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Which JRPG?

  • Xenoblade Chronicles Remastered

    Votes: 130 17.0%
  • Xenoblade Chronicles 2

    Votes: 56 7.3%
  • DQ XI

    Votes: 181 23.7%
  • P5 Royal

    Votes: 336 44.0%
  • Other (elaborated in thread)

    Votes: 60 7.9%

  • Total voters
    763

Tibarn

Member
Oct 31, 2017
13,370
Barcelona
Xenoblade Definitive doesn't have any relevant grinding unless you do post game content.

Xc2 and P5 can be completed without grinding, but both haves have "collectable fighting companions" so both can be grindy if you want something specific.

DQ XI is a grind against my patience, the game is so boring and slow and predictable it isn't even funny.

I think that most modern JRPG can be completed without major grinding unless you play on the hard setting, so the JRPG=grinding relation is a thing of the past IMO.
 

Mib

Member
Nov 16, 2017
654
P5 and most SMT like games are pretty grind free once you wrap your head around fusion, weaknesses, buff/debugging. Especially SMT games. You might grind up a specific character, but leveling up is fast and personas/demons are ultimately designed to be disposable.

I haven't played Bravely Default 2, but assuming it's like the original, the difficulty curve is designed to be smooth as long as you take detours for side quests. You can grind for job levels, but it's optional, and if you leave exp gain at normal you might end up over leveled.
 

Necromanti

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,546
If you want challenge without grinding, then you can't go wrong with anything Shin Megami Tensei adjacent. Exploiting weaknesses and understanding buffs/debuffs make a much bigger difference than leveling up. Persona 4 wasn't that challenging on Hard mode after a few hours, though, so I don't know about Persona 5.
 
OP
OP
SunshinePuppies

SunshinePuppies

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 14, 2020
3,340
If you want challenge without grinding, then you can't go wrong with anything Shin Megami Tensei adjacent. Exploiting weaknesses and understanding buffs/debuffs make a much bigger difference than leveling up. Persona 4 wasn't that challenging on Hard mode after a few hours, though, so I don't know about Persona 5.

I hear that P5R actually is big on status effects and stuff of that nature, that's kinda cool. Really hoping to hear something about a PC release
 

Morrigan

Spear of the Metal Church
Member
Oct 24, 2017
34,307
I honestly don't recall JRPGs being grindy since, like, the PS1 era at the latest? And even on PS1 the grindy JRPGs were like, niche ones and all, the mainstream ones weren't grindy at all. I don't get why this idea that JRPGs are grindy still persist decades after it's no longer the case.

In any case, I would recommend Octopath Traveler, as this is the best modern JRPG I've played recently by far.
 

Chaosblade

Resettlement Advisor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,589
I honestly don't recall JRPGs being grindy since, like, the PS1 era at the latest? And even on PS1 the grindy JRPGs were like, niche ones and all, the mainstream ones weren't grindy at all. I don't get why this idea that JRPGs are grindy still persist decades after it's no longer the case.

In any case, I would recommend Octopath Traveler, as this is the best modern JRPG I've played recently by far.
Because it's usually easier to grind levels to beat a difficult boss than it is to figure out a better strategy.

Xenoblade 1 is actually a perfect example of that. It's a common recommendation to be 3-4+ levels above the enemies/bosses to beat them, but all that does is throwing the level/stat scaling massively in the player's favor so you can basically mash buttons to win. It's entirely possible to get through the game and be 2-4 levels below the enemies/bosses, but it requires you to have a decent understanding of combat, gear, and gems.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
9,053
Because it's usually easier to grind levels to beat a difficult boss than it is to figure out a better strategy.

There's also many times where it is faster to just gain a few levels than it is to try against a boss and fail. Persona 3's tremendously long boss fight is a good example, where you can either make an attempt that could fail, or you could gain 5-10 levels.

Something like Bravely Default 2 isn't necessarily grindy, but you have a lot more margin for error if you go and fight more than the bare minimum.
 

Twister

Member
Feb 11, 2019
5,073
In any case, I would recommend Octopath Traveler, as this is the best modern JRPG I've played recently by far.
Octopath Traveler is a beautiful game, but as a fellow grind-hater, it most certainly does require grinding. I got about halfway through the game until the boss fights became insurmountable without either tons of items or grinding.
 

