I hear that the story in this game is pretty good, and that it's Spiders's best game to date. How's the combat, though?
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GreedFall has made a fool out of Bioware
- Thread starter Pygrus
- Start date
Greedfall has some of the worst quest design I have ever encountered in an RPG.
They definitely need to work on that
They definitely need to work on that
GreedFall is a much better game than prior Spiders titles (note: I played them all except Technomancer) . It's also their best crack to date at emulating that Witcher 2 formula. They've got the exploration aspect down much better this time, and I'm always interested in exploring a new zone to its utmost limits- and since each usually contains a few "skill altars" it always feels worthwhile.
The enemy variety isn't amazing- it's mostly similar wildlife species, though there are also the "guardian creatures"- I located 2 but haven't tried fighting them yet.
The quests are largely " go to a place and speak to a person" affairs, but the writing generally keeps things flowing, imho.
I can't say much about the main story, because I'm about 20 hours in and I've done like 1 main quest. The rest of my time is spent doing side quests, which are mostly about diplomacy between different factions, and they keep things interested. The companions and companion quests are the biggest Bioware influences, and they are... all right, but nothing amazing.
There are plenty of places where the low-budget nature is showing; but despite that, 20 hours in I'm keen to keep exploring, and I don't really think I need a main story to push me along for that.
Oh, and it makes for some really pretty screenshots.
The enemy variety isn't amazing- it's mostly similar wildlife species, though there are also the "guardian creatures"- I located 2 but haven't tried fighting them yet.
The quests are largely " go to a place and speak to a person" affairs, but the writing generally keeps things flowing, imho.
I can't say much about the main story, because I'm about 20 hours in and I've done like 1 main quest. The rest of my time is spent doing side quests, which are mostly about diplomacy between different factions, and they keep things interested. The companions and companion quests are the biggest Bioware influences, and they are... all right, but nothing amazing.
There are plenty of places where the low-budget nature is showing; but despite that, 20 hours in I'm keen to keep exploring, and I don't really think I need a main story to push me along for that.
Oh, and it makes for some really pretty screenshots.
After 10 or so hours of Greedfall, I think it's considered better than Bioware's games just because expectations are lower. The game is nowhere near being great, good-average at best. Greedfall feels like it's constantly trying to pretend that it's better than it actually is, and once you scratch that surface, there's not much underneath.
I completely agree that Greedfall is better than DA:I, while being of similar type. Actually I never understood the praise some people gave DA:I at release, it feels to be 90% MMO-like soulless bloat. Compared to that, much, much larger portion of Greedfall's content feels interesting (not quite on Witcher 3 level, but still).
I played about 10 hours of GreedFall and honestly I'm pretty disappointed in the game. The story hasn't been that interesting to me, the characters haven't drawn me in, the skill/class progression is very lacking, there are a ton of reused assets so the world design gets old fast. People want to compare it to Bioware games, and while I haven't played Anthem or Andromeda I wouldn't even say it compares very favorably to Dragon Age 2, which I found to be a decent game.
If Bioware released Greedfall they'd be laughed out of the room. The BioWare game it's closest to is Dragon Age 2 but it's not even at that level.
It's a 4/10 that maybe feels like a 6/10 if you go in with really low expectations and don't play too much of it. The more you play, the worse it gets.
It's a 4/10 that maybe feels like a 6/10 if you go in with really low expectations and don't play too much of it. The more you play, the worse it gets.
OP
OP
I think the comparisons to The Witcher 2 are pretty apt also. I can already notice the copy pasta nature of some aspects, but the presentation of it all is really well done. Even the wilderness sections of the island are just really engrossing to walk in as you make your way to a quest objective.
I would agree that the actual character progression is kinda bland. However the crafting system is actually well done and the way you can add certain motifs to weapons and armor is nice.
I would agree that the actual character progression is kinda bland. However the crafting system is actually well done and the way you can add certain motifs to weapons and armor is nice.
Risen's melee combat is better than Greedfall, I just did a full play through of Risen shortly after 10 hours of GreedFall and it's actually shocking how much better of a game Risen is but speaking about the combat, Risen, as a spiritual successor to Gothic, has really good skill progression and that's an area where GreedFall is really lacking. There's nothing that really compares in the ARPG space to Gothic 1, 2 and Risen 1's character/skill progression. I agree that Elex's combat is a tough pill to swallow though.
