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Lobster Roll

signature-less, now and forever
Member
Sep 24, 2019
34,387
Number 3 is a damn riot. Lets dig at the effort no other company is putting for BC becasue their solution is software based. I mean...
Number 3 is some mental gymnastics.
Hot take: Pretty much none of the zelda games have ever had particularly strong narratives and even in games like OoT what story was there was largely just an excuse for characters to tell you to go from point a to point b. Some have had a few good individual moments (I love the ending of Windwaker for example), but those moments are largely isolated and only stick out because it's easier to remember than the hours of relatively dull or straightforward narrative that surround them
You're not wrong at all. I'm a bit fanboyish when it comes to the Zelda series and the plot / narrative is the last thing it does well. It's got really cool lore and an amazing world built out, but the end-to-end story of Zelda games are typically nothing special at all.
 

Arklite

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,640
I do wonder what happened with Sony and PS1 BC. They did a great job on PS3, digital versions even had fully scanned manuals for reference. All of that still exists but they haven't bothered to make downloads accessible via PS4/5. I think the PS4 disc drive can't even read CD ROMs.
 

Deleted member 17184

User-requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,240
I'll reply to the ones I can say something, and I do hope you're open to people changing your opinion.

2. Consolidation of the industry

I know this will bring out fanboys about how it's good, this and that. I don't care. The idea that in 10-15 years all the big third party publishers might be gobbled up and owned by Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, Google, Apple, Amazon, and so on? That sounds horrible. I like owning multiple consoles, but I like being able to play on the one I prefer. Not only that, but it would mean a lot of bad things for the industry as a whole. The whole thing just depresses me so much, and now that Pandora's box has been opened, I don't see it closing. :(
I understand the sentiment, but this isn't what is happening. It's not like Bethesda was doing well and Microsoft aggressively bought them. Many of their recent titles failed to be profitable, and they were looking to sell. If it didn't happen, they could close down. But don't worry - EA, Ubisoft, Activision, Capcom, Take-Two... all of these are doing super well.

3. MS's anti-presevervation push

While the original 'always online' push for the Xbox One failed, and nearly killed the brand, the thought processes behind it lived on. Having all BC be based on downloads, and as of the time of typing, having Xbox Series X versions of games not ship fully on the disks? What about how some of their first party Xbox One games shipped with not all the game on disk? Finally, their push and belief for Xbox Series S be the successful variant, which doesn't even have a physical disk drive. Everything about all that I mentioned above relies on MS having their servers for such things up forever, which is impossible, and I wouldn't trust a large company with anyways. Microsoft have already shown what happens when they take down services with original Xbox Live and Games for Windows Live. Having everything rely on them is the wet dream of publishers around the industry, and as a huge preservationist, and huge fan of video games, it's really devastating to see this. :(
What you are looking for here isn't preservation, but a way to keep playing older games on newer devices. Preservation means keeping games playable on their original platforms, and that's been possible since the very first platforms, except for online games or modes.

4. Everything was open world

I really love well crafted level design, I love the feeling levels designed around encounters, and I think sandbox encounters are amazing, the way Bungie's Halo gave you tools and abilities to combat enemies with whatever was around, or Arkane's truly amazing level design in the Dishonored series that really lets you do things your way...

But I don't like open world games. They add so much bloat to the experience, so much time spent 'between points of interest' as well as overworld encounters just sort of being enemies placed on a map, rather than a map being based around the enemies and encounters, it really makes me burn out on them, unless they are really really good, of which there have been quite a few this generation, but even so, the reason I liked they were not due to them being open world.

think about it, how many high budget linear games can you name anymore? Where are the games that give you a full experience in 8-16 hours without padding everything out with time wasting? It's so sad, and the complete death of level design has made me cynical of a lot of games, which is very much not really who I am. It makes me value older games even more, with how the level are designed.
I currently have 12 games installed on my PC. Only two of them are open world. Out of the other 10, only one of them isn't story-driven, and another one isn't from this generation that's ending. You can find the games you're looking for.

8. Despite being happy to have ports/remakes/BC games, so many are just going to be left behind forever

While it's great to have some BC at all from MS, as well as full last generation BC from Sony and MS, there are so many classics we'll never be able to play in any optimal form ever again. Be it licensing or it being a cult classic or just not popular enough, there are so many games that just will never be remade, nor will become BC, which is sad.

To name a few off the top of my head, Burnout 3, Guitar Hero 1+2, various Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, 007, Marvel and so on games, Lego games, Gitaroo-Man, MotorStorm series, etc. Lots of these games won't get remasters, ports, remakes or become BC, because there is no money in it, which makes them on the vines of games slowly inching towards death, which is so sad. I still own like 70 PS2 games, of which the majority will never get ports/remasters. :(
Again, you can still play these games on the platforms they were originally released for.

11. GaS / Mobile Sequels

I hesitated to put in "Everything was GaS" as the title of this, but eh. I hate that every game these days has to have MTX, season passes, battle passes, pre order bonuses, and so on and so forth. You can make the argument that it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things, but when I am playing a game that has MTX to buy stuff in game or something, all I can see is the way the game is designed to encourage you to pay, not the game itself anymore. It makes it feel like a storefront, not a story or piece of art. Imagine watching Star Wars, and in the middle have them talk about how great the theater popcorn is, or how great the Disney Twitter account is. That's the level of "takes me out of it" that this gives me.

It's pretty hard to find games don't feel this scummy, which is probably why I gravitate to Sony first party games so often, they are high budget, they are story based, and they generally aren't filled with MTX. At worst we generally get expansion packs of additional content. Expansion packs over other MTX any day.

The fact that actually finding games like this continues to get more and more rare, with even Nintendo starting to dip their feet into it, and MS far and fully invested, let alone all the third parties, it paints a depressing picture for the future of games.
Again, you can find a bunch of different games that don't follow this model. If you're thinking about the AAA space only, there's Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order, God of War... the industry considers "Games as a Service" as any game with post-launch additional content, including DLC expansions. But if your definition is simply MTX, passes, etc, then you expand that list quite a lot.
 

arcadepc

Banned
Dec 28, 2019
1,925
While it is laudable that some producers give more opportunities to marginalised groups for their entertainment, their approach is still ridden with toxic positivity, also due to corporatism,often ignoring or sidestepping the serious issues.
This can be just as bad as misrepresenting or ignoring them.

I play now on PC that still keeps some traces of the older game approach,also thanks to bc and emulation.

Consoles became a serious investment now
 

Deleted member 13077

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,513
Completely agree on the Halo point.

The demo from earlier this didn't just look awful graphically, it looked about as far away gameplay wise as I'd ever want a Halo to look. You couple that with the 343i enabling some of the most toxic people in gaming and you have a pretty horrific combination and a place that even as a Halo fan I have absolutely no desire to be.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
Man I know people will nitpick but I have to agree with pretty much everything.

