Google workers to form global union alliance (Reuters)

Comrade Grogu · Feb 23, 2021

Saw this on Reddit.

From the article:

Google workers to form global union alliance

Google employees from across the globe are forming a union alliance, weeks after workers at the search engine giant and other units of parent company Alphabet Inc formed a labor union for U.S. and Canadian offices.

www.reuters.com

This goes along with what's happening in Bessemer, Alabama with Amazon and the would-be union workers (who are also trying to form their own union under a transnational company). We'll see how both go. Until then, it's very much a "wait-and-see" situation, though I would like to know more on how to give support to both of these groups or potential labor unions. Anyways, hopefully all will go well.

Cipherr · Feb 23, 2021

Hope like hell they are successful.

Weiss · Feb 23, 2021

This is probably a really stupid and ignorant question, but trying to form a union is the kind of thing that gets you fired on trumped up charges, isn't it?

MercuryLS · Feb 23, 2021

We need more unions, fuck these companies.

FliX · Feb 23, 2021

Join a union, y'all!

Rowsdower · Feb 23, 2021

Good on them.

Älg · Feb 23, 2021

Hopefully this can catalyse something that reaches outside of Google and be more inclusive. This is undoubtedly great, but having company-specific (or even industry-specific) unions still isn't optimal.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 23, 2021

FliX said:
Join a union, y'all!

My org is trying to partner with other labor unions in my state, but unfortunately, it's hard to find 'em. While there have been calls for more unions recently, we're sort of dealing with decades of anti-union policy. Otherwise, if you can't join a union, start one or, at least, start a branch of the closest labor union near you. I know it isn't easy, but I'm floating ideas out there.

take_marsh · Feb 23, 2021

Pinkertons:

Under U.S. labor law, Alphabet can ignore the union's demands until a majority of employees support it.

Pretty loaded when you can virtually fire anyone for any reason at any time.

Sign My Guestbook! · Feb 23, 2021

NEW SERVICE: Google® Unions

Kill3r7 · Feb 23, 2021

Maybe I am being naive but I don't understand as to why Google employees would need a union? Contractors sure.

choog · Feb 23, 2021

Weiss said:
This is probably a really stupid and ignorant question, but trying to form a union is the kind of thing that gets you fired on trumped up charges, isn't it?

It's about where power lies. If this union has enough high-skilled employees involved it is much more expensive for Google to push them out. Retention of high-skilled employees is a very high priority at tech companies.

(I've worked in software tech for over 20 years and was at Google 2007-2010)

Weiss · Feb 23, 2021

choog said:
It's about where power lies. If this union has enough high-skilled employees involved it is much more expensive for Google to push them out. Retention of high-skilled employees is a very high priority at tech companies.

(I've worked in software tech for over 20 years and was at Google 2007-2010)

Wouldn't they want a union to retain those high skilled employees to stay around then?

Sorry, I should already know this stuff.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 23, 2021

take_marsh said:
Pinkertons:

Pretty loaded when you can virtually fire anyone for any reason at any time.

Definitely.

Infinity Times Two · Feb 23, 2021

Sign My Guestbook! said:
NEW SERVICE: Google® Unions

Making it a Google product would be the fastest way for Google to kill it.

Pulp · Feb 23, 2021

Exciting stuff! Lets hope they are successful

Dis · Feb 23, 2021

Honestly america needs more unions so the workers can finally start getting some rights back there. If americans need any proof that unions do in fact work as a way to give workers power and more rights, just look at the police unions, they've got so much power from their unions they straight up murder people daily and on the very rare times that a cop seems like he may face consequences, they would just refuse to work at all and suddenly they get whatever they want. Now if a corrupt as fuck, awful group of people like that can have have power, then everyday americans sure as shit deserve a union to get them the workers rights they deserve.

platocplx · Feb 23, 2021

Global unions would totally fuck these companies into making labor and pay across the board in every country equal. Holy crap. We need more of this.

