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I don't respect video games as a medium
- Thread starter PogiJones
- Start date
OP
OP
That's a pro that I hadn't given much thought. While video games may dampen one's desire to do good things, it also may dampen one's desire to do harmful things. Thanks for bringing it up.
I honestly dont think your 3 points are that crazy. Though videogames nowadays aren't all EXP level up task task task. There are a lot of story based games nowadays that I dont feel you would have this same problem with based on your argument. Unless you have the same issue with movies and TV.
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If videogames dampen your desire to "do good things" I think the problem lies with you, not the medium.
it's a framing device for a discussion that you have had absolutely no participation in, when that person said nuance they actually meant: READ THE OP
So is the core of your valuation of sports physical fitness? In that case is there any reason you wouldn't simply suggest workouts that would more successfully target physical fitness goals?
And why is the bonding of teammates innately more valuable than, say playing video games competitively with others, or even casually playing video games with friends and using it as a central component of being able to build or further a friendship?
I think games in an extreme (as with sports in an extreme, hobbies in an extreme, or even creative endeavours in an extreme) can be negative, and that certain manifestiations of games can be negative but I echo some other sentiments here in that I can't help but find your criteria somewhat arbitrarily defined to give such a broadly sweeping statement.
I also generally agree with Feep's sentiment here. Games are a medium of expression. An art form. Do you see them differently than other media of expressions? If so why? As a creator within that medium it's a topic I'm intrigued to dig into.
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A play of Hamlet is around 4 hours, and that's a very long play. You might need to add some extra time for travelling to the theater, and discussing the play afterwards. But I still don't think you will still arrive an any kind of hours that compare to a week's worth of Fortnite playing for an average kid.
So because you dont throw a ball around, a video game has less value as a hobby?
Thats all these are by the way, hobbies. Books, Movies, Theater, Video Games. Anything that isn't Eating, Drinking, Sleeping, Shitting, and Fucking for the purpose of Reproduction is technically valueless to humans.
Thats all these are by the way, hobbies. Books, Movies, Theater, Video Games. Anything that isn't Eating, Drinking, Sleeping, Shitting, and Fucking for the purpose of Reproduction is technically valueless to humans.
I'd be more worried about what my kid does at 15 and beyond. Nerds generally stay out of trouble because all they're interested in is playing games, watch anime and magic the gathering tournaments, but the party type are the ones who will be doing coke, shoplifting or drunk driving. Of course you still have a chance to a raise a nerd who does all of that, but you know what I mean.
As long as your kid is a nice person, let the kid play. It's not about accomplishing anything, but to have fun for a little while.
As long as your kid is a nice person, let the kid play. It's not about accomplishing anything, but to have fun for a little while.
I see where you are coming from but I think "not respecting" is an exaggeration. With your explanation I will give you few things that you should also not respect as a hobby:
-Darts.
-Bowling.
-Pool/Billiards.
-Golf.
-AC cars/planes.
The above 5 examples fit your criteria I guess. So should we not respect them?
-Darts.
-Bowling.
-Pool/Billiards.
-Golf.
-AC cars/planes.
The above 5 examples fit your criteria I guess. So should we not respect them?
I feel like, based on what you're saying, it would make more sense to say you don't respect video games as a hobby, rather than a medium. Wouldn't/don't you have the same perspective on movies or TV or music or books? If your child just spent all day consuming these things wouldn't you rather them do something more productive? The issue seems to be more about consumption vs. production rather than anything else.
Basically, when you say "as a medium" it implies to me you put it lower than movies or TV or books or whatever, but then your OP compares it to sports or other activities/hobbies. So are you sure that it is "as a medium" that you don't respect it?
Basically, when you say "as a medium" it implies to me you put it lower than movies or TV or books or whatever, but then your OP compares it to sports or other activities/hobbies. So are you sure that it is "as a medium" that you don't respect it?
