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Deleted member 9306

Self-requested temporary ban
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
962
Your view on PC gaming is severely outdated. PC gaming has not been this "PC + monitor" setup for more than a decade now.

That's your opinion? Most people I know and most youtubers I see still mostly use PC + Monitor. Not everyone has a lot of money to be spending on 4k TVs or etc. If you make a thread on r/buildapc and ask people to build you a PC, they're most likely going to recommend you a monitor to go along with it.
 

RayCharlizard

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,969
Didn't Alex from digital foundry state that the ps5 was performing like a 2080 or higher in one of their videos last month, what is this garbage tier clickbait video. I expect better from gamer nexus
He said that regarding one particular game that performs better on AMD hardware than NVIDIA on PC and he clarifies this very specific point in said video.
 

Cactuar

Banned
Nov 30, 2018
5,878
it's like saying the PS3 was really $499 and not $599.

The feature complete PS5 is $499 and is also the one Sony is mainly manufacturing. Maybe if the split was more equal or even in favor of the digital edition, then sure the priority SKU is either or, but saying the PS5 is $399 because Sony are taking a massive loss to sell a stripped down system to hit a marketable lower price, then the Series X is actually $35.

"Sony is taking a massive loss" sounds a lot like the same people worrying about if "Microsoft is taking a massive loss" subsidizing Game Pass. How one billion dollar company is paying for their service vs how another billion dollar company is paying for their service doesn't mean squat to the consumer. What matters to the consumer is the price out of their pocket. How about you let Sony worry about their bottom line? They seem to be doing pretty well for themselves last I checked. Don't tell me about Sony "taking a massive loss" (No. 1 you don't know what Sony is taking) because that is beside the point. The statement was made that the PS5 has an MSRP of $399, despite your completely obtuse "feature complete" assessment, that statement is true. Who are you to say a disc drive makes the system complete? Who made you the President of Complete Features? I haven't bought a disc since 2016. The exact same performance and specs from the $499 PS5 is achieved with the $399 PS5. That is a fact.
 

Dolce

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,252
The title at least looks different from what it was earlier, I just can't remember what it was before.
 

NaDannMaGoGo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,967
Like, just looking at the raw hardware it's just kinda embarrassing for Steve to even vaguely suggest there's a valid comparison to be made. I mean 4 core vs 8 core CPU? Sure, PS5 doesn't clock quite as high and has less cache (or compared to a proper 3700x at least) but cmon. Similar applies for the GPU.

This is just a video that shouldn't have been made or at least not published after some thinking. He'll do so much followup just to "clarify" this video or why people supposedly totally misinterpreted his massage...
 

RayCharlizard

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,969
lol bruh

ilSXA6w.png
 

Alexandros

Member
Oct 26, 2017
17,814
That's your opinion? Most people I know and most youtubers I see still mostly use PC + Monitor. Not everyone has a lot of money to be spending on 4k TVs or etc. If you make a thread on r/buildapc and ask people to build you a PC, they're most likely going to recommend you a monitor to go along with it.

Nobody is going to recommend a monitor if you don't want a monitor. As with everything else on PC, the display you play your games on is the user's choice and nothing else. And didn't you just say in your previous post that most people have a TV? Why would that be any different for PC gamers?
 

FaceHugger

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
13,949
USA
Nobody is going to recommend a monitor if you don't want a monitor. As with everything else on PC, the display you play your games on is the user's choice and nothing else. And didn't you just say in your previous post that most people have a TV? Why would that be any different for PC gamers?

This is true, but how many people want to lug their PC into their living room and deal with all that? If they're PC gaming they're probably going to want their monitor, mouse, keyboard, speakers, and ethernet connection all right there.

Hell I can't even recall a single time someone shared their PC rig setup anywhere, ever, and it was in their living room.
 

Mindfreak191

Member
Dec 2, 2017
4,770
This is true, but how many people want to lug their PC into their living room and deal with all that? If they're PC gaming they're probably going to want their monitor, mouse, keyboard, speakers, and ethernet connection all right there.

Hell I can't even recall a single time someone shared their PC rig setup anywhere, ever, and it was in their living room.
Yeah, imagine your friends come over and they see a keyboard on the table in the living room, what an embarrassment.

It's joke regarding an old thread where someone was loosing their shit over having a PC in the living room.
 

