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ScubaSteve693

Banned
Mar 26, 2020
680
But what's the reasoning, once a platform is big enough they just have to let everyone use it without paying any money?

If Epic wins this it sets a big precedent that all other storefronts will have to follow.
Epic once again is not advocating to get rid of the cut that Apple takes, that is in their own press release regarding it. They just want to be able to set up stores where companies can use their own payment processing services without being hamstrung and forced to pay 30% just because someones hosts their service on their OS.
 

Bishop89

What Are Ya' Selling?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
34,528
Melbourne, Australia
VastWiltedBooby-size_restricted.gif
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
But what's the reasoning, once a platform is big enough they just have to let everyone use it without paying any money?

If Epic wins this it sets a big precedent that all other storefronts will have to follow.
Apple is forcing you to pay thru apple for in app purchases and taking a 30% cut on that too. In app purchases cost apple nothing.
 

DrEvil

Developer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
2,630
Canada
Breaking:

It a joint statement Apple and Epic Games will increase the cost of their games so the existing 30% cut amount can be gained by both corporations.


I know you're joking, but at least /s it or something, news is coming fast and hot and we don't need this kinda stuff muddying the waters.
 

Twig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,486
Apple makes sense to sue. Google doesn't, really. Android lets you sideload things all you want.

Bold move, I guess.
 

Cyclonesweep

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
7,690
Do you think Epic would be happy if Apple and Google changed their policies such that any company, which makes less than a certain amount or less than these many installs, pay 20% and other bigger apps or revenue generators pay 30% ?
Their big issue is being forced to use apple for customers to pay for purchases within apps. Which is bullshit
 

Benzychenz

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 1, 2017
15,378
Australia
Wouldn't this be like Microsoft controlling what software is put onto Windows, and how companies should sell their products?

Because even though yes Epic is a big company, they have a point against Apple and Google.
More like Microsoft controlling what software is released on Xbox.

It's just arguing that a platform isn't allowed to be curated.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,994
Genuine question: Why, from a legal standpoint, should Apple be forced to allow other storefronts in their ecosystem? They did 100% of the work designing the hardware, the OS, the storefront, basically every part of the phone except for the apps. So why should someone be able to create apps and make money in that ecosystem without going through Apple who created the entire thing to begin with and pays 100% of the cost of maintenance, curation, OS development, payment fees, etc?

And before anyone accuses me of shilling for Apple, I'm asking a genuine question and open to well-reasoned responses.
They are way too ubiquitous as computing devices to be locked down the way they are.

Imagine if apps for Windows and MacOS were completely regulated by MS and Apple. It would be a disaster.
 

Biggersmaller

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,966
Minneapolis
The fact that they are going after both of them for very similar practices, both companies that represent like...100% of the mobile market, if anything their case is stronger now than before.

Naw. Epic snd Fortnite isn't restricted to the mobile market, therefore Apple/Google doesn't control enough of their customer base. It participates in far broader gaming market that also includes Nintendo, Microsoft, and Sony.
 

SonicFighterV

Member
May 13, 2019
350
You are forced to use iOS. They actively stop you from using the device on any other way than agreeing to their terms.
As I said, you can jailbreak it and you void those terms and you can use the device as you see fit. Just answering your initial statement there that it's your device and you want to do what you want with it. Some of the older phones support android right now.
 

Deleted member 50374

alt account
Banned
Dec 4, 2018
2,482
Naw. Epic snd Fortnite isn't restricted to the mobile market, therefore Apple/Google doesn't control enough of their customer base. It participates in far broader gaming market that also includes Nintendo, Microsoft, and Sony.
Then the day when legislation is introduced for a right to run your own software on any devices you own, the console makers are about as fucked.

As I said, you can jailbreak it and you void those terms and you can use the device as you see fit. Just answering your initial statement there that it's your device and you want to do what you want with it. Some of the older phones support android right now.

No you can't. In fact it might be a grey area in some countries to even use the jailbreak. Unless the bootloader is free, you're always locked. Exploits aren't a replacement for a right.
 

