How would Super Goku act in Z situations?

[DragonSJG]

So almost everyone seems to think Super Goku has had his stupidity increase

So I was wondering, how do you think Super Goku would act in the following situations:
Meeting Raditz
Grabbing Raditz's Tail
Dying with Raditz
Meeting and defeating Nappa
Fighting and sparring Vegeta
Fighting Ginyu and saving Vegeta from his body swap
Sparring Frieza
Sacricifing himself against Cell

and many other moments

 

[PK Gaming]

I'll be nice and say he helps Piccolo beat Raditz

Trains with King Kai, beats Nappa and loses to Vegeta because he's too stupid to tell Gohan/Krillin they can reflect the spirit bomb

"Survives" the Frieza arc I guess but is omega fucked in the Cell arc

This is because Goku was the only one smart enough to properly maximize Super Saiyan's power and there's no way Super Goku is remotely intelligent enough to achieve that state on his own

Objectively fucked in the Buy arc. Goku was constantly making split second decisions and was extremely serious throughout the arc. Can't have that with Super Goku

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

 

[Aran]

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This is so accurate 🤣🤣🤣. Super Goku was the biggest problem with super for me.

 

[somerandomweirdguy]

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makes me want to vomit

I know Z's Goku isn't as bad as Super in Japanese, but being American and growing up with Funimation Goku, I really miss him.

Diet Superman is far better than any other Goku interpretation.

 

[SilverX]

Super Goku is just End of Cell saga Goku, the team started making him way less serious starting there.

And it wasn't Super Goku who stared seriously at Piccolo after he just merged with Kami and shocked him by then smiling and saying "Kamicolo!"

 

[VariantX]

Super Goku is just End of Cell saga Goku, the team started making him way less serious starting there.

And it wasn't Super Goku who stared seriously at Piccolo after he just merged with Kami and shocked him by then smiling and saying "Kamicolo!"

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I was kind of coming here to say this. Most of all the dumb shit Goku does I associate starting the point from giving Cell a senzu bean and Goku not understanding his own son and the position he put him in. Its directly Goku's fault that #16 got killed.

 

[SilverX]

I was kind of coming here to say this. Most of all the dumb shit Goku does I associate starting the point from giving Cell a senzu bean and Goku not understanding his own son and the position he put him in. Its directly Goku's fault that #16 got killed.

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I mean, he makes the same mistake twice by thinking Goten and Trunks can defeat Buu no problem if they just learned the Fusion Dance. He often makes risky moves like this that seem irresponsible, reckless, and just stupid but thats just what makes him Goku.

I just don't understand the fixation with "Super Goku" when DBZ started becoming very silly with characters like Mr. Satan, Gotenks, Buu, Old Kai, etc. in an effort to touch upon the roots of the series. Goku becoming less serious and more stupid fits better with the tone they wanted later in Z

 

[Welfare]

Super Goku would have handled Majin Vegeta very differently. He wouldn't have threatened Shin but instead just get all McDonald eyes n.n and say he was looking for a warm up before fighting Buu.

 

[ArchedThunder]

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I hate this image so much because it's complete bullshit. Goku still gets plenty serious in Super in serious moments like that.
In Super Goku's goofiness and stupidity is exaggerated outside of the big serious moments, not in them.

 

[Anonymous Tipster]

"Super Goku" is just one of those over exaggerated memes constantly bandied about in every Dragon Ball discussion much like "bad dad Goku".
I strongly believe that people who believe and get upset about this stuff don't really "get" Dragon Ball.

 

[LinkStrikesBack]

Basically the same way.

Super goku isn't very meaningfully different from how Goku ended up by the latter half of Z at the very best, arguably earlier. I just was a child then and didn't catch on how utterly foolish the star of the childrens TV show acted vs adult me who can't get over seeing how utterly irresponsible Goku is.

 

[Razgriz-Specter]

Super Goku honestly makes me dislike Goku entirely,
I miss Z Dub Goku.

 

[Normal]

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😂 😭

 

[lorddarkflare]

Basically the same way.

Super goku isn't very meaningfully different from how Goku ended up by the latter half of Z at the very best, arguably earlier. I just was a child then and didn't catch on how utterly foolish the star of the childrens TV show acted vs seeing how utterly irresponsible Goku is.

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We were all riding high on most of the Android and Cell sagas to realize just how awful his character had gotten.

 

[timedesk]

"Super Goku" is just one of those over exaggerated memes constantly bandied about in every Dragon Ball discussion much like "bad dad Goku".
I strongly believe that people who believe and get upset about this stuff don't really "get" Dragon Ball.