Decarb

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,643
Not like this Steve.
lol I've got one right here in my living room that I paid $399 for.
given the ratio Sony manufactured, the "$400 console" might as well not exist
Sony's marketing strategy is working really well on some people.
And this post is hilarious for people who actually own that console. I'm pretty sure they manufactured more DEs than Nvidia did with 3xxx FE cards. So they don't exist too, right?
 
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Deleted member 19533

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,873
Yeah, this is very inaccurate. I have a 1070 with an 8600k. It gets me PS4 Pro level resolutions (sometimes a bit lower) with 60FPS. It comes nowhere near the PS5. A 1060? Yeah, this is very much an exercise in cherry picking. Everyone knows DMC5 PS5 is poorly optimized, and we all know the last gen version and PC versions are very well optimized.

Why don't you take the PS4 version and run it in BC mode and compare it to the same rig? Because the PS5 will crush it resolution wise with a locked frame rate at 1800p. I'll tell you right now a 1070 gets you similar performance as a PS4 Pro on that game around 1440p.
 

John Frost

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,343
Canada
it's like saying the PS3 was really $499 and not $599.

The feature complete PS5 is $499 and is also the one Sony is mainly manufacturing. Maybe if the split was more equal or even in favor of the digital edition, then sure the priority SKU is either or, but saying the PS5 is $399 because Sony are taking a massive loss to sell a stripped down system to hit a marketable lower price, then the Series X is actually $35.

Are you losing your mind?
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
Why not pick the COD, NBA 2K21, Godfall and Valhalla?

There is no way he didn't consider picking the biggest and most recognizible games, so I will go and say there is some cherry picking involved.
 

Big-E

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,169
Why not pick the COD, NBA 2K21, Godfall and Valhalla?

There is no way he didn't consider picking the biggest and most recognizible games, so I will go and say there is some cherry picking involved.

People really need to watch the video. This is 120fps test. The list of games that support 120 fps on PS5 are:

Borderlands 3
COD
DMC 5
Dirt 5
Fortnite
Monster Boy and the Cursed Kingdom
The Nioh Collection
Rainbow Six Wiege
WRC9

That was the list they were pulling from. 3 games out of that list does not seem egregious.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
People really need to watch the video. This is 120fps test. The list of games that support 120 fps on PS5 are:

Borderlands 3
COD
DMC 5
Dirt 5
Fortnite
Monster Boy and the Cursed Kingdom
The Nioh Collection
Rainbow Six Wiege
WRC9

That was the list they were pulling from. 3 games out of that list does not seem egregious.

So... why not test Siege, COD and Fortnite? You know, the games people actually play, and could use the data to inform their purchases?
 

jfkgoblue

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,650
Your view on PC gaming is severely outdated. PC gaming has not been this "PC + monitor" setup for more than a decade now.
Uhh people who hook up their PC's to TVs are very much in the minorities despite what many people try to claim. I personally have my PS5 hooked up to my 4K TV in the living room and my PC(intel i9 10850k and a 3080) hooked up to a 1440/144 monitor(which ironically cost more than the TV) in the bedroom. I actually don't know anyone who hooks their PC to their TV, it makes using it as a PC so very impractical.

There is room for both, my 3080 does pretty much destroy any game I throw at it(well besides CP, even at 1440 and DLSS that struggles to hit 60 FPS fully maxed out) but there is still value in having the console on the TV as it just works and is a simple turn on and continue right where you left it.

anyways this video is clickbait trash(and the original title was straight up consoles wars) as you don't buy PCs to only match console settings, you would just buy a console for that.
 

Big-E

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,169
So... why not test Siege, COD and Fortnite? You know, the games people actually play, and could use the data to inform their purchases?

Video is already 30 minutes long and they are thorough? Its ok to admit you missed the point of the video by not watching though as Gamers Nexus did do their video a disservice with the original title and thumbnail but the video goes through in great detail what they did and reasoning.
 

Radec

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,406
What a bait by GN. Shame they had to do that.

Also there are people here doesn't believe there's a $399 (before taxes) PS5. Lol
 

Alexandros

Member
Oct 26, 2017
17,814
This is true, but how many people want to lug their PC into their living room and deal with all that? If they're PC gaming they're probably going to want their monitor, mouse, keyboard, speakers, and ethernet connection all right there.

Hell I can't even recall a single time someone shared their PC rig setup anywhere, ever, and it was in their living room.

In your post you present a use case that is based on a very specific assumption, that people who want to play PC games on a TV have a computer in a different room and have to move that PC to the living room. There are two much more plausible scenarios, people already having a TV in the room the PC is located in and people having a dedicated gaming PC for the living room.

