It can't be. It would have to be the greatest video game of all time and then some to even get close to justifying some of CDPR's shit.
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It can't be. It would have to be the greatest video game of all time and then some to even get close to justifying some of CDPR's shit.
your posts are really insightful on this from a management perspective. thanks
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Well this is certainly an interesting take. Jason dropped facts based on comprehensive journalism across numerous sources/employees, and brought receipts. I'm not sure that there's much room to play victim here.
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Yes actually I have. It was a little different, I was the lead of a merger/acquisition department. So you can GTFO with your shit.
Just the other day I saw that Jason had dropped something from his backpack, and when I went to pick it up, I found out the malicious truth of his agenda
And since he isn't working for a gaming specific outlet anymore but for big ass Bloomberg, he doesn't have to fear any kind of blacklisting
God, this forum gets so full of motivated reasoning when it comes to darling AAA video games. CDPR has been transphobic and super crunchy about this game. You can still want to buy it, just don't try to justify it by preetending everything is peachy in the background.
Regardless of what industry one chooses to work in, there will always be those who put in more time than others, paid or not. There will always be a manager who pressures their employees to go 110%. "Going above and beyond the call of duty" was once something to be celebrated, whereas now we shame it completely.
The truth is some choose to do it, others are pressured. Some get paid OT, others do not. Some have families that they're neglecting at home, others have no family other than those they work with.
This is not an issue of "good vs evil". Mandatory crunch is not something that should be celebrated, but is a complicated issue that should be reviewed on a case by case basis, with solutions brought forward that ensure the best outcome for all of the involved parties.
How is it our business to tell CDPR how much effort / time they should spend on a project that they're passionate about??
The truth is some choose to do it, others are pressured. Some get paid OT, others do not. Some have families that they're neglecting at home, others have no family other than those they work with.
This is not an issue of "good vs evil". Mandatory crunch is not something that should be celebrated, but is a complicated issue that should be reviewed on a case by case basis, with solutions brought forward that ensure the best outcome for all of the involved parties.
How is it our business to tell CDPR how much effort / time they should spend on a project that they're passionate about??
Love it when someone (Paris) accuses someone else (Jason) of having an agenda while they themselves receive free shit from the company they're defending.
They seem to be whining that he doesn't engage them in a "conversation" on Twitter about his reporting or the situations he reports on, and makes liberal use of the block function. That's what they call toxic - the fact that he is essentially ignoring them.
The mob complaint is laughable. Don't want to get quote tweeted? Don't make the original tweet
Really curious to know how many of these people who work at outlets have done original reporting themselves vs rehashing an IGN article that's based on a press release or copy from a Game's website.
Ah perfect. Thanks Thanatos. As I'm not aware of most things in English, I can only apology to misunderstand or not do my work to understand the meaning of crunch.
I think most people in "defense" of crunch do not know this, and they are talking about personal overtime, not crunch.
My apology and thanks again!
edit: Some mod should threadmark this post from Thanatos. It's really good.
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You recognize that "going gold" does not mean development is done, right? Not in the modern context of video games. Hasn't been for many years.
Wanna see some receipts on him sending his mob out. Publicly defending his reporting isn't sending out a mob.
Also, what the fuck is this dark agenda they all keep going at?
Okay... buckle up. Time to explain how cert and gold work these days.
Cert/FQA/Lot Check are important milestones, because they ensure that the game meets standards on all of the different console platforms on which the game will appear. This checks for stuff like "Do you use the correct button icons?" and "Do all your achievements/trophies work?" and "Does your game interface with the operating system for boot and shut down properly."
This process is LONG checklist, but it does not mean the game is done. It means it passes MVP (minimum viable product) standards set forth by the platform holders. It doesn't mean the game is at the quality the developer or publisher wants for launch.
Almost every studio relies on day one patches, even on PC. Many review games on PC come with a review branch password so reviewers can access the build and it can be updated on the road to launch. Cyberpunk isn't going to be any different. This is what happens between "gold" (a term that no longer has much meaning) and launch.
Lot of people here hiding behind the "What if they love what they're doing and want to work 60 hours" bullshit.
I like Parris a lot, but he seems to carry the water for CDPR consistently.
I also don't believe Liana in this.
The problem that you are kind of glossing over is that doctors, lawyers, bankers and engineers make $100,000+ a year in many cases.
Game development crunch impacts the lowest level (often outsourced) employees the most, who are crunching at $20,000 a year and are likely in school or working a job just to make ends meet. These are the people being exploited the most, and these are the people who, if they don't work on the project until it launches, are scrubbed from the credits and/or never credited to begin with.