I think the only thing I'd add is how much Sony seems to just completely disregard their legacy. Nintendo to. It's one thing Microsoft is doing way better. Many servers for old games are still up, and they're working hard to maintain BC, and grow it, meanwhile Sony just doesn't seem to care about their older devices or games. That's really great. But then of course there's the mention you said. Xbox is a part of Microsoft after all, and like any other huge tech company they're going to want to shift over time to everything being on their servers and their time. Capitalism drives a company that direction.
 

zeitgeist

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,060
I think if these things genuinely have you feeling sad or depressed, it might help to make yourself a list of the good things in the industry too.

I agree with a bunch or your points but I still think that the amazing stuff that has been released recently outweighs the negative trends.
 

Thorakai

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,234
I thought this was gonna cover things like exploitation of workers, continued lack of diversity in both the workforce and characters represented in games, the continued objectification of women, and preying on addiction to make profit (which you covered). It kinda sounds like you are really invested in AAA gaming, because a lot of these trends aren't really problems at all with indie games. All I can say is that I hope you don't let yourself be depressed because products aren't tailoring to your tastes and values anymore. If you haven't already, this could be a great chance to venture more outside the big AAA spaces.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
What you are looking for here isn't preservation, but a way to keep playing older games on newer devices. Preservation means keeping games playable on their original platforms, and that's been possible since the very first platforms, except for online games or modes.

Backwards compatibility is a form of preservation. Better in fact. The important thing is that the game/experience is preserved. That's it. BC is a great way of doing that. Better even, since old hardware eventually fades away and breaks and stuff. Being able to preserve things into the future on newer hardware is great. Because eventually that will reach a ceiling too, but it will last much longer all told, and the hope is that the newest line of whatever can run it, will do so flawlessly, without relying on something else.

Sort of like, I can play a lot of original xbox games on my xbox 360. Imagine if servers for the 360 go down, and the 360 had something in place that meant you had to connect to servers to play them. That would suck. You'd have to go back to an original xbox, fewer of which exist, certainly in as good condition, and which wouldn't run the game as well (ignoring emulation issues for the time being).

Heck, kind of already exists with any Games for Windows Lives games that still exist. You can't download the DLC for them any more. So even though their BC, the way they worked meant that BC could only do so much. The servers are down, even though my computer could still run the games just fine.

Part of preservation in games is how it needs to also come with accessibility too. It's not just enough to want to preserve something. You want to increase how many people can access it too. The two are interlinked. Backwards compatibility is a great way of preserving games for this reason as well. It means more people can play them.

Microsoft's solution with the series X doesn't decimate any of this. But it does go counter to it in a really needless way. There's no reason the game couldn't run how it originally does on xbox one, and then if it connects to the server, then download the config file, and do whatever enhancements it can do.

I honestly don't know why you'd think preservation has to mean original hardware. That's a subset of preservation. But when people talk about game preservation, they mean...preserving the game. And the game is in the playing of it.

I currently have 12 games installed on my PC. Only two of them are open world. Out of the other 10, only one of them isn't story-driven, and another one isn't from this generation that's ending. You can find the games you're looking for.

The issue isn't just that non open world games don't exist, but that games that probably would have benefitted from being tighter and smaller are instead big open worlds, when it doesn't really make them better and in some cases just makes it worse.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
I think if these things genuinely have you feeling sad or depressed, it might help to make yourself a list of the good things in the industry too.

I agree with a bunch or your points but I still think that the amazing stuff that has been released recently outweighs the negative trends.

I like this idea.
 

StereoVSN

Member
Nov 1, 2017
13,620
Eastern US
Honestly with the MS game preservation section, I have to disagree. If anything, their systems that are promising backwards compatibility in perpetuity (even if they are unfortunately limited with what they can bring back from the 360/OG Xbox) means that the games of today will be very much preserved forever, not to mention that they will have native PC versions of all their games moving forward as well, so if something goes south with the Xbox brand, the games will still be available on PC forever. Additionally, they have made an effort to preserve many of their classic games, meaning that game series like Splinter Cell, Assassin's Creed, Dead Space, Fable, Castlevania (the 4 games on the 360 lol), Mass Effect, Metal Gear Solid and the Lego games are all preserved and able to be played on modern hardware. While it isn't everything, they are doing a lot to preserve their efforts in gaming.

And if anything, I feel as though the 3d platformer is going through a renaissance, with Astro's Playroom, Sackboy, Psychonauts 2 and Crash 4 all being games that people enjoy and that will likely lead to more games being made in the same vein. Not as many big AAA 3d platformers, but you'll get your indies
Yeah, I have to agree here. While MS' approach is not ideal, at least compared to Sony they are working it. Talking about game preservation, Sony is the worst by far.
 

Deleted member 13077

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,513
The issue isn't just that non open world games don't exist, but that games that probably would have benefitted from being tighter and smaller are instead big open worlds, when it doesn't really make them better and in some cases just makes it worse.

This is why I won't play nearly any open world game now that doesn't support activities. At least give me the option to bypass the bullshit.
 

Dphex

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,811
Cologne, Germany
12. remakes/remasters/sequels instead of truly novel ideas

i feel like we have reached the same creatively bankrupt state that hit Hollywood movies 10 years ago.

instead of doing new stuff it is sequel after sequel or yet another remaster/remake. it is just not surprising anymore and more often than not it gives a severe feeling of "been here, done that".
 
Oct 28, 2017
5,339
Isn't number 1 based on rumours and speculation? Sony Japan Studio hasn't been shut down and just released Astros Playroom and helped develop Demon's Souls, two of the most critically acclaimed next gen games.

Sure they are not as huge as their were before, but it seems a little early to get depressed about their situation.
 

GhostTrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,316
I never enjoyed gaming as much since I decided to skip 99% of the shit stuff that we pretend is amazing every time to run the marketing hype machine and focus on the 1% that I give a shit about.
 

Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
This is why I won't play nearly any open world game now that doesn't support activities. At least give me the option to bypass the bullshit.

Yeah it sucks cuz I'll play a game and I'll be like, man I'd enjoy this if it was tighter.

I'm playing shadow of mordor right now, and that one like....okay yeah I feel like it probably does need to be open world to support it's design, but see even then look it manages to do that just fine by being a smaller open world. It doesn't need to be huge. But yeah even then I find myself just going man I kinda would rather just mainline the story. I'm so fatigued by it. I enjoy the game though. I find it pretty unique and I think it does need to be how it is. But I'm definitely feeling it from so many other games that proooobably could afford to be tighter.
 

Mr.Deadshot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,285
Well, this industry is going to shit more and more with every gen. But on the other side, there is more to play than ever and we are long past the point where there are more games out than you could ever finish in your life. Just stick to the stuff that makes you happy and ignore the rest as best as you can. Don't get cateched up in hype and FOMO.
 

ReginaldXIV

Member
Nov 4, 2017
7,805
Minnesota
The only real way to preserve the games of the past is through emulation. Completely digital is the way to go if you're trying to preserve data in perpetuity. All those game discs in cases on your shelf will eventually corrode even if it's not within your life time.
 

Fredrik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,003
MS's anti-presevervation push
Phew you scared me with that line, I thought they had stepped in to remove Retroarch.

