Game Grumps release statement acknowledging and apologizing for racist jokes/actions

[Sacul64]

Is Jontron still riding the 'Ill keep my personal racism politics out of my comedy' schtick or has he too seen the light considering everyone is getting exposed/gone full nazi.

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Did people forget Jon Tron is a White Nationalist or did he change and apologize The Completionist, PBG, NakeyJakey?

So I had come across this topic and clams were made that Jirard was with Jon Tron and ProJared again. When asked to back this up the user showed that Jirard and PBG had both attended Jon Tron's wedding and another user show a youtuber I'm unaware of NakeyJakey hugging Jon. For those that dont...

www.resetera.com

Got a lovely topic here about it all. GameGrumps tweet was nice to see while dealing with people whos content I enjoyed are still freinds behind the scenes.

 

[Trisc]

I'm glad Arin's not abandoning his past history of saying and doing regrettable things. He's owning it and apologizing for it. It says to me that he's really grown as a person, and while we shouldn't celebrate him for it ("I'm sorry I was shitty" doesn't really deserve a pat on the back), it's clear to me that he's sincere and remorseful.

 

[Protoman200X]

I'm glad Arin's not abandoning his past history of saying and doing regrettable things. He's owning it and apologizing for it. It says to me that he's really grown as a person, and while we shouldn't celebrate him for it ("I'm sorry I was shitty" doesn't really deserve a pat on the back), it's clear to me that he's sincere and remorseful.

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The way I see it, it's baby steps. And even if he will never get out of that stigma of what he was when he was younger, learning and growing from that experience is the better outcome than staying stagnant.

 

[Kain-Nosgoth]

Not the first time they apologised too, they're clearly aware of it and doing progress in that regard

when you hear some of their stories on grump, you can't possibly doubt deep down they're good people, they were just stuck for a long time in edgy humor, and i get that, i was too, i did bad jokes for a long time

People can learn, people can change

Fuck jontron though, no sign of change with him

 

[AliceAmber]

It's mostly Dan. He defends making them several times on the show when I use to watch them. Arin does push back on it but he doesn't push back far enough for what I would like for him to. Dan bragged one episode about getting permission to do black jokes from Jacob Anderson.

Like I said before, I'm not gonna be too cynical on Arin because I've watched him since Jontron days till a few years ago and I can see how he's changed and even addressed several times on the show how he wants to remove certain words from his vocabulary to be less hurtful so I def see him being genuine here. Dan on the other hand, I don't fuck with him...

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I completely agree. Its Dan now. Hopefully this is a wakeup call.

 

[Skyebaron]

Don't read the comments.

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This only picked my curiosity

What the fuck. That is some audience.

 

[Professor Beef]

It's clear that Dan, as the older half of the Grumps, has always been a bit slower to change. But it rarely seems malicious, if that makes sense. Like it's clear (as an example) gender identity is new territory to him, but he never goes out of the way to intentionally misgender someone to be an asshole because he's still trying to learn it. Arin seems to be helping him along with that though, which is great.

I think anyone trying to handwave Arin's feelings and integrity towards all of this is likely not arguing in good faith, just like the people who still trot out that video of the instances of him saying a bunch of ignorant shit from a decade ago while ignoring all of the growth he's shown since then, as well as the apologies.

EDIT: the Grumps' statement as a whole reminded me of the time they publically (in a GG Live show at least) said they would never work with JonTron again after the vile things he said.

 

[MinusTydus]

Yeah, nope. These are not good people.

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There's bonus homophobia in the Silent Hill: Shattered Memories LP.

And that's post JonTron.

They really aren't good people.

 

[HustleBun]

I discovered GameGrumps only a few years ago. I only knew of Arin's shitty Newgrounds and early Grumps humor when he apologized and told his audience why it wasn't ok. I thought that was interesting.

But it still didn't prepare me for how angry and sick I felt watching the montage that someone linked above. I found it a month ago, it's Arin from 2008-2012 making racist jokes and even using the n-word in some of his Newgrounds cartoons. It was disgusting. And even though the video was made by an alt-right YouTuber looking to trash him "for becoming an SJW" it didn't eliminate the fact that these clips were all real.