So yes, its absolutely a failure of management and its always bad, because crunch in the video game industry trickles down and hurts people at the bottom the most.
Yes but the act of fixing things shortly before release generally means major code cannot be fucked with. It also means that if QA finds, say, an art bug that causes seizures in some people or say, the ability to block all progress in the game shortly before launch, the teams behind those mechanics and systems, even if they don't want to crunch, suddenly have to to get it fixed and/or remove it before launch.
Thats kind of the problem, teams underestimate/undershoot how much time they'll actually need to fix bugs because they've been so busy trying to just make a game. It's also why the common way to fix bugs shortly before launch is either by removing the feature entirely if it isn't core or by slapping a "Will not fix" label on it.
I love all the talk of "agenda" without these people actually naming said agenda. I guess that might make them look bad.
Apparently Jason being a douche and CDPR ethically crunching is mutually exclusive.
It's not just crunch culture, but people have jumped hoops to defend other very problematic things from CD Project Red.
Also, lol at betting against probably the best video games investigative journalist current working.
Didn't Alanah do the same thing about the ND articles? Her conversations with the devs there returned the same responses.
The saddest part of the displays of half-assed volunteer corporate apologism must be the complete lack of self-awareness.
Cynical me says these people wholly understand what they're doing. They recognize that for most in the "games journalism" space, this kind of coverage is a stepping stone to working PR for these large companies in the future.
Really great posts about project management! Completely agree with everything you've said.
Richard from HoegLaw seemingly agreeing with him
Didn't expect to see this dude involved in this stuff
Damn that thread is an eye opener. Gotta spotlight a section a couple down from there.
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I think Jason is in the right here, but from following games for about 10 years I do feel like he can be a bit of a jerk.
Looks like she has been getting harassed... of course
Looks like she has been getting harassed... of course
I don't think this is generally true in the video game industry anymore.
Many of them are quite well compensated, given overtime pay, and are paid a bonus.
The estimated bonus CDPR employees stand to make this year from profit sharing is $50k per employee in addition to their base pay.
That's what I've seen from my experience so far, at least in Canada. Maybe they have laws for that protecting employees.
I mean Paris is a guy who deals with Colteastwood, Tim Dog etc.. what do you expect from him lol
"Sends his followers". People just don't get it (or they do not want to get it).
We both agree crunch is wrong. If I come off as dismissive of crunch I apologize.
Where else can I even bring up this topic anyway. Slave labor in China has been completely avoided.
Any chance I get I'm going to bring it up. I'm going to bring it up in every topic where we talk about games journalism.
You can call it whataboutism.....that's not the intention.
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I'd say it's like that in any industry though, the more time you dedicate to your employer/organization, the better you will be seen as you are showing dedication, there is nothing wrong with that and of course it should somewhat affect your career growth as when it's time for promotions you will always be compared to your peers, and no one would choose the person who works less, especially if the people you are comparing are just as efficient. I manage people and dedication is an actual thing we look at and on which I am being looked at as well.
I work in a field where deadlines can't be pushed back and where crunch is often forced, I've done 36-48 hour shifts more times than I can count (and I have a fixed salary so no extra income in my case), but nothing is stopping me from leaving my job. I have a wife of 15 years now and kids by the way so it's not like I don't have a family life to attend to.
In the end, business is business, and it's totally understandable. And after seeing a few places with unions (just look at Canada Post for a good example of how bad it can get and how much of your hard earned money is wasted there) and see how easy people have it, how well they are paid yet how ineffective they are in general, I can't say I agree with the idea of unions everywhere to protect workers. Imo, it encourages laziness as they tend to overprotect, but that is what I have more commonly seen in my career before my current job. I've mostly worked in government jobs though where I don't like to see taxpayer money go to waste so maybe it's different elsewhere.
Also, lawyer here: " crunch " in the law is a deeply toxic system whereby a few people are made very wealthy by the labor of the many. Big law firms chew up 20 something-year-old kids and spit them out. They literally hire dozens of associates with the intent that most of them will burn out. And then they hire a new set and do it over again. It's an incredibly immoral practice that ruins lives.
The idea that crunch is only video games or that it's okay is the stupidest thing ever.
The idea that crunch is only video games or that it's okay is the stupidest thing ever.
That makes sense, but then what is the suggested fix for that? How can the need for crunch be prevented? Better management is easy to say but especially creative projects are hard to time and shit always comes up in the end. Then some say delays just lead to more crunch. So to me it seems like we either need to stop producing games that big and complex or be fine with a whole of bugs.
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