Highly anticipated VR title Boneworks is a collection of VR sins

[Bryo4321]

A bug is an unintentional side effect. The exact opposite of a "deliberate design." A bug, by definition, cannot be deliberate.

Things that make abnormally high amounts of people sick are poor designs.

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I'm not really a vr dev, but do you think this could be improved by changing camera behavior? Maybe decouple the camera view from the player models' head a bit so these micro movements from the IK when climbing and interacting with objects doesn't shake the player view so much? It feels like all they did was lock the camera to the player models face like arma which seems short sighted for vr.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

you have a very odd idea of game development if you mean that by using the same engine as others then you can just slap stuff in your game

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[0xBADC0FFEE]

This is a constructive criticism thread. Not a "game sold well so idgaf if people are vomiting after 10 minutes of playing it" thread.

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criticism as in "this is bad design, they should have just done x" from people that probably don't know the amount of work behind the scenes, there's nothing constructive about it, it's flat out an attack and searching a sense of superiority / reinforcement of own ideas

 

[Cyanity]

criticism as in "this is bad design, they should have just done x" from people that probably don't know the amount of work behind the scenes, there's nothing constructive about it, it's flat out an attack and searching a sense of superiority / reinforcement of own ideas

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Krejlooc is literally a VR game dev

 

[Bigmac]

I get motion sick pretty easily in VR, so I think I'll wait until more comfort options are (hopefully) patched in. The point made about how the world interacts with the player is the sorta stuff that instantly messes me up. Really curious how the devs respond to all of this, it seems like adding a detached head should be a given to eliminate the wobble.

 

[0xBADC0FFEE]

I'm not really a vr dev, but do you think this could be improved by changing camera behavior? Maybe decouple the camera view from the player models' head a bit so these micro movements from the IK when climbing and interacting with objects doesn't shake the player view so much? It feels like all they did was lock the camera to the player models face like arma which seems short sighted for vr.

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the game follows a rigid body and it's a design choice, what's not a design choice is that you can get sudden jumps and glitches, what they could do is having interpolation and smoothing in place and obscuring the fov depending of how much of a disconnect there is between your tracked position and the physical head

 

[0xBADC0FFEE]

Krejlooc is literally a VR game dev

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same, and a regular AAA dev as well with 13 years of experience, you just don't slap other people's code in your custom vr physical body implementation and magically fix all the issues, it really doesn't matter if you also use unity or unreal, not even if it's the same exact version, developers that bad mouth other people's work like this are the worst in my book btw, you believe they should be more understanding, but sometimes their position makes for the worst critics

 

[Bryo4321]

the game follows a rigid body and it's a design choice, what's not a design choice is that you can get sudden jumps and glitches, what they could do is having interpolation and smoothing in place and obscuring the fov depending of how much of a disconnect there is between your tracked position and the physical head

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Yeah, I personally am a big fan of the body and arms. I just never noticed these camera jumps in blade and sorcery which works very similarly. Never had an issue climbing or rappelling in that game but a few hours of Boneworks started to get to me and I had to take a break. I wonder if blade and sorcery does something like this to mitigate these camera issues.

90% of the time Boneworks feels great to me, it's just those jumps/glitches you describe that get my stomach churning in a way that I've honestly never experienced before in any vr game or real life amusement ride or anything. I'll still say without hesitation that Boneworks also without a doubt the most immersive vr game I've played despite this, thanks to the interactivity and body.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

criticism as in "this is bad design, they should have just done x" from people that probably don't know the amount of work behind the scenes, there's nothing constructive about it, it's flat out an attack and searching a sense of superiority / reinforcement of own ideas

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Nobody is talking about "slapping" code anywhere, we are talking about the implementation, and the physics implentation Unity uses is well understood. There are literally mountains of research about how to avoid doing this kind of thing in unity projects. that you have gone from "implementation" to "slapping code" makes it sound like you have a weird notion about how programming patterns are disseminated among developers.