Right now he gets a lot of flack from alt-right viewers and tons of Twitter and YouTube comments about how he "betrayed his Newgrounds friends" for disowning his old cartoons for being problematic. Or GameGrumps fans that "feel insulted" because he even called out his early Dan era humor like "Sad Hoshi" for harmful stereotypes. But I think that's what I appreciate about him.

This isn't Arin's first apology and it's far from the first time that he has told his audience that he doesn't feel good about his past, that he's trying to learn and be better or openly describing going to therapy to learn to be a better listener.

It's completely valid to say "nah fuck him, he said those things and I'm calling it- he's not a good person."

But the self-awareness, willingness to listen and learn and admitting past problematic behavior because you're self-assessing instead of reacting to being called out, is something that I really appreciate.

I wish there was more of it in the world.

And from listening to him talk about this stuff and share what he's learned with his impressionable audience is something that I find valuable, and I found this apology to be very genuine and heartfelt.

and fuck Jontron.

 

[Deleted member 21709]

They're just afraid of the movement and changing times. I don't buy it. Fuck them all.

 

[Professor Beef]

It's completely valid to say "nah fuck him, he said those things and I'm calling it- he's not a good person."

But the self-awareness, willingness to listen and learn and admitting past problematic behavior because you're self-assessing instead of reacting to being called out, is something that I really appreciate.

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That's my take as well. I've seen his growth first-hand and know he's being sincere with all of this, but for the people who still feel the hurt it's just as valid to not want to accept the apology.

 

[Deleted member 61909]

It's clear that Dan, as the older half of the Grumps, has always been a bit slower to change. But it rarely seems malicious, if that makes sense. Like it's clear (as an example) gender identity is new territory to him, but he never goes out of the way to intentionally misgender someone to be an asshole because he's still trying to learn it. Arin seems to be helping him along with that though, which is great.

I think anyone trying to handwave Arin's feelings and integrity towards all of this is likely not arguing in good faith, just like the people who still trot out that video of the instances of him saying a bunch of ignorant shit from a decade ago while ignoring all of the growth he's shown since then, as well as the apologies.

EDIT: the Grumps' statement as a whole reminded me of the time they publically (in a GG Live show at least) said they would never work with JonTron again after the vile things he said.

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I feel like the issue with Dan is that he feels comedy should have no limit's. When I use to watch GG, he used to constantly say how "we should be able to laugh at ourselves". He's not considering how harmful offensive jokes are to the marginalized groups he's making fun of and that bothers me.

 

[Professor Beef]

I feel like the issue with Dan is that he feels comedy should have no limit's. When I use to watch GG, he used to constantly say how "we should be able to laugh at ourselves". He's not considering how harmful offensive jokes are to the marginalized groups he's making fun of and that bothers me.

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Yeah that's definitely where his older mentality comes in, and it's a shame.

 

[Weiss]

I feel like the issue with Dan is that he feels comedy should have no limit's. When I use to watch GG, he used to constantly say how "we should be able to laugh at ourselves". He's not considering how harmful offensive jokes are to the marginalized groups he's making fun of and that bothers me.

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Man, that's such a downer to hear. I really admired him.

I hope he's able to course correct before he does something really bad.

 

[M.J.]

Fuck racism is right! Fuck you too! Keep donating chumps!

 

[ElephantShell]

Honestly don't know much about these guys, I'm aware of them but never really watched their stuff. But I will say I do like when people plainly say "if you don't agree with this go ahead and unsubscribe" it does make things seem more genuine. When your entire career is reliant upon your audience and you're fully willing to tell part of it to fuck off I think that says something.

 

[Protoman200X]

Man, that's such a downer to hear. I really admired him.

I hope he's able to course correct before he does something really bad.

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My take is Arin, Brian, and co. are going to give him a talk that he needs to realize that offensive jokes to marginalized groups can be pretty damn harmful, and he needs to shape up.

 

[HustleBun]

2014 Danny goes into rough territory, him and Arin doing a lot of stereotype voices of people from other countries, shitty stuff like that. I found myself not always enjoying that era when I go back and watch that year. There's an awful moment where Danny creates a homophobic NPC in Zelda, something is bleeped and Danny says "Barry, edit that out, that's a horrible word". I can only assume what it was.