I think you're overthinking many of these points, doesn't seem worth getting depressed over. But then again I'm feeling depressed over not getting to play as a hero in AC Valhalla, the invasion angle is really not my cup of tea, feels like shit tbh, but I bought the $120 Ultimate version... Sigh.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
12. remakes/remasters/sequels instead of truly novel ideas

i feel like we have reached the same creatively bankrupt state that hit Hollywood movies 10 years ago.

instead of doing new stuff it is sequel after sequel or yet another remaster/remake. it is just not surprising anymore and more often than not it gives a severe feeling of "been here, done that".
It's not necessarily creativity bankrupt.
An issue Hollywood has is the consumer seems to enmasse go see sequels, popcorn flicks etc. They don't really care about original ideas. Tons of fantastic movies have come out the past decade that people simply do not watch cause if they are going to go out and watch a movie, it's going to be something big. Hollywood is following the money and that's where the money is.

Same with video games. Biggest selling games are sports, open world, Call of Duty, Zombies. You make those games you will sell well. There is a ton of great smaller and creative titles that don't sell well.

People like nostalgia. People like more of what they know and already like.
 

antispin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,780
You're forgetting slave labour. TBH, everything else pales in comparison to how our toys get made.
 

JigglesBunny

Prophet of Truth
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
31,144
Chicago
Apart from number 6, I actually agree with everything you've said here. I'm sorry that I can't offer reassurances and peace of mind, but I offer you my solidarity.
 
OP
OP
Jon God

Jon God

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,295
Your problem is believing that any major game publisher/corporation cares about anything beyond satisfying shareholders. They do not care about you or games as a creative art form.

I learned this the hard way back in 2002.

From your avatar, I assume you have some affinity for Full Throttle and therefore LucasArts in the 90's, so I understand your pain. LucasArts was my favorite developer/publisher of the 90's and made a lot of fun creative games from a variety of genres, Tie Fighter, Dark Forces, Outlaws, all the adventure games, etc. Then the 2000's hit and they stopped making adventure games, chased the trends, brought in a bunch of executives who didn't care about their legacy and didn't understand the industry and the quality of their games quickly went downhill only to be dissolved in the sale to Disney.

However, there is an alternative.

My interest in gaming returned back in 2010 thanks to digital distribution and indies.
Now thanks to GOG (owned by CDPR who fall into point number ten on your list unfortunately) I could suddenly get my favorite classic and current indie games DRM-Free for a fraction of what I payed originally. This is much better for game preservation than any console, since keeping old consoles around takes up extra space and also the games stop working (at least this happened with my Pokemon gameboy cartridges which are now unable to save.) There's no worry about my games not working or being inaccessible in twenty years and I will be able to play them on my future PC without any problem.

Thanks to indies, interesting games are still being made. Yes, they have smaller budgets and smaller teams, but many play better than the games of the past, with a larger variety of art styles than games from major publishers. Note that the games from major publishers of the past had much smaller budgets than today and were also more fun.

My best advice is to stop caring about corporations and publishers making big budget games, it only leads to disappointment.

I think the issue is that I like a complicated mixture of games, from low budget to high budget. When I only play smaller indie-y games, I end up wanting to play something more bombastic and larger scale, and when I just play those, I end up pining for smaller experiences,

It's easy to just say "ignore the larger publishers" but it would also greatly reduce styles of games I would be playing. I'd honestly probably end up playing more older games than more indie games, because I am looking for that balance.

Also, yes, watching LucasArts kill itself over like 15 years was pretty depressing.


Hot take: Pretty much none of the zelda games have ever had particularly strong narratives and even in games like OoT what story was there was largely just an excuse for characters to tell you to go from point a to point b. Some have had a few good individual moments (I love the ending of Windwaker for example), but those moments are largely isolated and only stick out because it's easier to remember than the hours of relatively dull or straightforward narrative that surround them

I am going to agree here, I mentioned Zelda because of the nostalgia, and the love of not exactly puzzle rooms, but the way dungeons are in that series. The stories in the games have always needed work in my opinion.

How horrible it must be to just focus on negativity

I don't, I am generally a very positive and optimistic person. I just had a day where I woke up sad. Sometimes when you're sad, all the little things that just sort of nag at you end up feeling more like being hit by boulders.

The next-gen versions of games not being on the disk is likely to be a temporary cross-gen thing as we transition to new consoles. The downloaded "containers" for BC, as I understand it, are vital to making that system work (at least for 360 and OG Xbox games - less clear on Xbox One games). This is probably why PS5 doesn't natively support games past the PS4.

The discless future is inevitable though, whether it's the Series S or the PS5 DE. If Sony don't believe the DE will outsell the traditional PS5 long term, it'll only be because they supply constrained it to keep down losses.

From a preservationist stand point though, I understand your concerns.

Yeah, I hope that it goes away soon, the more stuff we own, the better. As for the BC, they way they have it set up, they'd need to have all the executables already on the Xbox out of the box, but I wish they could have all the data files they need already on the Xboxes, and have it install all the assets from the disks.


These things shouldn't make you sad or depressing.

These are more a symptom of feeling down in the dumps today, and not the trigger for it.

Re open world, this is what gamers wanted. When a AAA linear not padded game comes out, gamers say it's not worth the money, it's only X hours long, wait for sales, wait for $20 or even cheaper. It's a terrible business model for these games. Sure, Sony does it, but remember they get 42% more revenue from every digital sale than a third party publisher does, and frankly those games don't need to be profitable so long as they drive hardware sales which in turn drives PS+ sales and other purchases. An open world game offering 50 hours of play, even if two thirds of that is just getting from A to B and finding collectibles or beating the Nth combat or race challenge, feels like value.

Re platformers, good news is there has been a lot of really good platformers in the last couple of years. Maybe not exactly what you're looking for, but it's still been great for the genre.

Nice to see you're such a big fan of Pixeljunk Monsters. I agree, the first game is phenomenal. I'm a big fan of many of their games. I did not expect to see that getting a mention here on Era. Again looking on the positives, I think it has been $1 on Steam and it probably runs on a potato. There is also a new mobile Monsters game soon, already launched in some areas iirc.

Yeah, it's sad. I like what I like, and I can't help that, but it often seems that the industry and gamers at large don't like what I like, so I end up digging for the scraps and remains of genres and series I like. :/

Yeah, if you want to see my Tweet history, I can show you that I've been bugging folks about it for some time. https://twitter.com/JonGod/status/1333172371243429888?s=20

You don't know what sadness truly is.

I am 100% positive there are people that have experienced much worse sadness than I have, though I do suffer from anxiety, which sometimes results in bouts of minor depression. Today was one of those days. I wasn't depressed because of these things, these things depressed me more.

Maybe Sony can push Valve to make half life 3?

What in the world..

At that point in time, it felt like something that could be possible. Stuff like Shenmue 3 was considered Dead. The Last Guardian was sort of canceled, and suddenly we have Final Fantasy VII's remake showing up at their shows. It's like, with all that happening, it felt like anything was possible.


Honestly, if you only follow the huge news, and look at what the major players are doing, it's depressing AF.