Further, regarding a supposed aire of superiority and unwillingness to move: I was originally against teleportation and comfort settings when I got my DK1. I talked about the need for smooth locomotion, spread talk about "VR legs." This was when the DK1 first launched. My views didn't spring up in isolation, what I say about VR has come from A) seeing first hand through demonstration why these things are needed, B) discussing with other developers on the oculus development forums, and C) actually building these kinds of demos and seeing first hand why they break. So like, the opposite of what you're claiming I did. They come from actual research and discussion and experimentation, and actually are quite different from my original "truthiness" assessment I had before all that.

 

[0xBADC0FFEE]

Yeah, I personally am a big fan of the body and arms. I just never noticed these camera jumps in blade and sorcery which works very similarly. Never had an issue climbing or rappelling in that game but a few hours of Boneworks started to get to me and I had to take a break. I wonder if blade and sorcery does something like this to mitigate these camera issues.

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they probably have a better implementation, but I guess the Boneworks guys forgot to download the premade perfect vr body asset that everyone is using from the store, woops

 

[Deleted member 12790]

they probably have a better implementation, but I guess the Boneworks guys forgot to download the premade perfect vr body asset that everyone is using from the store, woops

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me: "they should have heeded the mountains of research and discussion on the subject"

you: "Why are you talking about downloading and slapping code, hurr hurr"

 

[0xBADC0FFEE]

Nobody is talking about "slapping" code anywhere, we are talking about the implementation, and the physics implentation Unity uses is well understood. There are literally mountains of research about how to avoid doing this kind of thing in unity projects. that you have gone from "implementation" to "slapping code" makes it sound like you have a weird notion about how programming patterns are disseminated among developers.

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yes, I have few very weird notions for sure

Further, regarding a supposed aire of superiority and unwillingness to move: I was originally against teleportation and comfort settings when I got my DK1. I talked about the need for smooth locomotion, spread talk about "VR legs." This was when the DK1 first launched. My views didn't spring up in isolation, what I say about VR has come from A) seeing first hand through demonstration why these things are needed, B) discussing with other developers on the oculus development forums, and C) actually building these kinds of demos and seeing first hand why they break. So like, the opposite of what you're claiming I did. They come from actual research and discussion and experimentation, and actually are quite different from my original "truthiness" assessment I had before all that.

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so you came to different conclusions from them, good for you! their views didn't spring up in isolation either, they set to do something different and they did actual research and experimentation just like you

 

[Starviper]

Opinions like "teleportation has fallen off" which is demonstrably false? Opinions like "I didn't get sick, so they shouldn't provide accessibility options as a baseline?"

My stance is very clearly that games should cater to everyone. The "opinions" I'm going against are those saying that those who get sick somehow do not count.

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Not to knock a request for options, but based on this being a realistic sim experience, i'm not sure that "catering for everyone" really applies? They clearly state you should have prior VR experience before trying to play this game on the store page, and nowhere do they try to pretend they have teleportation or other locomotion options. If you're going for realism, teleportation or other mechanisms similar to that don't really make sense.

Not saying they can't do it, but i'm not going to rail against the dev for making a choice and sticking to it.

EDIT: Also, gotta say on the prior page the 4-5 posts of you linking Twitter comments stating the physics / motion make people sick; we get it, but honestly, you really do make it seem like your blowing this out of proportion.

 

[0xBADC0FFEE]

me: "they should have heeded the mountains of research and discussion on the subject"

you: "Why are you talking about downloading and slapping code, hurr hurr"

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you literally cited unity like vr in any other engine is different. also, again, they have TONS of videos on Node with development updates and progress, they met with valve, they are one of the most open devs in the whole vr scene, they published TWO vr games before Boneworks, Hover Junkers and Duck Season, how can you even say they didn't do their homework?

