Has Epic’s recent (Fortnite) stunts soured you on EGS?

[Ploid 6.0]

EGS has some of the best deals too, I'm thinking about waiting until they do another one of their ticket sales before I stack sales to get Watch Dogs Legion for something crazy, like $20 this year (EGS ticket + Uplay discount via uplay achievement points currency, and a Uplay sale).

 

[PSOreo]

I had no strong feelings one way or the other but the way they've handled this whole situation is disgusting. This is mainly due to their nonsense "for the consumer" stance and the way in which they manipulate and attempt to weaponise their predominantly young audience sickens me.

 

[Sean Mirrsen]

Their CEO soured me on EGS before EGS even launched proper, so these stunts are kind of chainsaw-flogging a long-dead horse at this point.

 

[Bufbaf]

I would be interested in reading your realistic appraisal of EGS and the moves Epic has made regarding it.

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I'm sure you are ;) I mentioned multiple times that I genuinely have no issues with EGS's approach. Exclusives are annoying, but the only possible way - at least to me - to build up any sort of actual, meaningful competition against Steam. I also honestly enjoy the minimalistic approach of the store itself, since I, personally, can't give less of any interest towards stores trying to build a community around their customers to keep them within their own shop.

I also have a bunch of problems on a social level when it comes to Steam, their handling of problematic games (or better, their not-handling of anything), be it the support of horrible gamedevs or games like Agony or Hatred and countless others. Their "hands-off" approach to curating to me is a silent acceptance of tons of shitheads within the industry, and all their messaging regarding this seems to underline that.

I could also widen this to GoG, which obviously is tightly connected to CDProjekt Red, which also have a bunch of issues to deal with.

The hate against Epic as a company, or Sweeney as a person, is completely understandable, even if I don't necessarily share it on this level. Sweeney's dumb, imo, but his idiotic adventures come from a good place and he is (again, imo) legitimately trying to help devs and players. Again, it's fine if you don't agree, I get that. What I don't get is this incredibly massive hate boner and the "gotcha" attitute towards people who aren't in line with it, idk.

Well, you asked.

 

[Zenkuso]

Nothing will dissuade me from free games.

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This.

Ill take the bad with the good.

 

[Alexandros]

I'm sure you are ;) I mentioned multiple times that I genuinely have no issues with EGS's approach. Exclusives are annoying, but the only possible way - at least to me - to build up any sort of actual, meaningful competition against Steam. I also honestly enjoy the minimalistic approach of the store itself, since I, personally, can't give less of any interest towards stores trying to build a community around their customers to keep them within their own shop.

I also have a bunch of problems on a social level when it comes to Steam, their handling of problematic games (or better, their not-handling of anything), be it the support of horrible gamedevs or games like Agony or Hatred and countless others. Their "hands-off" approach to curating to me is a silent acceptance of tons of shitheads within the industry, and all their messaging regarding this seems to underline that.

I could also widen this to GoG, which obviously is tightly connected to CDProjekt Red, which also have a bunch of issues to deal with.

The hate against Epic as a company, or Sweeney as a person, is completely understandable, even if I don't necessarily share it on this level. Sweeney's dumb, imo, but his idiotic adventures come from a good place and he is (again, imo) legitimately trying to help devs and players. Again, it's fine if you don't agree, I get that. What I don't get is this incredibly massive hate boner and the "gotcha" attitute towards people who aren't in line with it, idk.

Well, you asked.

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Thank you very much for taking the time to reply in detail.

 

[DXB-KNIGHT]

No as Nintendo being stubborn not making Paper Mario RPG won't lead me to break my Switch.

 

[not_smiff]

No, it's not at that point yet.

 

[spman2099]

I don't have a particularly high opinion of Epic, but I have a much, much lower opinion of Apple. Anything they do to give that company grief is a benevolent action in my eyes. That being said, I don't really do any PC gaming, so the point is moot.

 

[DHR54]

Epic says they are trying to improve things for creators and players but honestly they seem to be attacking anything they can to get a bigger piece of the pie. The only reason they have all these bones to pick, is they want more money. If they were top doge they would absolutely stop stirring the pot and instead fight tooth and nail to keep their hold on that position. It's dishonest to try and gain market share on righteous claims when they really have only their own personal interests in mind. and using their player base as leverage and building that hero narrative within their clientele is super shitty.

I see no reason to support epic at this time, just don't seem genuine in their interests.

 

[Mazzo]

what? no, I won't stop enjoying free games to defend apple... fuck apple

 

[Kaim Argonar]

I don't want anything to do with the EGS besides claiming the free games the way they operate now.

