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bananab

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,853
some people might think, I wonder if other statements I've made or beliefs I've expressed made this forgery so easy for folks to accept. Like if even a mediocre neutral bland celeb posted something like that, most folks would probably think hack. But here folks took it at face value. Wonder why...
 

Eumi

Member
Nov 3, 2017
3,518
Talking about women getting fired


I think at this point the benefit of the doubt for her should be out the window. What she's doing here is exactly how she was initially revealing her transphobia before I guess wanting to fear monger about cis women getting fired for believing only cis women are real women.

This plausible deniability dog whistling is her MO
Could well be. Even if she wasn't thinking about that when making the tweet it's not like she's going out of her way to correct the blatant transphobia she's getting in reply, so she's complicit either way.

I know if a whole bunch of bigots started using something I said to spread their hate, I'd probably want to say something about that.
 

Typhonsentra

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,947
Excelsior has not called her a nazi

lol yes, OP is totally actually a big fan of Rowling and are just trying to play defense for her /s
do you understand how stupid this post is?
... I know it can be hard to convey certain ideas over text so perhaps some of this is on me, but maybe re-read my message and think it over, lol.
 
OP
OP
excelsiorlef

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
Could well be. Even if she wasn't thinking about that when making the tweet it's not like she's going out of her way to correct the blatant transphobia she's getting in reply, so she's complicit either way.

I know if a whole bunch of bigots started using something I said to spread their hate, I'd probably want to say something about that.

Silence speaks volumes.

And like I said her reasoning for coming out of the dog-whistling and into out right naked bigotry was because she now believes trans folk and the government supporting us, are a threat to "real" women.

So going off about this is how totalitarianism happens in this case. It's just an escalation.

It's all part of a message to make trans rights out to be a threat.
 

Sunster

The Fallen
Oct 5, 2018
10,004
Yup. JKR is awful but come on. Are people constantly checking her feed 24/7 for a gotcha! moment?
Well the thing about twitter is that people tell on themselves. they literally log into twitter and type their opinions out and send them out to be displayed to the world (not in this situation, i know) sooooo yeah, if you talk shit and get corrected for it then you can't really blame outrage culture. they aren't writing in their personal diaries. they literally want our input or else they wouldn't put it out there.
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
29,890
Making gigantic leaps like this only discredits things when there are so many, much clearer receipts about her record
 

MrMegaPhoenix

Member
Oct 27, 2017
366
Seems the quote was about how it's easy for people to believe fakes. The quote from the nazi party would fit that to, where people believe a lie because they hear it enough. That obviously doesn't make someone a nazi to quote that, just someone using a quote that describes propaganda


I think some people are just proving quotes like these right, since the source was obviously wrong
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
29,890
Man that last thread was awful. Do not want to do that again

eJjh7Po.png


Good, neither do I
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,618
Spain
God, JKR is awful. These transphobes truly go out of their way to fuck with some of the most vulnerable people out there, and pretend they are the opressed. Truly despicable.
 

Llyrwenne

Hopes and Dreams SAVE the World
Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,209
Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.
VOX / Katelyn Burns said:
Her 2015 novel The Silkworm, written under her pseudonym Robert Galbraith, featured a scene in which the main character, Cormoran Strike, discovers a trans woman and threatens her with prison time, with the accompanying threat of prison rape. In 2017, Rowling was caught liking a tweet that linked to a Medium piece filled with vitriol directed at trans women.

A similar incident occurred in March 2018, when Rowling liked a tweet that called trans women "men in dresses," which her representatives at the time played off as "a middle-aged moment," claiming her finger accidentally hit the like button for the tweet.


them. / Katelyn Burns said:
For a more alarming look at Rowling's thought process when it comes to the trans community, it's useful to examine a scene from her novel The Silkworm, published under the pen name Robert Galbraith. In the scene, a trans woman, Pippa, follows and tries to stab the protagonist, Cormoran Strike, before getting trapped in Strike's office. After demanding Pippa's ID, her trans status is revealed and her visible Adam's apple is noted, while it's noted that her hands were jammed in her pockets. Pippa tries several times to escape the office before Strike finally says, "'If you go for that door one more time I'm calling the police and I'll testify and be glad to watch you go down for attempted murder. And it won't be fun for you Pippa,' he added. 'Not pre-op.'"


CNN / Rory Sullivan & Kathryn Snowdon said:
Forstater does not believe that it is possible to change sex, and that men who have undergone gender reassignment surgery are still men -- even if the law recognizes them as women. "I don't think people should be compelled to play along with literal delusions like 'transwomen are women,'" she wrote in a private message to a co-worker that was cited in evidence in the case.
CNN / Rory Sullivan & Kathryn Snowdon said:
Rowling announced her support for Forstater on Thursday, writing: "Dress however you please. Call yourself whatever you like. Sleep with any consenting adult who'll have you. Live your best life in peace and security. But force women out of their jobs for stating that sex is real? #IStandWithMaya #ThisIsNotADrill."