Uhh people who hook up their PC's to TVs are very much in the minorities despite what many people try to claim.

No doubt, but a minority use case is not any less valid than a majority one.
 
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RayCharlizard

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,969
So... why not test Siege, COD and Fortnite? You know, the games people actually play, and could use the data to inform their purchases?
If a similar performance differential was shown would you care? Games people actually play, give me a break. These results aren't shitting on the PS5, it's showing the games were not well optimized based on what we know about the hardware! And inform purchases lol. You mean inform someone's purchase of Fortnite?
 

JahIthBer

Member
Jan 27, 2018
10,383
Cut Down Zen 2's showing themselves at 120fps, full fat Desktop Zen 2 in Consoles wasn't truthful. Still PS5 is amazing value for it's price no lie.
 

RayCharlizard

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,969
So he did say it, strange they would try to compare this with a 1060
Sorry, I meant that Alex clarifies in his video that Valhalla runs better on AMD hardware than NVIDIA on PC, thus potentially making the performance differential greater than other games when comparing Valhalla's PS5 performance to PC. Steve does not reference any DF material in OPs video.
 
Oct 27, 2017
6,960
If a similar performance differential was shown would you care? Games people actually play, give me a break. These results aren't shitting on the PS5, it's showing the games were not well optimized based on what we know about the hardware! And inform purchases lol. You mean inform someone's purchase of Fortnite?

Yep, of course I would care. They would have a stronger case to make conclusions too. This is why they don't benchmark 3 games for the GPU comparisons, but instead, run through the lists of 10 or 20 titles to form a better picture and showcase the outliers.

Someone's purchase of either the €500 PC or the PS5, because the game they play runs better.
 

Rylen

Member
Feb 5, 2019
466
Isn't it possible that DMC's 120hz mode is displaying at 1440p for PS5 ?

Steve is likely using a monitor that can output 1440 like the NU8000

rpnmqgv.jpg
 

Welfare

Prophet of Truth - You’re my Numberwall
Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,915
"Sony is taking a massive loss" sounds a lot like the same people worrying about if "Microsoft is taking a massive loss" subsidizing Game Pass. How one billion dollar company is paying for their service vs how another billion dollar company is paying for their service doesn't mean squat to the consumer. What matters to the consumer is the price out of their pocket. How about you let Sony worry about their bottom line? They seem to be doing pretty well for themselves last I checked. Don't tell me about Sony "taking a massive loss" (No. 1 you don't know what Sony is taking) because that is beside the point. The statement was made that the PS5 has an MSRP of $399, despite your completely obtuse "feature complete" assessment, that statement is true. Who are you to say a disc drive makes the system complete? Who made you the President of Complete Features? I haven't bought a disc since 2016. The exact same performance and specs from the $499 PS5 is achieved with the $399 PS5. That is a fact.
You went really hard on one line which is accurate (The DE is taking a bigger hit to be cheaper). I'm not concerned about Sony's bottom line, I'm recognizing which model Sony actually produces more of by a substantial margin because the tech of the PS5 is worth $499

Was the PS3 a $499 or $599 console in 2006? It's the easiest parallel to make a call on.
 

RayCharlizard

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,969
Isn't it possible that DMC's 120hz mode is displaying at 1440p for PS5 ?

Steve is likely using a monitor that can output 1440 like the NU8000

rpnmqgv.jpg
This was patched but it also has nothing to do with the internal resolution the game renders at and that they're benchmarking against, only the output display resolution. DMC5:SE renders at a reconstructed 3840x2160 when raytracing is disabled and the high frame rate mode (120 Hz) is enabled. Steve I guess considers this a negligible increase in resolution when benchmarking against PC at 1080p.


 
Jun 10, 2018
1,060
Isn't it possible that DMC's 120hz mode is displaying at 1440p for PS5 ?

Steve is likely using a monitor that can output 1440 like the NU8000

rpnmqgv.jpg
No, what they are saying is that the Samsung NU8000 only supports a maximum of 1440p @ 120hz. Devil May Cry drops to 1080p but forces the 120hz refresh rate thus lowering the output resolution of the display to 1440p @ 120hz.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,086
PC gamers need to stop doing this "OH YOU CAN BUILD A PC FOR $500 DOLLARZ" bullshit. And this is coming from a gal who's been PC gaming for most of her life.