 

[Deleted member 41178]

I don't really pay too much attention to what goes on, I just go where the games are that I want to play. If it's am EGS exclusive or timed exclusive I'll generally buy it there.

 

[Aztechnology]

No, despite Sweeney being a complete hypocrite. This is something that's a good thing. The monopolies being established need to be fought. Even if it's by a hypocrite.

Competition is in fact a good thing.

 

[dunkzilla]

They're dicks, sure. But no it doesn't. I don't know why it would either. It's just a store front.

 

[White Glint]

Uncertain what harm I could be doing by just grabbing the free games. Epic's never getting my card details, that much has been certain from the start.

 

[Sblargh]

I don't even remember The egs have anything to do with fortnite most of the time. It is just the app that gives me free games.

 

[Deleted member 5596]

Greedy billionaire company acting like greedy hypocrites is nothing new or rather, is the common thing in the society we live.

 

[EVIL]

This thread def shows a lot of people are willing to not care as long as they get "free" shit. I wonder how far will that tactic stretch. Would you guys also not care about apples nonsense if they would give you free games? or amazons, facebook etc etc.

 

[MattEnth]

It's made me more likely to buy from EGS.

I am 100% on Epic's side in the Epic v Apple case.

The 30% cut for the App Store is a clear abuse of market power that benefits no one but Apple. It's especially egregious in cases like music and movies, where Apple forces their tax on other players yet not themselves.

Microsoft doesn't get to decide what software you're allowed to run on YOUR Windows computing device.

Why does Apple get to decide what software is allowed on your iPhone computing device?

 

[Sean Mirrsen]

This thread def shows a lot of people are willing to not care as long as they get "free" shit. I wonder how far will that tactic stretch. Would you guys also not care about apples nonsense if they would give you free games? or amazons, facebook etc etc.

Click to shrink...

I'm pretty sure the logical endpoint of that thought process, is communism. The people in power are giving you everything you (ostensibly) need or want for free, but in return you have to conform to rules and tolerate anything said people in power may do to keep things running.

Why does Apple get to decide what software is allowed on your computing device?

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Why did your argument start with the (industry standard) 30% cut, and end on the entirely unrelated walled-garden regulation system that Epic is also practicing?

 

[Deleted member 10726]

Not really, was soured before. That was rather back when they were yelling about the Steam monopoly before trying to monopolize the PC market by making everything exclusive to their store.

I don't believe a lick about anything they say in regards to the little dev, especially the stuff about the lower cut since you only need to look at companies like Activision to realize increased profits will not trickle down to the developers.

 

[MattEnth]

Why did your argument start with the (industry standard) 30% cut, and end on the entirely unrelated walled-garden regulation system that Epic is also practicing?

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Because they're intertwined.

Apple demands developers accept a 30% tax in exchange for being allowed to be used by consumers on their computing devices.

If Apple allowed consumers to install alternative app stores, the 30% is much less of an issue.

And if Apple charged a percentage that was a much more reasonable margin, then the walled garden is much less of an issue.

It's the combination - both the walled garden AND the 30% - that's an abuse of market power.

 

[ShinUltramanJ]

It's made me more likely to buy from EGS.

I am 100% on Epic's side in the Epic v Apple case.

The 30% cut for the App Store is a clear abuse of market power that benefits no one but Apple. It's especially egregious in cases like music and movies, where Apple forces their tax on other players yet not themselves.

Microsoft doesn't get to decide what software you're allowed to run on YOUR Windows computing device.

Why does Apple get to decide what software is allowed on your iPhone computing device?

Click to shrink...

I keep seeing the Microsoft example brought up, when Microsoft does the exact same thing as Apple with their Xbox.

If you're going to open up iPhone then you need to open up the other walled gardens as well. Especially if you're against a 30% cut, which Microsoft takes, as do others.

 

[EVIL]

Because they're intertwined.

Apple demands developers accept a 30% tax in exchange for being allowed to be used by consumers on their computing devices.

If Apple allowed consumers to install alternative app stores, the 30% is much less of an issue.

And if Apple charged a percentage that was a much more reasonable margin, then the walled garden is much less of an issue.

It's the combination - both the walled garden AND the 30% - that's an abuse of market power.

Click to shrink...

Microsoft is as closed as a walled garden as is apple when we are talking about Xbox, so is Sony, with play-station or Nintendo on their hardware platforms.

 

[c0Zm1c]

Microsoft doesn't get to decide what software you're allowed to run on YOUR Windows computing device.

Why does Apple get to decide what software is allowed on your iPhone computing device?

Click to shrink...

