The mainstream doesn't consume games like Era so a $10-$20 increase doesn't change much for them.
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GIBiz: Returnal, Skyward Sword, Ratchet & Clank and the value of video games
- Thread starter Bundy
- Start date
The mainstream doesn't consume games like Era so a $10-$20 increase doesn't change much for them.
Maybe I'm misreading the post, but why wouldn't there be more outrage? Demon's Souls is a remake from the ground up where every single asset, sound, and animation was redone for the project. IIRC BluePoint started work on this almost immediately after finishing SotC Remake and continued development up until the PS5 launch. They also added a 60fps mode, 3D audio, made quality of life changes, and put in a photo mode. Skyward Sword, on the other hand, is a remaster that (aside from the new controls) seems to keep most of the underlying structure intact. Even when compared to a Wind Waker HD, the amount of reworked material seems rather low.
I'm not going to claim that I have the data, but the time and budget case for Demon's Souls price seems much better than the one for Skyward Sword.
All of those Devs have been producing AAA titles though. Granted guerilla is better now than they were just because horizon has more mainstream appeal than killzone did. But killzone at least showed a degree of competency in the AAA space. Same for Bend with Syphon filter and uncharted golden abyss and sucker punch with infamous.
Returnal however is not only an unproven genre shift, but it's a shift from indie to AAA. Something they have NEVER done. And it's a genre that is all about repetition and procedural generation. It's just not an ideal series of events for them...but then this is the same developer who broke away from their excellent, but low performing arcade roots and thought making a battle royal title in an oversaturated, largely free to play market was a good idea...
The same issues are present in returnal really. They're entering a market that is super saturated by super popular titles (it feels like a good rogue-like releases every other week), that were all sub £15...and they're rolling up wanting £70 for their attempt. Sure it looks prettier than the others out there. But are nice graphics really worth £55? I think i need some convincing of that.
Returnal doesn't look as expensive to make as Sony's PS4 first party games just for starters. Sorry, but if this value perception pops up in every Returnal thread it's because there's something to it. Something about this game, even if it isn't well-articulated, is prompting this reaction from an unusually high number of people.
You can try to make the case that's it's totally irrational, but on its face the game doesn't have the production values of a AAA Sony game, even from last gen. Add to that that rogelikes are procedural and have tons of repetitive assets, and you get another decrement in perceived budget and justified price tag.
Many of the crowd here also declared Destruction All-Stars didn't look like a $70/full-price title. And they turned to be right.
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I'm baffled why Nintendo can get a way with charging so much for ports and such but Sony gets so much scrutiny for charging 10 dollars more for those linear naughty dog games as you put it.
Price isn't subjective. What is subjective is whetever you think it's worth that money.
60€ for a freaking Wii port, a game that released 10 years ago is expensive as fuck. But expensive as it is, I could see myself shelving 60€ for a port of a beloved game that is 10 or even 20 years old. I'd think it's worth it. But I'd also think it's very expensive.
60€ for a freaking Wii port, a game that released 10 years ago is expensive as fuck. But expensive as it is, I could see myself shelving 60€ for a port of a beloved game that is 10 or even 20 years old. I'd think it's worth it. But I'd also think it's very expensive.
I mean, so was Link's Awakening but it didn't matter and people raged over "paying $60 for a Game Boy game". The point is though Nintendo doesn't get less heat for this kind of stuff, if anything they get much more.
They're not getting away with anything. They've gotten and get plenty of criticism for that. This idea of them getting free passes is straight up console war nonsense
I completely agree with you, I'm not sure how Nintendo gets away with this stuff, especially when they aren't nearly as aggressive with sales as Sony. They seem to be able to charge 60 dollars for ports and people are fine with it but 70 dollars for new games is apparently absurd, I just don't understand it.
You got a link to that 63€ Returnal offer 👀? I am absolutely not paying 80 Euro for any non collector's edition version of a game, but I think I can do 63 depending on the reception of the game.
I mean... People still buy said ports anyways. But I guess that's a problem with the industry as a whole
I'm not a console warrior fyi and I'll admit they have got some scrutiny but it would be ridiculous if they didn't get any. I personally won't pay 70 pounds for new games and I'll wait for sales, which is another point as nintendo games notoriously don't go on sale that much.
The people saying this wont hold this expecation when every AAA game costs $70. It just the anger phase. The people will either suck it up and buy these games or they will wait for price drops. The same as literally every generation ever.
I feel like one of the only people who doesn't mind spending more on bigger titles here and there given how much cheap shit there is you can fill the gaps with. If something is too expensive I just wait. Shrug.
