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Couscous

Member
Oct 30, 2017
6,089
Twente (The Netherlands)
The game (OT and any hype thread) should be banned on here quite frankly. I reckon it'll get the Cyberpunk treatment but it really shouldn't even be afforded that.

This game was trash from day one.
I agree with you and I would also like to say that I still find it bullshit that the Cyberpunk OT was allowed here after everything that had transpired up until that point in time. It was a big middle finger to the trans community here and I want the staff to correct that mistake with this game in the future.
 

Transistor

The Walnut King
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
37,121
Washington, D.C.
Hey all,

The staff is going to be talking over how to handle this game. For now, please try to keep discussion civil. We'll let everyone know once we've had a chance to have that talk.
 

SuperBanana

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,739
Damn, that's an impressive collection of fucking awful tweets.

Cancel this game.

The guy definitely needs to be fired and replaced, and probably even investigate if his shit ideologies were snuck into the game, but firing hundreds of people during a pandemic because one guy is a piece of shit is just ridiculous and cruel.
 

MechaJackie

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,032
Brazil
The guy definitely needs to be fired and replaced, and probably even investigate if his shit ideologies were snuck into the game, but firing hundreds of people during a pandemic because one guy is a piece of shit is just ridiculous and cruel.
Once again:
You think he never expressed any of these views within his workplace? You think someone this high up in the project, does not reflect in any way other higher ups views? Do you think his views never affected in any way a minority coworker's ability to work? This not just one person.
 

Android Sophia

The Absolute Sword
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
6,096
Hey all,

The staff is going to be talking over how to handle this game. For now, please try to keep discussion civil. We'll let everyone know once we've had a chance to have that talk.

Nice~

It's hard to divorce the lead designer from the game in this case. They have a lot of influence on aspects of it, even in subtle ways. So it's good to see that it's being talked about.
 

SuperBanana

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,739
Once again:
You think he never expressed any of these views within his workplace? You think someone this high up in the project, does not reflect in any way other higher ups views? Do you think his views never affected in any way a minority coworker's ability to work? This not just one person.

In my old job I worked with about 200 people. About 3 or 4 people were hardcore Trump supporters, including one senior manager. Everyone else thought they were idiots, and I think a few complained to HR asking them to tone it down. Should I have been fired as well as all 200 people?
 

Cenauru

Dragon Girl Supremacy
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,940
Hey all,

The staff is going to be talking over how to handle this game. For now, please try to keep discussion civil. We'll let everyone know once we've had a chance to have that talk.
Thank you. Just learned of this right now and I honestly cannot see a reason for the game and IP to be promoted here at all.
 

Beth Cyra

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
2,903
In my old job I worked with about 200 people. About 3 or 4 people were hardcore Trump supporters, including one senior manager. Everyone else thought they were idiots. Should I have been fired as well as all 200 people?
Was your job actually doing something that would be used to harm a minority?

I ain't even all about the game being canceled.

However can we stop acting like it's just the team being affected? If this gets released, a large chunk of the money spent will go on to harm far far more than just this team when it empowered Rowling's behavior.
 

MechaJackie

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,032
Brazil
In my old job I worked with about 200 people. About 3 or 4 people were hardcore Trump supporters, including one senior manager. Everyone else thought they were idiots. Should I have been fired as well as all 200 people?
Dude's a lead designer, and has been working on this industry for more than a decade, it's not one person (besides, we do know a certain other shithead involved in this project y'know), it's an environment.
Edit:
And yeah, was your job something that would be used to harm minorities? This is the latest big thing on a franchise that has given a voice loud enough for one person to start having influence politically not only in their country, but many others as well.
 

Weltall Zero

Game Developer
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
19,343
Madrid
So maybe I'm misreading your point, but aren't you saying it's no surprise that someone working on a HP game is a chud?

I'm sorry but any benefit of the doubt I could give about "misreading" ends when you choose to misrepresent it the exact same way for the second time. Find someone else to construct bullshit strawmen from.
 

