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Deleted member 4518

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,278
I understand people being upset by the game price increases. The increase in prices this generation sucks as a consumer, but I also don't get why people find it impossible to just wait a bit? Most games drop in price 4-6 months after they're released and end up being more affordable (there's definitely special cases — i.e. Nintendo).

Even though for me personally — paying $89.99 CAD for a game isn't really difficult — I usually wait because 1) I have a lot to play as it is (and games go on sale all the time) and 2) the game will probably have a sale a few months later.
 

JJD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,506
I also feel like Sony is pretty good managing their sales expectations like they seem satisfied with Demon's remake but it fell of the charts super quickly.
 

Phendrift

Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,301
have you played it? the DeS remake is much more than a visual upgrade, bit disingenuous to describe it as such. not defending the pricepoint, think I got a copy for £60 but it's sublime and I've got 200 hours playtime so I can't complain.
I haven't played it, but going by ERA it seems like there wasn't any content? Like there was even cut from the original that people were hoping was in this and wasn't? What new stuff is there?
 

Pagoto93

Banned
Nov 3, 2017
776
Sony need to be more flexible with their pricing. Ok they might get away with £70 for flagship releases like Horizon and God of War but it's a death sentence for games like Returnal.

Did the Nioh Collection even chart in the UK? That was another ridiculous £70.
 

KingK

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,856
Eh, personally the $70 price tag doesn't bother me much. Playstation games go on sale pretty early and frequently. I already barely ever bought a game for $60 - maybe 1 or 3 times in a year. The vast majority of my game library was purchased on a discount.

I'm buying Ratchet for $70 because it's one of my favorite series. Returnal I might get at that price as well if it reviews well, because Hades has gotten me really excited for it. If you don't want to pay that price but still want the games, I'm pretty confident you'll be able to find both for much cheaper later in the year. Imo, it's not a huge deal unless you have FOMO and buy games at launch all the time.

Edit: I will say the EU pricing is bullshit though. Us Americans are spoiled in comparison.
I think far too many people are stuck in the mindset of "full-price or bomba". The reality is that games have much longer sales tails than they've ever had thanks to PS Store. So while I don't really agree with the £70 price point of Returnal, I have to imagine there are smart people at Sony who know X number of people will buy it at £70, but Y number of people will buy it at £50, and so on.

Surely they plan the game's sales trajectory around multiple promotional points now, rather than look at it as, "Oh it bombed at £70, so now we have to panic price drop." I'm sure they have a rough idea of when they're going to discount the price, how much they're going to discount it by, and what they expect the sales to look like at each stage.
Exactly. Gaming on Playstation felt cheaper than ever the last few years with how frequently everything goes on sale or permanent discount. My backlog is massive because of how many I've been able to pick up for $10-$30.

OTOH, I'm much less fond of Nintendo's pricing strategy for that reason. I rarely want to pay more than $30 for a game unless I know I'll love it, so Nintendo's strategy of never pricing below $50-$60 has really limited the number of Switch games I've bought. Tons of first party Switch games I'd snag at $20-$30, but will never buy because of this.
 

Pankratous

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,257
Skyward Sword is the worst offender by far, it's an absolute rip off. The problem is compounded by the fact that it'll take a very long time to go down in price.

Returnal/Ratchet are less of a problem when you consider that you can wait a month or two and get a sizable chunk off the price.
 

Min

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,073
I don't see how that is relevant at all? People spend money for new things? And?

And then that new thing depreciates by 50% 2 weeks later. How is this not relevant? The entire thread is about the value proposition of video games. Part of determining value is a product's retention of value, e.g. Nintendo's games.
 
Oct 26, 2017
6,261
I haven't played it, but going by ERA it seems like there wasn't any content? Like there was even cut from the original that people were hoping was in this and wasn't? What new stuff is there?

a lot of people got their hopes up (me included) that the missing content from the original would be in there, it's not. but in terms of differences from the original - 60fps, the loading, new sounds and their associated dualsense stuff are all amazing and instant gameplay improvements. then there's better online and QoL stuff, even visually was more than a reskin, e.g. animations and environments were entirely new. as far as remakes go it's the new gold standard.
 
Oct 26, 2017
9,827
The trilogy was 'only' a visual remake with identical gameplay, enemie behaviour etc to the originals with a few QoL additions. I don't mean that as a slight against Vicarious, they were fantastic remakes what they tried to be.

Crash 4 is a completely new game, with so much stuff to do and things that never were in the previous games.