OP
OP
No, I was just listing one very clear advantage sports have over video games. And no, I'm not saying your bonds through sports are better than bonds through games. I'm saying that people seek bonds with other people, and in the absence of video games, many people would seek those bonds in more beneficial hobbies.
Video games are basically problems, that you gotta solve. Imho you're getting old.
As someone who made games his profession, I think that's mostly a fair take. I don't fully agree with it (of course I'm biased), and though I don't mean to persuade you to a different opinion (this is mostly a values discussion), I'd like to offer the following retort:
- I think it's the other way around, fulfillment also leads to happiness (though much has been said on the relationship between eudaimonia and arete, so I'm not categorically saying you're wrong). Though perhaps a more sustainable and wholesome form of happiness. In essence everything is meaningless and wasting time until we die, so the pursuit of happiness is the most fruitful pursuit in our life (sorry for getting a bit dark here). There are different ways to achieve happiness, and I agree fulfillment is a more potent happiness, but also one with more short term pains.
- Playing is a learning process, humans play to learn. According to some, all of human culture is an extension of our playful nature. I think playing is an important meaningful process and a social cognitive skill that needs to sharpened, for children especially, to help them later in life. You need to be wary for when the kid stopped learning and is playing for other reasons (competition for example, or especially point 4). I think playing games is probably better than playing sports from a cognitive standpoint, though not a physical one obviously.
- Games should be more about co-constructing stories than necessarily living a Hollywood movie, something a lot of games 'still need to learn' (that the player is a player and not a lab rat). I think sensemaking and co-constructing a story is in itself a fulfilling experience in the sense that our real world fulfilling experiences are also storified by ourselves.
- But these points presuppose that the things we learn in games have meaningful repercussions and the stories we create are profound to use outside of games. I think this is the unconscious trepidation or visceral reaction gamers have to things like GaaS and F2P mechanics. It champions engagement over engaging with, and thereby trivializes the experience to time spent over time spent well. The more these systems and design paradigm encroach on games, the more it becomes something to be compartmentalized as meaningless time wasting.
It's behaviour that's connected to the medium. It's very difficult to get addicted to constantly see stage plays, due to the medium.
I kinda agree with OP, especially if you look at how videogames nowadays are for a large part designed around having satisfying and almost addicting progress systems rather than having actual meaningful story or actually engaging gameplay. For example I was playing Assassin's Creed Odyssey a few weeks ago and it became very obvious after a few hours that the story and dialogue choices were more of an afterthought compared to the billion of shallow if satisfying missions and systems in the game. Or compare the original 2 Fallout games and New Vegas (and maybe even 3) to Fallout 4 and 76. While the formee games were mostly interesting in creating a world and exploring ideas, the latter have been built from the ground up around the gameplay loop of exploring, killing, crafting. Games are very much made to be a product and not art.
Videogames can certainly be worthwhile experiences that teach you about yourself, the world and new ideas, but not with the same frequency that music, literature and even movies and tv can.
Videogames can certainly be worthwhile experiences that teach you about yourself, the world and new ideas, but not with the same frequency that music, literature and even movies and tv can.
Yeah it's a dirty fact that most software is designed to be addictive and that games are a really intense incarnation of that
The most successful games are so successful because their designers have struck addictive gold.
And as OP said that's not an inherently bad thing and of course tons of beautiful craft goes into it - however it demands care and vigilance on our part.
The most successful games are so successful because their designers have struck addictive gold.
And as OP said that's not an inherently bad thing and of course tons of beautiful craft goes into it - however it demands care and vigilance on our part.
There are games I respect, and games that I feel fulfill a really shallow level of enjoyment (and still enjoy). There are books I respect, and books that I feel only fulfill an extremely shallow level of enjoyment (in certain circles these books are call "schlock"). So it goes for movies, television shows, theater productions, and every other form of entertainment. Every entry in every medium is not the same. Sometimes they are extremely thoughtful pieces of art, and sometimes they are just a bit of escapism that can kill a little time and put a smile on your face.