I would assume it's because everything about the iPhone originates with Apple? That can't be said about Microsoft. Our Windows PCs typically comprise parts and critical software originating from numerous different sources that simply work together because it all adheres to a common standard. It's a closed versus an open system.

 

[Deleted member 6215]

Nothing will dissuade me from free games.

Click to shrink...

I have enough games to play that I don't need to support a garbage company like Epic. The price is irrelevant.

 

[RCSI]

I was soured with EGS's exclusivity when the PC market was moving toward more options, PC=pirate mentality years ago, and of course their blatant behavior with how they approached the Fornite/Apple set up.

The only two pluses was a refund of $30 back when UE4 was paid and free games, but when a company acts like a dick, those only go so far.

 

[Feign]

I'm sure you are ;) I mentioned multiple times that I genuinely have no issues with EGS's approach. Exclusives are annoying, but the only possible way - at least to me - to build up any sort of actual, meaningful competition against Steam. I also honestly enjoy the minimalistic approach of the store itself, since I, personally, can't give less of any interest towards stores trying to build a community around their customers to keep them within their own shop.

I also have a bunch of problems on a social level when it comes to Steam, their handling of problematic games (or better, their not-handling of anything), be it the support of horrible gamedevs or games like Agony or Hatred and countless others. Their "hands-off" approach to curating to me is a silent acceptance of tons of shitheads within the industry, and all their messaging regarding this seems to underline that.

I could also widen this to GoG, which obviously is tightly connected to CDProjekt Red, which also have a bunch of issues to deal with.

The hate against Epic as a company, or Sweeney as a person, is completely understandable, even if I don't necessarily share it on this level. Sweeney's dumb, imo, but his idiotic adventures come from a good place and he is (again, imo) legitimately trying to help devs and players. Again, it's fine if you don't agree, I get that. What I don't get is this incredibly massive hate boner and the "gotcha" attitute towards people who aren't in line with it, idk.

Well, you asked.

Click to shrink...

I know you're replying to someone else, but these are my mostly my feelings as well so thanks for writing this out. I'm less certain about Sweeney, but I also believe people doing the right thing for the wrong reasons is a valid means toward progress.

 

[Sean Mirrsen]

Because they're intertwined.

Apple demands developers accept a 30% tax in exchange for being allowed to be used by consumers on their computing devices.

If Apple allowed consumers to install alternative app stores, the 30% is much less of an issue.

And if Apple charged a percentage that was a much more reasonable margin, then the walled garden is much less of an issue.

It's the combination - both the walled garden AND the 30% - that's an abuse of market power.

Click to shrink...

No, Apple forces developers to accept a 30% "tax" because everyone does that. Everyone who wants to make money off of running a digital store, has that specific split. Itch doesn't care for money, Discord had a store they ran as a secondary attraction, and EGS is an internal currency combustion engine that burns Fortnite money and seems to exist solely as a publicity stunt.

The question of why Apple forces everyone to only use apps from the app store has already been discussed. Their platform, their rules, they don't have a monopoly on smartphones - ergo, everyone has at least one other option.

Making a platform and running the sole official store on it that takes industry-standard rates for service, is not an abuse of market power. It hasn't been since inception, and there's no reason to label it as such now. In fact, lowering rates for everyone would constitute an abuse of market power - as that is covered under Predatory Pricing aka undercutting, since Apple apparently have enough market share for some people to call it a monopoly. (Unless they somehow convince Google to simultaneously do the same. I think snowballs in hell would have a higher chance of spontaneously manifesting, than that particular possibility.)

 

[sirap]

At the end of the day EGS just isn't a good launcher and it doesn't give me the features I need to game on PC.

That, combined with Tencent and Sweeney's buffoonery means I'll never support them. The well is poisoned.

 

[Quiksaver]

Yes but I was already sick of Fortnite before

That they decided to add a Marvel crossover to their ongoing Apple feud soured me even more

 

[Bastos]

That doesn't affect my opinion about EGS in any way.

One thing has no impact on the other.

I don't like all this timed exclusivity thing, but that has not kept me from playing the things I enjoy either, why would this drama about a game I don't even play affect how I use a storefront?

 

[Lurcharound]

Epic soured me off the bat with the storefront exclusives. I'm fine with competiting store fronts and if they want to offer value via free games or better discounts or any other sensible means then i consider that positive competition from a consumer perspective. By mixing in mechanisms I see as net negative from a consumer perspective I'm going to purchase from the storefront until they cease those.

 

[Dyno]

I was never fond of EGS going the route of store exclusives but rallying the children to fight their battles has assured i won't touch anything by them again. Unfortunately since Rocket League is also under their umbrella now that also means dropping my most played game until now but whatever, I got my years out of it.