 

[0xBADC0FFEE]

Not to knock a request for options, but based on this being a realistic sim experience, i'm not sure that "catering for everyone" really applies? They clearly state you should have prior VR experience before trying to play this game on the store page, and nowhere do they try to pretend they have teleportation or other locomotion options. If you're going for realism, teleportation or other mechanisms similar to that don't really make sense.

Not saying they can't do it, but i'm not going to rail against the dev for making a choice and sticking to it.

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you have to have everything in your game and tie your experience to the lowest common denominator or you are a Bad Designer™.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

you literally cited unity like vr in any other engine is different. also, again, they have TONS of videos on Node with development updates and progress, they met with valve, they are one of the most open devs in the whole vr scene, they published TWO vr games before Boneworks, Hover Junkers and Duck Season, how can you even say they didn't do their homework?

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Because they are doing the exact opposite of what those people they met with recommend? I've met with valve as well, these are lessons they impart pretty clearly. If you do your homework, but then go against the research, that's even worse. And low and behold, here we are, and their decisions, intentional or not, are causing exactly what all the research has cautioned against.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

Not to knock a request for options, but based on this being a realistic sim experience, i'm not sure that "catering for everyone" really applies? They clearly state you should have prior VR experience before trying to play this game on the store page, and nowhere do they try to pretend they have teleportation or other locomotion options. If you're going for realism, teleportation or other mechanisms similar to that don't really make sense.

Not saying they can't do it, but i'm not going to rail against the dev for making a choice and sticking to it.

EDIT: Also, gotta say on the prior page the 4-5 posts of you linking Twitter comments stating the physics / motion make people sick; we get it, but honestly, you really do make it seem like your blowing this out of proportion.

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I am not railing against them for lack of teleportation. I am railing against their physics driven IK model. The stuff about teleportation is a tangent that another user set me off on. Read the OP.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

you have to have everything in your game and tie your experience to the lowest common denominator or you are a Bad Designer™.

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You forgot the irritating smiley faces at the end of your post :)

 

[0xBADC0FFEE]

Because they are doing the exact opposite of what those people they met with recommend? I've met with valve as well, these are lessons they impart pretty clearly. If you do your homework, but then go against the research, that's even worse. And low and behold, here we are, and their decisions, intentional or not, are causing exactly what all the research has cautioned against.

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so, just to follow you: you must do your research, but then you can't get off the beaten path so just do the stuff that people tried before (btw, they did, in their previous games), then low and behold, they have an incredibly successful game in their hands, and they probably convinced valve with their game to add smooth locomotion to hl alyx, I'd love to fail in the same way

 

[Starviper]

I am not railing against them for lack of teleportation. I am railing against their physics driven IK model. The stuff about teleportation is a tangent that another user set me off on. Read the OP.

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If what they've done is really that bad, surely the market and reviews for the game will show that it's a cardinal sin you can never commit.

 

[TrashHeap64]

For me the VR stuff has to be one to one or I get real fuckin sick. Even if the hands don't match my movements or the view wobbles. This is why I stopped playing PSVR in favor of the Quest. I had too many instances where the view or controllers would go haywire for a few seconds and that was enough to send me to bed for the rest of the night. It sucks, but I don't think Boneworks in its current state is for me. I don't think they can really do anything to patch in comfort options given the type of game it is. There's a lot of dropping and falling and that's not something you can just make comfortable for people like me :(

 

[Mad_Rhetoric]

Just played again today for over an hour and didnt feel sick, sitting down and using snap head turning really is the key. (played standing up with smooth head turning yesterday and felt sick in 15 min.)

 

[Natiko]

The interaction is reversed from how it should be. The player should be a physical object that interacts with the world, this game does it backwards. The world interacts with the physical player. The cardinal sin of VR design is taking camera control way from the player's head. You can decouple the head physics from the arm physics. It's not a big deal if your arms are being swayed by physical interaction. Your hand brushing up against a wall should not cause your head to move. Aside from making people sick, that is also not how physical interaction works in the real world. Decoupling something like that is actually pretty simple.

