The people online wanting pokemon to go open world mmo is actually the echo chamber.
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Game Freak "prioritising original projects... more than Pokémon", has adopted a new structure
- Thread starter Dwebble
- Start date
Open worlds usually lack structure, are empty, include meaningless side-quests full of fluff, make the story worse, take a huge amount of resources (especially when we are talking hundreds of Pokemon roaming the world) and we've had so many open world games in recent years that Pokemon sticking to going from point A to B is refreshing imo.
Do you think Sword and shield will be the inferior games regardless of how much content is in them?
What if there was a way you haven't thought of yet that could make a game in the Pokemon universe even more fulfilling though? I'm sure a ton of people thought Nintendo had perfected Zelda gameplay with Link to the Past, only to totally revel in z-targeting and 3D combat with Ocarina of Time.
I mean it wouldn't have to be giant fields, it could easily mirror what the Pokemon world is like now, couldn't it? I'm not saying I want "Pokemon Breath of the Wild" - but something less linear, something more open, etc. I agree with you, open-world has become stale, but I've fantasized about an open-world Pokemon game since pretty much the beginning.
Let's Go are the worst Pokemon games I have ever played. Even though I like visible pokemon in the world (the integration was dog shit though as the world was not dezigned for it), mechanically and gameplay wise its just fucking ass.
I can not be excited about something that I do not know how it is. I can only make equivalences of things that exist and do not fit into what I want from Pokemon.
Because of the fact that they went backwards, yes.
Suuuuure.
That's fair, but could you not also be open to people wanting GameFreak to try new things with the Pokemon IP? Like I said, it's possible to like Pokemon but not like the fact that the games haven't changed all that much since the original game. It seems to be "we want the same thing we don't want it at all" for a lot of Pokemon fans.
I'd honestly even be super happy with a game that maintained the gameplay and genre, but tried something different with the story/narrative structure. It'd be cool to see something like Fantasy Life Pokemon game where you could play the game as a breeder, or as a gym leader, etc. - but it kept the RPG elements and catching mechanics etc.
Hell, if a Pokemon game was coming out and they said "yes it's 8 gyms again, a rival again, etc. - but this time the starters are going to be fighting, poison, and ghost, and the gym leaders are going to have varied teams" I'd be so in (not actually advocating for those types, just an example).
Nah, if sword and shield have a crap ton of postgame, new megas, skippable cutscenes and a higher difficult, then people will consider it the superior game.
Let's Go is a rehash of the XY artstyle though? And SWSH are way less strictly cartoony than SM which is very apparent if you look at the style of the sky, water, and vegetation. The only thing similar is the character proportions and I cannot believe anyone would prefer Let's Go's chibis with the plastic shading and random bloom everywhere instead of cel shading and outlines. SWSH have much better lighting and scene compositions all around too. Random encounters are back but nothing points to them being the only way to encounter Pokémon either as even Sun and Moon had dynamic encounters scattered through the region, some of which were fully realized like Wimpod, and some that used shadows instead.
You can't really call him wanting a echo chamber, when this is becoming a echo chamber in it in itself
Its left a lingering feeling, and I know most casual fans I've met in my personal life went 'i didn't bother with black/white 2, why would I?" hence the statements I made, even regardless of the quality of each game, I met many people who's response was "Meh, looks like the last one" which is a problem. Each the past few generations, regardless of quality, they haven't been able to shake that general presentation sameness feeling, and it doesn't look like they will with sword/shield either, but I'm excited regardless.
That's a complete walk back from "I want an open world Pokemon". SwSh could have a lot of differences, we have had 1 min of vague gameplay so far, though from what we've seen, the 'gym' battles are happening in stadiums this time so there could be more meaning behind them. S/M also switched up the gym formula too did it not?
They developed Pokemon Quest, there's your new thing :P
Nah, seems pretty balanced between people who are content with the current state of Pokemon and people who want Game Freak to show a little more ambition.
Haha damn...
And yeah, I'm trying to have some give and take with the discussion here. I'm just saying while I'd certainly be down for a big open-world take on Pokemon, I'd even be happy with small change-ups like that - just to make a new game a bit more exciting.
But time will tell, you're right - we haven't seen a lot of Sword and Shield.
I really dont think this will help. GF has a culture that seems to hate carrying over ideas and improvements from older games and that's been happening ever since HGSS. Sun and Moon actually regressed with how much it forced you to watch its mediocre story. That's not including the time GF actively spited its audience by assuming kids would be bored by a freaking Battle Frontier. GF sucks because it can hardly handle incremental improvements on its own stale formula. Everything has to be different from last time, but the same at it's core. So, so dumb on so many levels.
Anyway, I doubt this will change anything unless management allows Pokemon to change/keep solutions to mistakes previous games have fixed.
Anyway, I doubt this will change anything unless management allows Pokemon to change/keep solutions to mistakes previous games have fixed.
It's also infuriating how people dismiss SM's switch to trials. Not only the totem battles were mechanically completely different from Gym battles on top of being harder, the way they were presented and integrated into the world was different as was everything around them. Are people suggesting Pokémon can't have boss battles at all now? Because honestly I don't get what would be considered different at this point besides literally going open world.
This sounds like a good thing.
More original content is always good, and having that experience/time to breathe will only be good for Pokémon.
I wish these guys the best.