Morrigan

Spear of the Metal Church
Member
Oct 24, 2017
34,307
Octopath Traveler is a beautiful game, but as a fellow grind-hater, it most certainly does require grinding. I got about halfway through the game until the boss fights became insurmountable without either tons of items or grinding.
I mean I never grinded and I did fine 🤷‍♀️
Sorry to be flippant but were you actually playing it right
 

HeyNay

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,495
Somewhere
You know what? This actually describes my situation perfectly. I want to be able to play on the hardest level without feeling like I need to grind. To me the hardest difficulty just means that I need to interact with the game's mechanics on a deeper level. This is actually why I love Sekiro and its lack of impactful leveling, despite it in my opinion being the hardest modern From game.

I think DQXI is your game, then. You can up the difficulty, you can play in short bursts, and the game will respect your time. P5 is great, but that game takes forever, and you actually have to pass the time (on an in game calendar) to advance the plot.
 

LazyLain

Member
Jan 17, 2019
6,486
i feel like many people here have a different concept about grinding than the one that is usually understood by the majority

using the P5R example, it doesnt matter if the battles take two seconds using ryuji's instakill or two minutes, if you need to go around killing enemies to gaing xp/money/resources to progress in the game, it's still grinding. having to invest time building social links and getting points to advance them faster is a grind. despite being "different" content going through mementos is still grinding (tartarus technically is "new" content too but i hardly think anyone would say p3 isnt grindy)

on the other hand a game being long isn't necessarily grindy either unless you consider using your time part of the "grind" (which makes no sense) and considering OP listed four above the average mark games for consideration it would imply they don't think it is either
Yeah, I'm gonna have to disagree on the notion of progressing social links = grinding. They're basically optional character story sidequests.

You're right that some of the stuff surounding social link advancement, such as increasing your social stats which can sometimes be a prerequisite for advancing, is repetitive and can feel grindy.... though my personal notion of grinding is when you're spending extra time to go out of your way to farm resources, which I don't think the social stat stuff 100% matches. Mainly the "extra time" part, since the way the game loop flows, it takes just about as much time to get through a day in Persona 5 if you waste it by doing nothing as it would if you actually made use of the day to do something that'd advance your stats. It can certainly be fatiguing trying to maximize your time, especially over the course of 100+ hours... but I wouldn't consider it grinding in the traditional sense.
 
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-Tetsuo-

Unlimited Capacity
Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,559
Xenoblade DE on casual mode is exactly what you want. People voting for Persona are out of their minds. That is a 100 hour long game full of grinding.
 
Oct 28, 2017
793
Looking at this topic makes me realize how few JRPGs are releasing nowadays... my thoughts on some of the common ones here. I will say that grinding is a little weird in how it can be implemented in games, even more older RPGs were generally balanced in a way that if you just sorta naturally fought every encounter on the way to an objective your level and resources would be on par with what you would need to progress, with true "grinding" reserved for if you were interested in end game content. But there are plenty of games where even doing the basic "fight every random encounter" stuff can feel like grinding even if you're not just sitting in one location repeatedly chaining encounters. There are also plenty of RPGs where the act of grinding in and of itself was not just farming something over and over but trying different builds/strategies.

I think DQ XI for me is a game without a traditional definition of grinding. Even on harder difficulties you pretty much never really need to sit in one location and fight enemies over and over, but the game does push you towards having a large number of fights naturally with huge zones, big dungeons, tons of enemies, etc. It does FEEL grindy to me since the individual random encounters are pretty rote outside of boss battles though. The formula pretty much never changes from town > dungeon > boss and cycle and it's the kind of game that you can literally feel yourself dozing off in during random encounters.