Sony's big games are worth every penny imo.
People will also pay $70 for new games too. It's not any different
Then why make console warrior type arguments? They've gotten just as much, if not more, scrutiny for that than Sony has for $70 games. They don't get free passes, not here or elsewhere, at least no more than anyone else does
Same here. I have no problem dropping 70 bucks on games, but most of the time I usually just buy stuff when it hits 10 bucks on Ebay or something
Even then, those $70 titles come out what, once every three months or so ?
Even if one was to buy every premium priced exclusive per year, it really wouldn't change the budget that much.
Besides, being an enthusiast also means knowing where to get the best prices. I'm paying 62€ with 15€ cashback for Returnal. It's lower than many games I bought last gen.
I do believe a 70€ price point might hurt new IPs for some digital buyers and/or people buying full price at a brick and mortar.
When it comes to Sony's prestige studios, yeah I can't say I mind paying a little bit more for that kind of experience.
I wouldn't say it doesn't but it's coming off the heels of a collection of remakes all while looking pretty much identical to them. It's not strange that some folks did a double take because of that. Had the remakes been $60, I don't think folks would've minded
An enthusiast board of all places saying no game is worth $70 is wild. I don't expect game sales to go down with these price increases to be frank.
It will be normal in 2 years and it will be accepted. There are generations of peoplw who never knew games were over $100 in the catridge days.
The industry will be fine lol
Not a huge fan of the $70 pricetag, but at least it'll feel more fair for a new R&C than $60 for an upres port of a 10 year old Wii game to me. Both will do fine though. I can't really see Returnal do particularly well at any pricepoint above maybe $20 tbh.
I would be more interested in Returnal if it was $70. I'll reluctantly pay to for Ratchet, just like I did for Demons Souls, but any game with the $70 tag needs to be a must buy and not a maybe.
Yeah, at the end of the day, it doesn't change too much. The bigger issue is that they're increasing the prices of their games despite games making record profits and having stuff like microtransactions or DLC to make more money from them anyways (not specifically talking about Sony here, just the industry at large) but that's a separate issue
I agree especially since most of their games are single player with no microtransactions, the games that make fuck tons of money from microtransactions and still increase their price that doesn't sit right at all with me.
Oh it really won't. I do see perhaps new IPs or what not suffering from this but, overall, I'd imagine game sales will remain pretty consistent. I will say it does suck that they're doing this while they also have additional methods of extracting more money from consumers but that's a separate issue
I can normally find games at prices I am okay paying. Digital sales make finding games so much easier at reasonable prices.
People here want the absolute best graphics, content and quality but also want to pay the least possible. In a sense it is being a good consumer. But also, if you listen to people's valuations here, you'd never buy anything at regular price.
I get what you're saying, but I think they're getting more because it's being compared to the value of the work their competition is doing.
If you look at the the Master Chief Collection, the Bluepoint Remakes, or that entire HD Trilogy line Sony put out for most of their series, it's hard to say that Nintendo is competing with their main competitors. At the end of the day though, they're still going to make bank, so why would they change?
At this point I have to buy games only on sale, and maybe 1-2 games at launch per year, if even that.
It will put me behind everyone else by 1-2 years, but it is what it is. I just don't have enough cash to justify 80 euros per new AAA release.
With nintendo the games are still expensive, but their resale value is also great. So it makes more sense to buy the games and then sell them out after beating. I'm sure it's not ideal for Nintendo, but eh..
It will put me behind everyone else by 1-2 years, but it is what it is. I just don't have enough cash to justify 80 euros per new AAA release.
With nintendo the games are still expensive, but their resale value is also great. So it makes more sense to buy the games and then sell them out after beating. I'm sure it's not ideal for Nintendo, but eh..
Generally speaking, $70 will be fine when it comes to AAAs. However, 80 Euros and 70 pounds is equivalent to about $100 and I can't see many people being ok with that. I can't think of many games that I'd pay that much for, it's basically a big ass collector's edition price and I can see this having a significant effect on sales before discounts.
However, Ratchet & Clank will still do fine, it's highly anticipated "next-gen" game from a big developer. Returnal thu? Watched a couple of people making faces as soon as they realize that it's a "roguelike", it would've benefited from being a launch game but now its close to other big releases.
However, Ratchet & Clank will still do fine, it's highly anticipated "next-gen" game from a big developer. Returnal thu? Watched a couple of people making faces as soon as they realize that it's a "roguelike", it would've benefited from being a launch game but now its close to other big releases.