Kaivan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,390
How is it a lie when it is a true statement that the developers are just not following through with? A less of a cut DOES mean that developers could sell for cheaper if they wanted to. Key words there being "if they wanted to". Epic cannot force them to sell at lower prices. That is not on them at all but on the publishers and developers entirely.
If it's not on them, why do they say it like it's a given? Here's the actual wordings:
"After you go through several cycles of game developers making decisions, you're going to see lower prices as developers pass on the savings to customers, realizing they can sell more copies if they have a better price."
Don't make a statement if you can't keep it. It's been almost 2 years since EGS launched and nothing has changed. It's called lying.
 

TyrantII

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,365
Boston
I look forward to them pulling this on Sony, Nintendo, and Microsoft. (they won't)

Can they?

This is where the reasoning get murky to me, since the only thing different are the console manufacturers locking down development on their platforms from the get go, and requiring licensing to even use the tools needed to build on those platforms.

Is Apple's allowing free development on their platform, then restricting the distribution, legally different? It is obviously them wanting their cake and eating it too; the innovation of unrestricted pc development, but then claiming distribution rights once the work is done.
 

bxsonic

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,224
I think this is just Tim Sweeney riding on the wave of the antitrust issues with big tech. Lol. Good luck.
 

Falore

Banned
Feb 15, 2019
745
I know a lot of teenagers will be unhappy but I personally will be glad when this temporary fortnite fad blows over. I suppose its really nno shock that the people behind fortnite would lash out at companies making these decisions though I suppose.
 

LewieP

Member
Oct 26, 2017
18,093
Is this the same Epic that has been paying developers to pull their games from a competing platform?

In their words, "Eliminating consumer choice".
 

Deleted member 50374

alt account
Banned
Dec 4, 2018
2,482
Sure, but you will void your warranty and probably break a few TOS's along the way.

Does rooting your phone invalidate its warranty? (In EU) :: Law is Freedom

This is a joint blog post written together with Matija Šuklje with the goal to disband some popular FUD that you lose your warranty if you flash or root your device Rooting your phone Does rooting your device (e.

Short answer: their ToS are toilet paper and so their warranty terms.
 

TaterTots

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,962
You don't even need that much..

Epic sued Apple after Apple kicked them off the App Store for implementing an alternative payment for Fortnite, bypassing the App Store 30 percent cut.

Epic did the same for Fortnite on Android and Google followed did the same thing, kicking them off the Play Store. Epic sued them as well.

This is weird. Epic has a store where they take a cut from people as well. I wonder how Epic would handle things if those devs put up an alternative payment method.

This isn't even accounting for MS, Sony, and Nintendo. This is all weird to me lol.
 

Aaron D.

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,306
If Epic wins this case Walled Gardens will come down across all platforms.

Hope you guys are prepared for the good, bad & ugly that will follow across all distribution platforms.
 

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
59,970
This is weird. Epic has a store where they take a cut from people as well. I wonder how Epic would handle things if those devs put up an alternative payment method.

This isn't even accounting for MS, Sony, and Nintendo. This is all weird to me lol.
They take a cut, but not 30 percent. And they alternative payment methods works with the Nintendo, Sony, and MS, not Google Play and the App Store.
 

enzo_gt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,299
I don't see how Epic wins this lol
The House is currently debating the biggest antitrust measures that would be implemented against Silicon Valley giants like Apple and Google (amongst others) in 20+ years. The cuts they take were directly brought up in the latest hearings.

The timing of this is not coincidental.

The lowering of prices such that Epic doesn't make more based on their changes, only consumers pay less, is not coincidental.

Epic isn't stupid. No company just goes to war with Apple and Google for the lulz.
 

SonicFighterV

Member
May 13, 2019
350
PayPal charges 3% to use it's payment system.
Apple charges 30% to use it's payment system for in app purchases.

30% to unlock things in the app.

It's insane.
Have you read what I wrote ? I said they need to take a cut based on the app revenue and tier it. Paypal cannot charge more because they haven't put billions of dollars and man hours to build an eco system. Now that it created a successful eco system, Apple charging more for other companies to use its userbase make sense. So, the method I proposed seems fair where the smaller developers get taxed less than the big ones.
 

lemonade

Member
May 8, 2018
3,044
It would be crazy if Fortnite is what turns iOS, Playstation, Xbox and Nintendo devices into malware infested shitfest.

Tim Epic is wilding out here. I could see Apple pulling their products across EU before them letting other stores exist on iOS.