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Shake Appeal

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,883
Surprised to see some negativity toward the ending. There was a scene toward the end there that I fucking couldn't believe I was seeing. I guess it was optional, but, man. It was basically perfect.
I do think the ending hinges a lot on how much attention you've paid to details throughout the game and how many side tasks you pursued and completed. In this game, 90% of the tasks--even seemingly unrelated ones--inform or fold into the "main quest," and with a high-FYS build, you can stumble into the ending much sooner than is ideal.

Massive ending spoilers:
If you treat it solely as a whodunnit and don't engage with the broader political context and history of Revachol, including talking at length to, e.g., Rene and Joyce, the ending will lose a lot of its thematic heft. I think it also helps to have a broad political engagement in this world, in real life, to understand the currents that have or haven't shaped our society and moment. The revelation of the murderer will also seem more or less connected to everything depending on how much you've learned about Klaasje and Lely, and how many other minor clues you've discovered and talked about (the flowers on the rooftop, for instance, or Inland Empire/Shivers checks that concern the island). Another key element is your tolerance for a mystery being dispelled or transformed rather than solved. This isn't a pure detective story, and it doesn't "play by the rules"; the identity of the murderer is ultimately less important than the emotional significance of the murder--for H.D.B., for Martinaise and Revachol, and for the player. The game isn't about catching the bad guy who did the crime; it's about understanding that the past keeps crashing into our present and destroying us. That we can't escape it.

Likewise, if you don't engage as much as possible with Lena/Morell, talk extensively to Joyce, and exhaust every possible option at the church (learning as much as possible about the swallow/2mm hole, and ideally even speaking with Revachol via a major Shivers check), you lose a lot of the context around the phasmid and what it reveals. You may not even be able to communicate with it! In which case, yes, it will seem like "a weird insect showed up." I found myself almost tearing up in that moment because of what that phasmid had come to represent, and what it told me: that the pale was a human creation. What's happening to the world of Elysium, what's slowly choking it, is us. That's a resonant truth for our world, too.

So yeah, best game.
 

Shake Appeal

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,883
how does this compare to planescape torment and baldur's gate
It's extremely different to Baldur's Gate, and a comparison won't serve either game. It's more similar to Planescape: Torment in that it involves an amnesiac thrust into an unfamiliar world who has to solve, among other things, the puzzle of who they are, largely by clicking on lots of dialogue options. Disco doesn't have combat or many other conventional RPG mechanics, though; it goes all in on its roleplaying and reactivity.

It has better writing than PS:T, and it's also in a world much closer to our own, with rich political and cultural depths, so it feels more relevant and vital.
 

Shake Appeal

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,883
It's my first time hearing about it, is it available on PS4 and what type of game is it?
It's coming out on consoles next year. It's a roleplaying game in the Western tradition but without combat. You could consider it a visual novel, albeit with much more reactivity and variety based on how the player approaches it.
 

Nakenorm

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
22,340
It's coming out on consoles next year. It's a roleplaying game in the Western tradition but without combat. You could consider it a visual novel, albeit with much more reactivity and variety based on how the player approaches it.

Thanks, sounds right up my alley! I'll make sure to buy it next year then.
 

Deleted member 46948

Account closed at user request
Banned
Aug 22, 2018
8,852
The ones that blew my mind were Eurogamer and RockPaperShotgun, neither of whom gave the game "Recommended," let alone "Bestest Best/Essential." I would have thought they were more predisposed to liking something like this than a lot of the other sites that have come out with 9s and 10s, but hey.

I guess RPS still called it a "flawed masterpiece," but the Eurogamer review was truly bad.

The RPS preview video was what made me buy the game in the first place, so at least that's something?
The Eurogamer review was truly shameful, though, I agree.
 
OP
OP
texhnolyze

texhnolyze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,176
Indonesia
Guys, can you play this with a controller?
No official controller support, but you can use a custom controller config on Steam.

3sDIKuD.png


I actually made one, played and finished the game with a controller. I don't really against kb/m, but being a dad with a 4-month old baby forces me to play games with a controller nowadays. While carrying the baby with a carrier, my hands are free and can still play with a controller.
 

Widdowmaker

Member
Oct 31, 2017
293
Great Britain
they werent brutal, thats how a perfect score should be given. Games actually worthy of those scores are one in many years. A score of 10 should feel like an event. Mindblowing. 10/10 are handed like candy these days. It literally means absolutely nothing right now. Every time some twenty something kid reviews a game and is a bit excited, bam, 10/10. It lost all meaning

I wasn't saying they were brutal for not giving many 10's, and I agree that they should be rare. That's why I said I'm nostalgic for those days. I was just making the point that their reviews back then, in general, were brutal. They often gave games lower scores than other publications, but their reviews were so well written and so well researched you could hardly argue with the result. The staff they had back then really knew their stuff.

