Are you implying that justifies gamergate? If not, what's the point you're making by saying this?
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Hypothesis: Gamergate was the same movement that interfered in the 2016 American Election
- Thread starter random_polymath
- Start date
There are no conspiracies in this world and everything is out in the open. There was not a shadowy hand behind Gamergate, Gamergate was just a reflection of the morals and beliefs of the people who flocked to it. Those happen to be similar to the Alt-right at large.
I sort of side-eye everyone who thinks this way because it smacks of growing up in a sheltered bubble. Its as if youre saying "How can people openly say and think these things, dont they know its wrong?!" They can say and think these things very easily and do it loudly and proudly. They say it because they really, truly believe in it. You know that conviction you have when you state things like treating workers with respect, not pre-judging people based on thier skin color or culture, or anything else you really believe in your heart of hearts? They have that same conviction too, just for things that are bad.
You said something on a public platform, using a searchable hashtag that anyone in the world can access and use to catalouge what everyones saying. I dont know why youre suprised that when you yelled out in the void, especially when using something that would flash your presence like youre Gandalf casting that spell on top of Moria, people noticed you.
I sort of side-eye everyone who thinks this way because it smacks of growing up in a sheltered bubble. Its as if youre saying "How can people openly say and think these things, dont they know its wrong?!" They can say and think these things very easily and do it loudly and proudly. They say it because they really, truly believe in it. You know that conviction you have when you state things like treating workers with respect, not pre-judging people based on thier skin color or culture, or anything else you really believe in your heart of hearts? They have that same conviction too, just for things that are bad.
You said something on a public platform, using a searchable hashtag that anyone in the world can access and use to catalouge what everyones saying. I dont know why youre suprised that when you yelled out in the void, especially when using something that would flash your presence like youre Gandalf casting that spell on top of Moria, people noticed you.
They're probably just saying that reactionary movements like Gamergate are not a novel concept.
This is overly reductive. GamerGate STARTED as that, and then opportunists like Bannon and Milo fed that resentment and nurtured it into alt-right proto-fascism.
I know I know, it was a joke.
Im well aware of the horrible things they have done.
Im not wrong though! ;)
Pretty well known that Banon helped back it and the tactics developed during it were used and carried over by the political side of the alt-right.
Fuck everyone who enabled that shit and stood by and did nothing, especially the game companies that didn't come out with a hard line against it and still really haven't. The amount of harassment and vile shit that went on and still goes on is inexcusable.
Fuck everyone who enabled that shit and stood by and did nothing, especially the game companies that didn't come out with a hard line against it and still really haven't. The amount of harassment and vile shit that went on and still goes on is inexcusable.
I think that's your assumption because you haven't read my first post :P
Gamergate was not an isolated event and yeah it can totally be seen as part of the same conglomerate of cultural reactions that brought Trump to the presidency.
Yeah and this too! :)
Well yeah, that's something that happens. That's not exactly an unrecognized phenomena.
It's a vulnerable state when society is changing. Liminal it may be called? Where those who want take advantage of confusion and discontent over changes recognize it and take advantage of it, like with gamergate.
Thanks for clarifying.
One of the other things that still doesn't sit right was the FBI not bringing charges related to the threats coming from those associated with gamergate. Considering the severity of the threats and the obvious political presence it does create a sense there may have been pressure on the investigation to not bring forward charges.
As charges would interfere with gamergate as a means to funnel support for Trump.
As charges would interfere with gamergate as a means to funnel support for Trump.
Right. There is definitely some crossover in ideals and a clear allegiance.
Gamergate is absolutely, 100%, beyond a shadow of a doubt, a prototype for the alt-right. Their methods and ideology are quite similar. Both involve weaponizing the privileged against the unprivileged in order to distract them from the actual problems of capitalism. It's not a coincidence that much of Gamergate's leadership transitioned into political punditry once the dust had settled and a new culture war was taking place.
They are both fascist movements, full stop, and one was very much a testing ground for the methods of the other. Robert Evans of Bellingcat has noted on a few occasions that Gamergate is by far the most common singular origin point he's seen in self-confessional threads in fascist communities.
They are both fascist movements, full stop, and one was very much a testing ground for the methods of the other. Robert Evans of Bellingcat has noted on a few occasions that Gamergate is by far the most common singular origin point he's seen in self-confessional threads in fascist communities.
While I feel like there is overlay there to say they are one and the same gives waaaaaaaaaaaay too much credit to the Gamergate people.
I'd say that you're giving them too little credit when you're referring to "Gamergate people". A lot of the major players weren't people who had any interest in video games to start with - maybe even mocking gamers up until that point like Milo did. But they saw an opportunity to radicalize a group, they took it.
User Banned (Permanent): Downplaying the impact of a hate movement. History of severe infractions.
This forum is so laughable in the myriad of ways it'll go to try and pin all of society's evils on what was largely an irrelevant and short-lived moment that was almost five years ago. Seriously, get over it. There are real problems out there that need to be addressed that have nothing to do with the GamerGate boogeyman.