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I don't know. I think you're right that his worst traits get exaggerated, but at the same time didn't he essentially doom Future Trunk's entire universe by forgetting a seal? Like the heroes had won the fight, and essentially solved the problem, but Goku ruins it. So countless beings die and the arc kind of ends with Trunks, the guy who saved Goku's life and all his friends by warning them of the future, feeling like a failure and then never being seen again. Instead of that failure leading to any introspection or change the next arc is Goku endangering everyone he has ever known or cared about so he can fight stronger people.

Dragon Ball wants to have it both ways. It wants moments of actual emotion and depth, but because Goku is such a static character, it winds up either making him look callous or it just undermines the emotion entirely. I'm not saying the memes are accurate, but I can understand why some people have just become frustrated with the character.

 

[ArchedThunder]

I don't know. I think you're right that his worst traits get exaggerated, but at the same time didn't he essentially doom Future Trunk's entire universe by forgetting a seal? Like the heroes had won the fight, and essentially solved the problem, but Goku ruins it. So countless beings die and the arc kind of ends with Trunks, the guy who saved Goku's life and all his friends by warning them of the future, feeling like a failure and then never being seen again. Instead of that failure leading to any introspection or change the next arc is Goku endangering everyone he has ever known or cared about so he can fight stronger people.

Dragon Ball wants to have it both ways. It wants moments of actual emotion and depth, but because Goku is such a static character, it winds up either making him look callous or it just undermines the emotion entirely. I'm not saying the memes are accurate, but I can understand why some people have just become frustrated with the character.

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Goku didn't forget the seal, Roshi forgot to give it to him.
As for the ToP, in both the anime and manga it was established the Zenos were going to erase the universes anyways and the ToP gave one universe a chance. In the anime another layer is added that the ToP was a moral test, though in the manga it's played straight.

 

[timedesk]

Goku didn't forget the seal, Roshi forgot to give it to him.
As for the ToP, in both the anime and manga it was established the Zenos were going to erase the universes anyways and the ToP gave one universe a chance. In the anime another layer is added that the ToP was a moral test, though in the manga it's played straight.

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Thanks for correcting me. I forgot Roshi was the one who dropped the ball there. Man I really hate that contrivance, that arc kind of killed Super for me.

On topic I don't think Goku has changed so much that you can separate him into two different versions. I think, for me, I am just kind of over Goku as a character. His whole gimmick is that he is a single minded guy who just really loves fighting. That's fine for the most part, but as the series has gone on several of the supporting characters have grown a lot more.

When you have characters like Vegeta who grows both as a person and as a parent, Gohan who chooses to pursue a more normal life, Piccolo who can find a balance between enjoying fighting and settle more into a mentor role, and Future Trunks who just wants to fight to protect his world, Goku feels shallow in comparison. No judgement to the people who love the character, I just find him a little tiresome I guess, especially when the show tries to have really big dramatic moments.

 

[PhoenixAKG]

Goku didn't forget the seal, Roshi forgot to give it to him.
As for the ToP, in both the anime and manga it was established the Zenos were going to erase the universes anyways and the ToP gave one universe a chance. In the anime another layer is added that the ToP was a moral test, though in the manga it's played straight.

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No in the anime Goku forgot the seal. In the manga Goku grabbed the wrong seal by accident due to being in a hurry.

But as people said yeah Goku doesn't really feel like a character in Super. To quote TeamFourStar, he's more like a mascot and not allowed to grow or have any meaningful character interactions. I get he's supposed to be uneducated but Super makes him a flat out moron who would be insufferable to be around.

 

[ArchedThunder]

No in the anime Goku forgot the seal. In the manga Goku grabbed the wrong seal by accident due to being in a hurry.

But as people said yeah Goku doesn't really feel like a character in Super. To quote TeamFourStar, he's more like a mascot and not allowed to grow or have any meaningful character interactions. I get he's supposed to be uneducated but Super makes him a flat out moron who would be insufferable to be around.

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No, Roshi didn't give it to him in the anime, there's even a cut away about the fact that he forgot to give it to him.

 

[donkey]

This is because Goku was the only one smart enough to properly maximize Super Saiyan's power and there's no way Super Goku is remotely intelligent enough to achieve that state on his own

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He found a way to get Kaioken Blue working, so I don't think that's a stretch to say he could still figure it out.

 

[ArchedThunder]

He found a way to get Kaioken Blue working, so I don't think that's a stretch to say he could still figure it out.