I wouldn't say so in general. I was very happy with seeing Spider-Man: Miles Morales announced, Astro's Playroom and Sackboy all made me so excited for the PS5 launch in a way I had never been for a console launch (While I've been [console] gaming since the SNES/Genesis, and playing on computer before that, the PS4 was the first console I actually bought at launch. I generally buy them after a few years.

If, otoh, you find a couple of (relative) no-name YouTubers who release trailer compilations for new indie titles basically every day, things suddenly don't look so bleak. Plenty of smaller devs are out there making smaller, story-driven 3D platformers. This year we had Pumpkin Jack, Effie, Woven, Ary and the Secret of Seasons, Tamarin, Skully, probably a whole bunch I'm forgetting... same thing with shorter single-player games without micro-transactions or crowbarred multiplayer- a whole bunch of mid-tier publishers like Focus Home, Nacon, Kalypso, Embracer (I know there's other reason to dislike them, but credit where credit's due- the non-Deep Silver branches tend to stay away from iffy monetization), etc all regularly release those shorter one and done titles- and in Embracer's case, they've been bringing back older platformers/cult classic series as well.

Yeah, I had my eye on Pumpkin Jack, Ary, Tamarin, and a few others, but most of these have the story as not a main focus, or didn't really have them pan out, from what I could see. (I am waiting on a sale for all of those, due to them not looking like my cup of tea. In general, if there was one that looked totally my style, I'd buy it day 1 to support it)


Honestly, the biggest problem with the gaming landscape I find is that there's so many hundreds of new games... but 90% of all "games media" is talking about the same handful of headline-generating titles. It takes work to find cool new things- whether it be sifting YouTube to find channels that do that, or look through e-stores new releases/coming soon sections yourself. But if you DO wanna look, there's never been a better time to actually find stuff.

I dig a lot to find games, and I also keep a list of all the games that interest me, with release dates, platforms and so on, so I can reference it, and see what's coming out 'this week', generally there's at least 1-2 games coming out a week that catch my eye. Some pan out, some do not, but I don't focus on only the popular things, actually I am not into a lot of the most popular series... Not because they are popular, just because they aren't my style of game.

Going digital/preservation. There's a lot of pros and cons about this, but ultimately, I feel it puts more power to the devs if they don't need to rely physical media and retailers to stock their games. If anyone can publish a game on Steam or the eShop, ultimately this gives everyone a (slightly) better chance at making it themselves. Sure, for every smash indie sleeper hit there's probably 50+ games that languish in obscurity; but being able to get on the storefront themselves is (imho) still ultimately better than needing to impress a publisher enough to do it for you. I don't know, it's a complicated issue, and game preservation certainly is a big part of it, as well (it's why I try to buy games on GOG whenever possible and download each game's installer and then back them up-its the best I can do to ensure I'm not reliant on the storefront's infrastructure, even if the price is often better for a Steam key elsewhere).

Yeah, I don't use steam except for all the games I redeemed from Humble Bundles over the years. I own a few 100 games on GOG though. Basically, I start steam up a few times a year, mostly by accident when trying to launch something else.


So, honestly, I think you need to shift your attention away from the big 3 and the EAvisions of this world. Gaming is a huge business these days, so the bigger the company, the less creative risks it can afford to take if it needs to maintain profits. You'll still get passion projects here and there (Microsoft's revival of Age of Empires by involving a prolific modder team is nothing short of a fairytale in that regard, for instance); but by and large, you have to look for smaller games and devs for those sparks; the good news are, with the revenue pie being so huge, there's literally thousands of devs out there; and with the quality of tools like Unreal and Unity constantly growing, small independent teams can more and more often put out stuff that's hard to distinguish from "AAA", big budget productions.

While it's true that higher budget means less risk, it's also true that you need a certain budget to actually nail specific styles of games. I mentioned before something like Uncharted 2 could not be done on an indie budget. It's the mixture of games that keeps me forever interested in games, Big game, smaller game, big game, smaller game.


I don't think games are the cause of how you're feeling... more like a symptom. Reach out for help, please.

I agree, they aren't.. they just make me who was feeling down today, feel worse.

In general I am very upbeat and positive, but I do suffer from anxiety, and sometimes it manifests in feeling depressed. When you feel depressed things that don't otherwise bother you, can feel a lot worse.

Again being said, I am very lucky I have a great support group, and I am okay. I feel depressed today, but tomorrow is another day, and I will make it through the depressing day.
 

5pectre

Member
Nov 16, 2017
2,237
The worst for me is Games as a Service or variants thereof. Keeping a game alive for years and years because it's a money printing machine. I get it , they want to make the money but it just slows the output from said company to a halt! And if you don't like the game? Tough shit, you have to wait 7-10 years for the next one.

In the PS360 era Rockstar experimented and put out some quality stuff.... until GTAV: Online. The game came out in 2013 and GTAVI hasn't been announced yet. Street Fighter V is nearing 5 years now and it wont be a year or two before the next one comes out.

PS4/XBone gen was the remaster generation. Milking GaaS and putting out old games in higher resolution.

Best thing to happen in the past decade is the rise of the indie games, which I have heavily gravitated towards
 

Feep

Lead Designer, Iridium Studios
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,603
Indie gaming has been absolutely BONKERS these past few years. Celeste, Baba is You, Outer Wilds? I understand AAA gaming isn't a great place right now, but every single studio on the planet with more than 20 people could collapse and I'd still be absolutely loving gaming.

Awesome stuff is out there! Keep searching!
 

Pyro

God help us the mods are making weekend threads
Member
Jul 30, 2018
14,505
United States
Really can't disagree with any of it, especially industry consolidation.
 
OP
OP
Jon God

Jon God

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,295
Number 3 is some mental gymnastics.

You're not wrong at all. I'm a bit fanboyish when it comes to the Zelda series and the plot / narrative is the last thing it does well. It's got really cool lore and an amazing world built out, but the end-to-end story of Zelda games are typically nothing special at all.

I've explained myself in previous posts, but essentially, I think Sony and Nintendo have done far worse, but the scary part for me is more that MS being the shining example is actually making the 'you don't even own your BC games' in the long term, palatable, and that makes me sad. Sony completely screwed up their BC on the PS4, and looks to be continuing it on the PS5, where Nintendo just doesn't even care anymore.

I do wonder what happened with Sony and PS1 BC. They did a great job on PS3, digital versions even had fully scanned manuals for reference. All of that still exists but they haven't bothered to make downloads accessible via PS4/5. I think the PS4 disc drive can't even read CD ROMs.

Yeah, total head scratcher, I hate that I have to keep my PS2 and PS3 hooked up just to play those old games, terrible.

I'll reply to the ones I can say something, and I do hope you're open to people changing your opinion.

I'd love to change my opinion, give me a reason to feel upbeat on a day I don't feel upbeat!


I understand the sentiment, but this isn't what is happening. It's not like Bethesda was doing well and Microsoft aggressively bought them. Many of their recent titles failed to be profitable, and they were looking to sell. If it didn't happen, they could close down. But don't worry - EA, Ubisoft, Activision, Capcom, Take-Two... all of these are doing super well.