Anton Sugar · Feb 23, 2021

It would be amazing for labor to become relevant again this decade. It will be hard going up against Google and Amazon, but this is one area that I expect Biden to excel in, based on his campaign and appointments.

Commedieu · Feb 23, 2021

Dis said:
Honestly america needs more unions so the workers can finally start getting some rights back there. If americans need any proof that unions do in fact work as a way to give workers power and more rights, just look at the police unions, they've got so much power from their unions they straight up murder people daily and on the very rare times that a cop seems like he may face consequences, they would just refuse to work at all and suddenly they get whatever they want. Now if a corrupt as fuck, awful group of people like that can have have power, then everyday americans sure as shit deserve a union to get them the workers rights they deserve.

americans are stupid. The end.

the argument is always the same, Unions don't do anything for you! Why should I pay money for them to tell me where I can work???? This is from pretty savvy VFX people as well. Same group killing themselves working 80hr weeks w rarely any benifits, pto, rates...

Its hard encoded into Us that unions are BAD. but you have a brilliant example here, but it will only be met with "well, thats different tho.." Everyone too, wants to be part of that 1% that they think they can be a part of one day, and they don't want the unions getting in the way of their future riches.

one of many many problems that could be solved via education explaining things like, why we have a 5 day work week... what is the meaning behind labor day all this shit.

PanickyFool · Feb 23, 2021

Good for them.

Damaniel · Feb 23, 2021

Weiss said:
This is probably a really stupid and ignorant question, but trying to form a union is the kind of thing that gets you fired on trumped up charges, isn't it?

In nearly the entire US, even the slightest whiff of interest in a union is enough to get you unceremoniously fired, no questions asked. Thank decades of right-to-work legislation and other Republican-enabled erosion of workers' rights for that.

Weiss · Feb 23, 2021

Damaniel said:
In nearly the entire US, even the slightest whiff of interest in a union is enough to get you unceremoniously fired, no questions asked. Thank decades of right-to-work legislation and other Republican-enabled erosion of workers' rights for that.

Oh wow, that's bad. Not even "we've decided you're a bad worker" just "we're firing you because fuck off."

That's incredible. That's some "work in a factory for 16 hours and die on the job" shit.

Palette Swap · Feb 23, 2021

This is good, unions are good, and they should be protected by law.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 23, 2021

Palette Swap said:
This is good, unions are good, and they should be protected by law.

They barely are and even that's only on paper.

krazen · Feb 23, 2021

Good. Hopefully this is successful and trickles down since having such a highly skilled, highly desirable workforce would be harder to stamp out

Comrade Grogu · Feb 23, 2021

krazen said:
Good. Hopefully this is successful and trickles down since having such a highly skilled, highly desirable workforce would be harder to stamp out

Let's hope that we can get an actual labor movement running again.

Threadkular · Feb 23, 2021

Google's intense hiring process already greatly limits the amount of people they'll bring into the company, and if those employees realize they have some power and Google don't lower their standards any it may work.

It be like a sports league union for engineers.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 23, 2021

Threadkular said:
Google's intense hiring process already greatly limits the amount of people they'll bring into the company, and if those employees realize they have some power and Google don't lower their standards any it may work.

It be like a sports league union for engineers.

Good point.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 24, 2021

Here's another article on the matter, though it's hard to find any new information or developments about this.

Google Workers Unionize And Protest Work Conditions Across The Globe

On Monday, January 25th, it was announced that Google employees would be unionizing across the globe. This news came a few weeks after workers at other units of Google’s parent company, Alphabet In…

theowp.org

For now, I believe that we'll definitely have to "wait-and-see" on this topic.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 25, 2021

Anyone else around the area know what's going on?

Comrade Grogu · Feb 25, 2021

Google's treatment of AI ethics researchers continues to stir up controversy | TechCrunch

You’ve landed on the web version of the weekly Human Capital newsletter. Sign up here to get this in your inbox every Friday at 1 p.m. Welcome back to

techcrunch.com

Not really relevant, but I do get the sense that this sort of encapsulates the culture at Google. At the end of the day though, this is very much capitalism, even if it's at a different stage than it was previously. I hope that we find out more news about what's going on with the unionization soon, but keep in mind: they have a lot to fight against.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 26, 2021

I'm going to assume this thread will die either now or soon, but hopefully, more people can find out more about this.

choog · Feb 26, 2021

Weiss said:
Wouldn't they want a union to retain those high skilled employees to stay around then?