The biggest flaw with Greedfall is enemy variety, otherwise it's pretty good, and it's surprisingly polished.
Bioware could probably put out a game on the caliber of Greedfall if they were not under EA. They have sales target to match which require them to chase trends.
But yeah, Greedfall looks like the closest thing to DA4 I'll ever get and I'm great full for it.
But yeah, Greedfall looks like the closest thing to DA4 I'll ever get and I'm great full for it.
Saying that Greedfall is comparable to Witcher 2 should be considered heresy :P
It's nowhere near as good, in any aspect.
It's an impressive game if you consider the budget it was likely made with but in itself there is nothing that's better than "good"
Combat is serviceable but it never evolves. I played as a mage and combat after 5 hours felt exactly the same like combat after 40 hours.
Quest design ranges from average to flat out awful.
The story starts of really slow and kinda boring but get's more interesting later on - tho I have never finished it because I just didn't find it jun to play.
Sidequests are usually pretty good storywise.
It's a decent game and if they can build on it their next game could be really good.
It's nowhere near as good, in any aspect.
It's an impressive game if you consider the budget it was likely made with but in itself there is nothing that's better than "good"
Combat is serviceable but it never evolves. I played as a mage and combat after 5 hours felt exactly the same like combat after 40 hours.
Quest design ranges from average to flat out awful.
The story starts of really slow and kinda boring but get's more interesting later on - tho I have never finished it because I just didn't find it jun to play.
Sidequests are usually pretty good storywise.
It's a decent game and if they can build on it their next game could be really good.
I've enjoyed a lot what Spiders have done in the past, warts and all, ever since Mars War Logs, and they keep getting closer to putting out something that's top flight with a bit more polish and financial muscle. Haven't started on Greedfall yet, but I'm looking forward to jumping in soon.
I think people have already nailed it here. It's not even a 60 dollar game. You can't compare the two really
No need to *roll eyes*....it's very obnoxious
The story is definetly not "garbage" or "weak as fuck"...it's actually one of the strongest aspects of Greedfall.
Guys, just ignore this poster and check some legitimite critics, like Karak over at ACG, or the Era OT if you wanna find more about it.
PS: The cons for me have been enemy variery and some repetition after 20 hours, but it's definitely worth it for the story alone, and has some great ideas that I wish Spiders could expand on a sequel
"Ignore this poster because he doesn't agree with me, so instead listen to these people because they do agree!"
I don't see how greedfall is better than any BioWare RPG (yes, including inquisition and Andromeda).
I am 25hrs into GF and struggle to play on. The story is ok but everything else from combat, enemy design and variety, lore, characters, quest/ world design is well below any of the BioWare games. I understand GF is not a triple A title and considered "junk", but even then it's a mediocre RPG at best for me. And if I hear one more time "I am bla bla and the bla bla of bla bla" every time I meet a new character, it will be very difficult to play on. Even though BioWare's last RPGs were bad compared to their prime time titles, I still enjoyed them more than GF.
GF is a good game and a step up from spiders previous games, but to compare them with BioWare is a bit of a low blow. Again, before I anger any Defense Forces and BioWare haters here, this is solely MY opinion.
I am 25hrs into GF and struggle to play on. The story is ok but everything else from combat, enemy design and variety, lore, characters, quest/ world design is well below any of the BioWare games. I understand GF is not a triple A title and considered "junk", but even then it's a mediocre RPG at best for me. And if I hear one more time "I am bla bla and the bla bla of bla bla" every time I meet a new character, it will be very difficult to play on. Even though BioWare's last RPGs were bad compared to their prime time titles, I still enjoyed them more than GF.
GF is a good game and a step up from spiders previous games, but to compare them with BioWare is a bit of a low blow. Again, before I anger any Defense Forces and BioWare haters here, this is solely MY opinion.
My main problem with Greedfall is its story. It feels like it took an interesting world and great characters and just didn't really use them to anywhere near their full potential. Loads of pacing issues, lacking suspense in places where it would've been easy to create some,... But all in all, it is really fun game and considering the kind of budget it was created on compared to the kind of budgets BioWare gets, yeah, it's an incredibly impressive achievement and BioWare should be taking notes.
I'm on board with this. Caveat: Still not done with the game, but I like a lot of what I've seen so far.
