Remember when Borderlands 2 ran like ass on anything that wasn't Nvidia because of Physx?
Glad AMD are slinging back.
Devs don't need to implement things for each specific brand. Battlefield V got it's RT patch in 2018 (partnering with Nvidia), even before RDNA1 cards was out, let alone RDNA2. And yet it works just fine with RT on new AMD cards. So, it's not even a toggle, unless devs specifically want to implement some vendor-exclusive feature (DXR is not), the game just talks to OS via generic API calls. That's the whole point of DirectX/OpenGL/Vulkan/etc.A lot of people here seem to believe it's a simple toggle to implement this for both gpu-brands. Maybe it's a bit more complicated than this hence why amd will get it first since it's sponsored and nvidia later. Really don't see the problem here.
They don't need to enable any amd specific options. AMD will use the same options as nvidia with DXR.Yall are misunderstanding what im saying. CDPR is at a state where their engine is using the RT tech with nvidia drivers to the level they need and not the AMD ones. They aren't stopping AMD, they just aren't ready yet. The option will be there when they finish the work of incorporating the support in their engine.
Cyberpunk is doing the same thing in reverse, can't blame AMD.
Yall are misunderstanding what im saying. CDPR is at a state where their engine is using the RT tech with nvidia drivers to the level they need and not the AMD ones. They aren't stopping AMD, they just aren't ready yet. The option will be there when they finish the work of incorporating the support in their engine.
They don't need to enable any amd specific options. AMD will use the same options as nvidia with DXR.
DXR is specifically made to be a vendor independent API that can be used by both manufacturers.
not having an option to enable particular thing vs being able to enable while having lower performance . Is there a difference?Remember when Borderlands 2 ran like ass on anything that wasn't Nvidia because of Physx?
Glad AMD are slinging back.
The ones released today?
Same reason it wasn't released on Xbox.As far as I know, this is an Unreal Engine game so unless they put their own RT code in I don't see any reason why Nvidia RTX would be disabled other than for marketing reasons
Yall are misunderstanding what im saying. CDPR is at a state where their engine is using the RT tech with nvidia drivers to the level they need and not the AMD ones. They aren't stopping AMD, they just aren't ready yet. The option will be there when they finish the work of incorporating the support in their engine.
I know why it's confusing - because Nvidia wants you to think it's proprietary technology, but it's not.
Engine support is already there.
RTX is AMD raytracing and AMD raytracing is RTX.
Both are DXR, there's no difference other than Nvidia calls it RTX for marketing reasons.
I know why it's confusing - because Nvidia wants you to think it's proprietary technology, but it's not.
As of press time, some of my favorite DirectX Ray Tracing (DXR) games to test simply do not work with RDNA 2 GPUs, perhaps due to those games rejecting any GPU IDs outside of Nvidia's list. I look forward to testing and comparing some of those games in the future, since Shadow of the Tomb Raider leverages a hearty ray-traced shadow pipeline, while Quake II RTX leans on ray tracing for its very handsome, and very demanding, global illumination model.
Then it should work on Nvidia cards too, unless it can't. The game is out, though the update probably isn't, only time will tell. Similar to freesync, I like when AMD stuff isn't locked since I currently have a Nvidia card, and I avoided G-Sync monitors since it would lock me into their ecosystem, removing my options.To be fair nvidias hardware implementation of RT uses specialised hardware (RT cores) and that's the reasoning behind the RTX label.. along with the tensor cores..
AMD does not use any specific different hardware to what it uses for raster graphics..
The API in DX12 DXR allows it work on all the hardware regardless.
I think that's why people tend to think Nvidia has some secret exclusive RT sauce... In some respects they do, but the marketing makes people believe that it's not vendor agnostic, when it is.
That's the theory, though it wouldn't be a first time with new, fundamental feature to have issues between vendors at beginning. Even without RT on DX/GL/Vk there are sometimes differences between drivers, for example performance might vary wildly or some tiny details might be handled differently hiding (application) bugs in renderer that other vendor's driver exposes. Modern APIs have better tools to deal with such issues but they are still possible.Devs don't need to implement things for each specific brand. Battlefield V got it's RT patch in 2018 (partnering with Nvidia), even before RDNA1 cards was out, let alone RDNA2. And yet it works just fine with RT on new AMD cards. So, it's not even a toggle, unless devs specifically want to implement some vendor-exclusive feature (DXR is not), the game just talks to OS via generic API calls. That's the whole point of DirectX/OpenGL/Vulkan/etc.
Q2 RTX doesn't use DXR, though. Along with Wolf2, it uses Nvidia's exclusive Vulkan RT extension. It had to, since at the time Vulkan didn't have it's own global RT extension.re ray tracing exclusivity on vendors' cards:
more at my RX 6800/6800XT review:
AMD Radeon RX 6800, 6800XT review: The 1440p GPU beasts you’ve been craving
Equivalent Nvidia GPUs beaten in significant cases—but not in ray tracing.arstechnica.com
I know which is why i asked why AMD doesn't enable DXR support for cyberpunk.
They could use the same API as Nvidia if they enabled it
The thing is, if anything they've had RT capable Nvidia GPUs in their hands for literal YEARS longer than they have AMD's. Don't tell me they've never touched a Turing GPU.A lot of people here seem to believe it's a simple toggle to implement this for both gpu-brands. Maybe it's a bit more complicated than this hence why amd will get it first since it's sponsored and nvidia later. Really don't see the problem here.