P5R is rightly well recommended since even though there are some areas where you're just moving through procedural generated dungeons these areas are short and the game is structured in such a way as you are constantly doing something different. It's easy to feel fatigued after tons of Princess-Maker style social sim and events, with long cutscenes, with grindy randomly generated dungeons, with persona building, with set piece dungeons and whatnot but the game bounces between them so often it doesn't feel repetitive. It also helps that P5R is really polished in a way most RPGs are not and tries very hard to make it a bombastic and appealing game. Since you're waiting for a PC version P4G is much the same though obviously much less visually appealing; as in yes there are areas where you are incentivized to grind if you want to and parts of the gameplay feel repetitive but it's so easy to change it out for an entirely different gameplay style at the drop of a hat and what is present is so well presented it doesn't FEEL like grinding.

For the mentions for Yakuza LAD, I think it isn't a bad recommendation but it feels grindy at times from poor pacing some of the time but the rest is amazing. Like the best way I can say it is that you have like 40 hours of really well paced RPG with almost no filler and some side content that has tons of variety and charm (there's a fully functional mario kart game, a million mini-games, an entire management game...) with this gigantic brick wall of a difficulty spike in this boring ass sewer dungeon that takes up like 5 hours of the game and more if you need to level or you chose poor classes. Like Yakuza LAD hour by hour compared to most RPGs has few areas of grinding, but when you do need to grind BOY do you need to grind in one of the worst grinds ever. So yeah, great game but it really depends on what you can tolerate. It should be mentioned though that Yakuza LAD if an amazing story, most RPGs still feel like they are targetted towards teenagers but Yakuza LAD honestly feels like it was written for a target audience of working adults who grew up playing RPGs.
 

KodiakGTS

Member
Jun 4, 2018
1,097
I mean I never grinded and I did fine 🤷‍♀️
Sorry to be flippant but were you actually playing it right

I guess it depends how much of a completionist you are, to get the "true" ending there is certainly grinding required. But yeah you can get by without much grinding to complete the main story.

OP, I would recommend CrossCode. It is a good modern take on classic JRPGs with basically no grinding and can be beat in a relatively short time (20-30 hrs).
 

Hieroph

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,995
Radiant Historia: Perfect Chronology has a story mode that's supposed to reduce any grinding to zero. Caveat, I haven't played with that setting, but the story is really good so it should be worth playing even if you're basically skipping battles. And who knows, maybe you'd like the battle system. It's pretty great.

 

Zafir

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,005
Since you're waiting for a PC version P4G is much the same though obviously much less visually appealing; as in yes there are areas where you are incentivized to grind if you want to and parts of the gameplay feel repetitive but it's so easy to change it out for an entirely different gameplay style at the drop of a hat and what is present is so well presented it doesn't FEEL like grinding.
Something that is underrated with the PC version of P4G is the customisable difficulty. You can keep the battle difficulty higher but raise the XP you get from enemies, which means you can actually just run through the dungeons and skip encounters without ending up severely underlevelled for the bosses. I played it first through on PS2 back when it first came out, and the dungeons often felt like a chore since they aren't exactly well designed, and you're constantly fighting the same dull enemies. I used the custom difficulty on the PC version and it made the dungeons so much more enjoyable. I could get through them in a way which didn't tire me out, the encounters felt so much more fresh since you battle them a whole lot less, and I still had the difficulty of the bosses to enjoy.
 

ShinobiBk

One Winged Slayer
Member
Dec 28, 2017
10,121
I don't consider any of those grindy, but they're all very long games where you'll battle a lot
I'd say Persona 5 Royal is probably the best choice cause it has that auto battle thing in Mementos

That being said, I recommend you play P5R with a guide to max all social links. There are spoiler free guides available and will help the gameplay tremendously
 

Tyrant Rave

Has A Pretty Cool Jacket
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,696
Xenoblade DE on casual mode is exactly what you want. People voting for Persona are out of their minds. That is a 100 hour long game full of grinding.
you don't have to grind in a single megaten game from the PS2 games on (and even earlier tbh) outside of DDS if you really need/want a skill. worst case, you die on a boss and just fuse a new persona to deal with it. that's it

game is long as hell but that's not grinding. it's just a long game
 

JustinH

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,391
If we're allowed some older options, The Last Story (Wii) and Anachronox (PC) don't have grinding. I think both have a strictly limited number of fights you get into, even.
I was going to mention Last Story simply because I remember people saying it was short for a JRPG, lol.

I never got around to finishing it. I should try to do that via Dolphin...
 