I'd love to think this, but with MS reiterating that they are going to continue to buy, I feel like companies, even outside of the obvious Sony or Nintendo, could potentially try to buy stuff so they aren't stuck in the dark. Companies like Google, Amazon or Apple might snatch up a developer or publisher, and I can't imagine that would make most people happy.


What you are looking for here isn't preservation, but a way to keep playing older games on newer devices. Preservation means keeping games playable on their original platforms, and that's been possible since the very first platforms, except for online games or modes.

Being able to continue to play old games is a way to preserve them. Eventually all the old hardware will cease to function, and we'll be left with emulation. In the current times, this is sort of the only solution I can see, but in 10-20 years, if/when MS shuts down the Series S/X download servers, because they are ancient machines, we'll be left with machines that can't even play the games the technically should be able to.


I currently have 12 games installed on my PC. Only two of them are open world. Out of the other 10, only one of them isn't story-driven, and another one isn't from this generation that's ending. You can find the games you're looking for.

Some of them for sure, I do admit that the "everything was open world" was hyperbolic. I talked about it in one of my other posts, but basically, I should have mentioned that when it comes to new games that aren't in ancient series (DOOM, Crash Bandicoot), and aren't remakes/remasters, the amount of story heavy games linear higher budget games is pretty low this year.


Again, you can still play these games on the platforms they were originally released for.

Sure, but as time marches on, the keeping all the old hardware working, as well as all the accessories you need (Imagine when all the PS1s start dying, trying to find a PS1, memory card and controller, all that still work.) when you can natively play it on a new system, it continues to keep it "preserved". For the moment, I can still use my PS3 to play PS1 games, which is a godsend, but the PS4 can't play them, nor can the PS5.


Again, you can find a bunch of different games that don't follow this model. If you're thinking about the AAA space only, there's Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order, God of War... the industry considers "Games as a Service" as any game with post-launch additional content, including DLC expansions. But if your definition is simply MTX, passes, etc, then you expand that list quite a lot.

I guess for me, I would consider MTX stuff like aesthetics, early unlocks or premium currency. God of War is a great example of a game that didn't indulge in that at all. Props to SSM.


Man I know people will nitpick but I have to agree with pretty much everything.

I think the only thing I'd add is how much Sony seems to just completely disregard their legacy. Nintendo to. It's one thing Microsoft is doing way better. Many servers for old games are still up, and they're working hard to maintain BC, and grow it, meanwhile Sony just doesn't seem to care about their older devices or games. That's really great. But then of course there's the mention you said. Xbox is a part of Microsoft after all, and like any other huge tech company they're going to want to shift over time to everything being on their servers and their time. Capitalism drives a company that direction.

Oh yeah, Sony is terrible, but I would put Nintendo as worse. They basically started from square 1 with the Switch, and haven't commented on wether they plan to keep things BC going forwards. With the way the DSi, 3DS, Wii, Wii-U and now Switch have gone though, likely, you'll just have to rebuy which games they decide to port. It really sucks. Sony on the other hand had a reason for not having PS3 BC, but besides just not caring, never had a reason not to have PS1/2 BC, it's frustrating.


I thought this was gonna cover things like exploitation of workers, continued lack of diversity in both the workforce and characters represented in games, the continued objectification of women, and preying on addiction to make profit (which you covered). It kinda sounds like you are really invested in AAA gaming, because a lot of these trends aren't really problems at all with indie games. All I can say is that I hope you don't let yourself be depressed because products aren't tailoring to your tastes and values anymore. If you haven't already, this could be a great chance to venture more outside the big AAA spaces.

It's not even that I am just invested in AAA. I am invested in most styles of games. I own apparently over 500 games for the PS4, maybe 100-120 of those are AAA? I just like trying all sorts of games, and I end up liking what I like. I mentioned it before, but Night in the Woods is one of my favorite games of all time.


Backwards compatibility is a form of preservation. Better in fact. The important thing is that the game/experience is preserved. That's it. BC is a great way of doing that. Better even, since old hardware eventually fades away and breaks and stuff. Being able to preserve things into the future on newer hardware is great. Because eventually that will reach a ceiling too, but it will last much longer all told, and the hope is that the newest line of whatever can run it, will do so flawlessly, without relying on something else.

Sort of like, I can play a lot of original xbox games on my xbox 360. Imagine if servers for the 360 go down, and the 360 had something in place that meant you had to connect to servers to play them. That would suck. You'd have to go back to an original xbox, fewer of which exist, certainly in as good condition, and which wouldn't run the game as well (ignoring emulation issues for the time being).

Heck, kind of already exists with any Games for Windows Lives games that still exist. You can't download the DLC for them any more. So even though their BC, the way they worked meant that BC could only do so much. The servers are down, even though my computer could still run the games just fine.

Part of preservation in games is how it needs to also come with accessibility too. It's not just enough to want to preserve something. You want to increase how many people can access it too. The two are interlinked. Backwards compatibility is a great way of preserving games for this reason as well. It means more people can play them.

Microsoft's solution with the series X doesn't decimate any of this. But it does go counter to it in a really needless way. There's no reason the game couldn't run how it originally does on xbox one, and then if it connects to the server, then download the config file, and do whatever enhancements it can do.

I honestly don't know why you'd think preservation has to mean original hardware. That's a subset of preservation. But when people talk about game preservation, they mean...preserving the game. And the game is in the playing of it.

Totally agreed.


The issue isn't just that non open world games don't exist, but that games that probably would have benefitted from being tighter and smaller are instead big open worlds, when it doesn't really make them better and in some cases just makes it worse.

Also, 100% agreed.

Yeah, I have to agree here. While MS' approach is not ideal, at least compared to Sony they are working it. Talking about game preservation, Sony is the worst by far.

I'd argue Nintendo is worse for the reasons I listed above. They both suck though.

Isn't number 1 based on rumours and speculation? Sony Japan Studio hasn't been shut down and just released Astros Playroom and helped develop Demon's Souls, two of the most critically acclaimed next gen games.

Sure they are not as huge as their were before, but it seems a little early to get depressed about their situation.

They aren't dead, no, but we aren't getting almost anything out of them. I am happy Astro and Demon's Souls happened, but with all the other games I listed, we aren't getting anything like that for the most part.

The only real way to preserve the games of the past is through emulation. Completely digital is the way to go if you're trying to preserve data in perpetuity. All those game discs in cases on your shelf will eventually corrode even if it's not within your life time.

The issue is that if it goes for emulation eventually, having a disk based copy will let you dump it, where as a digital copy might be much harder. Also, I hope you have space on your hard drive to have copies of every game you'll ever want to preserve, because you never know when a game might randomly be delisted.

Phew you scared me with that line, I thought they had stepped in to remove Retroarch.

I think you're overthinking many of these points, doesn't seem worth getting depressed over. But then again I'm feeling depressed over not getting to play as a hero in AC Valhalla, the invasion angle is really not my cup of tea, feels like shit tbh, but I bought the $120 Ultimate version... Sigh.

*hugs*

There are always things worth and not worth getting depressed over, but that's life I suppose. If you've not played it, try out Ghost of Tsushima, I hear it's sorta AC-like.

