It's my personal favourite of the trilogy, though admittedly it has some insane difficulty spikes at various points. I've heard Trilogy rebalanced the game, but I've never played that version so I don't know for sure.
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How is Metroid Prime 2: Echoes?
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It is pretty great, although it isn't a definitive upgrade over Prime but more of a sidegrade and a different flavor, if that makes any sense.
It does many things better than the first game- Namely, the difficulty and boss designs are much better than in the first game. Powerups are put to better use too and the level design was tightened up a bit. There are fewer empty hallway rooms than in the first game as an example. The layouts on average are more complex.
Still, there are some missteps. For starters, I think the combat was made worse and it already wasn't all that great in Prime. There is something that just feels uber unsatisfying about firing the light and dark beams. The limited ammo makes sense in the game but using your weapons never feels good and since often you might not want to waste ammo, it means that you will be stuck spamming the power beam and it can get really repetitive. The enemies are more bullet spongy to boot.
The Prime games have never had great combat like the 2D games and it is a bit of the same problem that pre BOTW 3D Zelda games suffer from in comparison to the 2D entries.
The dark world concept makes perfect sense for a series like Metroid but the execution could have been better. All dark world areas do a good job of instilling an oppressive and desolate atmosphere but they all look the same and after a while, all areas start to blend in. It is partly because of this that the game never managed to feel as memorable as the first game. The dark world also makes the pacing inferior to Prime, especially in the beginning. It is so slooooooow.
I also think I dislike the structure. Which is very Zelda-like and not like say Super Metroid.
Still, the game is really well polished and meaty. The best parts of it are the peak of the entire Metroid series, but there are some lows as well that you have to deal with. Think it is better than Prime 3 and definitely worth playing.
It does many things better than the first game- Namely, the difficulty and boss designs are much better than in the first game. Powerups are put to better use too and the level design was tightened up a bit. There are fewer empty hallway rooms than in the first game as an example. The layouts on average are more complex.
Still, there are some missteps. For starters, I think the combat was made worse and it already wasn't all that great in Prime. There is something that just feels uber unsatisfying about firing the light and dark beams. The limited ammo makes sense in the game but using your weapons never feels good and since often you might not want to waste ammo, it means that you will be stuck spamming the power beam and it can get really repetitive. The enemies are more bullet spongy to boot.
The Prime games have never had great combat like the 2D games and it is a bit of the same problem that pre BOTW 3D Zelda games suffer from in comparison to the 2D entries.
The dark world concept makes perfect sense for a series like Metroid but the execution could have been better. All dark world areas do a good job of instilling an oppressive and desolate atmosphere but they all look the same and after a while, all areas start to blend in. It is partly because of this that the game never managed to feel as memorable as the first game. The dark world also makes the pacing inferior to Prime, especially in the beginning. It is so slooooooow.
I also think I dislike the structure. Which is very Zelda-like and not like say Super Metroid.
Still, the game is really well polished and meaty. The best parts of it are the peak of the entire Metroid series, but there are some lows as well that you have to deal with. Think it is better than Prime 3 and definitely worth playing.
For people who will play MP2 for the first time: don't save up on ammo. You'll just make yourself miserable. Use your beams (and missiles) liberally, no matter how you feel, ammo is pretty easy to get even when you run out. Just need to open containers with one type of beam to get the opposite ammo type.
Prime 1 is superior, but there's something about Echoes that's just so... interesting? Like it has to be Samus's most unique adventure, and it just exudes stress and bleak stillness, especially in places like the Agon Wastes (has the most nihil and bleak sounding area theme I've ever heard). The Dark world actively hates you and I find it interesting how the game forces you to have to do unsafe things in order to progress. The pockets of light in the miasma areas were examples of this.
The game is also tough as nails and really doesn't hold your hand at all. Almost frustratingly so, unfortunately. It's super easy to get lost.
The game is also tough as nails and really doesn't hold your hand at all. Almost frustratingly so, unfortunately. It's super easy to get lost.
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This! As with Breath of the Wild (and toilet paper), people way overreact to the threat of scarcity. The game is balanced around using resources efficiently, not to hoarding them; and by "efficiently" I mean "not emptying your ammo into a door while you wait for it to open".
Also MP2 is the best Metroid.
Just slightly lower than Prime ( because that's perfection), probably top 5 all Metroid games.