ElephantShell

10,000,000
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,912
I don't recall grinding at all in Persona 5, though I'm not sure if Royal changes that.

You definitely won't have to grind at all if you play DQ XI without any of the difficulty modifiers. It's really an easy breezy experience that way which is kinda nice.

DQ XI allows you to pretty easily bypass enemy encounters which makes it feel even less grindy because you aren't forced into a bunch of battles all the time.
 

Tatsu91

Banned
Apr 7, 2019
3,147
Wow P5 Royal is getting a LOT more votes than I would have expected. Weren't previous Personas pretty grindy? Is this one that much of a departure?
I played through the OG P5 and i did not have to grind at all though Shido wrecked me it was me needing to find the right abilities to beat him but thats the only difficulty.
 
OP
OP
SunshinePuppies

SunshinePuppies

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 14, 2020
3,340
Something that is underrated with the PC version of P4G is the customisable difficulty. You can keep the battle difficulty higher but raise the XP you get from enemies, which means you can actually just run through the dungeons and skip encounters without ending up severely underlevelled for the bosses. I played it first through on PS2 back when it first came out, and the dungeons often felt like a chore since they aren't exactly well designed, and you're constantly fighting the same dull enemies. I used the custom difficulty on the PC version and it made the dungeons so much more enjoyable. I could get through them in a way which didn't tire me out, the encounters felt so much more fresh since you battle them a whole lot less, and I still had the difficulty of the bosses to enjoy.

I actually didn't know about the P4G difficulty stuff. I like the idea about being able to play the game on the hardest difficulty but crank up the EXP so that I can just fight every encounter, get the experience I need, and not feel like there are difficulty spikes in the form of stat checks
 

Suikodan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
857
Yakuza: LAD is a really fun RPG. You can have a decent challenge if you don't grind a bit but the game will be manageable.

Leveling up is 99% fun in this game, didn't bother for thre 1%...
 

noinspiration

Member
Jun 22, 2020
2,002
I don't think I've encountered an RPG made this century where killing everything I encountered naturally wasn't enough, so anything in the poll should be good.
 

aiswyda

Member
Aug 11, 2018
3,093
I honestly don't recall JRPGs being grindy since, like, the PS1 era at the latest? And even on PS1 the grindy JRPGs were like, niche ones and all, the mainstream ones weren't grindy at all. I don't get why this idea that JRPGs are grindy still persist decades after it's no longer the case.

In any case, I would recommend Octopath Traveler, as this is the best modern JRPG I've played recently by far.
I'm gonna second octopath. Octopath is so fun, and does not require any grinding unless you want to do the true final boss (which I think you can totally enjoy without doing). You *can* grind, but the game is built around that so long as you're doing chapters in relative order, you can get by via smart job combinations and good choices in combat alone. I absolutely adored the game bc of it.

also the music is great and it's on pc!!

additionally P5R is by far the easiest Persona game with one weird boss spike that was annoying.

xenoblade DE is great but if you're not interested in grinding ignore the side quests. I recall some minor difficulty spikes.

XC2 I think is a must play if you're looking for smth with good combat but def wants you to grind out blades and abilities in some aspect. Actual levels you'll be totally fine on.
 

Morrigan

Spear of the Metal Church
Member
Oct 24, 2017
34,307
You *can* grind, but the game is built around that so long as you're doing chapters in relative order, you can get by via smart job combinations and good choices in combat alone. I absolutely adored the game bc of it.
Same, it's how I played it too as I don't like grinding at all. And yes the music is godly, best OST of 2018 for sure.
 

NookSports

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,208
Just finished Persona 5, the last of the games you listed that I hadn't played. I think XBC2 is the most grindy out of all of them, but like people said, it's mostly the field skills, so if you stay ahead of that, it should be fine. I think it has the best combat system out of them. Persona 5 doesn't have level grinding, but the length does make it feel grindy in my opinion (only played the original version, not Royal)
 

Zafir

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,005
I actually didn't know about the P4G difficulty stuff. I like the idea about being able to play the game on the hardest difficulty but crank up the EXP so that I can just fight every encounter, get the experience I need, and not feel like there are difficulty spikes in the form of stat checks
I remember pcgamer did a article about it back when the PC version came out, but yeah I don't think people talked about it too much which is a shame. I wish more games had such fine tuning in terms of difficulty options. Maybe the PC version of Persona 5 will if and when it comes.
 