You're forgetting slave labour. TBH, everything else pales in comparison to how our toys get made.

Man. Yeah... I wish there was _some way_ to get away from that. :(
 

Deleted member 17184

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Oct 27, 2017
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Backwards compatibility is a form of preservation. Better in fact. The important thing is that the game/experience is preserved. That's it. BC is a great way of doing that. Better even, since old hardware eventually fades away and breaks and stuff. Being able to preserve things into the future on newer hardware is great. Because eventually that will reach a ceiling too, but it will last much longer all told, and the hope is that the newest line of whatever can run it, will do so flawlessly, without relying on something else.

Sort of like, I can play a lot of original xbox games on my xbox 360. Imagine if servers for the 360 go down, and the 360 had something in place that meant you had to connect to servers to play them. That would suck. You'd have to go back to an original xbox, fewer of which exist, certainly in as good condition, and which wouldn't run the game as well (ignoring emulation issues for the time being).

Heck, kind of already exists with any Games for Windows Lives games that still exist. You can't download the DLC for them any more. So even though their BC, the way they worked meant that BC could only do so much. The servers are down, even though my computer could still run the games just fine.

Part of preservation in games is how it needs to also come with accessibility too. It's not just enough to want to preserve something. You want to increase how many people can access it too. The two are interlinked. Backwards compatibility is a great way of preserving games for this reason as well. It means more people can play them.

Microsoft's solution with the series X doesn't decimate any of this. But it does go counter to it in a really needless way. There's no reason the game couldn't run how it originally does on xbox one, and then if it connects to the server, then download the config file, and do whatever enhancements it can do.

I honestly don't know why you'd think preservation has to mean original hardware. That's a subset of preservation. But when people talk about game preservation, they mean...preserving the game. And the game is in the playing of it.



The issue isn't just that non open world games don't exist, but that games that probably would have benefitted from being tighter and smaller are instead big open worlds, when it doesn't really make them better and in some cases just makes it worse.
I've explained myself in previous posts, but essentially, I think Sony and Nintendo have done far worse, but the scary part for me is more that MS being the shining example is actually making the 'you don't even own your BC games' in the long term, palatable, and that makes me sad. Sony completely screwed up their BC on the PS4, and looks to be continuing it on the PS5, where Nintendo just doesn't even care anymore.



Yeah, total head scratcher, I hate that I have to keep my PS2 and PS3 hooked up just to play those old games, terrible.



I'd love to change my opinion, give me a reason to feel upbeat on a day I don't feel upbeat!




I'd love to think this, but with MS reiterating that they are going to continue to buy, I feel like companies, even outside of the obvious Sony or Nintendo, could potentially try to buy stuff so they aren't stuck in the dark. Companies like Google, Amazon or Apple might snatch up a developer or publisher, and I can't imagine that would make most people happy.




Being able to continue to play old games is a way to preserve them. Eventually all the old hardware will cease to function, and we'll be left with emulation. In the current times, this is sort of the only solution I can see, but in 10-20 years, if/when MS shuts down the Series S/X download servers, because they are ancient machines, we'll be left with machines that can't even play the games the technically should be able to.




Some of them for sure, I do admit that the "everything was open world" was hyperbolic. I talked about it in one of my other posts, but basically, I should have mentioned that when it comes to new games that aren't in ancient series (DOOM, Crash Bandicoot), and aren't remakes/remasters, the amount of story heavy games linear higher budget games is pretty low this year.




Sure, but as time marches on, the keeping all the old hardware working, as well as all the accessories you need (Imagine when all the PS1s start dying, trying to find a PS1, memory card and controller, all that still work.) when you can natively play it on a new system, it continues to keep it "preserved". For the moment, I can still use my PS3 to play PS1 games, which is a godsend, but the PS4 can't play them, nor can the PS5.




I guess for me, I would consider MTX stuff like aesthetics, early unlocks or premium currency. God of War is a great example of a game that didn't indulge in that at all. Props to SSM.




Oh yeah, Sony is terrible, but I would put Nintendo as worse. They basically started from square 1 with the Switch, and haven't commented on wether they plan to keep things BC going forwards. With the way the DSi, 3DS, Wii, Wii-U and now Switch have gone though, likely, you'll just have to rebuy which games they decide to port. It really sucks. Sony on the other hand had a reason for not having PS3 BC, but besides just not caring, never had a reason not to have PS1/2 BC, it's frustrating.




It's not even that I am just invested in AAA. I am invested in most styles of games. I own apparently over 500 games for the PS4, maybe 100-120 of those are AAA? I just like trying all sorts of games, and I end up liking what I like. I mentioned it before, but Night in the Woods is one of my favorite games of all time.
I'm on mobile, so sorry for not separating into proper quotes, but I wanted to answer to both of you.

BC is absolutely a form of preservation. But we're talking about two different ideas here. We lost many games for various reasons. Hell, we can't even say what was the actual release date of the first Mario game. OP, you say you're a "preservationist," so I'm sure you're well aware that it's a very difficult thing to do, and not just in the games industry.

A few years ago, I went to an exposition showing games of all eras, all playing in their original devices. While you can certainly play Monkey Island on a modern PC today, it was a fantastic experience to play with those controls.

Preservation is hard. In the "20 years in the future" scenario, it's possible to preserve these games by copying the downloaded files into an external drive. Things break, sure. But just like that exposition found a way to get all those games running, I'm sure you can find a way, too.

As for other studios buying Bethesda, we're talking about 7 billion dollars here. Maybe Epic could buy them if they wanted. But most other companies can't afford that much. Sometimes the choice is either a big one like Microsoft or the company shutting down. Which one would you prefer?

AAA linear games aren't coming out as frequently as we want them to, I agree. But again, lots of interesting stories are coming from other places. AA, indie, even mobile that I know you're not looking at. And the best part of that is how you can look at these different places and see more diverse stories. You seem open to play games outside of AAA, and I think you'll find a lot of what you're looking for there.
 

Undrey

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,648
Agreed with most of these but especially the 3D platformer bit. Think I've been saying the exact same thing for a while. While I love the games that have come out in the genre, I don't know if anything will reach the highs that were reached a few generations ago.
 
OP
OP
Jon God

Jon God

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,295
BC is absolutely a form of preservation. But we're talking about two different ideas here. We lost many games for various reasons. Hell, we can't even say what was the actual release date of the first Mario game. OP, you say you're a "preservationist," so I'm sure you're well aware that it's a very difficult thing to do, and not just in the games industry.

It's totally borderline impossible, but it doesn't stop me from doing everything I can. I've personally revived at least 2 games lost to time. In the grand scheme of things that's a grain of sand in the ocean, but it's the best I can do.

A few years ago, I went to an exposition showing games of all eras, all playing in their original devices. While you can certainly play Monkey Island on a modern PC today, it was a fantastic experience to play with those controls.

While true, I'd rather have 'playable on not original hardware' over 'not playable'. I love the original Dark Castle games from black and white Macs from the 80s, but I no longer have a working 80s Mac to play them, so I can just play them through Mini vMac, an emulator, it's not 100% the same, but it's close enough for me to reexperience it. Without that, I'd just have to thinking about my times playing them back then.

