sundays some.
She's only getting paid for 40 hours though, so the state doesn't have to pay her more for her insane amount of work and hours, which is complete BS 😡
She has had to make school wide teaching strategy changes twice now....her plans literally have to be dynamic by the week.
Edit** On subject, being annoyed/upset by the pandemic is fine. However, I'd hope you'd choose to stay quarantined if you had the option. Dying/killing other people to get the "college experience" isn't exactly the right choice in this situation.