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TaleSpun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,449
All this Noctis talk has reminded me that while I overall still loved how Cloud was portrayed in FF7R, one thing I thought was kind of odd was that a lot of his awkward weirdness felt more like Noctis than Cloud to me. I'm thinking back to the Sector 8 slums when he defensively says "I've got skills!" It was a funny line and worked well to characterize Cloud but it just seemed like they were redoing a lot of traits Noctis had

Like, I said: Nomura. Neku is like that in The Workd Ends With You, which I'm playing right now. If they remade VIII, Squall would come off the same way. It's just a trope of his.
 

PshycoNinja

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
3,224
Los Angeles
i got roasted on this website for saying his design looks cool

sitll believe it

wgLSE6G.jpg

FtZPLsN.jpg

RcSHzkU.jpg

Better than his younger version for sure! But I think its mostly just alright.
 

Sawyer

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,234
Is this going to be the first FF protagonist with chest hair? I need a topless scene for science.
 

Tornak

Member
Feb 7, 2018
8,395
i got roasted on this website for saying his design looks cool

sitll believe it

wgLSE6G.jpg

FtZPLsN.jpg

RcSHzkU.jpg
Really? I like him better than many (most?) FF MCs. I think I only prefer OG Squall, Cloud and older Noctis tbh. If we're more liberal when choosing a protag, I could include Balthier and Celes above him, but he'd be around that tier.

His hair looks like a wig in the key art and we've yet to get a good in-game glimpse at him, but him being a bit older, bigger and wearing red (only Terra does beyond Clive) and a cape differentiates him from the most recent MCs, who went for more modern, younger and hip vibes.

The younger design I don't really like, but I think it's mostly the hairstyle. Otherwise, he looks cool and has a nice streamlined aesthetic, if he could just lose the Karen bang and be more like, idk, Kazuya.
 

Samawati

Member
Sep 15, 2019
216
There's also stuff like this, ex. the women having less facial emotions then the men because...reasons I guess.


Jesus, this is bad. It's even worse given that FF characters are barely allowed to really emote in general. I think the last time they were allowed to get "ugly" with the facial/muscle deformation and the last time the cast had unique features was like....FFX.
 

DiipuSurotu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
53,148
All this Noctis talk has reminded me that while I overall still loved how Cloud was portrayed in FF7R, one thing I thought was kind of odd was that a lot of his awkward weirdness felt more like Noctis than Cloud to me. I'm thinking back to the Sector 8 slums when he defensively says "I've got skills!" It was a funny line and worked well to characterize Cloud but it just seemed like they were redoing a lot of traits Noctis had
Cloud isn't like Noctis. Noctis is like Cloud to begin with.
 

Geg

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,553
Trust me, I'm not forgetting anything about how Cloud acted in the original game, I literally replayed it in Japanese a few months ago. OG Cloud is more like a middle ground between Remake Cloud and AC Cloud
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,127
Obviously GoT vibe. That's fine to the extent that some dark political fantasy could be an interesting addition to FF. Hope it's a LOT less rapey and infanticidy than GoT though. Just too much, got perverse.

edit: ha I keep forgetting to refresh before replying. I'm out of date X-)
 
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CRIMSON-XIII

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,176
Chicago, IL
I have a gut feeling that we are getting a cinematic Final Fantasy again, where there is a lot of dialogue in and out of cutscenes. They will be more realtime but I think we will get some fixed camera angles again more. XV had cutscenes but a significant bulk was dynamic dialogue during traversal.

I want both in XVI.
 

Caiops

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,107
I believe Old Noctis was the best design of a mc in FF.

But i really like Old Clive design too, i hope his personality is good
 

Turin

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,464
I'm hoping Clive is sort of like Spike Spiegel. Someone who can either be cool, chill, silly, etc depending on the situation he's given to react to.

And part of the reason I bring Spike up is because he is someone who, like presumably Clive, had been through some SHIT yet it didn't turn him into a walking edge conduit because literally no one is going to be like that. He's was a fluid, dynamic adult with an undercurrent of bitterness about his past.
 

PshycoNinja

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
3,224
Los Angeles
I hope Clive isn't just stoic. That would be disappointing.

Edit: Also being almost avatar like for the player either. I know it works for XIV but its not going to work for XVI.
 

skeezx

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,182
Clive looks like Dude McDude from some PS2 action game but that doesn't particularly bother me i guess
 

Tornak

Member
Feb 7, 2018
8,395
Edit: Also being almost avatar like for the player either. I know it works for XIV but its not going to work for XVI.
This would legitimately put me off the game. I remember, after having only watched the trailer once, thinking that maybe the MC would be mute (since we only get narration moments and just a couple of in-game dialogue bits that may or may not be his), which contributed to me feeling initially cold along with a few other things.