Sorry, I should already know this stuff.

Google wants the employees, but the corporate culture in America is so anti-union that I think Google's in an interesting place. They could lead here.

It's complicated. The full-time employees (FTE) already have tremendous power. The Project Maven protests at Google are a good example of this. No union was necessary.
A challenge this union will have is justifying its existence to employees who already have a lot of money and power.

Comrade Grogu · Feb 26, 2021

choog said:
Google wants the employees, but the corporate culture in America is so anti-union that I think Google's in an interesting place. They could lead here.

It's complicated. The full-time employees (FTE) already have tremendous power. The Project Maven protests at Google are a good example of this. No union was necessary.
A challenge this union will have is justifying its existence to employees who already have a lot of money and power.

Let's not forget what's happening at Amazon. There's also been an uptick in labor activity. We'll see how it goes. Let's keep our hopes up and support in any way we can, imho.

Comrade Grogu · Mar 10, 2021

I'll try to find more info on this, but it seems that news kinda went dark after the initial reports...

Cantaim · Mar 10, 2021

Comrade Grogu said:
I'll try to find more info on this, but it seems that news kinda went dark after the initial reports...

Yea not a good sign for the union. Was hoping it would get more coverage

mrmoose · Mar 10, 2021

choog said:
It's about where power lies. If this union has enough high-skilled employees involved it is much more expensive for Google to push them out. Retention of high-skilled employees is a very high priority at tech companies.

(I've worked in software tech for over 20 years and was at Google 2007-2010)

That's one of the problems, though, if the high skilled employees are generally treated well and compensated. They would almost have to join the union out of a goodwill effort instead of something that would directly benefit them right now (which is entirely possible).

If you're a young (this is probably the most important part), highly recruited "superstar" engineer, you probably don't plan to work at google until retirement and you think you can get any job even if you're let go. There's also the prevailing thought (and I still don't know how true this is) that unions in general reward longevity over aptitude, ie: your pay goes up the longer you're there, not by how much you contribute. Like I said, when you're young and have no family and are climbing the ladder, that's the last thing you want. Of course, this ignores that promotions and raises are also not just given out on aptitude alone.

BreakyBoy · Mar 10, 2021

mrmoose said:
That's one of the problems, though, if the high skilled employees are generally treated well and compensated. They would almost have to join the union out of a goodwill effort instead of something that would directly benefit them right now (which is entirely possible).

If you're a young (this is probably the most important part), highly recruited "superstar" engineer, you probably don't plan to work at google until retirement and you think you can get any job even if you're let go. There's also the prevailing thought (and I still don't know how true this is) that unions in general reward longevity over aptitude, ie: your pay goes up the longer you're there, not by how much you contribute. Like I said, when you're young and have no family and are climbing the ladder, that's the last thing you want. Of course, this ignores that promotions and raises are also not just given out on aptitude alone.

This is 100% correct, at least in my own case, and I think it fairly represents the position of a lot of my colleagues.

For most workers, a union protecting their rights directly translates into job security and equitable compensation.

Those things are, for all practical purposes, not a concern in my life. My compensation is pretty great, and I have near zero concern about finding another job if I need/want to. I expect that would be even more true for most of the high-skilled folks that end up at Google.

So yeah, absent those incentives, what you're left with is having people join a union for altruistic/social justice reasons. Which I would absolutely do. And I suspect many others would too.

The worry I would have is that those kind of incentives may not be enough to mobilize people to get a union established. Which is why I'm not surprised when these things make a splash in the news and then quickly die down.

tl;dr -- often people are all for the cause until they have to put the work in to make change happen

Google workers to form global union alliance (Reuters)

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