Trucy Wright

Member
Dec 15, 2020
132
You definitely have to grind in Like a Dragon, in the second half of the game the difficulty spikes massively and you really don't have a choice but to grind levels and job ranks.

I never felt that honestly? it felt really easy to level up, and because I kept changing jobs to unlock more skills, which took me like half an hour to an hour max to get great skills and defeat the boss everyone said was difficult ( I also saw many people defeating him with barely any grinding, you just need good jobs + skills) and I'm the type to hate grinding usually lol
 

DitaParlo

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,079
image.png


P5 NOT GRINDING? PEOPLE ARE INSANE
 

Phendrift

Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,288
Xenoblade Definitive Edition doesn't really have ANY grinding in it.
There are definitely difficulty spikes. And if you aren't grinding, then you are doing the EXP side quests to level up. So it depends if OP counts that as grinding

I just finished it, and now I'm over halfway through 2 and I've pretty much just beelined the story in 2 I think it requires way less grinding
 

cyklisten

Member
Nov 12, 2017
442
I always replay Xenoblade completely FFX style and i can finish it. Maybe you need to understand better the battle system, builds etc but it's entirely possible to finish the Wii version with zero grind. It doesn't mean i ignore every sidequest ever, i tend to accept all of them but never actively tried to do any, so i end up finishing some just by playing normally.

Along with the fact that Xenoblade on Switch has a casual mode.

Stop trying to blame it on people as though they don´t understand the games systems. Xenoblade 1 is not rocket science and is very straight forward and easy to understand bar for a couple of things the game flat out doesn´t tell you if I recall correctly.

To me, anything other than the main quest is grinding. Especially in Xenoblades 1´s case where the "sidequests" are some of the most braindead and boring in the entire medium.
I too accepted most of them, but I didn´t do anything to complete them if it wasn´t in my direct path. That lead me to getting severely underleveled. I could still beat the enemies in my path, but it took forever and sometimes "forced" me to use characters/strategies I didn´t give a shit about and disliked playing as. All in all it hampered the experience and knocked the game down a few notches.
That said, I did mostly enjoy the game and would recommend others to play it. But when OP specifically doesn´t want to grind at all, I think it´s fair to give a heads-up.
 

Lampa

Member
Feb 13, 2018
3,571

Phoenixazure

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,434
I think there's considered to be no grinding in P5R because not only good difficulty options but because the game is so long you probably end up grinding anyway without realizing it especially if you're a completionist. Though it's not on the list/might already be mentioned, I thought Cosmic Star Heroine is also well scalable difficulty wise and not overly long

can't go wrong with Chrono Trigger though
 
OP
OP
SunshinePuppies

SunshinePuppies

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 14, 2020
3,340
There are definitely difficulty spikes. And if you aren't grinding, then you are doing the EXP side quests to level up. So it depends if OP counts that as grinding

I don't consider side quests as grinding as long as it's meaningful content vs just bonus experience for playing the game in an arbitrarily different way e.g. kill 5 dire rats in a row in this certain location
 

Zafir

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,005
Stop trying to blame it on people as though they don´t understand the games systems. Xenoblade 1 is not rocket science and is very straight forward and easy to understand bar for a couple of things the game flat out doesn´t tell you if I recall correctly.

To me, anything other than the main quest is grinding. Especially in Xenoblades 1´s case where the "sidequests" are some of the most braindead and boring in the entire medium.
I too accepted most of them, but I didn´t do anything to complete them if it wasn´t in my direct path. That lead me to getting severely underleveled. I could still beat the enemies in my path, but it took forever and sometimes "forced" me to use characters/strategies I didn´t give a shit about and disliked playing as. All in all it hampered the experience and knocked the game down a few notches.
That said, I did mostly enjoy the game and would recommend others to play it. But when OP specifically doesn´t want to grind at all, I think it´s fair to give a heads-up.
Yep, same, that was my experience with Xenoblade as well. It's not like I avoided quests, I picked them up and did them if they were on my way, sometimes I did even go out of my way to do a few, but I still got underlevelled for some of the bosses which resulted in me not even being able to attack the bosses at all due to how accuracy/evasion works. I did try and make gems to help the issue but I just didn't have the required mats to be able to do too much about it so either way I was going to have to "grind".