Using the kids, during a pandemic, while removing some of these kids access to something that will help keep them distracted all to help bolster their case in trying to extract more money is some of the lowest shit I've seen from a company this year.

 

[Deleted member 5596]

Microsoft is as closed as a walled garden as is apple when we are talking about Xbox, so is Sony, with play-station or Nintendo on their hardware platforms.

Click to shrink...

And that's bound to be questioned once you can no longer buy physical copies from other stores and only Sony/MS/Nintendo will be able to sell console games.

 

[Mukrab]

i coulcnt care less about some beef between multi billion dollar companies so no

 

[Chimpzy]

Nah, I wasn't on board with EGS to begin with. It's by a wide margin the worst pc games platform I've had the pleasure of using and I also have issues with the way they do business. From my pov, their only value lies in their giveaways.

 

[plagiarize]

Not sure why some stupid fight over the iOS app store would change people's opinions (positive or negative) on EGS on PC.

 

[Z-Brownie]

i don't understand why Epic Store got so much hate, they give free games, they are pro consumer and pro devs on their cut, maybe the only downside is the exclusivity deals, but honestly i don't care. What they did with fortnite on apple is another thing. But maybe i am missing something.

 

[NPTinker]

Never care about them in the first place

 

[Absolute]

Not sure why some stupid fight over the iOS app store would change people's opinions (positive or negative) on EGS on PC.

Click to shrink...

People might find the company weaponising kids in their fight for profit pretty abhorrent and them putting small devs at risk through their selfish actions pretty shit. Is it really a mystery?

 

[Lobster Roll]

i don't understand why Epic Store got so much hate, they give free games, they are pro consumer and pro devs on their cut, maybe the only downside is the exclusivity deals, but honestly i don't care. What they did with fortnite on apple is another thing. But maybe i am missing something.

Click to shrink...

It sounds like you're missing a ton of context intentionally. Read this thread or the various other threads or the various headlines from the last few years. I get the positives of Epic, but let's not play this game where you pretend to not see the cons with the pros.

 

[ShapeGSX]

Nope. I'm cool with them challenging a company with arbitrary rules that wields their monopoly power unfairly.

I'm also cool with them bringing a challenger to the market leader, Steam. Competition is good.

 

[Sean Mirrsen]

I'm also cool with them bringing a challenger to the market leader, Steam. Competition is good.

Click to shrink...

Steam never needed more competition in the first place, let alone "competition" in the form of a store so miserably inadequate it has to burn money on exclusives and give away free games weekly just to keep people returning to it.

 

[ShapeGSX]

Steam never needed more competition in the first place, let alone "competition" in the form of a store so miserably inadequate it has to burn money on exclusives and give away free games weekly just to keep people returning to it.

Click to shrink...

You're entitled to your opinion. In my opinion, Epic's competition has already forced Steam to change for the better.

 

[BlazeHedgehog]

EGS has always felt like a necessary evil I have to engage with to play certain games, but I hold absolutely no allegiance. From day one, all of their shenanigans have felt performative rather than legitimately beneficial to the consumer. All of their cries of lowering rates, of securing exclusivities, of giving away free stuff, it's always obviously been a power play. Other storefronts (Itch.io) have always had lower revenue sharing rates but the way guys like Tim Sweeny were loud and boastful about it has always made me suspicious, because it was clearly the execution of a strategy.

The Epic Gravy Train is not sustainable. It ends when either:

1. Epic gets the control they want (depending on how things work out, this may never happen because of shifting goal posts)

2. Epic runs out of money and slowly gives up (see: what Electronic Arts is doing with Origin)

3. Epic burns down the entire game industry by massively devaluing games (extremely unlikely, but you never know)

 

[Deleted member 26156]

Not really as much as just Epic themselves. Still will happily indulge in all the free games while having yet to buy anything there though.

 

[kmfdmpig]

Not really. Epic made mistakes for sure, but I never saw them as a noble entity just like Apple, Steam, Don't, Microsoft, etc... their focus is on making money, not anything else.

 

[Lobster Roll]

I'm also cool with them bringing a challenger to the market leader, Steam. Competition is good.

Click to shrink...

I agree. Competition is good. I would love to see a competitive PC storefront hit the market and to absolutely destroy Steam with features, pricing, accessibility, user friendliness, functionality, etc.

What I'm not interested in is seeing a completely featureless, barebones, barely secure, lemonade stand of a storefront paying developers to only sell through that particular store.

I'll repeat your words - competition is good. Once EGS starts bringing a competitive advantage to the market place instead of restricting consumer choice, I'll start to embrace the store. What they're doing on PC is anti-competitive.