You don't have to respect them, OP. That is your prerogative. However, your position isn't one rooted in some fundamental truth or insight.
You don't have to respect them, OP. That is your prerogative. However, your position isn't one rooted in some fundamental truth or insight.
If we are talking about stuff connected to the medium we must also talk about the often unethical treatment of actors and crew. Be it sexual harassment, precarious working conditions the class exclusion in the high art space.
And people can get obsessed about theater. You'll often find them in theater programs of universities. There might even be a play about that unhealthy obsession with the hyperreal nature of the theater.
In the end new media will always be under attack by those who see interaction with it as "unworthy". You can go back to works like Don Quixote to see that mindset.
I think there is a lot you can take from video games and apply it in the real world. Video games, Resident Evil and Silent Hill specifically made me want to pick up a camera and find the beauty and disturbing things we see in every day life. Resident Evil taught me how to frame pictures while Silent Hill made me view everything around me differently.
I imagine, although I can't prove that they have taught me to remain cool under pressure, how to help each other out and work towards a goal, which just helps social skills in general...unless you're playing overcooked with a friend and yell at each other over potatoes.
Every art form, there is something you can take from it. You might consider it a waste of time, but your mind is going a million miles an hour and I feel they inspire creativity, character creation, writing, music, drawing and how to relate to other people.
I was in sports and never knew how to talk to my teammates as I didn't play because I wanted to as much as Inwas forced to. But my video game people, the ones who read stories and used their imagination is what I gravitated to.
I want to start writing children's books in the future because of how I connected to characters when I was young myself. I feel there is so much positive in finding a creative escape and for someone not to respect it isn't fine, but I think you're looking at negative aspects rather than positive.
I imagine, although I can't prove that they have taught me to remain cool under pressure, how to help each other out and work towards a goal, which just helps social skills in general...unless you're playing overcooked with a friend and yell at each other over potatoes.
Every art form, there is something you can take from it. You might consider it a waste of time, but your mind is going a million miles an hour and I feel they inspire creativity, character creation, writing, music, drawing and how to relate to other people.
I was in sports and never knew how to talk to my teammates as I didn't play because I wanted to as much as Inwas forced to. But my video game people, the ones who read stories and used their imagination is what I gravitated to.
I want to start writing children's books in the future because of how I connected to characters when I was young myself. I feel there is so much positive in finding a creative escape and for someone not to respect it isn't fine, but I think you're looking at negative aspects rather than positive.
Good for you.
You shouldn't respect anything that any other person has put time, passion and resources to create. It is automatically bollocks, unless you yourself did it.
Like you don't respect doctors unless you yourself perform your knee surgery. And like you don't respect Beatles. Cause you know, those damn hippie hairstyles.
I think the only reasonable thing to do now is to close Era and go fulfill our destinies picking berries and hunting and building houses out of timber.
THEN and only then we can enjoy video games. That is if we made them ourselves.
You shouldn't respect anything that any other person has put time, passion and resources to create. It is automatically bollocks, unless you yourself did it.
Like you don't respect doctors unless you yourself perform your knee surgery. And like you don't respect Beatles. Cause you know, those damn hippie hairstyles.
I think the only reasonable thing to do now is to close Era and go fulfill our destinies picking berries and hunting and building houses out of timber.
THEN and only then we can enjoy video games. That is if we made them ourselves.
Shame you'll never get that feeling in DMC5 because of all the microtransactions.
My dad also tried to limit my play time. All it did was make me find other ways to play (handhelds) and get completely addicted + live out what I couldn't for so long when I got old enough.
Would not recommend it.
Would not recommend it.
You are basically describing all forms of media entertainment.
What's better out there that I should be doing with my own time? Don't tell me I should sink my time into sports? I can do sports when I want, but I don't.