Then he starts saying he's going to ease off of that stuff, that he doesn't want to hurt anyone. One specific example is when he starts one video by saying "I'm trying to remove r*tard from my vocabulary", he and Arin get into a conversation about changing as people and "if you learn that a word hurts a group of people, just stop using that word. Don't be an asshole". I think it's during the Castlevania Dracula X playthrough. He's true to his word, there's a big change that happens as Grumps videos progress.

I used to assume he was more progressive. They used to promise no politics but Danny had a funny habit of saying "I don't mean to get political but..." and usually go into a rant that I completely agreed with. Pro-gay rights, issues with gun nuts, his hatred for Trump. But it's never safe to assume.

But 2020 Danny has made a couple of remarks about political correctness v. comedy and how sometimes people are too sensitive. It felt really shitty to hear that coming from him. Arin pushed back on him and they had a little convo about it but it was weird.

I like Danny, he has a big heart and has done a lot of wonderful things for fans, for charity, etc. I hope there's not a deeper rabbit hole there.

My take is Arin, Brian, and co. are going to give him a talk that he needs to realize that offensive jokes to marginalized groups can be pretty damn harmful, and he needs to shape up.

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That's right, Ninja Brian is super left leaning too. Wish I heard him actually speak more often.

 

[Professor Beef]

Not to truly compare them, but the thing I've noticed about Jon and Danny is that one of them is actually receptive to change and the feelings of the fanbase (even if it's baby steps), while the other would rather keep going.

 

[mhayes86]

I was kind of surprised they had any statement at all since they always seemed to resist much in the way of political or social commentary not to split their base, I suppose.

Having followed Arin back on Newgrounds and eventually discovered Game Grumps during the Jon era, I couldn't stand it. Once Dan joined I started liking their content a bit more. That said, I wasn't aware of the slurs they used back then, geez. Fortunately they distanced themselves from Jon and publicly stated they'd never work with him again due to what he's said.

They've come off as being fairly transparent, learn, and have grown over the years. There was some word Arin used often for a while, and mentioned in an episode that someone told him not to use it due to being racially insensitive, so he stopped using it and apologized. I can't remember what it was. They seem like their hearts are in the right place, but there is definitely room for improvement.

 

[Melody Shreds]

It's clear that Arin has grown and made a huge effort to change over the years just from watching his videos, Dan seems to be having a much harder time considering how many times Arin has had to push back at some of Dan's jokes lately.
Danny being an old school comedian type might have something to do with it, he clearly has a hard time understanding things like gender issues that Arin on the other hand is very familiar with and explains things as often as he can during videos.

The thing with Arin though is this isn't his first apology, he has apologized so many times for his past shittyness and has donated significant amounts of many to good causes. It's weird to say after his newgrounds edgelord years but he's become a pretty good person.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

They're just afraid of the movement and changing times. I don't buy it. Fuck them all.

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Arin's been talking about how ashamed he is of his old behavior for years, though. It's not like this is anywhere close to the first time he's addressed this stuff or apologized for it.

 

[Protoman200X]

2014 Danny goes into rough territory, him and Arin doing a lot of stereotype voices of people from other countries, shitty stuff like that. I found myself not always enjoying that era when I go back and watch that year. There's an awful moment where Danny creates a homophobic NPC in Zelda, something is bleeped and Danny says "Barry, edit that out, that's a horrible word". I can only assume what it was.

Then he starts saying he's going to ease off of that stuff, that he doesn't want to hurt anyone. One specific example is when he starts one video by saying "I'm trying to remove r*tard from my vocabulary", he and Arin get into a conversation about changing as people and "if you learn that a word hurts a group of people, just stop using that word. Don't be an asshole". I think it's during the Castlevania Dracula X playthrough. He's true to his word, there's a big change that happens as Grumps videos progress.

I used to assume he was more progressive. They used to promise no politics but Danny had a funny habit of saying "I don't mean to get political but..." and usually go into a rant that I completely agreed with. Pro-gay rights, issues with gun nuts, his hatred for Trump. But it's never safe to assume.