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Krej is not the one setting this nor does he have a narrow vision. HE just notices some stuff that goes against some of the bases that have been developed during more than half a decade of VR design to avoid causing motion sickness on people in VR (one of the most importants parts of VR).


As you said... they can fix those issues and they should. They should have thought about it when designing around the feature and put worst case scenario options to avoid that.


You can make it so that some interactions dont affect your POV which is what causes most of the motion sickness problems. The feeling is similar to when you turn around very fast and stop and feel the world shake.
Displaying full parts have an issue of you not feeling confortable (to soe people) because you are unable to put your body image in the game, but it is not that bad.

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Got it - that makes more sense. I personally haven't enjoyed any VR games with full movement anyways so I always knew this one probably wouldn't be for me. Just was curious.

 

[Letters]

I don't know how a game forcibly taking camera control away from the player in VR being a really big NO-NO is hard to understand unless you've never tried on a VR headset or not know how these displays follow your head movement 1:1 perfectly to make you think you're there.

Imagine some magic making your eyes move sideways away from their sockets in your head for a bit while still feeding what they're seeing back to your brain. It's screwed up.

I'm all for smooth locomotion in VR and even requiring people to put in some work to get their VR legs for that (if they ever can) in order to be able to play some games where the devs don't want teleportation because it doesn't match their vision (with clear warnings in the store page and during loading), but what these guys are doing with the crazy view displacement is plain irreponsible towards the players and the future of the tech as developers of a really popular game. Valve with all the good they're doing for the future of VR should not be advertising this game in their website page for the controllers either, show a gif of The Lab interactions instead or something.

 

[DanteMenethil]

Would it make sense to decouple the camera from the ik body? Like the body bouncing up and down from climbing but the eyes (camera) staying level

 

[Deleted member 12790]

so, just to follow you: you must do your research, but then you can't get off the beaten path so just do the stuff that people tried before (btw, they did, in their previous games), then low and behold, they have an incredibly successful game in their hands, and they probably convinced valve with their game to add smooth locomotion to hl alyx, I'd love to fail in the same way

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This is some weird "nothing is off limits" libertarian mental masturbation, probably because you're more interested in scoring gotcha points and dunks and smiley faces and trademark symbols than actually conversing. To tie making people sick as some imperative towards innovation is ridiculous. Yes, when you start talking about things related to making people actually, physically sick, there are boundries that shouldn't be crossed. Revisiting things shown to make people sick in the past -- wrestling the camera away from someone's head tracking -- should be off limits. Especially since this is not a free demo or proof of concept someone has put out on a developer portal for feedback, this is a paid product.

It's not at all a hard concept to grasp. Don't do things that are very well known to make an abnormally high number of people sick.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

Would it make sense to decouple the camera from the ik body? Like the body bouncing up and down from climbing but the eyes (camera) staying level

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that's what you should do. That's what is being argued for in this topic.

 

[DanteMenethil]

that's what you should do. That's what is being argued for in this topic.

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What I meant is keep body collision, the body bouncing etc but just not make the camera follow that. You seemed to argue to not have collisions / bouncing in the first place.

 

[Cyanity]

Well this thread sure did turn into a blood pressure multiplier real quick.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

What I meant is keep body collision, the body bouncing etc but just not make the camera follow that. You seemed to argue to not have collisions / bouncing in the first place.

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Then perhaps I haven't been articulating myself well enough. This is what I've meant by the "it's not an either-or situation" or "you can have your cake and eat it too" or "IK and physics are not mutually exclusive." The problem regarding people getting sick isn't IK, nor is it physics. It's IK physics tying into the head model. Again, aside from lessened proprioception, you don't really mind when physical interactions make your hands move. When it moves your head, that's when it becomes a problem. Their physics model is tying IK to head motion. That's a huge, well understood no-no. Don't wrestle control of the head away from the player. It's as simple as that.