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Yeah, he figures out Blue Kaioken in the anime and in the manga figures out Perfected Blue and even manages to do a Hakai against Zamasu. People over exaggerate his stupidity in Super, it's mainly relegated to gags, not his fighting smarts.

 

[Rentaru]

Technically the z goku died to a heart attack right?

 

[PhoenixAKG]

No, Roshi didn't give it to him in the anime, there's even a cut away about the fact that he forgot to give it to him.

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Oh my bad then.

 

[Sargerus]

I know how he would act in the og Dragon Ball

 

[Tanerian]

I know how he would act in the og Dragon Ball

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#MyGoku


This is my Goku. This is who he will always be to me, and this is what I love about his character.

He's socially inept and uneducated, but in the end, he is the ultimate Saiyan. Fighting is absolutely everything to him.

One thing I disliked about the DBZ dub was it made him more heroic than I felt he was ever intended to be. I like him so much better as a man child who just wants to fight strong people. Super got that right about him.

He's absolutely the guy that would hire an assassin to kill him, so that they could fight.

 

[ArchedThunder]

I know how he would act in the og Dragon Ball

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This one is even worse than the other one, it's like people actively chose to ignore when Goku went apeshit on Black when being told he murdered his family, when he cried when he thought Roshi died or when he went apeshit on Jiren after a murder attempt on his friends.

 

[Tanerian]

This one is even worse than the other one, it's like people actively chose to ignore when Goku went apeshit on Black when being told he murdered his family, when he cried when he thought Roshi died or when he went apeshit on Jiren after a murder attempt on his friends.

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Those things aren't mutually exclusive. You can be a dumb idiot who's excited to fight people, and still be horribly upset when your loved ones are hurt.

 

[ArchedThunder]

Those things aren't mutually exclusive. You can be a dumb idiot who's excited to fight people, and still be horribly upset when your loved ones are hurt.

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He gets excited to fight strong foes in Super, yes, but he's never excited by strong foes killing people.

 

[Hyun Sai]

Cell saga Goku is just as stupid.

 

[Fj0823]

The same really, he draws the line at his family and friends being endangered (See Goku Black, him offing Frieza in seconds to prevent him destroying the planet and Jiren)

His "I want to see how strong this dude can get even if risky" flaw is a thing since the cell saga if not earlier.

But for most of Super the threats are either manageable at the start or it's all a simple competition so he decides to have his fun. Unlike in Z where it's do or die.

The image posted above is complete bullshit as is this "Super Goku" narrative.

 

[Dark_Castle]

I'm not the biggest fan of DBS , only watched through DBS once and multiple times of DBZ, and I didn't notice any major difference between the Gokus in the two. DBZ Goku has always have silly or jokey moments and serious when needs to be, and often making poor decisions, just like himself in DBS.

 

[ArchedThunder]

His "I want to see how strong this dude can get even if risky" flaw is a thing since the cell saga if not earlier.

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It predates Cell, he let Piccolo live and gave him a Senzu because he wanted Piccolo to get stronger and fight him again, he let Vegeta live because killing him seemed like a "waste" to him and he wanted to fight him again and finally he let Freeza power up to 100% just so he could avenge Krillin with Freeza at full power.

 

[Weiss]

They are the same character.

I'm sorry, everyone, but the English dub of Dragon Ball Z lied to you.

 

[Merc_]

Pretty much the same.

I'm convinced that a section of the fanbase only half paid attention to Dragon Ball Super and those comics that have been posted only solidify that fact for me.

 

[Jimnymebob]

DBS Goku only really feels different than DBZ Goku because there aren't any real threats in DBS, except Beerus I guess, but that entire saga is like 90% played for laughs and he's not actually bad.
Once Goku gets off Namek, he starts with the whole "I wanna fight. I know you've been holding back, I've been holding back too. I wanna fight you at your full strength" schtick that people complain about with DBS. I guess he's a bit sillier than on DBZ, but the whole series is sillier than DBZ for the most part.

 

[formasymphonic]

This is because Goku was the only one smart enough to properly maximize Super Saiyan's power and there's no way Super Goku is remotely intelligent enough to achieve that state on his own

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if you are talking about the SSJ2 state then I think that might be a bit harsh. Don't forget that Goku had SSJ longer than the others and had training time on Yardrat where he could have figured out "this thing is powerful but it wears me tf out". It's also kind of a natural assumption for him given the trade off for him with kaioken (more power but fucksup your body etc)

Also in the Freiza resurrection movie both Goku & Vegeta realise & explain to Freeza that he fucked up by rushing to challenge them as soon as he got Gold rather than having taken time to get used to it.

They are the same character.