Ignore the "muh dark world" comments, its a non issue.
Also this.
Ignore the "muh dark world" comments, its a non issue.
Also this.
I enjoyed it the most out of the Trilogy games. I enjoyed the environments, Dark World and the challenge.
Definitely the hardest and least beginner-friendly from the MP trilogy, but it is very enjoyable. It is my personal favorite, specially with motion controls.
I started an MP1 playthrough using hlhbk's excellent config from this thread. Game looks incredible even without texture packs. I'd highly recommend it if you have a gaming PC.
This is exactly how I feel haha, like the oppressive atmosphere of the game was done so well, that it felt like every frustrating or stressful element to it was meant to be that way in order to contribute to it. It's really hard to explain.
It's very good but the weakest of the trilogy in my opinion.
Having ammunition for the weapons feels kinda wrong. Also some mini bosses were a little bit boring. I liked how fast the first game was with the scan jumping etc.
Having ammunition for the weapons feels kinda wrong. Also some mini bosses were a little bit boring. I liked how fast the first game was with the scan jumping etc.
It's a phenomenal sequel. Even outside the Dark World, the setting is the most oppressive, hostile, and stressful Metroid has ever been. I mean that in a good way, because it really sells the apocalyptic threat that the Ing and Dark World are. Combat is much more engaging, thanks to better encounter design and enemies that are smarter, meaner, and more varied. Also, it has some of the greatest level design, like, ever.
With all that said, Prime 2 has a few controversial quirks that you may or may not like. First off, the game is hard. Some of the bosses are infamous for providing some egregious difficulty spikes. Second, the light/dark world mechanic makes traversing the world a notably more complex, maybe to the point of being a little obtuse at times.
Superficially, Prime 2 looks like an iteritive sequel, but it really isn't. If you're looking for the sequel to the greatest game ever made, then congrats, that's whay you're going to get and then some. However if you're just looking for Metroid Prime 1 again, you'll be in for a rather hard hitting surprise. Does that even make sense? Doesn't matter, just play it.
With all that said, Prime 2 has a few controversial quirks that you may or may not like. First off, the game is hard. Some of the bosses are infamous for providing some egregious difficulty spikes. Second, the light/dark world mechanic makes traversing the world a notably more complex, maybe to the point of being a little obtuse at times.
Superficially, Prime 2 looks like an iteritive sequel, but it really isn't. If you're looking for the sequel to the greatest game ever made, then congrats, that's whay you're going to get and then some. However if you're just looking for Metroid Prime 1 again, you'll be in for a rather hard hitting surprise. Does that even make sense? Doesn't matter, just play it.
I'm actually in the extreme minority that loves the beam system, though it took me to maybe my third playthrough to utilize it properly. It actually makes the game quite easy in many parts, even on hard difficulty on the original gamecube version (admittedly I've played the game almost 10 times at this point so I'm pretty good at it).
Don't try to be conservative with your use of the beams. If you come across a tougher or bullet spongey enemy, use the opposite polarity beam. The Dark beam can freeze most enemies in the light world, and the Light beam just tears through most enemies in the dark world. It's pretty easy to refill your ammo from crates lying around everywhere. And if you run out of ammo, you can still use it like the charge beam, though it releases just a single normal shot. The tougher enemies like Rezbits and Tallon Metroids become cannon fodder if you utilize the beams properly.
I will say though, there is no getting around the fact that the Boost Guardian is EXTREMELY difficult on hard difficulty on the gamecube version nomatter what you do (even if you've maxed out your E-tanks and beam ammo up to that point), since the environment is literally killing you at all times. If you're playing the trilogy version though he's a breeze.
Don't try to be conservative with your use of the beams. If you come across a tougher or bullet spongey enemy, use the opposite polarity beam. The Dark beam can freeze most enemies in the light world, and the Light beam just tears through most enemies in the dark world. It's pretty easy to refill your ammo from crates lying around everywhere. And if you run out of ammo, you can still use it like the charge beam, though it releases just a single normal shot. The tougher enemies like Rezbits and Tallon Metroids become cannon fodder if you utilize the beams properly.
I will say though, there is no getting around the fact that the Boost Guardian is EXTREMELY difficult on hard difficulty on the gamecube version nomatter what you do (even if you've maxed out your E-tanks and beam ammo up to that point), since the environment is literally killing you at all times. If you're playing the trilogy version though he's a breeze.