The game ships with an AMD RT. DLL I velive, so I think Godfall may end up using a different Version of RT shadows than the Standard UE4 ones.As far as I know, this is an Unreal Engine game so unless they put their own RT code in I don't see any reason why Nvidia RTX would be disabled other than for marketing reasons
This is not true..I am saying that CDPR is the one going forward implementing the nvidia path
Technically incorrect, they did use their own VKRay solution for Q2RTX and Youngblood. And I know about at least one game where the developer can't enable RT on any h/w but NV's for some period of time. So they are, again, equal here. AMD isn't "open", NV isn't "evil". Both are commercial companies selling their products however they can.Wow. So much for AMD being the "open" one. For comparison, Nvidia didn't do this *at all* with RT. For DX12 nvidia is using DXR, which is open, and for Vulkan the VK_NV_Raytrace extension is open for all to implement. AFAIK no games have a vendor lock towards Nvidia for RT.
Technically incorrect, they did use their own VKRay solution for Q2RTX and Youngblood. And I know about at least one game where the developer can't enable RT on any h/w but NV's for some period of time. So they are, again, equal here. AMD isn't "open", NV isn't "evil". Both are commercial companies selling their products however they can.
It performs badly because it uses a ton of tesselation, which NVIDIA GPUs are very good at, and AMD GPUs have traditionally been much weaker at.You can enable it, but it runs like shit because Nvidia refuse to share the code to allow AMD to tailor drivers for it. AMD had always been pro open source, and Nvidia against it. Seems like AMD are finally giving up on winning karma points.
I'm not sure if it fully caught up but Vega and then Navi both greatly improved AMD's geometry performance. I don't think that's a hugely relevant weak point for them anymore, now it's RT and ML (DLSS).It performs badly because it uses a ton of tesselation, which NVIDIA GPUs are very good at, and AMD GPUs have traditionally been much weaker at.
AMD's solution to this was a driver hack that forced tesselation to run at lower iterations than specified by the games, which often produced very bad results.
I don't know if that is still the case with their latest hardware.
That's what I thought, but that's the entirety of the "gameworks kills AMD performance" thing.I'm not sure if it fully caught up but Vega and then Navi both greatly improved AMD's geometry performance. I don't think that's a hugely relevant weak point for them anymore, now it's RT and ML (DLSS).
nVidia do this all the time, why is it a surprise AMD is doing it? Timed exclusives have been a thing in the game industry for a very long time.
aside from PhysX, all of their stuff was made inhousenVidia do this all the time, why is it a surprise AMD is doing it? Timed exclusives have been a thing in the game industry for a very long time.
also, Godfall might just have RT Shadows for character models? or might have some additional screen space rt shadowing going on
probably for performance reasons? or possibly because RT was such a late addition they couldn't add much else. the lack of RT reflections is weird given how much shiny shit is in the gameThat is big oofff... for title that has been pushed pretty hard as RT game to play with newest AMD dGPUs.
Is it to save performance or just developer not being good with implementation?
probably for performance reasons? or possibly because RT was such a late addition they couldn't add much else. the lack of RT reflections is weird given how much shiny shit is in the game
Reflections with this amount of reflective surfaces would be something else for AMD and NV cards :D
You see the first AMD RT demo video thing? they are up to the task of making mirror world.
I remember it looking really bad and reflections being low-res.
Maybe I remember wrong 🤔
The reflections, from a technical point, seemed fine. But everything else about the demo looked disgusting so you're right about it looking really bad.I remember it looking really bad and reflections being low-res.
Maybe I remember wrong 🤔
VK_NV_ray_tracing is NV's proprietary Vulkan extension which served as a basis for Vulkan's generic VK_KHR_raytracing.Not sure about your unnamed game you know of, but VK_NV_Raytracing is what both Q2 RTX and Youngblood use. This is a standard Vulkan extension that any vendor is free to implement. It is common for vendors to implement other's extensions in Khronos API's - the vendor tag just signifies who created it initially for extensions too new or rare to be added to the API proper.
Cause they aren't cheap when done in full. And RT which isn't cheap is not something which AMD will be pushing into their games.Shadows are considered one of the cheapest effects to RT, but why to even do that partially?
I disagree with your terminology. Proprietary usually indicates some kind of special secret sauce or lock in to the vendor. The Vulkan extension has no such thing and it is in fact common practice for one vendor to implement another's extension in Khronos APIs.VK_NV_ray_tracing is NV's proprietary Vulkan extension which served as a basis for Vulkan's generic VK_KHR_raytracing.
They are very close obviously and one could relatively easily support the former if there's already support for the latter.
But it's not "standard Vulkan extension".
Whether this is even relevant is another question though since there were no KHR extension back with NV launched their first RT h/w.
right? then it turned out Godfall maxes out at 8600MB VRAM at 4K. That was the weakest cheap shot marketing i ever seen. Besides stating they have more cards than nVidia and ending up having even lesser amounts on release...RT EXCLUSIVE LAUNCH ! Between this and the "VRAM 4K" necessities, it's been pure hilarity.
So I got some bad news for ya:It absolutely isn't. The RT capabilities in the game is vendor agnostic, using DXR.
Performance will be dependant on hardware
Like it's absolutely in the same boat as Godfall re: DXR implementation being bizarrely restricted to one vendor on launch.Google Translate of this said:When asked by the editors whether Cyberpunk 2077 will only offer raytracing on Nvidia GeForce RTX, CD Projekt said no and made the following statement:
Accordingly, ray tracing will be reserved for the GeForce RTX systems for publication. Ray tracing on AMD Radeon RX 6000 will be available later.We are working with AMD to integrate ray tracing options for their graphics cards as quickly as possible. This will not be the case when the game launches.
CD project
So I got some bad news for ya:
Like it's absolutely in the same boat as Godfall re: DXR implementation being bizarrely restricted to one vendor on launch.