Kyuuji

The Favonius Fox
Member
Nov 8, 2017
32,012
Hey all,

The staff is going to be talking over how to handle this game. For now, please try to keep discussion civil. We'll let everyone know once we've had a chance to have that talk.
Appreciate the update. Hopefully we can throw this destructive IP into the trashcan here.
 

flyinj

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,940
It's bad enough to be a chud in the industry and have these views.

It's on a completely different level to have a youtube channel created to actively broadcast destructive bigotry into the world.

Seriously, how in the hell did the company allow this guy to stay employed while he was doing that?

People get fired in the industry for making the company look bad with a single tweet.

This is almost hilarious in how completely fucking over the top this situation is.
 

SuperBanana

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,739
Dude's a lead designer, and has been working on this industry for more than a decade, it's not one person (besides, we do know a certain other shithead involved in this project y'know), it's an environment.
Edit:
And yeah, was your job something that would be used to harm minorities? This is the latest big thing on a franchise that has given a voice loud enough for one person to start having influence politically not only in their country, but many others as well.

If you're saying the game should be canceled because of Rowling's views, then that's a different topic to what I was talking about. I was specifically replying to the comment saying the game should be canceled, and since this thread is about the Lead Designer, I took it as basically meaning if someone in a senior position was a dickhead then the entire project should be cancelled.
 

BrickArts295

GOTY Tracking Thread Master
Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,735
Rowling is trash, Fantastic Beast is trash and now the long waited RPG game is being developed by (a single) trash so far.
That franchise is cursed more than a horcrux at this rate 😅
 

DealWithIt

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,669
I'm sorry but any benefit of the doubt I could give about "misreading" ends when you choose to misrepresent it the exact same way for the second time. Find someone else to construct bullshit strawmen from.
I don't know why you're being so severe about this. I've been totally polite to you. I'm not accusing you of saying anything wrong or of bad faith. I'm actually interested in your view of the morality of working at avalanche.

If you're saying it's no surprise the director is a chud, I'm just asking you if you feel like that extends beyond this particular person or not. I'm totally willing, for example, to entertain the idea that we've known Rowling is bad news for years now. The latest anti trans stuff is not new, just a bad-to-worse double down. Maybe it was unreasonable to start working on an HP game even in 2017 or whenever they started dev. How responsible is someone for who you work for and when is too much too much?

I'm really not trying to antagonize you.
 

jeelybeans

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,948
Damnit. I was really looking forward to a next gen open world set in the harry potter universe. Why are they making it so hard.
 

jeelybeans

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,948
Dude's a lead designer, and has been working on this industry for more than a decade, it's not one person (besides, we do know a certain other shithead involved in this project y'know), it's an environment.
Edit:
And yeah, was your job something that would be used to harm minorities? This is the latest big thing on a franchise that has given a voice loud enough for one person to start having influence politically not only in their country, but many others as well.

This is really simplistic. Almost every industry in a capitalist society can harm employees. Firing a bunch of minorities from their jobs also hard minorities. This dude should have pressure put on him because he's a shitty person but this thread is filled with cruelty as well.
 

Scrappy-Fan92

Member
Jan 14, 2021
8,884
In case people needed a bite-size refresher..

Through the significance afforded to her by the Harry Potter IP, JK Rowling:
  • Has repeatedly sent out and echoed transphobic rhetoric.
  • Relates transition to being a new form of gay conversion therapy, one that should be further restricted.
  • Has driven trans children to self harm and suicide.
  • Has given voice, promotion and platform to numerous transphobes and large anti-trans groups.
  • Led a revolt that saw GRA reform scrapped, despite a 70% approval rating prior.
  • Added to a pressure that resulted in links to support systems for vulnerable trans children being removed by the BBC.
  • Has grown an influence that saw trans teenagers face further restrictions in accessing puberty blockers.
  • Has been cited by foreign politicians in their own bids to restrict trans rights, healthcare access and freedoms.
  • Poisoned discourse around trans access to bathrooms.
She is actively destructive to trans lives. Especially those in the UK, and of younger people looking to live as themselves. An utterly vile and contemptible woman.
Transistor We thank you for you and the staff's deliberation. I'm sure you're very busy, but is there a way we can threadmark the above post? I believe it's very informative and puts things into perspective.
 