 

[Skittles]

The people defending this are the same people who are ok with apple removing the headphone jack. Such bravery

 

[DanteMenethil]

Then perhaps I haven't been articulating myself well enough. This is what I've meant by the "it's not an either-or situation" or "you can have your cake and eat it too" or "IK and physics are not mutually exclusive." The problem regarding people getting sick isn't IK, nor is it physics. It's IK physics tying into the head model. Again, aside from lessened proprioception, you don't really mind when physical interactions make your hands move. When it moves your head, that's when it becomes a problem. Their physics model is tying IK to head motion. That's a huge, well understood no-no. Don't wrestle control of the head away from the player. It's as simple as that.

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I think I get it. When you say head you're inferring to the vr camera / our head, not the literal character model head. It's fine to have IK affect the model head as long as it doesn't affect your (the player's) head (like a ghost coming out of your body).

 

[Deleted member 12790]

I think I get it. When you say head you're inferring to the vr camera / our head, not the literal character model head. It's fine to have IK affect the model head as long as it doesn't affect your (the player's) head (like a ghost coming out of your body).

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Right, the way boneworks is doing things, when the model's head moves due to the IK, it moves the camera. That's a really bad implementation. Regarding moving the camera through smooth locomotion, that's, you know, whatever, a philosophical argument. But having your body in the game influence the camera is pretty much universally considered a bad thing. At best, someone doesn't care, but I've never seen anybody actually claim they prefer it. At worst, and frequently, doing that makes people sick.

 

[padlock]

that's what you should do. That's what is being argued for in this topic.

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When the player attempts something in their physical space that is not possible in the virtual environment, you need to convey that they're doing something they shouldn't be. The solution the boneworks devs arrived at is to dissociate the in game model with the player's physical actions. Yes, for some people that could lead to discomfort. But there is no perfect solution. Other approaches have their own drawbacks, regardless of what standard practices are.

The devs cleary decided to weight the trade offs differently than most. Perhaps they weren't trying to optimize for minimizing discomfort, but to minimize some of the other drawbacks instead.

The end result is a game that may make more people uncomfortable then normal, but which others find less restrictive and more cohesive.

They sinned? So what? Sometimes it's better to laugh with the sinners than cry with the saints.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

They sinned? So what?

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So they are making people sick. Making people sick isn't a laughing matter.

 

[ninjaboyjohn]

Yeah - this is really weird. Haven't played the game yet but hope to in the next couple of days.

The way you'd do full body IK in VR is that the head and the hands are fixed points, where the hmd and controllers are, and the rest of the body is "hanging" off of those. And if you want physicalized hands (think the ghost-hand separation of Lone Echo), then that's fine, but never ever touch the head / camera in this way.

If something in the world needs to move the player, it would do so on the player controller / capsule that is a child of the head object and could be constrained to not produce unwanted movement.

I'd definitely not want Unity physics to be touching my player's camera in VR :D

 

[Ada]

I don't mind IK jankiness in VR in fact I prefer to see the estimate of my arms position. However external forces affecting my viewpoint is a definite no no. Instant queasiness.

 

[copelandmaster]

not gonna lie I've been thinking about this game all day and can't wait to get back into it. It really sucks that it's so inherently inaccessible, and I have to wonder what this game would lose if the simulated physics never moved the player's camera. Like, keep the foot height stuff. Keep the Gorn-style delayed arms. Keep the jumping, even. But maybe externally-forced head movement could be reconciled by occasional blinking to a ghost head instead of continuous movement or something?

regardless get that FOV reduction in there at least

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Gorn doesn't do delayed arms, it does delayed/floppy weapons. Boneworks, Sword of Gargantua, and Blade and Sorcery do delayed arms. The later three are worse for it because you are always faster than the body, and the body in at least 2 of those games (haven't got my hands on B&S) feels like being a skinny teenager with brittle bone disease.