It's just... what's the point of these videos? The so called "500 builds" never include any peripherals, a monitor, a desk, or any of the extra shit that you need to actually use the PC. Then there's the fact that if you're gaming with a $500 gaming PC, you're probably not going to get to the parts of PC gaming that make it unique from console gaming (gaming over 60hz, g-sync/freesync, usually better graphics, etc.). And then there's the fact that that 500 build will maybe get you through a year or two of medium-low end gaming before you're running games at 30fps. And that's not even getting to the fact that you usually can't even build a PC for that cheap in the first place unless you rob a computer store or are given components for free.

Instead of these clickbaity "U CaN BuILd a CONsol Kill3rz foOr $500" fake ass videos, why don't youtubers be more honest with their audiences? Instead of lying to people about these mythical $500 gaming builds, how about they instead focus on realistically cheap builds (800-1200 range), or focus on how people can upgrade their old builds to 'catch up' with new games. Like, PC gaming is always going to be a rich person's arena and unless people stop pre-ordering $1000 GPUs I don't see that changing.
While I kinda agree with the greater point of this, it's pretty disingenuous to say the console is the cost of the console alone while the PC HAS to include a desk, monitor, speakers, headset, etc. The only periphs you NEED for a PC are a mouse and keyboard, which you can get for $20-30 if you don't care for fancy stuff. I read your earlier arguments about not everybody having a monitor and TVs not being normal, but by that metric a very small portion of PS5 users don't have a PS+ subscription and I'd argue half or less don't have a headset, so those would have to be accounted for.

That being said, I still agree with your greater point about price-perf not really being a great metric for PC, especially compared to 2014 when you actually could build a console killer for sub-$500. PS5 GPU is probably comparable to a 2060S or 2070 given various metrics (ik Valhalla seems to imply otherwise but that game is unfavorable to NVIDIA GPUs). Even if you're counting on next gen improvements through Ampere, a 3050 Ti (hopefully comparable to a 2060S) would probably cost $250, which would leave only $250 for the rest of the components and require a good bit of compromise. PC enthusiasts should instead promote the benefits of DLSS, better ray tracing, scalability, and most obviously, productivity and flexibility.
 

RayCharlizard

Member
Nov 2, 2017
2,969
While I kinda agree with the greater point of this, it's pretty disingenuous to say the console is the cost of the console alone while the PC HAS to include a desk, monitor, speakers, headset, etc. The only periphs you NEED for a PC are a mouse and keyboard, which you can get for $20-30 if you don't care for fancy stuff. I read your earlier arguments about not everybody having a monitor and TVs not being normal, but by that metric a very small portion of PS5 users don't have a PS+ subscription and I'd argue half or less don't have a headset, so those would have to be accounted for.

That being said, I still agree with your greater point about price-perf not really being a great metric for PC, especially compared to 2014 when you actually could build a console killer for sub-$500. PS5 GPU is probably comparable to a 2060S or 2070 given various metrics (ik Valhalla seems to imply otherwise but that game is unfavorable to NVIDIA GPUs). Even if you're counting on next gen improvements through Ampere, a 3050 Ti (hopefully comparable to a 2060S) would probably cost $250, which would leave only $250 for the rest of the components and require a good bit of compromise. PC enthusiasts should instead promote the benefits of DLSS, better ray tracing, scalability, and most obviously, productivity and flexibility.
This is all console gamers need.

ah9ktlia6ee11.jpg
 

gundamkyoukai

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,141
You went really hard on one line which is accurate (The DE is taking a bigger hit to be cheaper). I'm not concerned about Sony's bottom line, I'm recognizing which model Sony actually produces more of by a substantial margin because the tech of the PS5 is worth $499

Was the PS3 a $499 or $599 console in 2006? It's the easiest parallel to make a call on.

From what we seeing at least 15% to 20% of the model seem to be DE.
If Sony sold 2.1 million in the first 2 week like PS4 that is 420k DE @20%.
Either way that is a good amount of people with DE , that likely more than the new 3000 series GPUs and won't say they not on the market .
 

DongBeetle

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,017
If he's using a 1060 I already know this will be dumb. Sony and MS ate a lot of cost on these cutting edge systems and it's gonna be hard to beat them price wise. But soon enough you're gonna get to that part of the gen where it's almost harder to build a computer less powerful than the current consoles
 

Rylen

Member
Feb 5, 2019
466
Why wouldn't they just test DMC5 at Native 4K with it's unlocked framerate?

So much easier and no CPU bottleneck

With Digital Foundry, the native 4K Mode never drops below 60 FPS and the frame rate typically hovers around 80-100 FPS.