People have a narrow range of interests and use those interests to view the rest of the world. GG is just one small expression of a much greater system. GG isn't a "cause," it's an "effect" - one of many.
Well if you manage to connect losing a presidential election via Russia to it then I guess it can go on forever.
I'm sure someone has posted this already, but there's a reason the two troll armies of GamerGaters and r/The_Donald or 4Chan Donald trolls were so similar, Steve Bannon -- Trump's former Campaign Advisor and Cabinet Member -- was instrumental in organizing and shaping both groups.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech...-harness-troll-army-world-warcraft/489713001/
Bannon cut his chops motivating angst-driven gamers first with World of Warcraft, where he bought company made up of a troll army, and then spun that experience into Breitbart, where he hired Milo Yiannopolous to be his leading tech columnist, which widely promoted far right conspiracy theories in the wake of what came to be known as GamerGate. Breitbart's influence of the so-called GamerGate ended up shaping the argument and married the outsider oppressed videogame culture with the outsider oppressed conservative, white power political culture.
Now, Bannon certainly didn't create GamerGate, the toxic gaming community is at the heart of it... a community that is toxic outside of Bannon or Yianopolous, but Bannon, Breitbart, Yianopolous and others were instrumental in shaping the argument and appealing to insecure, conspiracy minded loners, who were desperate to find an enemy to help define their pathetic lives -- and the same playbook would be used to find help similar insecure, conspiracy minded losers to find a hero in Donald Trump.
I kind of hate that this user was banned for this, because it's much easier and I think constructive to debunk this post than it is to just ban the person and pretend that they don't represent a common point of view. There's probably a solid 10% of people who read this and agree with it, and when you ban the person before they can have their theory debunked, then you're giving up on that 10% of people -- even if only a smaller fraction could be convinced otherwise.
The OP (and me) aren't pinning society's evils on GamerGate, but rather, pointing out how the two movements -- the alt-right internet troll army behind Donald Trump and GamerGate -- have a similar DNA. The OP noticed it using quantitative and qualitative data, my post is recognizing it through facts, that both groups share a similar DNA because their movements were motivated and shaped by two of the same influential people.
Trump did not rise to ascendancy because of GamerGame, and GamerGate wasn't like ... the John the Baptist of the Trump Presidency ... but both movements, Trump's internet troll army and GameGate, are symptoms of the same problem. Despondent, identity-less losers who are on the wrong side of history who are conspiratorial loners and feel a need to coalesce around enemies and heroes. In the case of GamerGate, the enemies are people like most of us on this forum, or SJWs, or whoever the journalists are who made them mad, and the heroes are people like Milo Yianopolous, Donald Trump, and others. Because they're so inadequate as human beings, they're looking for adequacy in some other identity that they can be proud of: "Ethics in videogame Journalism!" or "Make America Great Again!" Those are very comforting slogans for people who are otherwise very sad.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech...-harness-troll-army-world-warcraft/489713001/
Bannon cut his chops motivating angst-driven gamers first with World of Warcraft, where he bought company made up of a troll army, and then spun that experience into Breitbart, where he hired Milo Yiannopolous to be his leading tech columnist, which widely promoted far right conspiracy theories in the wake of what came to be known as GamerGate. Breitbart's influence of the so-called GamerGate ended up shaping the argument and married the outsider oppressed videogame culture with the outsider oppressed conservative, white power political culture.
Now, Bannon certainly didn't create GamerGate, the toxic gaming community is at the heart of it... a community that is toxic outside of Bannon or Yianopolous, but Bannon, Breitbart, Yianopolous and others were instrumental in shaping the argument and appealing to insecure, conspiracy minded loners, who were desperate to find an enemy to help define their pathetic lives -- and the same playbook would be used to find help similar insecure, conspiracy minded losers to find a hero in Donald Trump.
I kind of hate that this user was banned for this, because it's much easier and I think constructive to debunk this post than it is to just ban the person and pretend that they don't represent a common point of view. There's probably a solid 10% of people who read this and agree with it, and when you ban the person before they can have their theory debunked, then you're giving up on that 10% of people -- even if only a smaller fraction could be convinced otherwise.
The OP (and me) aren't pinning society's evils on GamerGate, but rather, pointing out how the two movements -- the alt-right internet troll army behind Donald Trump and GamerGate -- have a similar DNA. The OP noticed it using quantitative and qualitative data, my post is recognizing it through facts, that both groups share a similar DNA because their movements were motivated and shaped by two of the same influential people.
Trump did not rise to ascendancy because of GamerGame, and GamerGate wasn't like ... the John the Baptist of the Trump Presidency ... but both movements, Trump's internet troll army and GameGate, are symptoms of the same problem. Despondent, identity-less losers who are on the wrong side of history who are conspiratorial loners and feel a need to coalesce around enemies and heroes. In the case of GamerGate, the enemies are people like most of us on this forum, or SJWs, or whoever the journalists are who made them mad, and the heroes are people like Milo Yianopolous, Donald Trump, and others. Because they're so inadequate as human beings, they're looking for adequacy in some other identity that they can be proud of: "Ethics in videogame Journalism!" or "Make America Great Again!" Those are very comforting slogans for people who are otherwise very sad.