The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;


Twitter / @choachblade said:
We know who the totalitarians are...

EPPL_BPVAAAocuC



Twitter / @LAZ_R_US said:
To force people on pain being fired, losing their livelihoods and all they have worked for, to affirm what they believe is a lie and which is a lie is not a lie, with the power & force of the ideological & repressive state apparatus behind it, is tyranny. We now live in dystopia.



Twitter / @Blythespirit80 said:
Thanks for defending women from those who wish to erase women in law and in life A totalitarian endeavour led by Stonewall and other trans extremists


( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.
 
OP
OP
excelsiorlef

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.










The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;













( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.


Thank you for doing the academic version of my Jezebel article XD

<3
 

Deleted member 5086

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,571
Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.










The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;













( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.


Great post. :3
 

AliceAmber

Drive-in Mutant
Administrator
May 2, 2018
6,640
Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.










The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;













( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.


This post is absolute perfection. Thank you for taking the time to do this.
 

Finale Fireworker

Love each other or die trying.
Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,710
United States
Great job, Llyrwenne.

Nobody should be circulating fake tweets but we still got a good look at some irrefutable truths as a result. JKR perceives herself as an activist. Her followers perceive her as a heroine. They all perceive themselves as victims. The image was fake, but these things are still true. That's the meaningful take away here. They are rank and file transphobes.

TERFs and LGBs who pervert equality movements with notions of segregation and disenfranchisement are traitors and racketeers. JKR has become a figurehead of these sort of politics and it's pathetic. It is a shame that someone who was beloved by so many will leave behind a legacy of prejudice. Trans exclusion is the most vile flavor of political alienation.
 

Apollo

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,087
Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.










The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;













( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.


This is a brilliant post.
 

FormatCompatible

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,071
Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.










The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;













( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.

This is a amazing post, truly thank you for it. Every time some idiot tries to argue that she isn't a TERF I'll just link to it.
 

Deleted member 3294

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,973
So that Hannah Arendt quote is a dogwhistle to for transphobes? One of us doesn't know what that word means, I guess.
It coming from Hannah Arendt isn't the dogwhistle. Think for two seconds about who J.K. is comparing totalitarians to, or even just read the thread and look at the twitter replies that are posted, and it's not hard to see what the dogwhistle is.
 

beelulzebub

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,582
What's the dogwhistle here? It's an overreaction, is all.

👇

Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.










The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;













( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.
 

Aske

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
5,571
Canadia
It's a weirdly dickish move that definitely tries to lump this one crazy fake tweet in with other anti-Rowling sentiments; thereby discrediting them due to the association she's drawn with it.

It's not profound: she's a TERF who doesn't like that people call her a TERF, and is trying to paint herself as the victim of a character assassination akin to the Jews.

I want her to wake up and be a real progressive, but she's really digging her heels into this appalling, anti-science philosophy. I don't know why or how she's capable of ignoring all research on the topic in order to choose to deny a group of marginalised women their womanhood, but here we are.

I wish someone would sit down with her and ask her about her transphobia in detail, on the record; and what she thinks of those of us who stand against TERFs. Because right now, all we have is this, and it seems absolutely nuts.
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
So I don't want to derail the thread too much, but I think some people both here and on twitter are putting The Origin of Totalitarianism on a pedestal I don't think it deserves.
It's a DEEPLY problematic book that I'm honestly not sure anyone should be quoting in 2020.

I suspect JK Rowling hasn't read it, so I'm not sure how relevant it is to the question of how awful she is, but I would kinda urge people to not die on that hill without actually reading the book.
 

CJSeven

Member
Oct 30, 2018
770
Why isn't JK pressed and held to task on her stances? It feels like the British media and public gives her a total pass, and outside of American-based articles like Vox and CNN, I completely understand why some felt the need to speak out through the spreading this image.

And it was pretty telling that even though everyone knew/now knows it was fake, no one was saying "she doesn't feel that way", rather the defense was just "she wouldn't be that blatant"
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
49,964
I don't really see the tweet being strongly linked to her transphobia, but I'd like to state my support for the OP here.

JK Rowling is trying to position herself as a victim against accusations of bigotry, but unlike the Jewish people that the Protocols of the Elder of Zion demonize, she's actually as harmful as she's being depicted as - albeit to the T rather than the LGB. The tweet is fake, but it's close enough to the reality that it may as well be satire under Poe's law.

It's the old issue where you can scream about witch hunts against you, but it's a less substantial complaint when you're actually out there turning people into frogs and throwing children into your cauldron.
 

Deleted member 48897

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 22, 2018
13,623
I've read it and I know she's a transphobe and a TERF, still wouldn't call it a dogwhistle. Neither did that post.