I'm not even a fan of Crash 4, I was even disappointed by it in the end. The scope of the game is still nothing else but a brand new, full game game though. Any other 3D platformer with that much polish and content should cost full price as well.
I'm not saying that it didn't do anything new or anything. Just that, on its surface, it looks like the remakes but more expensive and with only one game. I agree it's worth full price too, like any other new big budget 3D platformer, but, unfortunately, that's the perception they had to work with and it hurt them
 

RedDevil

Member
Dec 25, 2017
4,127
The immediate effect of price increase will be a drop in day-one sales, you can say goodbye to Sony gloating about how whatever new exclusive has sold record numbers in three days. Doesn't mean the games will sell less, but sales won't be as frontloaded.

What are the chances that really happen?

Skyward Sword being a "ripoff" at 60 dollars is a very interesting phenomenon. I didn't see people making these types of complaints with software like Pikmin 3, Mario Kart 8 or even Splatoon 2, which were mostly switch ports of WII U titles sold at full price. In other words, this is really just the first time the greater audience may have been asked to buy a game that they already own at the same market value.

I thought we had moved past the narrative that Splatoon 2 was a port. With Skyward Sword there's a lot of bias against the game so people are more vocal because the possibility that like many other ports it sells more than its original release is real, just like Mario Kart 8 Deluxe sold 5 what its original release did and Pikmin 3 Deluxe is the best selling entry of that series, hell if I recall correctly even Link's Awakening(also at $60) sold more than the previous releases in a few months.
 

Oddish1

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,820
I was watching someone stream recently and they made the great point that maybe part of the reason Crash 4 did not sell as well as the remakes is that the remakes cost $30 and had inadvertently primed an audience to expect a budget price for that series. Beyond just getting more money companies will put games at full price just to ensure that the series is continued to be perceived as valuable and worth that money. Nintendo puts a lot of effort into maintaining the value of their brands, particularly Mario and Zelda, and this is partly why they don't put their games on sale very often.
 

TheRaidenPT

Editor-in-Chief, Hyped Pixels
Verified
Jun 11, 2018
5,949
Lisbon, Portugal
As much excited as I am for Returnal, I'm gonna wait for a price drop. These are uncertain times, and honestly other than big games like Horizon I'm not really prepared to pay that price upfront for games
 

Sky87

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,865
Good to see articles bring this up. Games sell more and are more profitable than ever and the greed of these companies are reaching new heights. At least compensate by offering a service like Game Pass which almost feels like stealing in comparison.
 

fanboy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,452
Slovakia
70€ is already too expensive. 80€ is hilarious.
I mean, it's not a big issue for me. I'm simply not buying their stuff at launch anymore. Let a few of them flop, starting with Returnal, and maybe then Sony will reconsider it. Or maybe they're actively trying to push customers to subscription services, where you don't own shit anymore.
Vote with your wallet. As always.

Its sad to read this. "Yeah well let Housemarque's first aaa game flop really hard so other games can be cheaper".

I will gladly give them more money in exchange for the quality that only a few can deliver nowadays.

I think that Returnal will be fine if reviewd are going to end up great (80+). I would games around 90 of it wasnt their first aaa but I trust them to deliver.
 

CitrusScorpio

Member
Feb 18, 2021
167
I completely disagree about Ratchet. I think Ratchet is polished enough to warrant a full asking price. The bigger mainline entries have like 90 minutes of very well animated cinematics with expert art direction and mechanics.

I am interested to see how it performs at full price though- the last Ratchet game to be full price was All 4 One I think? I wonder if there's a stigma against non Nintendo platformers not being full price.

Writer is absolutely on the money about remasters though. I think to charge full price for a remaster there should be a lot of additional content. I don't know if the value proposition's there.

If 3D All Stars were not done by Nintendo, it would've been a from the ground up remake of all four and $40. Only Nintendo has the cache to charge that much.
 

poklane

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,932
the Netherlands
As much excited as I am for Returnal, I'm gonna wait for a price drop. These are uncertain times, and honestly other than big games like Horizon I'm not really prepared to pay that price upfront for games
Same. If I'm gonna pay €80 for a game I simply want a certain amount of hours in that game (30+ minimum) and I'm not sure if Returnal would provide that.
 

ty_hot

Banned
Dec 14, 2017
7,176
The article fails to mention that every month dozens of games are released at full price in all platforms... It talks about 70 and compares it with a 40 dollar game (RC PS4) that was a clear outliner...if.makes it sound like only Sony is releasing games at full price lol.

You can talk about raising prices from 60 to 70 with much better arguments. And as always the people complaining about game X not being worth 70 wouldn't buy it for 60 either way so I don't know what the hell they are thinking.
 