Video Games is like reading for me. It's engaging and stimulates my mind.
Sure, I could've learned more instruments or learned how to draw or something. At this point, I'd rather that I find time for those things when I get bored with video games.
What's better out there that I should be doing with my own time? Don't tell me I should sink my time into sports? I can do sports when I want, but I don't.
Video Games is like reading for me. It's engaging and stimulates my mind.
Sure, I could've learned more instruments or learned how to draw or something. At this point, I'd rather that I find time for those things when I get bored with video games.
Looking at OPs avatar picture, has this anything to do with you being a father and maybe the fact that you had a discussion about the same thing with him recently? Just honest and curious question. Is this you trying to justify why you can play video games all night long and he can't? ;)
Edit: wow I skipped over that part. It totally is after reading it completely again. I just got this from your avatar and the headline. I am a genius.
To the topic: I think as always in life, it's a balancing thing. If you don't neglect other stuff it's totally ok. I personally never saw gaming achievements as fulfilling. That whole idea is alien to me. I came to the conclusion that life is a struggle and pretty shitty for the most part so the entertainment side keeps my spirits up, even if just a little. So I totally respect any for of entertainment for that.
Edit: wow I skipped over that part. It totally is after reading it completely again. I just got this from your avatar and the headline. I am a genius.
To the topic: I think as always in life, it's a balancing thing. If you don't neglect other stuff it's totally ok. I personally never saw gaming achievements as fulfilling. That whole idea is alien to me. I came to the conclusion that life is a struggle and pretty shitty for the most part so the entertainment side keeps my spirits up, even if just a little. So I totally respect any for of entertainment for that.
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Just like reading improves your language proficiency, there are some nice "side effects" to video games, even if they are less pronounced:
Video games made me a better surgeon
Video gams are good for your mind and body
Sounds like you need to play more games, OP ;p
Video games made me a better surgeon
Video gams are good for your mind and body
Sounds like you need to play more games, OP ;p
As do video games. Video games inspire so much creativity. Most of my artistic and design-driven decisions stem from my experiences from games. Characters, stories, worlds, music, animation, and so many parts of games bring massive amounts of inspiration to people.
Not to mention I play DDR for exercise because it is both fun and physically demanding, though this would make it more similar to a sport which you don't have a problem with. Nevertheless it is a video game too so it's worth mentioning.
I do agree with you that progression in games can sometimes be an unfortunate time sink. That's why I only invest my time in 100%ing games that truly mean something special to me.
Personally I don't agree, which I imagine will be a pretty common response on a gaming forum!
I think that a lack of respect and the realisation that a hobby doesn't necessarily 'improve' your life aren't the same thing.
For example you could easily say that about most non-activity based pastimes. Watching films, reading a novel, playing chess etc etc. For the most part those hobbies aren't really improving my life in any tangible manner but yet I have a great respect for the medium. There are more ways than simply viewing how/if something makes you better to judge their value.
I think that a lack of respect and the realisation that a hobby doesn't necessarily 'improve' your life aren't the same thing.
For example you could easily say that about most non-activity based pastimes. Watching films, reading a novel, playing chess etc etc. For the most part those hobbies aren't really improving my life in any tangible manner but yet I have a great respect for the medium. There are more ways than simply viewing how/if something makes you better to judge their value.
I pretty much disagree with everything you said here. If it weren't for video games I wouldn't be where I am today and there are many others to have varying levels of financial success because of their love for video games. If you're the type of person that isn't able to "accomplish anything in the real world" the problem isn't the video games, it's you.
Despite your explanations I cannot really agree with the premise that video games are worse off than other mediums in this respect. Sure, what you said is technically true, games can give you a false sense of fulfillment and are meant to just distract you from boredom, you can simplify it down to that I guess, but so is every other form of entertainment. Just like how watching your favorite sports team win gives you fulfillment or watching an entertaining movie does. Yet those are no more productive than video games, nor do they give you any more of a meaningful experience. I would even argue that if anything video games can give you more of a meaningful experience due to your actual interaction with the medium, something you do not get from movies or sports where you're just a viewer.