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I don't think that matters. One of my roommates made his first Facebook account with a fake name and new email. Still suggested him us and people he knew.
As with many movements of this nature... it takes time and perspective to see the trends and make strong assertions.
We can definitely say now that GG and the alt-right online presence was pushed along by Russian actors and a few pretty fucked up people (IE Bannon).
I would have to say I'm 99% sure that's exactly how it went down.
Same thing happened to me with GG - criticize them or the "movement" and you'd be swarmed, like, insanely so. I had people threatening me IRL with my wife's name within minutes... insanity.
The Trump movement reflected that heavily.
I think that's important to note.. Because I would find it hard to believe that the founding events of Gamergate were orchestrated for a political purpose. Who would have ever thought that a (non-existent) sex scandal would be spun into a (non-existent) corruption issue in the (enthusiast blogger) gaming media, and that it would somehow galvanize gamers around anti-feminist influence in gaming and eventually right-wing politics? It's too weird to plan out!
The biggest WTF about Gamergate isn't that they're shitposting political warriors... that, I get. It's that they were founded on a myth that silly gaming blogs are some monolithic power structure on the take and that this has something to do with feminist influence....?? Weird weird weird.
I think you'd have to be of a certain young generation to think Kotaku is some journalistic power player instead of some silly Mickey Mouse blog (meanwhile these same kids probably watch YouTubers who actually are getting sponsorship from gaming companies, and no one cares!) But the fact that there are many adults in the movement is puzzling. I'd guess most of them got on after it turned into general anti-SJW sentiment in gaming.
States have been influencing each other's subcultures for yonks. Intellectual pathogens innit.
Not to suggest 'they' are entirely responsible, because then you might as well start looking for reptilian shape shifters, but I'm sure 'they' fan the flames all the time.
Not to suggest 'they' are entirely responsible, because then you might as well start looking for reptilian shape shifters, but I'm sure 'they' fan the flames all the time.
People who dug into the very early stuff did find that it was radicalized from then.
The thing is that while Gamergate came out of an angry boyfriend, the people pushing the movement forward didn't really have a whole lot of sympathy for him even when they were participating with him. The cover story gave them some veneer of legitimacy, but I suspect that there was always a group who wanted to use it to cause some kind of havoc, and managed to keep it hidden by appealing to a whole lot of idiots who were just upset that their favourite game got a bad score once.
I think it's a bit of a reach. I was following the news on the lead up to the election. Not only were people certain Hillary would win, there was no talk of a hate movement or gamegate types.
I think what happened was those people were emboldened and vindicated by the unexpected victory and undoubtedly many in the Game Gate and sympathizer camps quietly voted for Trump, but I assume many didn't think they'd win. This is the same as with any sporting or heck even sales talk over at the gaming side. One side or another gets really loud when an unexpected result happens and they feel they've been vindicated.
I think what happened was those people were emboldened and vindicated by the unexpected victory and undoubtedly many in the Game Gate and sympathizer camps quietly voted for Trump, but I assume many didn't think they'd win. This is the same as with any sporting or heck even sales talk over at the gaming side. One side or another gets really loud when an unexpected result happens and they feel they've been vindicated.
Can't buy you having no presence on twitter; you're so likeable.
That logic just gives me the same NPC meme vibes.
If Twitter had just made better policies against threats and harassment, we'd live in a better timeline.
If Twitter had just made better policies against threats and harassment, we'd live in a better timeline.
Gamers will be the next wave of shitty conservatives that the next generation of youngsters will have to battle.
What can we do to fight back? Right now, the left is extremely unsophisticated almost tech illiterate, while people are running circles around them by using technology to control the narrative.
What can we do to fight back? Right now, the left is extremely unsophisticated almost tech illiterate, while people are running circles around them by using technology to control the narrative.
I don't feel they're the same movement but they do deploy the same methods, which is zero'ing in on particular words or phrases in social media to brigade en masse, and then youth outreach (ugh) by preying on masculine insecurities. That is, the formula was established during GamerGate, and then it was reused for some 2016 disinformation campaigns.
I think the thing with social media manipulation campaigns is that they're opportunistic and leverage whatever already works, and GG did "work" for a while. Russian troll farm interference takes advantage of patterns and biases already there, rather than conjuring them up out of the blue.
I think the thing with social media manipulation campaigns is that they're opportunistic and leverage whatever already works, and GG did "work" for a while. Russian troll farm interference takes advantage of patterns and biases already there, rather than conjuring them up out of the blue.
Trump has been literally decades in the making, but there are some important similarities, specifically in the online media campaigns.
This is where I'm at. What's interesting is that these forces are both using mediums that originated in liberal bastions with liberal founders. It's really subversive when you think about it.
To try to separate gamergate from the alt right movement is folly.
The disaffected are a powerful disruptive force, and liberals in the West haven't been inclined to use them since 1848.
Projection, either born of pathology or strategy, answers alot of these questions.
Read the above big posts and links please.
https://www./threads/united-states-election-nov-8-2016-ot-hate-trumps-love.1308247/