Dragonyeuw

Member
Nov 4, 2017
4,375
I do think there is a psychological barrier to $70 that will actually dissipate fairly quickly. Even though $69.99 seems pretty damn expensive, I don't know why I would be okay with $59.99 in 2008 when I made less than half as much than I do now but another $10 seems steep now. It's just inflation, plus I do value these first party titles pushing machines as far as they can.

If these games didn't already feature other forms of monetization the $10 increase may be more palatable. Then there's issue of a global pandemic causing mass un/under employment. Raising prices *right now* just seems kind of tone deaf. But really, it's the people who buy day/month zero who they're trying to squeeze a bit extra. Those who have the patience to wait till a game in their respective price range will continue to do so.

Me? I didnt buy a single game over $20 last gen. Bloodborne, Horizon and Spiderman GOTY were the most expensive at $20 a pop, but stuff like Uncharted 4, Last of Us Remaster, Until Dawn, God of War....these games were all purchased at like $10 or so on PSN after anywhere from a year to a year and a half post launch. When TLOU2 and Ghost of Tshima gets into that range I'll scoop them up too.
 

KingJ2002

Member
Feb 18, 2018
92
Los Angeles, CA
I get what the OP is saying. The price tag for gaming is coming into a space where its even more questionable when aligned with the content. For me, when it comes to video games, I always seek the discount price. There have been a ton of games with large marketing pushes but, I usually snap them up at a discount. Much of this reasoning is due to the rise of games as a service and I spend the majority of my gaming time on titles like Destiny where I pay for an expansion and I'm good for the year. With this i've accumulated quite the backlog, so titles like Ratchet & Clank, Returnal, and even launch games like Demon Souls won't be purchased until later this year or a sale comes along where the price is aligned with what I think the experience is worth after reviews, impressions, etc.
 

4859

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,046
In the weak and the wounded
Honestly, I dont really care about the prices. Time is my more valuable currency right now.

There are so many games to play, and at so many different prices. But so very very very few are worth my time.

Nintendo, typically, if it's one if their products that suits what I want to play, is a pretty good bet to be worth my time.

Lately though, that has not been the case. I didnt get a switch at launch, because I was burned by the Wii u. I cashed in nintendos good faith credit they built with me and got the system at launch. I have a very small library of games I like very much. I also have a ton of missing entries I typically saw on a nintendo console. The kind of entries that made getting nintendo system a good investment for me. But they didnt happen that time. Nintendo spent their good faith credit.

When I finally decided to get a switch, it was not because of nintendo games, but because of the excellent 3rd party library that had accumulated over the years, and were good enough ports for the purpose of portability. Which I have greatly enjoyed. I have exactly two Nintendo games on my switch profile. Mario O and FE3H. It just feels like after launch Nintendo started focusing on other parts of their very diverse demographic with games that dont interest me. Which is cool, not everything needs or should be targeted to my tastes, but it's been years. It just seems like nintendo does not have the workforce to serve their entire demographic in a reasonable amount of time. One area gets games, and while that's going on the others wait for years. Meanwhile it seems like they are trying to mitigate this by firing out outsourced ports of older games. I already played these games. I still play these games. Nothing they offered in genres I typically like has any value to me, because I already bought these games. Nintendo is literally sitting on a mcduck size moneyvault. They can invest in their studios. Hire some freaking people man.

I completely disagree about Ratchet. I think Ratchet is polished enough to warrant a full asking price. The bigger mainline entries have like 90 minutes of very well animated cinematics with expert art direction and mechanics.

I am interested to see how it performs at full price though- the last Ratchet game to be full price was All 4 One I think? I wonder if there's a stigma against non Nintendo platformers not being full price.

Writer is absolutely on the money about remasters though. I think to charge full price for a remaster there should be a lot of additional content. I don't know if the value proposition's there.

If 3D All Stars were not done by Nintendo, it would've been a from the ground up remake of all four and $40. Only Nintendo has the cache to charge that much.

This is what's going through my mind right now. Good faith credit.

The thing with that is, if you dont deliver a return on that good faith trust based investment, sooner or later that trust credit is going to be shot, and people wont simply buy systems and games uninformed because of the trust they have in the company based on good past experiences.
 

Bish_Bosch

Member
Apr 30, 2018
1,036
I mean obviously everyone's resources are different but even if Returnal is say 20 hours that's still comparable to seeing 20 or so hours of film in a cinema. I also find this idea that artistic worth is some ratio of dollars to hours of content which is becoming increasingly common throughout media to be pretty gross anyway. If its a good work of art who cares if its comparably priced to similar media.
 