Weltall Zero

Game Developer
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
19,343
Madrid
If you're saying it's no surprise the director is a chud, I'm just asking you if you feel like that extends beyond this particular person or not.

You're not "asking"; you're interpreting:
So maybe I'm misreading your point, but aren't you saying it's no surprise that someone working on a HP game is a chud?

Which is particularly absurd given a) my original post was exceedingly specific in its wording about this being about the position of the director, and b) I had just repeated it again after your unwarranted and uncharitable reinterpretation:
It's not "every name in the credits", it's the freaking director.

How many more times do I have to answer it? Yes, it's about the freaking director. No, I'm not claiming every last goddamn intern in the studio is "sus".
 

deepFlaw

Knights of Favonius World Tour '21
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,494
Well... this certainly makes it that much harder for people to pull "but what about the innocent people working on it!!" if nothing else.

Honestly just a little baffled by how directly shitty it is? Like if it's any game that was going have this revealed, I guess I'm certainly glad it was this one, but I didn't expect it. Like even separate from Rowling, you hired someone like this to that position? Fucking really?
 
Aug 12, 2019
5,159
In my old job I worked with about 200 people. About 3 or 4 people were hardcore Trump supporters, including one senior manager. Everyone else thought they were idiots, and I think a few complained to HR asking them to tone it down. Should I have been fired as well as all 200 people?

I mean, we're talking a high level position in a more creative project that wields influence over it that is also literally created due to and will directly benefit the racist TERF with a penchant for British Exceptionalism billionaire. The only not fucking terrible part of this whole endeavor would be those workers who do not align with the garbage ideologies literally at the forefront of the project in every way, and they'll probably be crunched to hell and back in a hostile work environment before this game ever sees the light of day...
 

Gay Bowser

Member
Oct 30, 2017
17,654
This is disappointing. I've worked with Troy in the past. I wasn't aware of his politics. I know it says he's the lead designer but from my understanding he was always more of a producer/project manager. I don't know if that makes it any better. I'm not 100% sure what the team structure is over at Avalanche these days, but my understanding was that Alan Tew was the lead designer on the Hogwart's game. His linkedin lists him as a lead designer at WB in SLC. Same as Troy. I don't know if they have multiple lead designers on the project or they have other projects in development other than Hogwart's or what. For some projects you'll have a bunch of lead designers with each over a particular feature of the game and then maybe a creative director over the whole game. I'm not sure if that's how they're arranged there or what.

I know Alan Tew is a really good guy though. Very quiet, thoughtful and humble. A really good lead designer. I always had a lot of respect for him. I'm not sure of his politics, but I'm doubtful he's a right wing/gamer gate guy. He never seemed like the type. He was always very considerate of everyone on the team. So not everyone there as a lead on the team is a douche. There are some good people there.

HOWEVER... there have been a lot of comments about how a studio could employ someone like Troy who seems very publicly out about some obviously controversial (and by our standards ugly) viewpoints. The sad truth about Avalanche is while there are no doubt probably some people working there on the team with more progressive viewpoints, from my understanding a lot of the rot goes straight to the top. From what I've been told about the studio is that there's a lot of cronyism there and it's very top heavy with a lot of guys who are part of the "boy's club." I did hear a particularly ugly story about John Blackburn who's the studio head. I wasn't there so this is hearsay, but I trust where the story came from. Basically, Blackburn had some of the team management out for lunch one day and for some reason he decided it would be a good idea to go around the table and have everyone throw names out of people at the studio they thought were secretly gay and in the closet. What he didn't know was there was someone actually there at the table who wasn't out and was completely embarrassed and mortified by the whole thing. Totally unprofessional. That was back when Disney owned the studio and my understanding was that Disney HR ended up having to get involved.

So I wouldn't describe the studio management there as being very LGBTQ+ friendly. So given all of that I'm not too terribly surprised about this news.

