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Hollywood Reporter: Dave Chappelle Slams Michael Jackson Accusers and "Cancel Culture" in Netflix Special
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See I hate to see Dave Chappelle doing transphobic shit because a lot our community already has a bigger issue with LGBTQ already. Now all attempts to have a conversation about it will be shut down with cries of "cancel culture!" or "you're just offended!" or "it's just a joke". And people are gonna defend him to death because they like Dave Chappelle more than they care about the LGBTQ community
Was there anything more to this joke? If not, he's fallen far from that Elizabeth Smart joke.
Which still lands kinda funky but had some redeeming qualities (talking about victims of color and their media representation).
Hate to bring up the audience once again but aren't they partially to blame? They were dying laughing. I just don't think society is there yet where they won't laugh at that. I don't know much about Atlanta but isn't it a progressive bed? I believe the epilogue was in NY. I don't think him not doing the jokes will solve the problem if society is still ok with laughing at it. One could maybe argue they are not laughing at the jokes but just laughing because it's Dave being Dave. I still think we are a good decade away before the audience boo's Dave for this stuff. I'm sure he gets negative reactions at some venues (as mentioned in the epilogue) but then he ends that encounter in what I call Chappelle defiance and the crowd erupted with laughs, when I was expecting half boos.
Or maybe it's just because Dave is the exception to the rule for some people. Or maybe it's just careful editing to only show the jokes that landed idk.
Or maybe it's just because Dave is the exception to the rule for some people. Or maybe it's just careful editing to only show the jokes that landed idk.
There's many opinions here on this thread, both pro but especially con, so here's mine (as someone who's watched the special):
Chapelle isn't just a comedian telling jokes, he's got a voice and a pedestal and he definitely knows it here. His goal, outside of telling jokes, is challenging the "Cancel Culture" and #MeTooMovement. He's basically daring people to "cancel" him next. Maybe he feels he's got enough money to not care anymore? He pretty much admits he doesn't fit into the current climate anymore.
However, I didn't hate the set. I actually enjoyed it in general. IMO, if you laughed at a particular joke someone else was offended by, that does not automatically make you an awful person. A comedian is supposed to come out with an absurd or outrageous take on a given situation. You're not necessarily laughing because you agree, you're laughing because he said something surprising. For me, the MJ / Macauley Culkin joke landed.
Someone earlier in the thread asked for a list of family friendly, "safe" comedians. To me that's almost an oxy-moron. How can you be safe but say something unexpected/silly at the same time?
But that's not to say that people aren't allowed to be offended by some of his material, or challenge it. Like I said, he knows he's got the microphone and an audience. None of the LGBTQ jokes made me laugh and he certainly was intentionally making the subject a point of his act.
Chapelle isn't just a comedian telling jokes, he's got a voice and a pedestal and he definitely knows it here. His goal, outside of telling jokes, is challenging the "Cancel Culture" and #MeTooMovement. He's basically daring people to "cancel" him next. Maybe he feels he's got enough money to not care anymore? He pretty much admits he doesn't fit into the current climate anymore.
However, I didn't hate the set. I actually enjoyed it in general. IMO, if you laughed at a particular joke someone else was offended by, that does not automatically make you an awful person. A comedian is supposed to come out with an absurd or outrageous take on a given situation. You're not necessarily laughing because you agree, you're laughing because he said something surprising. For me, the MJ / Macauley Culkin joke landed.
Someone earlier in the thread asked for a list of family friendly, "safe" comedians. To me that's almost an oxy-moron. How can you be safe but say something unexpected/silly at the same time?
But that's not to say that people aren't allowed to be offended by some of his material, or challenge it. Like I said, he knows he's got the microphone and an audience. None of the LGBTQ jokes made me laugh and he certainly was intentionally making the subject a point of his act.
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One of the founding rules of comedy is that you don't make fun of people less privileged than you. Punching down is cheap and easy and it makes you an asshole.
The solution is just "don't punch down". It's really not hard.
It is not wrong to be offensive. At all. It is wrong to hurt vulnerable people. As you know.
No, it's because transphobia is still rampant in our world. Including in his act and the crowd's (and taunting assholes in this thread's) endorsement of transphobic 'jokes' as 'hilarious'.