Honestly, if they kept the IK body itself for visual purposes only, that's fine.
Detach the players view from the head.
Remove the headbob when you jump.
Turn off IK under the hood when climbing. There are quite a few IK-less climbing games where you can throw yourself across the level at 30mph no problem.
That's a start.

I just saw that twitter video with the climbing onto rickety platforms. wth...

When you play enough VR, you might reach a point where you can mentally 'detach' yourself from quite a few crazy bullshit things you generally do. A state where something like the infamous Richie's Plank won't do anything for you anymore, you're totally fine standing on air or falling hundreds of feet. That still requires a lot of concentration for new experiences, they have unique quirks that you need to acclimate yourself with. If you lose that focus for whatever reason - like trying to struggle with your brittle, semi sensory deprived, uncooperative teenager body while vaulting over objects you can't really feel - you have a high chance of getting sick, even if its just a little.

This might be their first physics focused game, but its also their 3rd game. Maybe they should've had a closed alpha or something, idk.

 

[Komo]

I feel like a lot of the hate coming towards Boneworks is insanely unwarranted. The game straight up tells you in a huge warning that this isn't a casual VR game and only for experienced VR users.

 

[Deleted member 12790]

I feel like a lot of the hate coming towards Boneworks is insanely unwarranted. The game straight up tells you in a huge warning that this isn't a casual VR game and only for experienced VR users.

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This isn't a problem of experience, and those kinds of messages (and in-game jokes) are referring to locomotion. This is an entirely separate problem, a much more fundamental problem.

Playing this off like those getting sick are "casual" or "inexperienced" is detrimental to the medium.

 

[Freakylinks]

hopefully valve is watching close here and knowing they cant do this in halflife:alyx.

talking bout my issues in the steam discussions for the game was told i was lying and im not a real vr person if im getting sick.

how the hell is this game got so many positive reviews?

 

[Komo]

This isn't a problem of experience, and those kinds of messages (and in-game jokes) are referring to locomotion. This is an entirely separate problem, a much more fundamental problem.
Playing this off like those getting sick are "casual" or "inexperienced" is detrimental to the medium.

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I mean it's sorta true. In a game like this you can't just jump in an experience VR. It will make you sick without a doubt. You need experience because your brain has to adjust for all the movement without actually moving.

I would literally never let somoene play this or alyx without something else first. If they feel sick sorry but either watch me play it or get some comfort in VR first.

 

[Armaros]

I feel like a lot of the hate coming towards Boneworks is insanely unwarranted. The game straight up tells you in a huge warning that this isn't a casual VR game and only for experienced VR users.

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"experienced" is not an excuse for bad design.

I mean it's sorta true. In a game like this you can't just jump in an experience VR. It will make you sick without a doubt. You need experience because your brain has to adjust for all the movement without actually moving.

I would literally never let somoene play this or alyx without something else first. If they feel sick sorry but either watch me play it or get some comfort in VR first.

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Do you actually subscribe to the idea that the only people that get motion sickness are just people that havent experience disorienting motion? People making this excuse like "you just need to be experienced" pretend motion sickness is new and we just need people to deal with it. Or that something that literally makes people feel ill is the price of 'innovation'

 

[Deleted member 12790]

I mean it's sorta true. In a game like this you can't just jump in an experience VR. It will make you sick without a doubt. You need experience because your brain has to adjust for all the movement without actually moving.

I would literally never let somoene play this or alyx without something else first. If they feel sick sorry but either watch me play it or get some comfort in VR first.

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There are people who have played hundreds of hours of VR going back several years who are getting sick with this game.

 

[Santini]

Krejlooc, I appreciate your development insight regarding this topic. It's been pretty eye-opening.

Until reading through this thread, I had the mistaken belief that you had to build up your so-called "VR legs" to truly enjoy VR. AKA you had to "git gud".