Peak GameSpot, from '97 to '07, was by far the best gaming website on the net.
 

Shake Appeal

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,883
The RPS preview video was what made me buy the game in the first place, so at least that's something?
The Eurogamer review was truly shameful, though, I agree.
And then, just this morning: https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2019/11/04/cant-stop-playing-disco-elysium/

I reviewed Disco Elysium, and I really like it, but I find it hard to articulate my thoughts about it. I, frankly, can't get my head around large swathes of it. It's a game that says and does a lot. About politics, economics, sociology, class. And disco. And Dungeons & Dragons. Matt grappled with some of the philosophy. We've barely even begun. It has layers. Liek onyon.

It feels destined to be one of those Significant with a capital S PC games, for good or ill. My Inland Empire is telling me we should write more about it. Stay tuned for that.
 

.exe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,241
The ones that blew my mind were Eurogamer and RockPaperShotgun, neither of whom gave the game "Recommended," let alone "Bestest Best/Essential." I would have thought they were more predisposed to liking something like this than a lot of the other sites that have come out with 9s and 10s, but hey.

I guess RPS still called it a "flawed masterpiece," but the Eurogamer review was truly bad.

At least they tried it out and gave it some critical thought. On GB, it was "well, I don't like that my character has the option to be a total shitstain" without reflecting on what actions caused them to land on such a disturbed character in the first place. Meanwhile, Outer Worlds, a game in which you can also roleplay as an absolute maniac is totes ok, the only difference being that DE verbalizes it (more often). It's not really up alley and that's okay, but the way they dismissed it in such a knee-jerk way was disappointing. Like, I get it, but there's more to it.
 
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Deleted member 29682

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
12,290
At least they tried it out and gave it some critical thought. On GB, it was "well, I don't like that my character has the option to be a total shitstain" without reflecting on what actions caused them to land on such a disturbed character in the first place. Meanwhile, Outer Worlds, a game in which you can also roleplay as an absolute maniac is totes ok, the only difference being that DE verbalizes it (more often).

I'm a bit iffy on the comparison, if only because The Outer Worlds is more obviously tongue-in-cheek moustache-twirling evil rather than Disco's grounded black comedy approach. It's closer to being a real-life bad person.
 

.exe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,241
I'm a bit iffy on the comparison, if only because The Outer Worlds is more obviously tongue-in-cheek moustache-twirling evil rather than Disco's grounded black comedy approach. It's closer to being a real-life bad person.

In the sense that you can, for example, completely shut down Parvati and make light of her asexuality. Or enact your personal hatred against some group. There is mustache twirling for sure but also more subtle toxicity. For me, the main difference is that there's an option not to and the player has to willfully pursue this. So, like you said, you have to think that way yourself to choose that path. In DE, it's more like a fail state that you can be spiraled into, which I think is in any case a more nuanced game-narrative device (especially in the context of today's world) than being able to become a knobhead at any point, irrespective of your choices thus far. In DE, you can at least take responsibility for things you thought or said by confronting those ideas rather than them being an option at any point, as if that's a normal thing bubbling in every person's brain at any point like in OW. As cynical as DE is, I don't know what's a more twisted perspective of people, if we're trying to read into philosophical intent from the choices a player is given.
 
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takriel

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,221
They really still have GTA IV on there? Invalidated.
 

Buggy Loop

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,232
I started the game 2 days ago and i can already tell it's going to be a classic, something i have not experienced in videogames since Torment.

I mean...
The tie is a character, that's already fucking wack
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,689
How is the tone of the game? Is it one of those stories that people praise just because it seems deep because every character is an irredeemable asshole?
 

Deleted member 46948

Account closed at user request
Banned
Aug 22, 2018
8,852
How is the tone of the game? Is it one of those stories that people praise just because it seems deep because every character is an irredeemable asshole?

It is very cynical and bleak, but also very funny, and you can be a decent person.
Though it's absolutely a tragedy/tragicomedy, it has a lot of genuine humanity. DE doesn't confuse being a flawed person with being an irredeemable asshole, that's for sure.

Edit: although yes, you can totally be a raging asshole.
 

Viale

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,617
How is the tone of the game? Is it one of those stories that people praise just because it seems deep because every character is an irredeemable asshole?

I think there are times that game kind of gets lost in itself with some of the talk on different philosophies, but the characters are very well realized and there's a good degree of humor in most of the interactions. I wouldnt call almost any character an "irredeemable asshole"
 

Kalentan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,689
It is very cynical and bleak, but also very funny, and you can be a decent person.
Though it's absolutely a tragedy/tragicomedy, it has a lot of genuine humanity. DE doesn't confuse being a flawed person with being an irredeemable asshole, that's for sure.