I'm sorry, everyone, but the English dub of Dragon Ball Z lied to you.

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also this

 

[Furisu]

Goku is still Goku. Dragonball Super is a little more comedic than DBZ so his stupidty is played for laughs more often but that's it.

 

[ArchedThunder]

DBS Goku only really feels different than DBZ Goku because there aren't any real threats in DBS, except Beerus I guess, but that entire saga is like 90% played for laughs and he's not actually bad.
Once Goku gets off Namek, he starts with the whole "I wanna fight. I know you've been holding back, I've been holding back too. I wanna fight you at your full strength" schtick that people complain about with DBS. I guess he's a bit sillier than on DBZ, but the whole series is sillier than DBZ for the most part.

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Black/Zamasu was a threat and he was deadly serious against them a good 95% of the time, in the ToP he gets pretty serious for large amounts of it and in the Galactic Patrol Prisoner arc (currently not animated) he is very serious when up against the villains in that arc. But yes, I agree that we see him in more situations that are conducive to comedy which definitely messes with people's perceptions.

 

[Weiss]

What Dragon Ball Z looked like in your head when you were eight years old:

What Dragon Ball Z actually was:

 

[Infcabbage]

Goku is way more fun as a character in Super. In most of Z he was just frustrating Because what Toriyama wanted to do with the character was always at odds with what his editors wanted. As a result of that, Goku in Super IMO feels more "pure" and "fun" like he was in most of Dragon Ball. Serious Goku is boring and doesn't play as well off of the other characters. But you see shades of this in the Buu arc of DBZ as well.

 

[donkey]

Yeah, he figures out Blue Kaioken in the anime and in the manga figures out Perfected Blue and even manages to do a Hakai against Zamasu. People over exaggerate his stupidity in Super, it's mainly relegated to gags, not his fighting smarts.

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He also came up with the best way to keep Hercule's integrity to the public/aliens on the fly while getting the hell back home to Chi Chi, lol.

Slice of life Goku is the best.

 

[Deleted member 3208]

I know how he would act in the og Dragon Ball

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Nah, this is exagerating everything. We know Goku is an idiot who only thinks of fighting, but even in Super, if someone threatens or harms his friends, he gets pissed off. Or did we forget when Zamasu revealed he killed Chi Chi and Goten, or when Jiren attacked his friends.

 

[Gotdatmoney]

He gave Cell a fucking Senzu bean to fight his own son. He has always been stupid and dumb as fuck.

 

[Furisu]

He also came up with the best way to keep Hercule's integrity to the public/aliens on the fly while getting the hell back home to Chi Chi, lol.

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Unironically one of my top ten DB moments

 

[Malajax]

The same. They are the same character.

 

[Fj0823]

Super Goku in situations where his loved ones/earth are in danger like in Z






Thing is, in Super most challenges are much more light-hearted, so he can freely be his relaxed idiot self

 

[PK Gaming]

I don't understand why so many people are coming to Super Goku's defense, he just isn't that enjoyable of a character. More of a mascot for children than the protagonist of Dragon Ball at this point. Sure, he's serious when the situation calls for it but he still ends up reverting to a simpleton when the tension lets up for even a minute. We're talking about a man who doesn't even know what a kiss is. Contrast that in Z where he's telling old Kai he'll give him pictures of Bulma because she's "hotter than his own wife". They're completely different characters in terms of tone and appeal.

And as for the "Cell saga Goku is just as stupid" comments, Goku literally spends the entire arc giving people orders. He's the one who figures out how to master super saiyan. He's the one who realizes that Cell straight up can't be beaten by anyone but his son. He's "stupid" for giving Cell a senzu bean but he carries himself in a serious and mature manner throughout the arc. That's what's missing from Super Goku.

 

[Zeno]

He gave Cell a fucking Senzu bean to fight his own son. He has always been stupid and dumb as fuck.

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To be fair, it didn't really matter if he gave Cell a senzu bean or not. If Gohan didn't activate his full power, he wasn't going to beat Cell either way, and Goku knew Gohan at his full power could beat Cell easily.

 

[PK Gaming]

To be fair, it didn't really matter if he gave Cell a senzu bean or not. If Gohan didn't activate his full power, he wasn't going to beat Cell either way, and Goku knew Gohan at his full power could beat Cell easily.

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Goku's problem in that arc isn't that he's too stupid. It's that he's too cynical, assuming that his son will step up to fight Cell because he's like him. But he didn't realize that Gohan was fundamentally different from him.

Literally no other Z fighter had a plan beyond "uhhh let's just take him on at the same time" as per usual