Preservation is hard. In the "20 years in the future" scenario, it's possible to preserve these games by copying the downloaded files into an external drive. Things break, sure. But just like that exposition found a way to get all those games running, I'm sure you can find a way, too.

I wish there was a way to backup OG Xbox DLC onto the Xbox One. Being able to play Battlefront 1/2 at a higher resolution is great, but I still end up playing them on my OG Xbox due to having like twice as many maps.

Maybe someday, we'll find a way that makes sense to the bigger game companies to persevere their legacy... but alas...


As for other studios buying Bethesda, we're talking about 7 billion dollars here. Maybe Epic could buy them if they wanted. But most other companies can't afford that much. Sometimes the choice is either a big one like Microsoft or the company shutting down. Which one would you prefer?

Was it ever confirmed they were on the verge of shutting down, or was that the rumor on the street? I'd prefer them to stay alive, but I am not sure that's what happened here.


AAA linear games aren't coming out as frequently as we want them to, I agree. But again, lots of interesting stories are coming from other places. AA, indie, even mobile that I know you're not looking at. And the best part of that is how you can look at these different places and see more diverse stories. You seem open to play games outside of AAA, and I think you'll find a lot of what you're looking for there.

I mentioned it before that I apparently own between 500-600 PS4 games, and tops, 100-120 of those are AAA games. I absolutely look in different places for stories, games and gaps to fill.
 

Deleted member 17184

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It's totally borderline impossible, but it doesn't stop me from doing everything I can. I've personally revived at least 2 games lost to time. In the grand scheme of things that's a grain of sand in the ocean, but it's the best I can do.



While true, I'd rather have 'playable on not original hardware' over 'not playable'. I love the original Dark Castle games from black and white Macs from the 80s, but I no longer have a working 80s Mac to play them, so I can just play them through Mini vMac, an emulator, it's not 100% the same, but it's close enough for me to reexperience it. Without that, I'd just have to thinking about my times playing them back then.



I wish there was a way to backup OG Xbox DLC onto the Xbox One. Being able to play Battlefront 1/2 at a higher resolution is great, but I still end up playing them on my OG Xbox due to having like twice as many maps.

Maybe someday, we'll find a way that makes sense to the bigger game companies to persevere their legacy... but alas...




Was it ever confirmed they were on the verge of shutting down, or was that the rumor on the street? I'd prefer them to stay alive, but I am not sure that's what happened here.




I mentioned it before that I apparently own between 500-600 PS4 games, and tops, 100-120 of those are AAA games. I absolutely look in different places for stories, games and gaps to fill.
Oh, don't get me wrong, I'm all for preservation. I just don't think it's as bad as you initially wrote. There are a few things that need to be better, for sure.

As for Bethesda, I don't think they were on the verge of shutting down, but there was a writing on the wall. Out of their last new projects after the first Dishonored, only Fallout 4, TESO, DOOM, and DOOM Eternal were successful commercially. Maybe Fallout 76 as well, not sure. But suddenly you have all these great studios making great games giving nothing but losses. If Microsoft can provide them the stability they need to create these games without worrying about the financial part, I'm all up for it.
 

Zweisy1

Member
Oct 30, 2017
561
Well, Nintendo never really has been a developer that really does anything story first outside of a few notable exceptions such as the Detective Club games..
They havent really changed much in that regard I dont think, but I can totally understand If the current output of Nintendo doesnt appeal to someone.
They do have things like the Monolith Soft RPGs or Fire Emblem that are a lot more story heavy however.

I must say I do look forward to Psychonauts 2 as well, was refreshing to have a platformer with actually good writing and interesting characters.
 

calibos

Member
Dec 13, 2017
2,006
MS is anti preservation and Halo is dead? Did I wake up in some alternate reality?

I am enjoying gaming more than ever at 46 years old as a lifetime gamer.

OP, I just can't relate to the above...it's crazy talk.
 

thelongestj

Member
Oct 27, 2017
979
I think the issue is that I like a complicated mixture of games, from low budget to high budget. When I only play smaller indie-y games, I end up wanting to play something more bombastic and larger scale, and when I just play those, I end up pining for smaller experiences,

It's easy to just say "ignore the larger publishers" but it would also greatly reduce styles of games I would be playing. I'd honestly probably end up playing more older games than more indie games, because I am looking for that balance.

Also, yes, watching LucasArts kill itself over like 15 years was pretty depressing.

I should have said ignore the larger publishers' current and upcoming titles, but embrace their older titles. Almost all of the games I bought a PS3 for have since released on PC and sometimes even DRM-Free. Even Sony is starting to come around and just released Horizon Zero Dawn DRM-Free on PC after only three years so now there's actually hope that we'll be getting more of their games on PC in the future. It sucks that Microsoft and Sega still embrace DRM so strongly, but it is at least in the realm of possibility that we'll be getting their older games DRM-Free in the next few years. Nintendo is a lost cause, but there's always emulation.

Surely you have a lifetime's worth of older games that you've never tried that can be picked up easily now for cheap or even free.

I also think spending time on Resetera is part of the problem. I took a break from here last month and my gaming enthusiasm increased immediately. Maybe the patientgamers subreddit is a more appropriate place.
 

garion333

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,722
The industry is so large now that I think it's super easy to feel terrible about it.

But there's gaming going on for everyone now, it's a matter of finding those games and devs and supporting them.

The past is in the past, things will never be the same again as things continue to evolve. 2020 has slowed games releases and maximized negative feelings in a lot of folks, so take care, relax and hope for the best. You can find where you belong in the hobby again.
 

EggmaniMN

Banned
May 17, 2020
3,465
Maybe stop reading reddit looking for more voices to reinforce negativity and instead enjoy what does exist. Honestly I didn't think this year was anything negative as far as actual game releases went.
 

Deleted member 6056

Oct 25, 2017
7,240
Sounds like OP golden era was the 3d platformer into the dawn of fps dominance years. So...n64 to 360or a little before.

Yup. The focus shifted, the budgets bloated and the middle tier disappeared. You were either AAA or straight to bargain bin so it meant to stay solvent with rising costs less risks were taken and more of the same was made. I cant blame folks for doing what they gotta to stay afloat but it lead to a slow 15 year death of quirky heart filled games and as multiplayer and dlc caught on i. Open 3d worlds it lead to a loss of designs being based upon singular scripted moments and more about large setpiece interactions leading to a few moments.

I feel ya op. It changed a ton and the focuswd visionary feel new titles used to have thinned. Thanks to steam originally popularizing online game marketplaces though and the rise of eshops though we now have markets that allow more individual developers and small teams than ever to come forward. It took years but it finally got big enough to help the industry reclaim many genres. 3d platforming and the like are still rare from indies but they are finally emerging in response to the market gap. A hat in time was stellar and pumpkin jacks recent jak and daxter like new game are signs the indies may be about to try to bring back some of what you miss.