Of course actually doing something in the real world would be more fulfilling than games, but like I said, I think it applies just as much to other mediums. At the end of the day these are just hobbies, you cannot (and should not) spend your entire life only seeking experiences that you believe are "actually meaningful" or whatever, sometimes you just gotta have fun.
Of course actually doing something in the real world would be more fulfilling than games, but like I said, I think it applies just as much to other mediums. At the end of the day these are just hobbies, you cannot (and should not) spend your entire life only seeking experiences that you believe are "actually meaningful" or whatever, sometimes you just gotta have fun.
If you were expecting all of that from video games I can see why you're disappointed!
I feel like there's truth to your points, but also video games provide something that life doesn't: The fun in the escapism of video games imo shines with how it offers memorable, engaging experiences that are unlikely if not impossible to have in real life. I know for a fact I will never explore outer space, dive to the bottom of the ocean, team up with or play against friends in battles where you can build forts and shoot each other at the same time, mentally project a game of psychedelic tetris around me, fight robot dinosaurs, experience a zombie apocalypse (hopefully not), and lots of other neat spontaneous experiences that actively happen to and around you and friends that you can't get from reality or a more directed/authored creative work. Video games, sometimes even bad ones, can also enhance real life social hangouts and can help you improve creativity and hand eye coordination.
But if you're expecting most games to rival your favorite books and movies and life experiences that challenged/pushed you mentally, emotionally and physically, I agree for the most part - video games by definition are more about fun distractions than serious fulfillment. Compared to experiencing that, playing most video games will be comfort food. And like food and anything else it can become addictive in a bad way so it's best in moderation. But they also have the potential to bring our dreams to life and make it possible to share them with others in a way that other mediums cannot, and that's something you might be able to appreciate!
I feel like there's truth to your points, but also video games provide something that life doesn't: The fun in the escapism of video games imo shines with how it offers memorable, engaging experiences that are unlikely if not impossible to have in real life. I know for a fact I will never explore outer space, dive to the bottom of the ocean, team up with or play against friends in battles where you can build forts and shoot each other at the same time, mentally project a game of psychedelic tetris around me, fight robot dinosaurs, experience a zombie apocalypse (hopefully not), and lots of other neat spontaneous experiences that actively happen to and around you and friends that you can't get from reality or a more directed/authored creative work. Video games, sometimes even bad ones, can also enhance real life social hangouts and can help you improve creativity and hand eye coordination.
But if you're expecting most games to rival your favorite books and movies and life experiences that challenged/pushed you mentally, emotionally and physically, I agree for the most part - video games by definition are more about fun distractions than serious fulfillment. Compared to experiencing that, playing most video games will be comfort food. And like food and anything else it can become addictive in a bad way so it's best in moderation. But they also have the potential to bring our dreams to life and make it possible to share them with others in a way that other mediums cannot, and that's something you might be able to appreciate!
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Yep, I agree to an extent, but I think more games provide merit than you might at first think. For kids, Minecraft would be a fantastic example, really flexing their creativity (often in a social way) the same way group play with LEGO can accomplish. As a young adult, I made friends around the world through WoW and we used to travel across the globe to meet up, and go exploring together. Granted that's not something the game accomplishes directly, but it was the keystone to allowing it to happen and many games provide a comparable framework. Similar situation with Bloodborne, one of my favourite gaming memories of all time because I played it side-by-side on a couch with my best friend, swapping the controller on each death, no summoning for boss fights, and it was an incredible experience.
