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Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,595
A species where the average member might drop a spoon and flipout and kill a whole village, AND look down on the sciences doesn't seem primed to make it into space let along become a major empire. TOS handled them different but TNG and beyond have been the majority depiction of them. And whatever Discovery was doing with their new ones
 

bushmonkey

Member
Oct 29, 2017
5,629
Maybe there was another race in their planet who were the intelligent ones? The Klingons just wiped them out and stole their tech. That's my head cannon anyway
 
Oct 28, 2017
55
If I'm not mistaken they were invaded by an unknown species and eventually fought them off the planet. Probably inherited the technology that way. Similar to how the Ferengi actually didn't invent warp, but simply bought it.

edit: yeah, I just checked memory alpha, this is what it says:
According to the manual for Star Trek: Klingon Academy, the Klingons acquired warp drive from the Hur'q, by capturing and reverse-engineering some of their ships when they resisted their incursions. This explained how the Klingons, despite not being focused on technological research, managed to make the societal jump to interstellar travel.
 
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djplaeskool

Member
Oct 26, 2017
19,824
Conquest and survival.
Most of that tech is either found, stolen, or 'inherited'
Their class of actual scientists and inventors is small
 
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Jan 29, 2018
9,446
I think there was an Enterprise episode where Archer had a Klingon lawyer who basically told him "c'mon dude, we're not all warriors".
 

Hollywood Duo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
42,329
Arms race to create new tech with superior weapons. Kind of like how there was an exponential leap in technology during WW2.
 

Westbahnhof

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
10,118
Austria
Klingons were actually peaceful and pacifist before one invented the internet, which for them happened way after the atomic age.
 

DrForester

Mod of the Year 2006
Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,824
TNG and even Enterprise went into the fact that there are non-warriors in the empire. Their society just tends to look down on them. But they're allowed to do their work.
 

Entryhazard

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,843
I think there was an Enterprise episode where Archer had a Klingon lawyer who basically told him "c'mon dude, we're not all warriors".
It was also in TNG and DS9

actually klingon scientists and other professions in general aren't necessarily looked down on as long as they still treat advancement in their field as a battle to win

this was clear with klingon lawyers, that despite engaging in an intellecual manner are still framing the courtroom as a battlefield to conquer
 

mAcOdIn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,978
Everything about the Klingons is stupid. Why does such a proud warrior race bent on the honor of combat even have cloaking devices? You'd think they'd be big ass gaudy ships broadcasting Klingon opera on all channels as they gloriously charge into battle but all their ships are instead kitted out like submarines stalking prey.
 

gozu

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
10,442
America
A species where the average member might drop a spoon and flipout and kill a whole village, AND look down on the sciences doesn't seem primed to make it into space let along become a major empire. TOS handled them different but TNG and beyond have been the majority depiction of them. And whatever Discovery was doing with their new ones

The truth? Yes, your intuition is bang on.

Humans are the most aggressive a species can be and still not annihilate itself*. Klingons are absolutely impossible. Same with Terrans.

Vulkans is what we should be, and Klingons is what we are. So, when we reach for something worse than us to make us look like the "balanced middle", and we make up Klingons and Terrans, they are logically inconsistent with what we know of evolution and society.


* this statement is disputed. Humanity may yet annihilate itself through environmental pillage and vandalism.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,219
Klingons were more sophisticated and doing some crazy high tech shit in Discovery and that's 10 years before TOS.
 
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Slayven

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,595
The truth? Yes, your intuition is bang on.

Humans are the most aggressive a species can be and still not annihilate itself. Klingons are absolutely impossible. Same with Terrans.

Vulkans is what we should be, and Klingons is what we are. So, when we reach for something worse than us to make us look like the "balanced middle", and we make up Klingons and Terrans, they are logically inconsistent with what we know of evolution and society.
Terrans are cartoonishly evil
 

Cross-Section

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,876
2011-08-01-The-Smartest-Klingon.jpg
 

Justin Bailey

BackOnline
Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,508
If I'm not mistaken they were invaded by an unknown species and eventually fought them off the planet. Probably inherited the technology that way. Similar to how the Ferengi actually didn't invent warp, but simply bought it.

edit: yeah, I just checked memory alpha, this is what it says:
According to the manual for Star Trek: Klingon Academy, the Klingons acquired warp drive from the Hur'q, by capturing and reverse-engineering some of their ships when they resisted their incursions. This explained how the Klingons, despite not being focused on technological research, managed to make the societal jump to interstellar travel.
That would make an interesting story. It would be kinda like if the Native Americans beat the Europeans and stole their ships and conquered the world with them.

Shit, I think we just figured out the plot to the Avatar sequels. . .
 

Entryhazard

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,843
hy does such a proud warrior race bent on the honor of combat even have cloaking devices?
Bashir asks the same thing in a DS9 episode and Worf answers: "In war, there is nothing more honorable than victory."
Their concept of honor is different from that of humans', and good part of Worf's friction with the Empire is that despite he knowing what Honor actually is for Klingons, he personally ascribes more to the human conception of it
 
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Slayven

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,595
Everything about the Klingons is stupid. Why does such a proud warrior race bent on the honor of combat even have cloaking devices? You'd think they'd be big ass gaudy ships broadcasting Klingon opera on all channels as they gloriously charge into battle but all their ships are instead kitted out like submarines stalking prey.
Even better, they got them from the Romulans. They had a treaty that shared tech, then the Klingons were like "Psych!" and skipped out when they got cloaks.
 