I mean on the initial posting of this thread I didn't process that she's implying trans people are totalitarian monsters because I wasn't starting from the presumption that a trans person made the fake tweet to smear her. Doubly so when the play for savvy transphobes to claim they actually do support LGB people so like they're not actually bigoted but it's just that trans people are unreasonable.

The replies quoted in Llyrwenne's post make any argument I could put here, already. The image taken from one of the tweet replies puts the claim that trans people are all evil totalitarians right at the top:
EPPL_BPVAAAocuC
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
49,964
What's the dogwhistle here? It's an overreaction, is all.

Whenever a minority group complains about abuse against them, people who are disaffected by the issue frame it as if it's just an academic issue being raised by people who are equally disaffected. Essentially, they attempt to deny the voice of the minority group.

The one that personally comes to mind is the Apu issue in The Simpsons. The Apu documentary was made by an Indian man, and featured appearances from several other Indian and South Asian guests talking about their experiences. But when it's posted, you get a rush of people saying that they're just virtue signalling trying to find something to complain about - instead of, you know, just talking about their own personal experiences - or trying to put them to task for why they aren't solving all of racism and also attacking the stereotypes against white people in the show - when they're just showing what's happening to themselves and never had the presented the solution of all racism as the goal of the documentary.

Essentially, when a minority group says "this is what's happening to us", they voice is silenced by saying that they're actually straight white cisgender middle class college students who aren't actually experiencing what they're saying they're experiencing and should leave the talking to the minorities that don't actually exist.
 

Llyrwenne

Hopes and Dreams SAVE the World
Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,209
I've read it and I know she's a transphobe and a TERF, still wouldn't call it a dogwhistle. Neither did that post.
I would agree that 'dogwhistle' isn't really the correct term here. She isn't using particularly coded or obscured language. She's invoking a pretty straightforward (but inappropriate) comparison - one that, whether intentionally or not, feeds into the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' narrative pushed by her supporters in the replies to her tweet. This is an audience she herself courted with her previous tweet in support of the transphobe who attempted to get her transphobia legally protected.

I don't feel it is fair to characterize criticism or analysis of how Rowling handled this as 'b*tch eating crackers'. There's more than enough context here to justify a critical look.

So I don't want to derail the thread too much, but I think some people both here and on twitter are putting The Origin of Totalitarianism on a pedestal I don't think it deserves.
It's a DEEPLY problematic book that I'm honestly not sure anyone should be quoting in 2020.

I suspect JK Rowling hasn't read it, so I'm not sure how relevant it is to the question of how awful she is, but I would kinda urge people to not die on that hill without actually reading the book.
I am not familiar with the book and I didn't mean to put it on a pedestal in any way. I merely think it is relevant in that the quote Rowling used is about totalitarianism, is from a book about totalitarianism, which was written by someone fleeing totalitarianism, which makes her tweet very clearly about totalitarianism, and specifically invokes a comparison with totalitarian propaganda - which I feel some were downplaying.

I don't really see the tweet being strongly linked to her transphobia, but I'd like to state my support for the OP here.

JK Rowling is trying to position herself as a victim against accusations of bigotry, but unlike the Jewish people that the Protocols of the Elder of Zion demonize, she's actually as harmful as she's being depicted as - albeit to the T rather than the LGB. The tweet is fake, but it's close enough to the reality that it may as well be satire under Poe's law.

It's the old issue where you can scream about witch hunts against you, but it's a less substantial complaint when you're actually out there turning people into frogs and throwing children into your cauldron.
I agree that the tweet itself may not be directly linked to her transphobia, but I feel it is inevitably entangled in it. The support it is getting is explicitly transphobic, whether intentional or not, and it ultimately fails to examine why people would even think it could be real in the first place. As you say, the closet tweet is obviously fake, but it's really not that far from reality due to her known transphobic views. Rowling seems unwilling or unable to examine that, positioning herself as the victim instead while seemingly ignoring this aspect entirely.

As muteKi pointed out, there's a reason her statement wasn't some variation of "This is false. I support LGBTQ+ people." - it's because we already know she doesn't support the T. She posted that explicitly transphobic tweet supporting another transphobe and has not once since commented on or apologized for it. Now with this fake tweet, she responded within hours, not to express or reaffirm her support for the LGBTQ+ community, but to position herself as a victim by invoking an entirely disproportionate equivalence. The reactions to her tweet are filled with explicitly transphobic support for her - but I very much doubt she is going to condemn that or distance herself from it in any way. I believe people can change, but it seems that at least for now, Rowling is unwilling to examine or challenge her own transphobia, much less condemn that of others.

This place is kinda gross sometimes.
If you have anything to say, I would prefer you actually say it instead of dropping in with a vague drive-by like this.
 