But I do agree completely that trying to make yourself happy through gaming as a distraction is an illusion. Not to say that's a bad thing because escapism is incredibly important for sanity if anything else, whether through games, books, TV/film, music etc. Yes, consuming works as a quick fix, and no doubt a lot of people will chime in here to say it makes THEM happy so it must just be you, but when you've genuinely achieved something creative and fulfilling yourself it becomes clear that it's a different kind of happiness. There's no illusion. No need to lock yourself away in a different world to achieve that feeling. It's almost tactile in how much better it feels.
Personally I've found this bizarre crossover between the two, and I get that sense of true fulfilment by creating art assets for Beyond Skyrim, a video game mod. I am helping to create the biggest TES world since Daggerfall, a mod that is larger than the base game itself, with a preview release (Bruma) that has over 2 million downloads, and seeing that all come together is roughly 174 bazillion times more rewarding than anything I've accomplished in Skyrim itself. And no game makes me feel happier than playing Skyrim does, so that's saying something.
So while I agree that happiness through fulfilment is "better", however each individual might achieve that, I don't think happiness through games or other forms of entertainment consumption is necessarily a problem. It's just different, and only a problem if it's the only way you can achieve a sense of happiness (which I think might be where gaming addiction can stem from).
But I do agree completely that trying to make yourself happy through gaming as a distraction is an illusion. Not to say that's a bad thing because escapism is incredibly important for sanity if anything else, whether through games, books, TV/film, music etc. Yes, consuming works as a quick fix, and no doubt a lot of people will chime in here to say it makes THEM happy so it must just be you, but when you've genuinely achieved something creative and fulfilling yourself it becomes clear that it's a different kind of happiness. There's no illusion. No need to lock yourself away in a different world to achieve that feeling. It's almost tactile in how much better it feels.
Personally I've found this bizarre crossover between the two, and I get that sense of true fulfilment by creating art assets for Beyond Skyrim, a video game mod. I am helping to create the biggest TES world since Daggerfall, a mod that is larger than the base game itself, with a preview release (Bruma) that has over 2 million downloads, and seeing that all come together is roughly 174 bazillion times more rewarding than anything I've accomplished in Skyrim itself. And no game makes me feel happier than playing Skyrim does, so that's saying something.
So while I agree that happiness through fulfilment is "better", however each individual might achieve that, I don't think happiness through games or other forms of entertainment consumption is necessarily a problem. It's just different, and only a problem if it's the only way you can achieve a sense of happiness (which I think might be where gaming addiction can stem from).
Exactly. All entertainment serves the same function, yes, even literature.
That game would be MGS3 for me. It actually made me think of what patriotism meant to me personally.
Well said.
Its more about how you choose to consume the media, pretty much the same as anything. Instead of rewatching Friends every week, you could choose to explore the medium and explore other shows that have messages and meanings to you. Same as overplaying COD every day, you can choose to play other games that involve characters and philosophies. Basically do whatever makes you happy. But from the sounds of the OP, its seems like to feed your confidence in the medium, you have to take out all the repetitive, endless games that have no meaning, and replace them with actual progressive games.
I owe a lot of my creative skills to an interest in games and what makes them work, as do many others I'm sure. Many coders, visual artists, composers, sound designers etc often trace their careers to trying to make their own games or mod existing ones. And the skills you learn are of course applicable even outside the scope of games. Even software QA skills can come from an interest in games (I view software testing very much the same way as trying to break/outsmart a game to reveal the boundaries of the "rules" and what kind of scenarios devs did or didn't think of).
I'm... actually surprised that I can't hardly disagree with you, OP. I think on a conceptual level video games as a medium is not that different than books, movies, or music as mediums. But yeah, gaming time not being (nor should be) standardized means all the big players are currently prodding you to spend hundreds and thousands of hours on a single game and entice you with subtle manipulation to spend bits of mtx money along the way. It can make you pretty cynical to the medium as a whole, I suppose.
Eh. Maybe because video game as a medium is still relatively younger and immature compared to others.
Eh. Maybe because video game as a medium is still relatively younger and immature compared to others.