Speaking of grinding, is it beneficial in Like a Dragon? I'm picking it up soon, and I like grinding.
There's a big spike at a certain point in the game, which you may consider "grinding". Basically the game will tell you about a battle arena having opened up, which is technically optional. It's not really optional though, the next boss is a massive jump in levels, which you may struggle with if you didn't do the arena.
I don't consider side quests as grinding as long as it's meaningful content vs just bonus experience for playing the game in an arbitrarily different way e.g. kill 5 dire rats in a row in this certain location
Sadly most of the quests in Xenoblade 1 are just kill x without any depth. There is a few which give dialogue but they're relatively rare.

it's something they did fortunately improve on in X and 2, the side quests are much better in both of those.
 

Dogui

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,783
Brazil
Stop trying to blame it on people as though they don´t understand the games systems. Xenoblade 1 is not rocket science and is very straight forward and easy to understand bar for a couple of things the game flat out doesn´t tell you if I recall correctly.

To me, anything other than the main quest is grinding. Especially in Xenoblades 1´s case where the "sidequests" are some of the most braindead and boring in the entire medium.
I too accepted most of them, but I didn´t do anything to complete them if it wasn´t in my direct path. That lead me to getting severely underleveled. I could still beat the enemies in my path, but it took forever and sometimes "forced" me to use characters/strategies I didn´t give a shit about and disliked playing as. All in all it hampered the experience and knocked the game down a few notches.
That said, I did mostly enjoy the game and would recommend others to play it. But when OP specifically doesn´t want to grind at all, I think it´s fair to give a heads-up.

What? I just said Xenoblade can be finished without grind or doing most sidequests, how you go from this to "You're blaming people!"? Wtf, to hell with your hostility.

Grind has a meaning, it's not something you can change based on your opinion. Unless you're not doing any objective while fighting enemies nonstop, it's not grind. Also, i just said i don't do sidequests in Xenoblade unless it's naturally finished, your definition of grind doesn't even refute my post.

Why bother to even discuss and make a big post if i'm "blaming people" to you, for starters? OP didn't even play the game wtf.

Can't just discuss videogames anymore without being accused of things. This place can be insufferable at times. Atleast there's the ignore function :p
 

cyklisten

Member
Nov 12, 2017
442
What? I just said Xenoblade can be finished without grind or doing most sidequests, how you go from this to "You're blaming people!"? Wtf, to hell with your hostility.

Grind has a meaning, it's not something you can change based on your opinion. Unless you're not doing any objective while fighting enemies nonstop, it's not grind. Also, i just said i don't do sidequests in Xenoblade unless it's naturally finished, your definition of grind doesn't even refute my post.

Why bother to even discuss and make a big post if i'm "blaming people" to you, for starters? OP didn't even play the game wtf.

Can't just discuss videogames anymore without being accused of things. This place can be insufferable at times. Atleast there's the ignore function :p

You indicated that the problem was that people don´t understand the mechanics of the game as though it´s some deep thing, when it isn´t. It´s a condescending tactic people use to dismiss other peoples valid and often wellargumented opinions. I regret it if you felt attacked by my comment, that wasn´t the goal, but peoples view on whether Xeno1 is grindy has nothing to do with understanding the game.

The "sidequest" design of Xenoblade 1 is so shitty that it has no objective - it´s grinding in all but name. And if you don´t do them you have to fight enemies that you don´t stumble into naturally (read: grinding). You can probably technically do a run where you don´t do any "sidequests" and don´t fight any enemy that doesn´t stand in your way, but that´s probably not gonna be a fun time as I described (incredibly long and boring fights, slowly chipping away at even regular enemies health).

Edit: And if you read other peoples comments here, quite a few had the same experience as me.
 