Chikor

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
14,239
I am not familiar with the book and I didn't mean to put it on a pedestal in any way. I merely think it is relevant in that the quote Rowling used is about totalitarianism, is from a book about totalitarianism, which was written by someone fleeing totalitarianism, which makes her tweet very clearly about totalitarianism, and specifically invokes a comparison with totalitarian propaganda - which I feel some were downplaying.
I think you assume what this quote (and that book) is about based on the title, and I think you might get the wrong impression.
For example, this particular quote is in a middle of a discussion about what responsibilities do Jews bare for Antisemitism. And that's not even the really problematic part of the book.

And to be clear, I think your conclusion about JK Rowling is correct, I'm pretty sure she haven't read the book and she's just doing that "people being mean to me is just like the holocaust" garbage you see fragile famous people do online.
I honestly just suggesting that we leave this actual book out of this, because it's a really really problematic, and I kinda doubt many people in this fight has read it.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,895
I think you assume what this quote (and that book) is about based on the title, and I think you might get the wrong impression.
For example, this particular quote is in a middle of a discussion about what responsibilities do Jews bare for Antisemitism. And that's not even the really problematic part of the book.

And to be clear, I think your conclusion about JK Rowling is correct, I'm pretty sure she haven't read the book and she's just doing that "people being mean to me is just like the holocaust" garbage you see fragile famous people do online.
I honestly just suggesting that we leave this actual book out of this, because it's a really really problematic, and I kinda doubt many people in this fight has read it.
So her using that paints her even worse than people already thought then I guess.
 

Kyuuji

The Favonius Fox
Member
Nov 8, 2017
31,928
Rowling is a transphobe.

She has used her platform to signal-boost other transphobes, she has featured transphobic writing in her books, and she posted a blatantly transphobic tweet in support of another virulent transphobe who was seeking to have transphobic views protected under the law.

www.vox.com

J.K. Rowling’s transphobia is a product of British culture

Her "gender critical" tweet on Thursday shouldn’t be surprising.










The closet tweet is fake. It was clear it was fake pretty much immediately - it was much too blatant, even for her. It should not have been made, and it should not have been spread. However, the sentiment expressed in the fake tweet (that Rowling supposedly believes some people should stay in the closet) is absolutely in line with Rowling's known beliefs. Her open transphobia and refusal to address it in any way make it absolutely clear that she does believe there are people who should stay in the closet. Transphobia keeps trans people in the closet. She is an unapologetic transphobe, and as such I can not in good faith see her response as a rebuttal of the actual sentiment expressed in the fake tweet, because that sentiment inherently follows from her transphobia - the transphobia she hasn't apologized for or commented on or addressed in any way.

Her response isn't a rebuttal of the content of the fake tweet. It cannot be that without explicit acknowledgement of, and apology for, her own transphobia.
Her response is an evasion. It's a fancy "I didn't say that!", lacking any examination of why people would think she could have, or of how her own transphobia means that she effectively is saying that.

Of course, she is right - she did not say that. She did not make that tweet. The tweet is fake. It should not have been made and it should not have been shared.

But leaving it unspoken doesn't change the fact that her transphobia contributes to an environment that keeps trans people closeted. She deflects that responsibility, while also evading addressing her own transphobic views. It's cowardly.

Her response also draws an absolutely disproportionate equivalence between the fake tweet and totalitarian propaganda. It is a quote about totalitarianism from a book about the origins and rise of totalitarianism, written by a Jewish woman who was fleeing Nazism. Rowling's tweet is very explicitly about totalitarianism - downplaying it as 'just a quote about forgery' is absolutely naive. Just look at the replies to the tweet, and look at how the tweet's supporters are interpreting it;













( excelsiorlef posted a few more earlier )

Rowling is a transphobe, and her transphobic supporters clearly believe her tweet is about 'standing up against the totalitarian trans rights activists who want to erase women'. - and why wouldn't they? It's a tweet featuring a quote about totalitarianism from a book about totalitarianism written by a woman fleeing totalitarianism, posted vaguely in response to a fake tweet concerning LGBTQ+ themes. Why would they not interpret that tweet as being about totalitarianism? Add in Rowling's known transphobic views, and this flood of transphobes railing against the 'totalitarian trans rights activists' is what you get.

When a known transphobe posts something, and all the other transphobes interpret it as 'standing up to trans rights', and several trans people and allies tell you that maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe, then maybe that reading was intended by said known transphobe. Dismissing it as a 'gigantic leap' or accusing those who point it out of 'proving quotes like these right' is silly and ignorant.

She has chosen not to comment on her transphobia at all, but did choose to comment on this one fake tweet in this particular manner.
Without explicit acknowledgement from her of her own transphobia and the explicitly transphobic support her response is receiving, I see no reason to give her the benefit of the doubt.

Bookmarked, thank you for putting that all together so well.