Lets draw the line at telling children they should feel honored for being raped by famous people.
Well obviously, as this thread demonstrates, plenty of people are cool with mocking and dehumanizing trans people for the sake of a laugh. So I guess the line falls short of that for some folks.
He said he'd be a hero because everyone knows how hard that kid is to catch (reference to Home Alone). I actually think that punchline softens the previous part quite a bit.
Congratulations on talking around a defense for his transphobia while claiming to not be doing that.
Also cool that hate is fine as long as it is comedy!
Yes of course they are.
Lots of transphobes in this world and Dave has empowered them to laugh at us, and in turn they empower him to mock us.
I mean, but does anybody really believe he feels that way? I mean it's a joke and it's funny because it's absurd. That's what most of the jokes offending people were.
Any comic can do stupid and absurd. That's not been Dave's style. And doing moronic tone deaf comedy followed immediately by a QA in which he says he was just kidding around isn't brave. Or smart. All he did was repeat stupid shit morons on the internet have been saying since the HBO doc released.
Before this one I was a fan of Chappelle, having found almost all of his previous stuff hilarious.
Got about 5 minutes into this one before I had to back out. I thought the suicide stuff was super cringe and unfunny. Then he started talking about me too stuff and I had to turn that shit off. Didn't even make it to the Michael Jackson/Transphobic stuff.
Maybe I'm more sensitive now? Or maybe the way he handles these topics is just misguided and not funny. In any case, I'm a little sad I'll have to think twice about putting on one of my go-to, 'this guy's always funny' comedians going forward. Oh well.
Got about 5 minutes into this one before I had to back out. I thought the suicide stuff was super cringe and unfunny. Then he started talking about me too stuff and I had to turn that shit off. Didn't even make it to the Michael Jackson/Transphobic stuff.
Maybe I'm more sensitive now? Or maybe the way he handles these topics is just misguided and not funny. In any case, I'm a little sad I'll have to think twice about putting on one of my go-to, 'this guy's always funny' comedians going forward. Oh well.
I mean, I mean.
Yes, because it's an unfortunate but frequent belief stemming from the fact it's Michael Jackson and there's a high level of idolisation and adoration at play with many people. Every single thread about it on it here has been plagued by the same issue.
Not that it matters. As said before, mocking two victims of child rape and dismissing their story as lies isn't just something waved away because it was said by some prick with a mic on a stage. It emboldens and reinforces it.
That's part of the problem, though. He demands that people challenge him and that he is allowed to challenge whatever limit he wants, but then he keeps making it clear that he's actually terrified of being challenged.
Which is the thing that is so frustrating with everyone in this thread who keeps coming in screaming about how no topic is off limits and how comedians should be free to do whatever they want because "the point of comedy is to push things" as if comedians are themselves immune from being challenged and pushed. Part of being a good comedian is actually growing with your audience. There's a reason the vast majority of comedians who really play up the whole PC/cancel culture shit are the ones who are either bitter at tanking their careers or are rich from selling out years ago and can afford to just coast for the rest of their lives.
I didn't even realize he had another special up on Netflix! I think with was even better than the last two.
The absurd humor of the joke was that Michael Jackson is obviously innocent because Macauly Culkin was never molested, and if you're a pedophile you obviously have to molest him.
The problem is that the joke becomes considerably less funny because Dave has already told you he doesn't believe the accusers. So the absurdity loses its edge to reality. I think if he just takes out "I don't believe these motherfuckers" the bit improves by a large margin. I'm not talking about censorship but rather keeping the words in line with the theme of the joke.
Same thing with
Obviously meant to be absurdist humor that falls apart because he told us seriously that he doesn't believe the kids anyways, but doesn't provide any serious explanations, only absurd ones that undermine his stance. Which makes sense and is funny if he's protesting himself as a douchebag... But he's not.
User Banned (2 Weeks): Excusing Transphobia; Account in Junior Phase
Thats shock value. Sure it's strong but that's a big part of observation comedy (or comedy as a whole), especially his take. I can't think of a group of people he hasn't mocked harshly honestly. Personally I found the special really great.
Do you also believe "the customer is always right" is one of the founding rules of retail?