Yet in this supposed 1080p/120hz mode Steve gets this ? It's worse than Digital Foundries Native 4K results, It makes no sense

rgjbJZH.jpg
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,061
If the positioning of the video is more like 'I'd like to game on my PC - is that feasible at a similar enough level to a next gen console to reassure me' then fine. But a blunt comparison like this seems disingenous
 

medyej

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,440
This thread is a goldmine of reactionary defensive posts from people who clearly didn't watch the video. The first page alone is like wow.

People really rushed into this thread because of the OP title with their claws up, huh
 

Stoopkid

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,368
User Banned (1 Month) - Inflammatory Generalizations and Antagonizing others; History of similar
Oh yeah, let's use the rare-as-a-unicorn version to prove that it's a $400 system. The system that the vast majority will likely ever have access too is currently $500. The $500 system is the system that Sony is actually taking the least loss on too, because that drive didn't cost them close to $100.
I love the posts in here trying to claim the PS5 is a $399 console. It's $499, don't be disingenuous.
given the ratio Sony manufactured, the "$400 console" might as well not exist
Sony's marketing strategy is working really well on some people.
Y'all are starting to sound like trump. Like it or not the ps5 starts at $400.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,061
Can we not make armchair analyst points which are supposition and wield them as fact? We don't know if the cost of the PS5 is closer to the DE or drive version, or somewhere between. Fact is, its not remotely the same as the PS3 with important features removed, and many users are already digital.

Also with a comparison to a PC it would seem more A-B to have the discless version. Alternatively, spec the PC with a UHD bluray drive and playback software license just to be fair
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,951
PC gamers need to stop doing this "OH YOU CAN BUILD A PC FOR $500 DOLLARZ" bullshit. And this is coming from a gal who's been PC gaming for most of her life.

It's just... what's the point of these videos? The so called "500 builds" never include any peripherals, a monitor, a desk, or any of the extra shit that you need to actually use the PC. Then there's the fact that if you're gaming with a $500 gaming PC, you're probably not going to get to the parts of PC gaming that make it unique from console gaming (gaming over 60hz, g-sync/freesync, usually better graphics, etc.). And then there's the fact that that 500 build will maybe get you through a year or two of medium-low end gaming before you're running games at 30fps. And that's not even getting to the fact that you usually can't even build a PC for that cheap in the first place unless you rob a computer store or are given components for free.

Instead of these clickbaity "U CaN BuILd a CONsol Kill3rz foOr $500" fake ass videos, why don't youtubers be more honest with their audiences? Instead of lying to people about these mythical $500 gaming builds, how about they instead focus on realistically cheap builds (800-1200 range), or focus on how people can upgrade their old builds to 'catch up' with new games. Like, PC gaming is always going to be a rich person's arena and unless people stop pre-ordering $1000 GPUs I don't see that changing.

To be fair; If you have been building a PC all your time, then you also understand that you don't end up buying a monitor, desk, keyboard, mouse every time you upgrade most of the PC components (the PC block mainly), just like how you don't keep purchasing a new TV and sound bar every time someone gets a new console or multiple consoles.

Note: I have a GTX 1060 and it can never run something like RDR2 at 4K 60fps (let around 4K and constant 30fps), compared to Series X and PS5 at equivalent settings. So I understand the performance profiles. But emphasizing that there is need to buy other additional associated costs also warrants bringing up the old/ancient discussion about "What I can do with PC, that you cannot do on consoles".

Edit
To be even more accurate, someone who has also been using a PC for a long time. For me the realistic* costs to switch to more performance is just the CPU, Motherboard, RAM and GPU (that would be my budget/goal and no other costs associated except them). Why should I waste throwing away my cabinet, PSU and storage drives the bin to get everything new just because I am transitioning to a faster PC.
 
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Kolx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,505
The amount of cuts he had to take just to get with that conclusion in that end is astounding. It almost feels like he was set dead on getting that conclusion and then started to make the video with how ridiculous some of his criteria are.
 

BobbeMalle

Banned
Dec 5, 2017
2,019
There was no need for GN to make a video like this. It feels completely out of place, since everybody knows that for now you just can't beat a 399 console like the PS5. Yes, it's sold at loss, yes PC will be better in 2 years for the same money but for now it's actually a pretty good offer.
That said, the advantage of building a PC is not the upfront cost of components, but the price of videogames who are always at 30/35 euros/dollars on day one.