But 2020 Danny has made a couple of remarks about political correctness v. comedy and how sometimes people are too sensitive. It felt really shitty to hear that coming from him. Arin pushed back on him and they had a little convo about it but it was weird.

I like Danny, he has a big heart and has done a lot of wonderful things for fans, for charity, etc. I hope there's not a deeper rabbit hole there.

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If Eddie Murphy, part of the same generation that popularized 1970's/1980's SNL, who nowadays cringes at his RAW and Delirious stand-up skits (he even said he wanted to gag when he watches his old routines from that era) and works to better himself as a comedian, then there's hope for Danny.

We all have our own personal hubris. No one is perfect. But it's a matter of knowing if you're willing to learn and grow from those experiences and become a better person in the long-run.

 

[Deleted member 1589]

Glad Arin has been receptive to change, but we shall see. I havent kept up with any of his works after you know, learning what he has said throughout the years.

JonTron however,

 

[ClutchAnderson]

FOH.

 

[Wetwork]

I definitely feel like there's hope to be made in Danny. I watched his NSP career go from more sexism and crass to more making fun of himself and his character. Just a 40 year old dude, former drug addict, actively trying to better himself. I saw them in 2017, and he quoted how (paraphrasing) there is a lot fucked up shit going in the world, and we all need to love each other. Friends, family, neighbors alike. I absolutely feel like Dan is a genuine man, just needs a little more pushing. But, as someone who hasn't been keeping up lately due to a disinterest in their humor and style, I can only speak for myself.

As iterated above, anyone who feels that they are irredeemable, not good, or ingenuine, that's absolutely fair and valid. Fullstop.

 

[DNAbro]

Arin has constantly shown that he wants to better himself and I really respect that. I remember when all his ex-newgrounds friends started attacking him for being too PC after he told another animator to not punch down and he just completely ignored them and made that statement apologizing for past behavior. They seemed obviously jealous of his success. I also remembered he was the only youtuber who responded to one of the threads on here about shitty you tubers about his past behavior.

Still really enjoy his content and the work he has done.

 

[HustleBun]

Arin has constantly shown that he wants to better himself and I really respect that. I remember when all his ex-newgrounds friends started attacking him for being too PC after he told another animator to not punch down and he just completely ignored them and made that statement apologizing for past behavior. They seemed obviously jealous of his success. I also remembered he was the only youtuber who responded to one of the threads on here about shitty you tubers about his past behavior.

Still really enjoy his content and the work he has done.

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That's the big "betraying his friends at Newgrounds" that people still spam and harass him about?

That he told one of his old animator friends to chill on problematic jokes? And they couldn't handle it?

Fucking hell man.

I've seen more than a few people on Era talk about getting a personal apology from Arin or having him enter conversations online on forums when people have an issue with him. That's really cool. I didn't know he did that.

 

[Protoman200X]

That's the big "betraying his friends at Newgrounds" that people still spam and harass him about?

That he told one of his old animator friends to chill on problematic jokes? And they couldn't handle it?

Fucking hell man.

I've seen more than a few people on Era talk about getting a personal apology from Arin or having him enter conversations online on forums when people have an issue with him. That's really cool. I didn't know he did that.

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Look at it this way. It's great when certain people show their true colours and outright tell you they're trash, as it makes life easier for everybody when the trash takes itself out.

Anyway, Arin doesn't do it as often nowadays, as he can't handle the stress of people verbally harassing him online as he once did. And who can blame him? That type of harassment can eventually get to you, no matter how good you are with not allowing people to get your goat.

 

[UltimateHigh]

I've watched them less and less these past few years but they aren't bad people at all (certainly not perfect, who is?) and absolutely come across as sincere on social issues.

Jon Tron having a successful career after all his shit is fucking disgusting though.

 

[HustleBun]

Yeah. That's the thing that really bothers me.

Arin becoming more and more sincere, open-minded, heartfelt and pretty god damn progressive.

Other the other side Jon has gone full alt-right and arguably full on white supremacist, making open statements about immigrants muddying the gene pool and quoting fake black on white crime stats.