More original content is always good, and having that experience/time to breathe will only be good for Pokémon.
I wish these guys the best.
When the only critter you have to buy a game is for it to be open world, I can't help but feel bad for you.
That's still two games from their non-pokemon output that you liked, which is significant enough that you calling them a poor developer is weird.
I mean, kind of? But people are starting to get tired of Pokemon never changing it up. Especially since we're getting a mainline console game that they're approaching like a handheld one.
Well, gen 7 had way more postgame content than gen 6 so gen 8's postgame should be larger than gen 7's. Lets go let you skip the cutscenes and that feature most likely will be back in SwSh.
I'm more worried about the difficulty or the lack of an interesting new feature like mega evolutions.
I'm kind of tired of gimmicks that Gf doesn't use in their latter games, look at megas
This is not true, in 2017, one year after Sun and Moon, several people complained or almost cried because they announced USUM instead of a gen 4 remake.
Lol
Now well get new ips that look like complete dog shit. Unless they actually hire some competent devs and are willing to put the money and effort in. They obviously are not with pokemon games
Yup I feel the same way. In a way it's even crazier to me because pokemon because there are counting pairs and third ver releases, there are 19 (33 total ones) pokemon titles out right now. There are so many options for playing classic style pokemon that it's really hard for me to empathize with people who are completely content with how the structure and formula of the games are right now.
Zelda and Mario had much fewer classic entries before shifting it up in their 3d versions. And metroid managed to shift even more drastically from an 2d side scroller to an fps and still managed to find positive reception even though fans were going ballistic before its launch echoing similar arguements I hear from the pkmn fanbase on why mess with something that just works.
Resident evil 7 is another title that jumps to mind that has changed up its formula a couple of times (RE4 and RE7 off the top of my mind). Resident evil is also interesting because capcom showed that even after the more experimental RE7 they would still do traditional style games like RE2 Remake.
There's also just the small stuff that I've noticed people still push back on that wouldn't even change pokemon's identity like voice acting, faster battle load times, difficulty modes. At least here, on other sites I've seen people a bit more open to criticism, but people come out so hostile while defending classic pokemon formula that it just gets exhausting to talk about.
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The Pokemon franchise and the fans demands of that franchise can pretty much be summed up from this one old 4Chan post.
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Removing natures, abilities, wild Pokemon battling, affection & refresh, Mega Evolution & Z-Moves, held items, double battling, breeding, day/night cycles, over 400 individual attacks, Battle Spot/GTS/Wonder Trade, and fishing....
...that's moving backwards.
Removing overworld monster visibility? That's moving backwards, too, but that's one step back, and not the several described above.
If Pokemon Sword and Shield retain those features mentioned above and add to them, then it will be less of a regression by nature than Let's Go was.
At the very least, there should be a smattering of overworld-visible Pokemon in Sword and Shield, too. It'd be a neat way to make some Pokemon feel more unique and to make the world feel more lived-in... but as implemented in Let's Go, it doesn't do nearly enough to enhance the game's mechanical core and overall feel to make up for the huge losses incurred elsewhere.
I just don't see how Sword and Shield could or should be seen as a clear regression from Let's Go, which was objectively, for better or worse, the most intentionally pared-down entry in franchise history.
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LG's cutscene skip isn't the kind that would help Sun and Moon. the problem wasn't the cutscenes, but the actual dialogue portions that took control away from you. you can't skip those
No one pushes back against that kind of features, you're being voluntarily disingenuous. Pokémon is a turn based RPG and as such didn't gain much from going 3D. The only difference left is in how environments are designed and no one is against an evolution on that from. And evolution doesn't mean open world.
And you've never been able to. And people used to complain about it as well, but now everyone likes to pretend it's only a problem in Sun and Moon because they sometimes use different camera angles while you go through dialogue.
I wish. It's usually the same handful of people that are present in legit every single Pkm thread who love to argue even in favor of GF not offering proper difficulty options, often bringing up some fallacious arguments à la "oh god, grown men complaining about difficulty in a game for kids", "just turn off XP-share" and so forth.
not just camera angles, but animations as well. let's not pretend like the move to 3D didn't change up things there. we can't speed through dialogue boxes because of those camera pans and character animation, so they do take longer to get through now
Hey there, thats not true.
Fromsoft threads can get real toxic if you try to ask for an easier mode.
I mean, what're you trying to say here? Because we know those games crunch the devs to near death to make HD assets they don't need
Man imagine if Sony acquires GameFreak and in turn became the new publisher for Pokémon games (I'm assuming in this scenario they still aren't getting the IP). The fire that would spread across every Nintendo fan forum would extremely fun to read through
I have plenty of criticism for a lot of beloved games; there is always going to be a group of people who are simply no interested in something no matter how great it is. But that's the thing; why should they change anything for artistic reasons (since you're not arguing about the business side) if the games are most likely their own artistic vision for it? We know they have the budget to throw at it if they wanted to wildly change it, but I think it's clear that they don't see it for the game. Game Freak is more interested in dynamic changes to how the games work than complete genre shifts.
It doesn't. I was being sarcastic.
That's not really the same thing.
I'm pretty confident that if Game Freak announced earlier this year that progress on gen 8 was going well, but it's going to be delayed an extra year or two in order to improve the quality, the majority of the fanbase would be accepting of that. Yes, a small subset of fans would cry about it for a couple of weeks. Whatever.