Edit: although yes, you can totally be a raging asshole.
I think there are times that game kind of gets lost in itself with some of the talk on different philosophies, but the characters are very well realized and there's a good degree in humor in most of the interactions. I wouldnt call almost any character an "irredeemable asshole"

Alright, more interested now. I'll probably check it down the line when I don't have so much on my plate.
 

Deleted member 29682

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
12,290
Yeah as a whole the NPCs tend to be mostly friendly, with some exceptions (like the unfortunately named 'Racist Lorry Driver'). Even beneath the dark humour there's a sense of genuine frustration and discontent that rears its ugly head in the game's more serious moments. How you play your character factors into it too: if you play the game with a serious and grounded approach, it will accommodate. And if you want to get silly, it'll be happy to join in.
 

Mechaplum

Enlightened
Member
Oct 26, 2017
18,832
JP
Can't wait to dig in, playing 428 SS now and having lots of fun so this probably next after a palate cleanser.
 

peppersky

Banned
Mar 9, 2018
1,174
I recommend playing it with some sort of spoiler-free walkthrough, so you get the "good ending" that actually kinda ties up the story instead of what I got, which was unsatisfying as all hell.

I got neither the motivation of the murderer nor the conversation with the phasmid, because in both cases I missed just a single story flag.

Really made me think that maybe Telltale had a point when TWD S1 always ended the same way.
 

Deleted member 27551

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 30, 2017
660
Only heard of this when someone mentioned it in a outer worlds thread. Looked it up and it's right up my street. Will get this on the xbox or ps4 when it's out for consoles.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,460
I do think the ending hinges a lot on how much attention you've paid to details throughout the game and how many side tasks you pursued and completed. In this game, 90% of the tasks--even seemingly unrelated ones--inform or fold into the "main quest," and with a high-FYS build, you can stumble into the ending much sooner than is ideal.

Massive ending spoilers:
If you treat it solely as a whodunnit and don't engage with the broader political context and history of Revachol, including talking at length to, e.g., Rene and Joyce, the ending will lose a lot of its thematic heft. I think it also helps to have a broad political engagement in this world, in real life, to understand the currents that have or haven't shaped our society and moment. The revelation of the murderer will also seem more or less connected to everything depending on how much you've learned about Klaasje and Lely, and how many other minor clues you've discovered and talked about (the flowers on the rooftop, for instance, or Inland Empire/Shivers checks that concern the island). Another key element is your tolerance for a mystery being dispelled or transformed rather than solved. This isn't a pure detective story, and it doesn't "play by the rules"; the identity of the murderer is ultimately less important than the emotional significance of the murder--for H.D.B., for Martinaise and Revachol, and for the player. The game isn't about catching the bad guy who did the crime; it's about understanding that the past keeps crashing into our present and destroying us. That we can't escape it.

Likewise, if you don't engage as much as possible with Lena/Morell, talk extensively to Joyce, and exhaust every possible option at the church (learning as much as possible about the swallow/2mm hole, and ideally even speaking with Revachol via a major Shivers check), you lose a lot of the context around the phasmid and what it reveals. You may not even be able to communicate with it! In which case, yes, it will seem like "a weird insect showed up." I found myself almost tearing up in that moment because of what that phasmid had come to represent, and what it told me: that the pale was a human creation. What's happening to the world of Elysium, what's slowly choking it, is us. That's a resonant truth for our world, too.

So yeah, best game.
Urgh, yes. Cool cool best game.
 

Deleted member 49319

Account closed at user request
Banned
Nov 4, 2018
3,672
The game is too strong in flavor I had to use Bloodborne as my palate cleanser while waiting for Death Stranding.
 

HK-47

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,595
how does this compare to planescape torment and baldur's gate
It's very much in the same vein as Planescape and Mask of the Betrayer. Lots of dialogue, skill checks in said dialogue, tons of philosophical themes that weave through every quest and character.

Very much not the epic power fantasy romp with a heavy combat focus that Baldurs Gate excels at.
 

Sanctuary

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,229
Yeah. I mean this hyperbolically, but I kind of feel like this game has ruined other RPGs for me in a way that Dark Souls did almost a decade ago. It is to dialogue in RPGs in 2019 what Dark Souls was to combat in 2009. I feel like it should be the new standard in the same way.

Torment already did this two decades ago. It's also why I doubt I'll ever play this game either. Torment was less of a game and more an interactive book. I've already had my fill of those (as well as point and click adventures) growing up, and I need more interactivity when I play a video game.
 
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