Which one of these two keeps breaking the top 10 trending videos on YouTube every time they release a video? Which one of these two continues to get work, has appeared as a voice in games and in a commercial with Justin Roiland?

It's so fucked.

 

[Gunny T Highway]

Arin and Danny of course are not perfect (none of us are), but they over the years have continually strived to be better people. Jon has been doing the complete opposite.

 

[DNAbro]

Yeah. That's the thing that really bothers me.

Arin becoming more and more sincere, open-minded, heartfelt and pretty god damn progressive.

Other the other side Jon has gone full alt-right and arguably full on white supremacist, making open statements about immigrants muddying the gene pool and quoting fake black on white crime stats.

Which one of these two keeps breaking the top 10 trending videos on YouTube every time they release a video? Which one of these two continues to get work, has appeared as a voice in games and in a commercial with Justin Roiland?

It's so fucked.

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Wasn't Arin actually a VA on Rick and Morty?

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Yeah. That's the thing that really bothers me.

Arin becoming more and more sincere, open-minded, heartfelt and pretty god damn progressive.

Other the other side Jon has gone full alt-right and arguably full on white supremacist, making open statements about immigrants muddying the gene pool and quoting fake black on white crime stats.

Which one of these two keeps breaking the top 10 trending videos on YouTube every time they release a video? Which one of these two continues to get work, has appeared as a voice in games and in a commercial with Justin Roiland?

It's so fucked.

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Arin gets plenty of voice work. I just don't think he pursues it as avidly as Jon does because he's busy running his company.

 

[Seesaw15]

Which one of these two keeps breaking the top 10 trending videos on YouTube every time they release a video? Which one of these two continues to get work, has appeared as a voice in games and in a commercial with Justin Roiland?

It's so fucked.

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Jon at this point is an unsalvageable piece of shit but Arin/the Game Grumps brand is still doing really well. Arin does a ton of voice acting in TV/video games and his channel does well but the format of 10+ minute game playthroughs is never going to break into trending.

 

[HustleBun]

That's not my point.

My point is that Jon made despicable comments about immigrants and people of color, he stood by them and his apology was a double down.

After that, he continued getting voice work, he appeared in commercials and he frequently hits the Top Trending videos on YouTube.

It makes me fucking sick.

And I'm so done with "well I can separate art from artist, he's still funny to me". That's your privilege. Because he's not talking about you, you can shrug it off. I don't understand that mindset.

 

[waugh]

As iterated above, anyone who feels that they are irredeemable, not good, or ingenuine, that's absolutely fair and valid. Fullstop.

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Nah, fuck that. How can we expect the world to change if we don't allow people a path forward to become more progressive. Don't cast away people who want to become better because all of you sure as shit didn't come out the womb perfect.

If you want a better world you better be prepared to make it better.

 

[HustleBun]

Nah, fuck that. How can we expect the world to change if we don't allow people a path forward to become more progressive. Don't cast away people who want to become better because all of you sure as shit didn't come out the womb perfect.

If you want a better world you better be prepared to make it better.

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I understand but let's try to look at it a different way.

Look. It does bother me when I see drive-by comments or folks that only saw 10 yr old clips declaring "these are bad people", "they are only apologizing because of the current situation". We believe they're wrong because we've seen the growth demonstrated in the 6 years afterwards, we've seen Arin call himself out, participate in difficult conversations, give to important causes and change over time. It's really good to see.

But we also need to remember that those jokes still exist. Imagine being a person of color and seeing a clip of your favorite content creator doing "black voice" or making jokes about harmful stereotypes that impact your culture.

Does it matter how old these clips are? Does it matter that they were assembled by racists trying to punish that creator for "becoming an SJW"? No. It doesn't matter.

They still hurt. They still exist.

And people have a right to choose not to forgive.

Of course people need to be allowed to grow and evolve. Of course. But that does not that wipe away history and we do not have the right to tell people how or when to forgive someone.

Part of growing is accepting the consequences for your mistakes and understanding that you cannot erase them.