Echoes is a mixed bag, from a relative point. That relative point being in general the very high quality of the trilogy.
The bosses are super cool looking, but fall even harder into strict wait for this moment to attack a thing, after attacking the thing the boss exposes the weakpoint, attack the weakpoint to do damage, repeat 3 times. I vastly prefer the more arcade like boss battles where while there are weakpoint you can exploit at times, or by need, you just fucking fight without a super obvious script to follow.
The ones that don't follow this, are even more annoying. Boost guardian comes to mind.
To see the culmination of this design practice completely unrestrained look at the Batman Arkham origins (the 2d Arkham) games boss fights.
Game introduced a lot of tedium into the prime design. Going back and forth between light and dark world wears thin very quickly, there are keys you have to collect multiples of to simply unlock a door to a new area, instead of getting a new powerups to overcome an obstacle. You have to do this many, many, times. The screeching halt of finale pacing to do a key hunt is even worse and more tedious than the first game.
This spoiler section is about powerups, which I think is as spoilery as it is important to talk about.
Set piece level design is as awesome in design as it is to look at. It's really really good
.....but.... Compositionally, it doesn't really come together as a whole interconnected world anywhere near as well as Prime did.
It's my least favourite of the series, only because while prime 3 is even more fragmented, it doesn't waste time with sheer tediousness like echoes does, and has better moment to moment combat.
The bosses are super cool looking, but fall even harder into strict wait for this moment to attack a thing, after attacking the thing the boss exposes the weakpoint, attack the weakpoint to do damage, repeat 3 times. I vastly prefer the more arcade like boss battles where while there are weakpoint you can exploit at times, or by need, you just fucking fight without a super obvious script to follow.
The ones that don't follow this, are even more annoying. Boost guardian comes to mind.
To see the culmination of this design practice completely unrestrained look at the Batman Arkham origins (the 2d Arkham) games boss fights.
Game introduced a lot of tedium into the prime design. Going back and forth between light and dark world wears thin very quickly, there are keys you have to collect multiples of to simply unlock a door to a new area, instead of getting a new powerups to overcome an obstacle. You have to do this many, many, times. The screeching halt of finale pacing to do a key hunt is even worse and more tedious than the first game.
This spoiler section is about powerups, which I think is as spoilery as it is important to talk about.
Beam Powerups are the same. The main weapons are very clearly still the same as before functionally, except with a snazzy visual/thenatic makeover, and a tedious beam ammo system. Optional to find Combo bean weapons are nearly all the same functionally, big aoe attacks, just with spectacle displays. Like really really cool spectacles, so they're still fun, and they still exist which is definitely a plus that outweighs any cons for beam combos.
Visors are basically the same, again, aside from the cosmetic way they are presented. They are not used nearly as well as in prime. Very obvious lock and key design.
Then you have the space jump/screw attack which is made out of pure awesome. In combat and level design for crossing huge gaps.
Then you have the wall jump pads that go with it which are made of pure lame..... Or is that only in 3?
Nothing more I can remember is great enough or not great enough to include in this spoiler rundown.
Visors are basically the same, again, aside from the cosmetic way they are presented. They are not used nearly as well as in prime. Very obvious lock and key design.
Then you have the space jump/screw attack which is made out of pure awesome. In combat and level design for crossing huge gaps.
Then you have the wall jump pads that go with it which are made of pure lame..... Or is that only in 3?
Nothing more I can remember is great enough or not great enough to include in this spoiler rundown.
Set piece level design is as awesome in design as it is to look at. It's really really good
.....but.... Compositionally, it doesn't really come together as a whole interconnected world anywhere near as well as Prime did.
It's my least favourite of the series, only because while prime 3 is even more fragmented, it doesn't waste time with sheer tediousness like echoes does, and has better moment to moment combat.
The first couple of trips into the dark world are kinda tedious when you don't have many energy tanks and have to stay in those bubbles. Also I got hopelessly lost in Torvus Bog every time.
Also fuck the Boost Guardian. I hated that boss. After that though the game gets great. Maybe my favorite of the trilogy overall.
Also fuck the Boost Guardian. I hated that boss. After that though the game gets great. Maybe my favorite of the trilogy overall.
The scavenger hunt is by far the worst in the Prime series, but I don't think it even begins to come close to Windwaker's.