My first experience with VR was around two years ago, on a friend's Vive with Obduction. I don't recall why he picked that title as the first ever VR game to show me, but after a few minutes, nausea and motion sickness kicked in. This was what VR was about? I pretty much almost swore VR off completely after removing the headset. While I liked the idea of VR and what it could bring to gaming, that intial experience was not good for me at all.

One year later, I convinced myself (and my SO) to pick up a PSVR because of the accolades Astro Bot had been receiving, as well the good things I'd been hearing about a little game called Beat Saber. That initial negative VR experience remained in the back of my mind, but I ultimately decided to give VR another chance. I'm glad I did. Turns out I really do like VR and think it's good.

I'd realized that it wasn't VR that was "bad", it was just that particular game and how it handled the player experience. Maybe the comfort settings were off (if they were there to begin with). I don't know if it's since been fixed in that title, and I don't care enough to find out, but that negative experience almost made me write off VR completely.

Someone's first experience with VR can determine if they come back for more or leave it for good. I can have non-gaming family and friends come over, play, and have fun in games like Astro Bot, Beat Saber, Superhot, Tetris Effect, and even Until Dawn: Rush of Blood without having them going through hours and days of "gitting gud" just to enjoy it.

If I'd initially put them through experiences like Resident Evil with all comfort settings off, Ace Combat VR as their first ever game, Sairento VR with all of the "git gud" options turned on, that one section in PlayStation Worlds, etc., I'm pretty sure they'd get sick, never want to consider playing VR again, and would be certain to share how bad their first VR experience was with everyone they knew.

I haven't tried Boneworks yet, but after reading about the VR development sins it commits, I'm glad Steam has a 2 hour refund policy in place. After having played some of Sairento VR, I can't say I'm a fan of VR game cameras that take away control from you, though its backflipping camera is off by default and has to be enabled. Options are nice. Making sure the player doesn't get sick is better.

 

[Caesar III]

There are people who have played hundreds of hours of VR going back several years who are getting sick with this game.

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Like me. I will continue to play this, cause it's cool to some extend but only in small bursts of 30min. After this I need to stop and play something not so disturbing like elite or beat saber or gorn. Otherwise I'd puke.

I pre-ordered Alyx already though

 

[copelandmaster]

I feel like a lot of the hate coming towards Boneworks is insanely unwarranted. The game straight up tells you in a huge warning that this isn't a casual VR game and only for experienced VR users.

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The problem is that this game might be the highest profile VR game of 2019, depending on who you ask. Corridor/Node's reach is very large on youtube. It's been promoted like crazy on $280/$1000 VR equipment. For over a year, this game has been praised as the second coming of Half Life, thanks in part to the marketing and aesthetic for the game. Even after release its still being hyped that way, see VNN leaks and all the VR subreddit hype.

Tons of eyes are on this game right now. It's not really nailing it in the execution department, for a lot valid reasons. There are a significant amount of minor problems with this game (and a few major) that add up. People are nervous because they feel that there are high stakes at hand regarding VR's public perception, and I wouldn't blame them.

 

[Deleted member 48828]

I tweeted this thread to one of the devs yesterday and this was their response. Take from it what you will, I haven't played boneworks so I don't feel particularily qualified to talk about it other than it should definetly have basic VR accessibility options.

 

[Deleted member 22002]

Tons of eyes are on this game right now. It's not really nailing it in the execution department, for a lot valid reasons. There are a significant amount of minor problems with this game (and a few major) that add up. People are nervous because they feel that there are high stakes at hand regarding VR's public perception, and I wouldn't blame them.

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I can understand the preoccupation, but DAMN if this isn't the most explicit attempt at a dev shaming thread I've read on this website.

 

[Randomly Generated]

I can understand the preoccupation, but DAMN if this isn't the most explicit attempt at a dev shaming thread I've read on this website.

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...dev shaming?