Zafir

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,005
Grind has a meaning, it's not something you can change based on your opinion. Unless you're not doing any objective while fighting enemies nonstop, it's not grind. Also, i just said i don't do sidequests in Xenoblade unless it's naturally finished, your definition of grind doesn't even refute my post.
I mean the base general meaning of grind means to kill enemies over and over again, sure, but games can also feel grindy even when there's an objective. That's where there's a distinction, and that's where subjectivity comes into play.

In my mind doing the quests in Xenoblade 1 is basically the same as grinding. Majority of them are just kill x or get y from x quests. You're doing the same things as you would grinding, the difference is you get a little text box telling you to do it instead of doing it of your own accord. There is some side quests with dialogue but since there's only a small amount of them it can be difficult to just pick those up and ignore the fluff, and even if you did only those you'd still be underlevelled due to how few in numbers they are.

This also kind of links into the Persona games as well. Technically they don't require grinding, I never needed to in 3, 4 or 5. However, the dungeons can definitely feel grindy at times. Admittedly Persona 5 less so since they finally made actual dungeons and not just copy pasted corridors, but at least in the original (not played Royal yet) some dungeons did feel like they over stayed their welcome a bit still. Which is why even in this thread you've got people debating whether Persona 5 is a good suggestion or not. I can totally see it from both sides.
 

Dogui

Member
Oct 28, 2017
8,783
Brazil
I mean the base general meaning of grind means to kill enemies over and over again, sure, but games can also feel grindy even when there's an objective. That's where there's a distinction, and that's where subjectivity comes into play.

In my mind doing the quests in Xenoblade 1 is basically the same as grinding. Majority of them are just kill x or get y from x quests. You're doing the same things as you would grinding, the difference is you get a little text box telling you to do it instead of doing it of your own accord. There is some side quests with dialogue but since there's only a small amount of them it can be difficult to just pick those up and ignore the fluff, and even if you did only those you'd still be underlevelled due to how few in numbers they are.

This also kind of links into the Persona games as well. Technically they don't require grinding, I never needed to in 3, 4 or 5. However, the dungeons can definitely feel grindy at times. Admittedly Persona 5 less so since they finally made actual dungeons and not just copy pasted corridors, but at least in the original (not played Royal yet) some dungeons did feel like they over stayed their welcome a bit still. Which is why even in this thread you've got people debating whether Persona 5 is a good suggestion or not. I can totally see it from both sides.

I agree this is as bad as grind in the case of Xenoblade sidequests, but the term exists for a reason. Itt some people even considered social links grind. The term is not subjective and it was never linked to sidequests. It's even common for Jrpgs to have a lot of battles in the normal path, a lot of people could consider that grind, but again, the term has a objective meaning and doing content is not part of it, no matter how bad the content can be.

Okay that a game can feels grindy without actual grind, but that depends on how much you enjoy the combat.

I agree that Xenoblade's sidequests are terrible. It would never be one of my favorite games if i couldn't ignore them tbh. At the very least, they're easy to accept and ignore. Also, lots of sidequests are just "kill x enemies of y kind" or "Get x collectable items", which are stuff i would probably do in my normal way even if i wasn't asked to.

Even tho my point is that Xenoblade can be finished ignoring sidequests, only fighting what appears in your way (Which means a lot of battles anyway, that can feel grindy if you dislike the combat, but there's no helping it). Not mentioning casual mode.
 
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m0therzer0

Mobile Gaming Product Manager
Verified
Nov 19, 2017
1,495
San Francisco bay area
Ys Oath in Felghana is an awesome game that actively prevents you from grinding since the exp rubberbands you to the intended level. But if you're looking for something big, meaty, and new/modern it's probably not what you're after, since it's only 10-15 hours and like 15 years old now. I'm not as much of a fan of the newer games, but Ys 8 gets a lot of love. It's bigger, but IMO in a more bloated sense.
I don't see Ys come up often enough. What a wonderful series that is.
 

SykoTech

Member
Dec 23, 2020
558
Good poll results. Persona 5 Royal has no grinding. Just fight the enemies you run into and you'll be fine. It also has an Easy Mode that you can switch to at any time. I've never used it, but I imagine it'd take care of anything that you could possibly get stuck at. You definitely won't have any gaming sessions where you do nothing but grind to beat a tough boss.

It's also an excellent, meaty game. So yeah.