Ok, I see where you're coming from.
But, since you're looking behind the mechanism of boredom as an evolutionary tool, here's a counterpoint - from the evolutionary standpoint, your main (if not sole) point of existence as a living organism is to ensure your survival and the continuation of your species.
Both of those goals are obsolete for homo sapiens sapiens in the modern Western world on an individual level. You were born into a world where your biological goals are accomplished by default. We as a species are grossly overdeveloped, there's a lot more of us than the planet can even sustain in the long-term, so the drive to fulfill your biological mission is an atavism that needs to be redirected to something else.
Basically, your life has the meaning, any meaning, you yourself assign to it. As long as you find said meaning fulfilling, it's all good, be it caring for others, devoting your life to your work, seeking spiritual enlightenment or watching TV shows and playing video games.
Sure, we can reliably assign value "for the society" to different pursuits, and keeping yourself entertained wouldn't be very high on that list, but that is largely a social construct.
And then there's the fact that art is a huge part of our culture and society. You don't learn much from great literary works of fiction, except maybe gain some self-insight that may or may not be of any value to you personally, as an individual biological unit that will die in 70-90 years and take all that precious understanding into your grave.
Same can be said of good movies, TV shows and video games. This value is subjective, obviously, but for many, self-knowledge is the most important pursuit.
I see, and I partially understand where you're coming from, while I still disagree with areas of your claims. What is likely to be a major dividing line in this discussion is that last sentence. The idea of what is or is not a more or less beneficial hobby is both placing games lower on a scale that we all define in differing ways, but more importantly it implies an actual sequential scale. It implies (and of course this is only inferred from that statement, feel free to correct me) that sports are the better hobby. Not different, not expressing different elements of our interests and passions. More beneficial. In essense it will be incredibly hard to debate something on which we have different foundations on judging what is beneficial, but something that I think is more useful to bring up is that I don't think it is particularly nessecary to make this single-dimensional comparison or better or worse. Games can allow us to explore new cultures, worlds or perspectives as players play them. They can facilitate learning and certain reflexes. I do not think these are better or worse than benefits given by, say, sports but I do think they are different in a way that we should appreciate rather than pit against each other. These activities compete for time but it does not mean we can't still make time to partake in both and gain benefits that both can offer.
Additionally speaking as a creator in this medium, while I appreciate discussion on the benefits and drawbacks of it, it's a bit disheartening to read statements like "fundamentally, I think the medium as a whole is a diet pill on society, lessening society's motivation to accomplish things", which speak about an entire medium of expression in fairly sharp terms, but when mentioning another activity you don't feel is beneficial to your son, you specify an area of that medium ("non-learning TV shows"). I hope you can understand a bit of my frustration to see this medium critiqued as a singular conglomeration but other mediums split into 'useful' and 'non-useful' components.
I do appreciate that you're trying to approach this topic in a thoughtful manner and I hope that this can shed some light on where I'm coming from on this topic.
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OP
OP
Your post echoes the sentiments of many here, and also addresses the specific major complaint I have with video games (false accomplishment), so thanks for this.
I do acknowledge in my OP that many mediums and hobbies share this component with video games. But it was already a really long OP and I didn't want to make it longer by listing specifics.
I think you're right that sports fans get a false sense of accomplishment from their teams winning. I don't much respect sports fandom as a hobby either. And you're also right that entertainment movies give you a false sense of accomplishment at the climax of the movie when the good guys accomplish something and you feel you're right there with them.
Having said that, as I said in my OP, I don't think these false accomplishment pills served up by movies are as pronounced and pernicious as those in video games. The very nature of the vast majority of video games is putting some sort of obstacle for you to overcome, you overcome it and feel accomplished, then they put another, and another, and another. It's a never-ending treadmill of false accomplishment pills. Especially RPG leveling up mechanics. That's what I feel makes the medium less... uh, respected by me, I guess.