 

[Professor Beef]

Nah, fuck that. How can we expect the world to change if we don't allow people a path forward to become more progressive. Don't cast away people who want to become better because all of you sure as shit didn't come out the womb perfect.

If you want a better world you better be prepared to make it better.

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Far be it for me to speak for that poster, but I think the sentiment isn't "if you think they can never be redeemed or change ever then that's ok," but rather "you should not be forced to accept their apology if you're not ready to."

 

[zektbach]

Don't like "And again, if it bothers you that this is where we stand, you can easily unsubscribe."

If you realise that where you stand bothers people, you can easily remove all of the content in question so that you no longer receive any monetary benefit from it... Or you know, if people don't like it, turn that thumbs up into a thumbs down and hit that subscribe button a second time. Or donate any monetary gains from said content going forward? Just telling people "if you don't like it, you know where the bell is" is pretty shitty

EDIT:

Ah okay, I see they're saying "if any of what we're saying this bother you, you can unsubscribe". Forgot the order of images. Still, de-monetizing the content would be a good idea.

 

[Deleted member 25140]

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Fucking hell

 

[HustleBun]

Don't like "And again, if it bothers you that this is where we stand, you can easily unsubscribe."

If you realise that where you stand bothers people, you can easily remove all of the content in question so that you no longer receive any monetary benefit from it... Or you know, if people don't like it, turn that thumbs up into a thumbs down and hit that subscribe button a second time. Or donate any monetary gains from said content going forward? Just telling people "if you don't like it, you know where the bell is" is pretty shitty

Click to shrink...

That's not what they meant at all. I see how this is confusing and they probably could it have worded it better.

They are saying "if you don't like that we support the protesters/BLM and you disagree with our stance on the issue you can unsubscribe" which is actually fucking great. I am appreciating all the content creators that take a hard line stance like this.

Again, totally see where the confusion comes from.

Fucking hell

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Maybe we should stop boosting videos with Jontron.

 

[Contramann]

I mean at least it's an apology but nah that shit ain't enough. It wasn't just JonTron making all the jokes.

 

[Johann Mistletoe]

Nah, fuck that. How can we expect the world to change if we don't allow people a path forward to become more progressive. Don't cast away people who want to become better because all of you sure as shit didn't come out the womb perfect.

If you want a better world you better be prepared to make it better.

Click to shrink...

I get where you're coming from and I personally don't doubt the Grumps' sincerity and growth, but I wouldn't fault anyone for being wary when we live in a world where opportunism and exploitation (especially from people with a business to run) are ubiquitous.

 

[HustleBun]

Look. It does bother me when I see drive-by comments or folks that only saw 10 yr old clips declaring "these are bad people", "they are only apologizing because of the current situation". We believe they're wrong because we've seen the growth demonstrated in the 6 years afterwards, we've seen Arin call himself out, participate in difficult conversations, give to important causes and change over time. It's really good to see.

But we also need to remember that those jokes still exist. Imagine being a person of color and seeing a clip of your favorite content creator doing "black voice" or making jokes about harmful stereotypes that impact your culture.

Does it matter how old these clips are? Does it matter that they were assembled by racists trying to punish that creator for "becoming an SJW"? No. It doesn't matter.

They still hurt. They still exist.

And people have a right to choose not to forgive.

Of course people need to be allowed to grow and evolve. Of course. But that does not that wipe away history and we do not have the right to tell people how or when to forgive someone.

Part of growing is accepting the consequences for your mistakes and understanding that you cannot erase them.

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needs repeating, over and over again.

 

[Htown]

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[Inugami]

.

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We get it, can we not do this though? One video was bad enough, we don't need to post "greatest racist hits" compilations throughout the thread.

 

[Protoman200X]

We get it, can we not do this though? One video was bad enough, we don't need to post "greatest racist hits" compilations throughout the thread.

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Basically this.

"no jon." Barry, 2012

 

[Jeremy]

There's bonus homophobia in the Silent Hill: Shattered Memories LP.

And that's post JonTron.

They really aren't good people.

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Ooof... So self-serving and shameless.

 

[DNAbro]

Apparently they are going back and removing old videos/series that have offensive content now.

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