I don't think they are getting away with it, but at the same time, when you have people raging over Links Awakening remake at $60 I get the sense there will ALWAYS be some people who will rage if it's an older title getting remade, even if it's 100% ground up rebuilt. Especially if it's not 'mature' looking. At this point it's become performance art whenever Nintendo announces a new old game coming to their very successful platform.
And yea, I also suspect but can't prove (obviously) a lot of it is console wars nonsense
I have to imagine that the hearts sank for the staff at Housemarque when Capcom announced the date for RE8. One week after may as well be the same day.
I would agree with you if RE8 was for next gen only. But is crossgen so it's makes sense for it to be $60
Don't preorder games and you'll likely get them cheaper on launch. I ain't paying £50 for SS or £70 for Ratchet.
You can easily slash £10 from each title if you buy online.
You can easily slash £10 from each title if you buy online.
I would have bought Returnal and Ratchet if they weren't $70. Instead, I'm waiting. Feel bad for the devs but I just can't justify it
$70 is without tax. However some states don't have sales tax like Oregon. Some states don't have tax for digital version
There is tax but nothing that compares to EU.
For example, UK was paying close to 60$ during past gen were Europe was already paying 80$, that is why you see a lot of complain about Uk prices do to them paying 20$ less then the rest of europe.
Nintendo has played hardball on prices for years. They succeed because they don't budge and people reluctantly spend the money. I spend on some games but Nintendo is the only major first party where I typically only play about half of their games. It's a shame, but I'm not paying $50-$60 a pop for years old games in some cases.
Returnal and R&C will probably be successful, but there are many of us that will wait until the price dips after a few weeks/months.
Returnal and R&C will probably be successful, but there are many of us that will wait until the price dips after a few weeks/months.
Because for me, value is determined by how much replayability I get from a game. I find Zelda games to be infinitely more replayable than a Naughty Dog game; therefor I'm willing to pay $60 for a port of a Zelda game where I'm going to be skeptical of a $70 linear naughty dog story focused game. This is all personal preference though.
I can't justify paying £70 for a single game, no matter how much I love the Ratchet & Clank series. A rise to £60 would have been grudgingly accepted, but £70 is absurd.
On the Nintendo side of things, their lack of price drops for their titles usually means that I just don't buy many of their games.
On the Nintendo side of things, their lack of price drops for their titles usually means that I just don't buy many of their games.
Isn't SSHD just a "prettier version of what (Nintendo) released in previous gens?"
It sounds like you don't care about games pushing the envelope - you just like certain games and dislike other games, that's all. Returnal will most certainly be a newer and more novel experience than SSHD.
The trilogy was 'only' a visual remake with identical gameplay, enemie behaviour etc to the originals with a few QoL additions. I don't mean that as a slight against Vicarious, they were fantastic remakes what they tried to be.
Crash 4 is a completely new game, with so much stuff to do and things that never were in the previous games.
I'm not even a fan of Crash 4, I was even disappointed by it in the end. The scope of the game is still nothing else but a brand new, full game game though. Any other 3D platformer with that much polish and content should cost full price as well.
Indeed. Add on 15% tax where I live and every day 1 buy is $103.
Sure Demon's Souls visuals and performance were redone from the ground up but other than that it's the exact same game. No new content. Link's Awakening was too (visuals completely redone, and actually had some new content!) and it gets way more complaints.
Hell, 3D World launched with an entire new six hour game bundled with it and even that gets more complaints than full priced Demon's Souls. The next gen visuals really softened the blow there imo.
SS HD may even have new stuff, we don't know yet. Plus reworking that game's controls is a ton of work, if you're going by the "effort put in".
On top of that, DeS is $10 more than all of these
This price increase is especially awkward coming at the same time that subscription services are emerging. Why pay $70+ for a new Ubisoft game when I can sub to Ubisoft+ for a month and play it at an ~80% discount? It's interesting to note that the increase seems to be spearheaded by two entities that aren't doing the subscription service thing, Take Two and Sony, but it seems absurd that other megapublishers were caught off guard. An easy argument to make is that the price increase is actually intended to drive adoption of these services, but I don't think that really tracks. It takes time for the dominant mode of consumption to shift, and there's no evidence that these services are approaching critical mass yet.
It's very strange for prices to be increasing in one section of the market while dramatically decreasing at the same time in another. It's clear nothing's going to break because of it, but it's super weird when you're informed enough to see and take advantage of it. Wonder how long this awkward state will last.
It's very strange for prices to be increasing in one section of the market while dramatically decreasing at the same time in another. It's clear nothing's going to break because of it, but it's super weird when you're informed enough to see and take advantage of it. Wonder how long this awkward state will last.