Keeping expectations in check is probably the difference between those loving the game and shitting on it. Nobody in their right mind should be picking this up expecting huge enemy variety, tons of expansive yet diverse environments, or a voice acting cast in the dozens. It's a low budget title that knocks it out of the park with what it has to work with, and that's great. Serious talent went into this.
After all the griping about "not enough mid tier games" here we have an excellent mid tier game and immediately people are griping that it's not AAA!
The only thing anyone should be *rolling eyes* at are claims that "you see everything there is to see" in 5 hours or less- this is literally impossible, since all the character development is tied up in sidequests that cannot be accessed that fast, let alone completed. A MAJOR plot twist occurs halfway through the game that turns everything on its head, depending on how you played it.
Greedfall is a pretty great example of the Genre. It's not the best that exists, but wasn't really aiming to be. There's potential in a higher budget for greater variety here and there and some more polish, but it's definitely worth the time of anyone who enjoyed mass effect/dragon age/kotor/etc for the plot development and character interaction. If you were to ask from *that* aspect what was the better game, Greedfall or Mass Effect 3, Dragon Age 2, or similar bioware AAA efforts that missed the mark, it's Greedfall easily and that's a hell of a feat.
I really loved my time with GreedFall and it's up there with A Plague Tale as my biggest surprise for 2019 (although I loved Plague Tale a lot more). It did some neat things and I really liked the world and characters and the side quests are very meaty.
Just hope if there's a sequel Spiders gets a bigger budget and don't have to resort to reusing the same assets over and over. I'm still there either way, it was a very good game.
Just hope if there's a sequel Spiders gets a bigger budget and don't have to resort to reusing the same assets over and over. I'm still there either way, it was a very good game.
The OT is actually pretty negative once people got to the second half of the game and the repetition really set in.
For me, I was very excited to play Greedfall but it fell super flat. I played maybe 10 hours and have zero desire to ever go back to it.
I'm glad you liked it, but I'm not even sure in good conscious that I'll be willing to play a colonialist fantasy RPG
But I guess people are so hungry for a Bioware-like game and the hate train against Bioware are still going that they're willing to set aside some principles to play this game
"conscience."
Breaking the mold of yet-another-tolkien-clone or space opera ripping off star wars yet again isn't a bad thing. Does the colonial thing raise uncomfortable questions? yes it does, but these are questions that every western civilization should be asking themselves all the time. Getting a game that acknowledges that "oh yeah. these fantasy civilizations absolutely sprang up using some reprehensible and brutal treatment of natives in the process" and seeing the conflict around it is actually pretty interesting.
I mean, you could probably play through Greedfall as if you're Christopher Columbus, but the game's narrative (at least what I've made it through so far) makes it pretty clear that those people are assholes and not to be emulated.
I don't want to say it's bad or compare it to other games, but imo the world feels completely lifeless and that is something that hurts my enjoyment of the game.
Well, you're not wrong. Still enjoyed my time with it, even though you could definitely feel that its dated at its core.
While I agree with the general sentiment, I imagine you'd see a lot less eye-rolls if OP didn't launch the thread using hyperbolic, click-bait sentiments.
Isn't it enough to simply say GreedFall is an awesome effort from a AA studio? Without resorting to sensationalist claims?
Guess that wouldn't pull in as much traffic.
This is where I'm at too.
Probably my game of the year. It really scratches that single player / Bethesda / bioware itch I have. While it took 1-2 hours to fully grasp the flow of the game, my experience has been consistently good and with no technical issues as well. It's quite apparent that the teams budget limited the amount of mission types, which is why there's a lack of deeper dialogue trees like in Mass Effect for example. The story does a good enough job to mask those imperfections.
If anything I'm shocked how good Greedfall is for an AA title; especially when it comes to its graphics and presentation.
I disagree however that this game "humiliates BioWare" or anything along this line. So far they failed with Anthem and another Studio under the BioWare brand didn't meet expectations with ME: Andromeda. Be more reasonable than this.
Horrible.. the worst I have ever played (my first Spiders game). I dropped the game because frankly, it was shit.
Why are you quoting me on that? I didn't make the OP, and I didn't reference it, either.
I can tell you Greedfall or it's writing is not garbage, through
To be fair, EVERYONE has been comparing the game to Bioware's output... including the developers themselves. Official trailers for the game literally quote journalists going "Bioware fans, take note", and welcoming comparisons to Dragon Age. It is heavily influenced by Bioware's classics and leveraged that appropriately.