Jan 11, 2018
9,653
I don't think I'm going to purchase a single game at 70$, nomatter what it is. I'll gladly wait for a price drop, rent, or checkout from the library.
 
Oct 28, 2017
925
I think far too many people are stuck in the mindset of "full-price or bomba". The reality is that games have much longer sales tails than they've ever had thanks to PS Store. So while I don't really agree with the £70 price point of Returnal, I have to imagine there are smart people at Sony who know X number of people will buy it at £70, but Y number of people will buy it at £50, and so on.

Surely they plan the game's sales trajectory around multiple promotional points now, rather than look at it as, "Oh it bombed at £70, so now we have to panic price drop." I'm sure they have a rough idea of when they're going to discount the price, how much they're going to discount it by, and what they expect the sales to look like at each stage.
You mean the same smart people that figured out that Destruction Allstars was worth 70 dollars, before it was pulled and went on PS+ and is now 20 dollars on the store?
 

Aether

Member
Jan 6, 2018
4,421
I mean, i applied for a position for 20 hours at the moment... and a week later they came to me with 10 hours for about 500+€.
Thinking how far i can travel with those 80€ (train tickets,)... 80 fucking € is a lot.
currently thats about half of my monthly groceries (i reduced that in the pandemic quite a lot)... i know i am the extreme (i have money on the side, more then enough), but i find it rather inexcusable to pay 80€ while im having way higher priorities currently, and going by the new unemployment numbers...its probably more the norme that people are rethinking their expenses.
 

GOOCHY

Member
Oct 29, 2017
299
Returnal is going to have a difficult time at $70. Not just because it's a new IP but because of the genre it's in.
 

Rodelero

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,536
Returnal is going to have a difficult time at $70. Not just because it's a new IP but because of the genre it's in.

This, for me, is the more reasonable criticism of the pricing. A lot of the complaints in here boil down to arbitrary expectations about how much games of a given genre or given length should cost, which doesn't resonate with me at all. But pricing games correctly is vital to games being successful not just out of the gate but long term because it affects reception and reviews, and so it's quite possible that the game will be more successful and make more money if it is launched at a lower price.

In the end we don't know how long Returnal is, and we don't know how good Returnal is. Sony do know those two things, so I hope they're basing the price point on that rather than a strange belief that their games are inherently worth more than other publisher's games. I really, really hope the developers at Housemarque aren't looking at that price wondering what the hell Sony are thinking.

I want Returnal to be a big success for Housemarque more than I want it to be cheap, essentially.
 

alr1ght

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,053
The bloat and value=hours garbage that permeated last gen is going to get exponentially worse.
 
OP
OP

Bundy

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,931
Its sad to read this. "Yeah well let Housemarque's first aaa game flop really hard so other games can be cheaper".

I will gladly give them more money in exchange for the quality that only a few can deliver nowadays.

I think that Returnal will be fine if reviewd are going to end up great (80+). I would games around 90 of it wasnt their first aaa but I trust them to deliver.
Just in this thread alone we can see people, ordinary "customers", defending multi-billion dollar corporation for selling simple ports and remasters for $60. Demanding 80€ for "standard editions" of their games, even tho they are making more money than ever and selling more games than ever. I'm not even suprised anymore. These corporations should offer a feature where you can link your bank account with their bank accounts, so you can easily transfer your monthly salary directly to them. Way easier this way. It really is "sad to read this".
 
Last edited:
Oct 25, 2017
21,466
Sweden
if i have a ps5 by then i will likely get returnal at launch. it would hurt to pay €80 for it but i want to support the developer. ratchet i may wait out. now that insomniac is owned by sony, they don't need my support to the same extent

it would break my heart to see returnal fail because of sony's inane pricing of ps5 games. game looks fresh as hell
 
Oct 25, 2017
21,466
Sweden
I haven't played it, but going by ERA it seems like there wasn't any content? Like there was even cut from the original that people were hoping was in this and wasn't? What new stuff is there?
while expanding the game with the sixth archstone would have been so cool, demon's souls is still the GOAT. if i had been able to find a ps5 when it launched, i definitely would have paid the full €80 to play the GOAT remake on day 1
 

CitrusScorpio

Member
Feb 18, 2021
167
This is what's going through my mind right now. Good faith credit.

The thing with that is, if you dont deliver a return on that good faith trust based investment, sooner or later that trust credit is going to be shot, and people wont simply buy systems and games uninformed because of the trust they have in the company based on good past experiences.