I really like MP2, but the dark world was a bit of a pain on my first playthrough. My second time through the game I didn't find it too bad, as long as you find a decent amount of health containers early on and once you get the suit upgrades it becomes less of an issue since you lose health slower.
And the game also recycled the same endgame "treasure hunt" from MP1 and Wind Waker which I always find kills the pacing at the end. Mp3 is the only game in the series that I felt the end treasure hunt wasn't bad, since it seemed like the easiest to find them early on instead of only realizing you need them until late in the game.
I ended up using a guide for it in MP2 because it's especially annoying with needing to hop between worlds at certain points and I'm pretty sure the things you were finding were invisible (or semi-invisible like the Predator) too, which just felt like an extra annoyance to the whole thing.
But beyond that I remember really loving the game. I like the layout of the world, it felt a little better than MP1 for me since I seem to remember it being a little quicker to get from one end of the map to the other.
And the game also recycled the same endgame "treasure hunt" from MP1 and Wind Waker which I always find kills the pacing at the end. Mp3 is the only game in the series that I felt the end treasure hunt wasn't bad, since it seemed like the easiest to find them early on instead of only realizing you need them until late in the game.
I ended up using a guide for it in MP2 because it's especially annoying with needing to hop between worlds at certain points and I'm pretty sure the things you were finding were invisible (or semi-invisible like the Predator) too, which just felt like an extra annoyance to the whole thing.
But beyond that I remember really loving the game. I like the layout of the world, it felt a little better than MP1 for me since I seem to remember it being a little quicker to get from one end of the map to the other.
I think that was the point. Added a sense of dread and horror to the game for me and makes the entire experience feel more death defying and epic.
Easily the hardest part of the game, took me ages back in the day but if I played it again now I'd definitely want to try with that same difficulty.
It's my favorite Nintendo game, and maybe my overall favorite game. It is, more than any other game, the one that got me back into gaming as a hobby, after an almost 8 year break from really playing anything other than a handful of party games or Goldeneye over at my friends' places in high school and university.
I disliked it immensely. I'm not a fan of games that stick you in worlds where you are constantly taking damage unless you stick to bubbles.
Borderlands PreSequel was another one I couldn't stand for the same reason.
Of the Prime games, 2 is my least favorite and the only one I never beat.
Borderlands PreSequel was another one I couldn't stand for the same reason.
Of the Prime games, 2 is my least favorite and the only one I never beat.
Overall excelent. Some of the highs are even better than prime. One thing that keeps me from replaying it more often is the beginning is kind of a slog. I can breeze through the frigate in mp1 no issue, but mp2 just feels like it takes forever to actually start.
Overall I like it as much as Prime 1.
Incredible atmosphere, leveldesign and soundtrack.
It gets bonus points because its the most complex of the three Prime games and I like it when a game makes me think this much in a 3D environment (I bet they will never make a Prime game this complex again).
I really hate the artifact hunt near the end though and there could be a few more save points, especially one right before the spider guardian.
Incredible atmosphere, leveldesign and soundtrack.
It gets bonus points because its the most complex of the three Prime games and I like it when a game makes me think this much in a 3D environment (I bet they will never make a Prime game this complex again).
I really hate the artifact hunt near the end though and there could be a few more save points, especially one right before the spider guardian.
Finished it very recently and it was definitely on par with the first Prime. I actually liked the dark world mechanic and the increased difficulty. It has a couple of flaws though: especially the key hunt at the end of the game and the fact that you have to recollect a lot of the power-ups from Prime 1.
Gameplay wise it's phenomenal. The maps and equipment make for a wonderful game experience.
The atmosphere is incredibly hostile and oppressive, possibly more than any other Metroid game. If you aren't in for that, you're not gonna have a good time. But if you like it, it "captures" the hostile alien world aspect of Metroid perfectly.
The atmosphere is incredibly hostile and oppressive, possibly more than any other Metroid game. If you aren't in for that, you're not gonna have a good time. But if you like it, it "captures" the hostile alien world aspect of Metroid perfectly.
Agreed. The Temple Grounds as a whole is one of the worst areas in the series visually and level design wise (the music bops though I'll admit). Reading the GF trooper scan logs was fun, and being introduced to U-Mos is cool, but other than that it's quite a slog.
I know it's infamously hated, but I think Prime 3 has by far the best opening segment in the trilogy, culminating in one of the best boss battles in the series.