... And SUCCESSFULLY. It feels more like a "vintage Bioware game" than anything Bioware themselves have put out in well over a decade.
"Ignore this poster because he/she is using obnoxious language, look for all kinds of different opinions, good and bad, on the OT"
Anything else you want to misrepresent?
I'll agree "humiliates Bioware" is probably hyperbolic here. Bioware isn't a bad studio by any means and even ME: Andromeda is still playable.
That being said- when looking at the type of RPG that Greedfall is, and that should be Bioware's bread and butter there are some serious questions raised by Greedfall being as competent as it is *as a roleplaying game* while Bioware hasn't managed to nail this aspect in some time. Since Mass Effect 2 in 2010, we got:
Dragon Age II (2011)
Mass Effect 3 (2012)
Dragon Age Inquisition (2014)
Mass Effect Andromeda (2017)
Anthem and The Old Republic aside (because they are different experiences) It's not just andromeda that didn't meet expectations. The best of that batch is Inquisition, and there were more than a few issues with the quest design. The OT for that game back in the day was full of people who got frustrated because it wasn't clear when/how you should leave the Hinterlands and just got stuck there for hours doing repetitive time waster quests that quickly ramped past your ability to tackle them.
Give Greedfall the budget of any of the above (well...except DA2 maybe, that one was notorious for being rushed into production) and it would likely be a better game than any of Bioware's last 4 attempts.
Don't know about that one.
Mass Effect 3 is a fantastic game for most of its playtime. The gameplay is legitimately great. Rannoch and Tuchanka are two of the best questlines that Bioware has ever delivered and they make up a pretty substantial portion of the game. The ending is one of the biggest buzzkills that I've ever experienced in gaming. And an unsatisfying conclusion to the story is a pretty big deal in an RPG. So I won't argue that Greedfall couldn't be a preferable experience overall. But a huge portion of Mass Effect 3 is fantastic and these kind of statements feel like they need an addendum or something.
On topic, Anthem was a mistake. It failed to deliver on practically every level. The article put out by Kotaku makes it pretty clear that there was no passion for the project coming from the ever changing leadership. And if the people directing the project have no idea what kind of game they are trying to make then none of the developers are going to be able to put their best foot forward either. Andromeda suffered because they were forced to work with an engine that... well it just isn't good for anyone outside of DICE. They spent countless hours on technical issues that could have been spent coming up with characters, stories, locations, etc. I have no doubt that Andromeda would have turned out a lot better if the developers were allowed to work with a friendlier engine. They absolutely nailed the combat in that game.
I don't think Greedfall compares favorably to Dragon Age: Inquisition. The characters in Inquisition are on a whole other level. The combat, while not the best Bioware has ever produced, is still more cohesive and solid. The environments are also much more varied but that comes down to budget. And that's what Greedfall feels like. Bioware on a budget. Dragon Age II feels like a surprisingly accurate comparison. And you know what? I'd take Dragon Age II over Anthem a million times over. So I'm happy that Greedfall exists and I hope that the developers will continue to improve from here. Because Bioware's future is in dire straits right now.
I wasn't misrepresenting anything mate. You can't say to ignore one poster just because he said some things that you don't agree with. His opinion of the game is just as valid as the opinions of those who find the game to be on par with Biowares output.
I know, I didn't say the OT was nothing other than a collection of different opinions, both good and bad...
I agree with this, specially the part about expectations....
All in all I'd say there's many good things about the game, and some bad as well, but if you're a WRPG fan it's definitely one to check out.
You were indeed misrepreseting things, because as many people have said already, the OT is also full of negative opinions, so I didn't suggest that people check it "because it agrees with me", like you say, but because it would be more fair than an obnoxious poster rolling eyes and calling the game/story garbage and lame as fuck, which is certainly isn't.
The game has it's problems, but there's no need to arbitrarily shit on it. Agaiin, check the OT
So yes, you did mis-represent what I said, mate
I do have this game on my wishlist but reading through this thread confused me.
Edit: I like having to experience a deep, meaningful story and not something that 12yo wrote like Mass Effect Andromeda.
Edit: I like having to experience a deep, meaningful story and not something that 12yo wrote like Mass Effect Andromeda.