The dlc, season pass and bc phase outs are not something I have any encouraging things to say to you. They wont end the first 2 models keep companies solvent the easiest and build franchises. The last is an issue of software emulation and dedicated manhours costs vs profit potential. Its not cheap so only select things will get official bc stuff. At least the ps2p is a handheld using a modded ps2 and not emulation to allow you to play ps2 portably because other than console mods like that yiur pretty much down to fan emulation for things of the past.

Its not all bad op. But yeah...when you stop being the main demographic thats catered to in tastes it sucks hard. If it wasnt for indies and a few select genres id be bout done.
 

Deleted member 17207

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I find it so strange how tons of people are unimpressed with Switch and it's lineup when it's probably my favourite console ever lol.

I have too many games on it that I want to get to, I can't fathom thinking the lineup is underwhelming.

To each their own.
 
OP
OP
Jon God

Jon God

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Oct 28, 2017
2,295
MS is anti preservation and Halo is dead? Did I wake up in some alternate reality?

I am enjoying gaming more than ever at 46 years old as a lifetime gamer.

OP, I just can't relate to the above...it's crazy talk.

I explained myself and my feelings on the matter, it's totally fine if you don't agree, but this is a sort of a poor driveway post.

I should have said ignore the larger publishers' current and upcoming titles, but embrace their older titles. Almost all of the games I bought a PS3 for have since released on PC and sometimes even DRM-Free. Even Sony is starting to come around and just released Horizon Zero Dawn DRM-Free on PC after only three years so now there's actually hope that we'll be getting more of their games on PC in the future. It sucks that Microsoft and Sega still embrace DRM so strongly, but it is at least in the realm of possibility that we'll be getting their older games DRM-Free in the next few years. Nintendo is a lost cause, but there's always emulation.

Surely you have a lifetime's worth of older games that you've never tried that can be picked up easily now for cheap or even free.

I also think spending time on Resetera is part of the problem. I took a break from here last month and my gaming enthusiasm increased immediately. Maybe the patientgamers subreddit is a more appropriate place.

It's hard for me to play games on the computer these days. I work at the computer most of the time, so when I want to relax, I have to step away from my computer. When I am at my computer, my brain goes into work mode.

I also lived through the 90s, where you could pretty much guarantee every few years, when the next system hit, a % of your games would just no longer function, and from then I moved over to playing more on console, and found it more my speed. I own loads of games on PC, but mostly just to support developers, since I don't think I've put more than 2-4 hours into a game on the PC (Outside of the ones I've professionally worked on) in probably 10 years.


Maybe stop reading reddit looking for more voices to reinforce negativity and instead enjoy what does exist. Honestly I didn't think this year was anything negative as far as actual game releases went.

I don't visit Reddit, it's too toxic there, no reason to even start visiting any communities there.


I find it so strange how tons of people are unimpressed with Switch and it's lineup when it's probably my favourite console ever lol.

I have too many games on it that I want to get to, I can't fathom thinking the lineup is underwhelming.

To each their own.

I am glad you are enjoying it mate! I, in no way, mean to shoot down anyone who doesn't feel the same as me.
 

Deleted member 17207

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I explained myself and my feelings on the matter, it's totally fine if you don't agree, but this is a sort of a poor driveway post.



It's hard for me to play games on the computer these days. I work at the computer most of the time, so when I want to relax, I have to step away from my computer. When I am at my computer, my brain goes into work mode.

I also lived through the 90s, where you could pretty much guarantee every few years, when the next system hit, a % of your games would just no longer function, and from then I moved over to playing more on console, and found it more my speed. I own loads of games on PC, but mostly just to support developers, since I don't think I've put more than 2-4 hours into a game on the PC (Outside of the ones I've professionally worked on) in probably 10 years.




I don't visit Reddit, it's too toxic there, no reason to even start visiting any communities there.




I am glad you are enjoying it mate! I, in no way, mean to shoot down anyone who doesn't feel the same as me.
No no that's fair - I just genuinely find it crazy that there can be such difference in opinion about it, but fair enough.
 

Z-Beat

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,853
It depresses me when a cool game gets announced then higher ups in the company turn out to be pieces of shit or they get bought out by some sketch-ass pieces of shit or their employees get crunched into oblivion over something I would've been fine having a delay but they couldn't because angry fans/stockholders said that has to be out before the end of the quarter

Also when companies see another company's successful model and go "let's do that" and don't understand why it's successful or that people can't divide their time between the two
 
Oct 20, 2018
1,281
Brazil
I haven't been "feeling" Nintendo's Switch output honestly. As a console I like it a lot, but there's just too many Wii U ports (which I already played most of them on Wii U and the ones I'd actually buy again, aka Zelda remasters still aren't a thing), plus I didn't like BotW and Odyssey was good but I felt it went too much for quantity before quality and became very repetitive as a result. Animal Crossing and Smash Bros are probably the best things they've put out on the Switch so far. But yeah, when my favorite game on the Switch so far has been a third-party game (Dragon Quest XI S) instead of a Nintendo one, you know there's something wrong here.

Honestly I could really use a new Mario Kart right now. Or Bayonetta 3, maybe a new "Wii" Sports, anything. I just feel really uninterested in what they've been putting out recently and it saddens me. Ever since Iwata passed away I feel something changed over there, can't put my finger on it but it just feels like Nintendo has been less "playful" if that makes sense. I know I'm just being weird but yeah.
 

EggmaniMN

Banned
May 17, 2020
3,465
I don't visit Reddit, it's too toxic there, no reason to even start visiting any communities there.

I mean, by the sound of things, in that case, you're the one with the negativity issue. I don't know what to tell you. But this place is typically barely better than reddit on negativity.
 
OP
OP
Jon God

Jon God

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,295
No no that's fair - I just genuinely find it crazy that there can be such difference in opinion about it, but fair enough.

For sure, you understand where I am coming from, at least?

I mean, by the sound of things, in that case, you're the one with the negativity issue. I don't know what to tell you. But this place is typically barely better than reddit on negativity.

Naw, the issue with Reddit is that, at least in gaming communities, has always appeared to be a collection of echo chambers. As someone who doesn't like a lot of the more popular games, because they aren't really my taste (Not all mind you), having people dunk or shit on your opinion and often not even come back to discuss it leads to drive by replies, and generally not real conversation. I guess I could liken it a bit to YouTube comments. There are people that are fine with that, but for me, if I am going to talk with people, I'd rather they be willing to understand where I am coming from, and have me give that in return.
 

Lord Fanny

Banned
Apr 25, 2020
25,953
Isn't number 1 based on rumours and speculation? Sony Japan Studio hasn't been shut down and just released Astros Playroom and helped develop Demon's Souls, two of the most critically acclaimed next gen games.

I mean, Astro's Playroom is a fun little tech demo that is carried by its nostalgia and gimmicks, but little more, and they were on Demon's Souls in some capacity but it's not really clear how much they were involved, if it was a true co-development or if they were a glorified support studio. Besides that, the last major titles they did were Gravity Rush 2 and Rescue Mission, which a lot like but they clearly were not big projects.

Putting aside the "rumors," it's not that hard to see where the OP is coming from. You can try and stretch their recent output but they definitely aren't much in Sony's grand scheme anymore