Jesus.
 

flyinj

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,940
This is disappointing. I've worked with Troy in the past. I wasn't aware of his politics. I know it says he's the lead designer but from my understanding he was always more of a producer/project manager. I don't know if that makes it any better. I'm not 100% sure what the team structure is over at Avalanche these days, but my understanding was that Alan Tew was the lead designer on the Hogwart's game. His linkedin lists him as a lead designer at WB in SLC. Same as Troy. I don't know if they have multiple lead designers on the project or they have other projects in development other than Hogwart's or what. For some projects you'll have a bunch of lead designers with each over a particular feature of the game and then maybe a creative director over the whole game. I'm not sure if that's how they're arranged there or what.

I know Alan Tew is a really good guy though. Very quiet, thoughtful and humble. A really good lead designer. I always had a lot of respect for him. I'm not sure of his politics, but I'm doubtful he's a right wing/gamer gate guy. He never seemed like the type. He was always very considerate of everyone on the team. So not everyone there as a lead on the team is a douche. There are some good people there.

HOWEVER... there have been a lot of comments about how a studio could employ someone like Troy who seems very publicly out about some obviously controversial (and by our standards ugly) viewpoints. The sad truth about Avalanche is while there are no doubt probably some people working there on the team with more progressive viewpoints, from my understanding a lot of the rot goes straight to the top. From what I've been told about the studio is that there's a lot of cronyism there and it's very top heavy with a lot of guys who are part of the "boy's club." I did hear a particularly ugly story about John Blackburn who's the studio head. I wasn't there so this is hearsay, but I trust where the story came from. Basically, Blackburn had some of the team management out for lunch one day and for some reason he decided it would be a good idea to go around the table and have everyone throw names out of people at the studio they thought were secretly gay and in the closet. What he didn't know was there was someone actually there at the table who wasn't out and was completely embarrassed and mortified by the whole thing. Totally unprofessional. That was back when Disney owned the studio and my understanding was that Disney HR ended up having to get involved.

So I wouldn't describe the studio management there as being very LGBTQ+ friendly. So given all of that I'm not too terribly surprised about this news.

So what you are saying is this guy was actively creating bigoted videos on youtube while he was working for DISNEY? And they didn't do anything about it?

This just gets better and better.
 

deepFlaw

Knights of Favonius World Tour '21
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,494
I just want harry Potter, a perfectly fine IP on its own, to be completely separated from its creator and problematic people.

Also, with the message of the IP, it's incredibly confusing to me to see JKR be transphobic. It's literally antithetical to the meaning of the IP. The themes of the IP. It makes literally zero sense and I hate her for it.

Why can't these people just shut up? Why can't they all just be silent?
It's so ungodly frustrating to me. To a degree unfathomable.

Like, please - correct me if I'm wrong - but the IP is about making friends and the power of love for the most part. The bonds you make with others, despite their origins and background. Like... insert white guy blinking gif. I don't get it

I don't want to pick on you specifically but as I read through the rest of the thread, this stuck out to me because of how often this framing of the series usually comes up.

The thing is, as much as you - and many others, me included - took away that sort of thing from it back in the day, that's not really what was happening. The series is a huge mess of half-executed on themes, mixed messages that it constantly undermines, and often just straight up cruelty. It's sometimes about friendship and love and acceptance on a surface level, sure, but often the actual events actively go against that. Like you can say it's about that, but if you went looking for actual hard examples I don't think it would be as established as you'd expect. There's nothing there that would make me expect her to be a kind and accepting person.
 

Belmont

Member
Oct 27, 2017
292
So what you are saying is this guy was actively creating bigoted videos on youtube while he was working for DISNEY? And they didn't do anything about it?

This just gets better and better.

If the timelines add up then I guess so. Though, in Disney's defense, I doubt they're going around stalking all the developer's social media profiles. I doubt they'd know about it unless someone informed them. How much they would do about it in that case I don't know. I assume it would have to get some media traction before they would act on something like that. Look how long they took to deal with Gina Carano.
 

Decarb

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,641
Of course he's a fucking Slytherin. The sorting hat could tell that from across the hall.