Are you trying to argue in favor of using comedy to beat up on people who are already suffering because customers can be dickheads sometimes?
A white person doing blackface to mock black people would have shock value in a comedy skit. You wouldn't advocate for or defend that though.
Comedy has lines in the sand as much as everything else, even if it's largely given more lenience in places.
The argument simply being 'it's comedy' or 'it's supposed to be offensive' doesn't hold much weight.
Is it really shocking if he's had the same take for years now?
Wait... I think he literally has done that. Also Sarah Silverman has. His comedy is trademark offensive and if you can't see the humor in that, I can appreciate it's just not for you. Context does mean a lot, for example David Cooke famously making a 9/11 joke too soon. Personally, I found his standup special really well done. That's all I'm saying.
Chappelle Show is one of my favorite shows of all time, along with his standup. But I have a hard time bringing myself to watch this new one based on what folks are saying. I'm sure I'll laugh at parts, but then I hear about the transphobic shit again and I'm just like....why, Dave? He's smart and doesn't need to shit on marginalized people to be funny. So when he goes out of his way to do so...I just don't get it. It's pure stubbornness, and shows he doesn't have a sliver of space in his heart for empathy.
I don't remember any of those jokes so I guess I missed that. I realize this must have pushed a button but I enjoyed his standup and I'm not going to bother trying to convince you that you should too. Personally I think it was really well done. That's all.
I'm arguing you quoting 'the founding rules of comedy" is nonsense. If you dont feel marginalized groups should be mocked you can say just that, no need to couch it in constitutional language. There are no rules, comedians can punch in any direction they choose if it gets a laugh.
As someone who's been a professionally-trained comedian for a decade, there are a couple of basic ground rules that the majority of comics tend to follow.
Rule number one is that punching down makes you a dickhead. And laughing at jokes that punch down ALSO makes you a dickhead. Obviously you can do them, there's no Comedy Cops or whatever who are going to arrest you for making fun of disabled people or gay people or trans people, but if you're a comedian whose whole shtick is making jokes from a place of privilege about people less fortunate than you, you are a dickhead.
Or you're Jeff Dunham, and nobody wants to be Jeff Dunham.
It's insult comedy. Some people can take that and laugh and I can appreciate that some cannot. Literally any stand up has mocked someone or something. That's pretty much the point. If all of a sudden you're upset at this one because it made fun of trans people, maybe think of all the other standups you watched that made fun of other races/genders/ or even specific individuals. They are in good jest and people live their day.
Making fun of specific people is very different from making jokes that generalize an entire group of people and make light of the ways they're marginalized by society.
Sarah Silverman was blasted and apologised for it recently, saying she regrets it. So it's not really the best example of comedy having no lines.
Perhaps you can tell me where the humour is in a white person putting on blackface to mock black people.
You should have just said Yes.
Nothing Dave says about trans people is in good jest
Why do they insist on making Arnold's role comedic in these fucking movies? Jesus.
"You seem upset" just smacks of more T3 and Genisys style humor. Ugh.
And that made it into the fucking TRAILER. I can only assume the movie itself will be even worse.
I definitely preferred the teaser more than this. Now I'm just worried this will be another Genisys.
I do like Sarah Connor though, I haven't seen anything from her I haven't liked yet.
"You seem upset" just smacks of more T3 and Genisys style humor. Ugh.
And that made it into the fucking TRAILER. I can only assume the movie itself will be even worse.
I definitely preferred the teaser more than this. Now I'm just worried this will be another Genisys.
I do like Sarah Connor though, I haven't seen anything from her I haven't liked yet.
what exactly is the track? We really need a mod/threadmarks post on what is allowed to be posted in this thread and what is not. From the banned trail, it seems anyone who doesn't acknowledge the special contains transphobia will be banned. Is the only point of this thread to talk about how Dave Chappelle is wrong?
the joke is that hes hard to catch because he's Kevin McCallister from Home Alone
There is a difference between discussing what Chappelle said and just doing weak drivebys where shitty people insist that anyone upset just need to have the rules of comedy explained to them.
Maybe the track is to discuss the content of the show beyond dropping a single line about how you liked a thing that has aspects that is upsetting historically marginalized people.
It's not fucking rocket science.
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