JonnyDBrit

God and Anime
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,073
TNG and even Enterprise went into the fact that there are non-warriors in the empire. Their society just tends to look down on them. But they're allowed to do their work.

With Enterprise in particular, the idea is touched on that the empire is slowly veering into kind of an anti-intellectual, overly militarised phase. Where the work of scientists and lawyers and scholars used to be more highly valued, it's getting buried beneath the warrior fetishism.

Basically, they turn into the modern GOP
 
Oct 27, 2017
42,891
Everything about the Klingons is stupid. Why does such a proud warrior race bent on the honor of combat even have cloaking devices? You'd think they'd be big ass gaudy ships broadcasting Klingon opera on all channels as they gloriously charge into battle but all their ships are instead kitted out like submarines stalking prey.
Isn't this the same as the predator race?
 

mAcOdIn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,978
I think there's a difference between a hunt and a fight so I don't think the Predator or Hirogen have the same kind of "honor" as the Klingons.
 

The Adder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,301
A species where the average member might drop a spoon and flipout and kill a whole village, AND look down on the sciences doesn't seem primed to make it into space let along become a major empire. TOS handled them different but TNG and beyond have been the majority depiction of them. And whatever Discovery was doing with their new ones
Wiping out your enemies from afar without combat is dishonorable. Tactically stalking your enemies only to reveal yourself when you're ready to attack is not.
 

Mr. Poolman

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
7,034
They didn't.
All this time the Federation has been dealing with space ghosts.

My canon is cooler.
 
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Slayven

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,595
Nice constant design that ever Klingon ship interior looks like it needs a good pressure wash
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
62,364
They obviously got bored of fighting each other and invented space travel so they could go fight people on other planets
 
Nov 27, 2020
4,303
Everything about the Klingons is stupid. Why does such a proud warrior race bent on the honor of combat even have cloaking devices? You'd think they'd be big ass gaudy ships broadcasting Klingon opera on all channels as they gloriously charge into battle but all their ships are instead kitted out like submarines stalking prey.
They got the cloaking device through a script change in Star Trek III. Originally, the Klingon Bird of Prey was actually a Romulan Bird of Prey that Kruge and company stole. They streamlined the script and that change influenced everything since. It makes way more sense with everything that came before that the BOP would have been a Romulan ship though...
 

The Adder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,301
Furthering my last point: This difference is illustrated in the DS9 episode House of Quark when Quark disarms and leaves himself entirely at the mercy of his Klingon opponent, unwilling to give him the chance at an honorable kill. That his opponent still tries to kill him is what shows to the rest of the Klingons that he has no honor.

There's no honor in simply exercising overwhelming force.
 
Apr 25, 2020
3,418
You could ask the same question about the Krogan in Mass Effect, and even humanity. We dropped nukes on Japan and 20 odd years later were walking on the Moon. Sometimes an intelligent species is able to separate its primal tendencies from its ambitions for the greater good. It might seem like a paradox from the outside looking in, but history has proven its possible.
 

Doggg

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Nov 17, 2017
14,566
Yeah, I always imagined the explanation was that they got the technology from others somehow. Apparently that's canon?
 

AnotherNils

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,936
I always assumed they expanded tech to expand the empire past their planet. I'd think it was all conquering and subjugation.
 

Stalker

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,775
Klingons as of TOS have had 10000 years of relatively peace or at least house unification after a 1000 year war ended by Kahless the Unforgettable
 

Siggy-P

Avenger
Mar 18, 2018
11,869
I'm rewatching through TNG every so often and they're not a purely violent race, more of an aggressively martial race. They have scientists and medical people and beurocrats.
 

deimosmasque

Ugly, Queer, Gender-Fluid, Drive-In Mutant, yes?
Moderator
Apr 22, 2018
14,315
Tampa, Fl
That's why my favorite depiction of the Klingons is Undiscovered County's version.

It showed a version that had a class of Klingon were refined and cultured (by Klingon standards) yet still very much warriors who could easily be a deadly threat to those who face them.

More like Space Samurai instead of Space Vikings.
 

mutantmagnet

Member
Oct 28, 2017
12,401
Everything about the Klingons is stupid. Why does such a proud warrior race bent on the honor of combat even have cloaking devices? You'd think they'd be big ass gaudy ships broadcasting Klingon opera on all channels as they gloriously charge into battle but all their ships are instead kitted out like submarines stalking prey.
I guess you never played a "stealth" character in a multiplayer game. When you want to force PvP you need invisibility to force fights when they have nothing to defend. Klingons using cloaking is the most realistic thing about their portrayal.
 

NoName999

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,906
A species where the average member might drop a spoon and flipout and kill a whole village, AND look down on the sciences doesn't seem primed to make it into space let along become a major empire.

Well humans already had space travel and an atomic age, so it's not impossible lol