Nintendo's in a unique spot- through their IP's general wide appeal & being around for 40 years- they've cultivated multi-generational attachment unlike anyone else. Their characters are so beloved they've seeped beyond pop culture and into general osmosis. Your grandparents know who Pikachu is, or Link, or Mario; even though they may have never directly played their games. While Sony's IP are also deeply beloved and influential, I don't think many people beyond the gaming community are aware of who Nathan Drake or Ratchet is. Their back catalog commands so much nostalgia, and as rarely Ninty re-releases it, that people are willing to pay the full price. Nintendo has far more in common with Disney than another game company, they can re-print Snow White or Dumbo constantly into perpetuity.

I don't think Nintendo will ever have a public relations nightmare strong enough to knock all that down, there's so much goodwill and strong attachment. People can complain about a $60 Mario collection, or $60 Skyward Sword, and there will always be people willing to buy it. It would take several years of poor products to begin to shake that. Also like Disney.
 

Str0ngStyle

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,356
why do people compare r&c to a mid budget remake instead of all the other previous games, which were full priced?

this is annoying af.
I wonder how much the genre of the two games that were originally referenced factors in to it? I mean you're correct that R&C traditionally has been full price, but look at how people complain about this specific game. Between this and Returnal, it kinda feels like the argument is that certain genres don't have the right to cost "full price" which if thats the case, is complete BS. But maybe I am reading too much into this.
 

hersheyfan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,749
Manila, Philippines
$70 is actually on the lower side, it's €80 in Europe, which is $96.36
Yes, I'm aware! If we're talking regional differences, here in Asia brand new Sony first party games used to run around 50$ on day one. I checked the local shops and theyre flogging Returnal preorders for 60$, so its a straight 10$ increase across regions.

I (personally) can afford a ten dollar increase no problem, but I refuse to pay their premium out of principle - I don't want to support that practice. Pay an extra 10$ to get that "PlayStation Studios premium feel", GTFO Jimbo.
 

HockeyBird

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,591
I wonder how much the genre of the two games that were originally referenced factors in to it? I mean you're correct that R&C traditionally has been full price, but look at how people complain about this specific game. Between this and Returnal, it kinda feels like the argument is that certain genres don't have the right to cost "full price" which if thats the case, is complete BS. But maybe I am reading too much into this.

I think with Ratchet specifically, the consumer just sees that a Ratchet and Clank was $40 at release and the new one is now $70. A $30 increase. The average consumer doesn't know or care about the specific budget that went into each game. Without more research, they can't determine if one game has more content. They just know that both games are called Ratchet and Clank. One was $40. One is going to be $70.

The genre also has a lot to do with it too. We've been conditioned to expect a certain price. I think platformers and rogue likes are perceived as lesser value even if they may have more content than something like The Last of Us. Heck, I remember when indie games started selling above $20 and people were complaining. Now these games were bigger and expansive then indie games prior in many cases but it didn't matter, people only saw that the new indie games were more than the old ones.
 

ForthU

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,309
I wonder how much the genre of the two games that were originally referenced factors in to it? I mean you're correct that R&C traditionally has been full price, but look at how people complain about this specific game. Between this and Returnal, it kinda feels like the argument is that certain genres don't have the right to cost "full price" which if thats the case, is complete BS. But maybe I am reading too much into this.
No, you're totally right, just look at the Crash 4 reactions. There's a vocal community who thinks that certain games aren't worthy of full price, regardless of quality, content or budget. Which of course is major bullshit and not sonething that should belong to enthusiast forums and discussions.
 

Akash

Member
Oct 27, 2017
311
I have opinions:

Gamepass not being part of this article is....glaring

Returnal is this generation's The Order.

I cant stomach 70. Ive been buying PS5 games secondhand, so now Sony is seeing zero revenue from me. I think they drop back to 60 in short order.
 

Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
I think $60 for Skyward Sword would go down easier if it just got the substantial QoL tweaks and improvements the original so clearly needed but lacked.

But I find it funny that people harped on the price of Mario 3D All-Stars, when I picked up new for $50, and it's three of the highest rated games of all time officially released in HD for the first time in one bundle. It's not much beyond that, but considering the eShop cost of the games are $9 for Mario 64, $20 for Mario Galaxy, and Mario Sunshine never even got a re-release (with used copies going for full-price on Ebay for ages), I think the collection is a good value, even if more could have been done.

It's one reason why something like Mass Effect Legendary Edition at $60 is a total steal. Three great games, over $100 in DLC, substantial visual and performance enhancements... That is definitely more of what I expect.