I really don't think that's happening, though. And I could imagine Yoshida, Takai and the rest being eager to have a voiced, fully established MC after working on XIV for so long.
 

TaleSpun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,449
They wouldn't even consider doing an unvoiced MC at this point lmao what are y'all even talking about
 

Fraxin

Member
Oct 28, 2017
864
They wouldn't even consider doing an unvoiced MC at this point lmao what are y'all even talking about

You know cause it's by the FFXIV team so seems some people think the game might just take what works from there and just apply it on FFXVI.

I'm starting to doubt the MC was speaking in the trailer after reading about unvoiced MC.
"I am Joshua's shield."
It's either someone was speaking as 1st person instead of him or maybe it's an alien taking control of him.
 

Tornak

Member
Feb 7, 2018
8,395
My point was you don't even need to entertain the possibility they would, since there isn't one. A mainline SP FF will never have an unvoiced lead again. It's ridiculous to even suggest as much (not that you did.)
Oh, yeah. Like I guess it's fair to say nothing is impossible (the same way noone could have foreseen a mainline being a MMO before XI), but yeah, there's no way they're going that route for a SP one.

There's just so much baggage that comes with the series, its stories and MCs for them to ditch having an established protagonist, especially now with more grounded, realistic games (which would make things more jarring). Take a look at what people talk more with regards to the older games: characters and their relationships, even more so than the plot or the lore themselves. Like people still talk about Cloud (even before the remake), Squall, Zidane... and they're a huge part of what makes spin-offs succesful. The main draw, really.
 

TaleSpun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,449
Oh, yeah. Like I guess it's fair to say nothing is impossible (the same way noone could have foreseen a mainline being a MMO before XI), but yeah, there's no way they're going that route for a SP one.

There's just so much baggage that comes with the series, its stories and MCs for them to ditch having an established protagonist, especially now with more grounded, realistic games (which would make things more jarring). Take a look at what people talk more with regards to the older games: characters and their relationships, even more so than the plot or the lore themselves. Like people still talk about Cloud (even before the remake), Squall, Zidane... and they're a huge part of what makes spin-offs succesful. The main draw, really.

I've never been big on insert characters/silent MCs; I think a written, defined character is always better. And that's still role-playing to me. The difference is you've been assigned a role rather than making up your own, and hopefully it's a character you can empathize with and relate to.

But yeah, this I feel is just one of those things that comes with being a AAA franchise. It's like when people dream about a new mainline game that's 2D. Yeah, they could do that, but chances are the catch would be it's really just a stop-gap between the last and next mainline games (and at that point if may as well just be a side game). Because a 2D FF would be cheap to produce and sometimes that's great (the industry would benefit from a lot more of it!), but it would also be limited in its appeal. When you have an established franchise that can actually put up big numbers, you tend to want to make a big investment in hopes of a big return. You wouldn't be doing that with a 2D FF.

High fidelity graphics, voice acting, and honestly at this point, yeah, combat that's a little more visceral and involved than a turn-based system; these are things any mainline FF simply must do now because ultimately SE isn't just competing with other RPGs for RPG fans money and attention. They have a big media brand that has to try to capture as many people as possible while hopefully maintaining it's identity and artistic integrity.
 

Tornak

Member
Feb 7, 2018
8,395
I've never been big on insert characters/silent MCs; I think a written, defined character is always better. And that's still role-playing to me. The difference is you've been assigned a role rather than making up your own, and hopefully it's a character you can empathize with and relate to.

But yeah, this I feel is just one of those things that comes with being a AAA franchise. It's like when people dream about a new mainline game that's 2D. Yeah, they could do that, but chances are the catch would be it's really just a stop-gap between the last and next mainline games (and at that point if may as well just be a side game). Because a 2D FF would be cheap to produce and sometimes that's great (the industry would benefit from a lot more of it!), but it would also be limited in its appeal. When you have an established franchise that can actually put up big numbers, you tend to want to make a big investment in hopes of a big return. You wouldn't be doing that with a 2D FF.

High fidelity graphics, voice acting, and honestly at this point, yeah, combat that's a little more visceral and involved than a turn-based system; these are things any mainline FF simply must do now because ultimately SE isn't just competing with other RPGs for RPG fans money and attention. They have a big media brand that has to try to capture as many people as possible while hopefully maintaining it's identity and artistic integrity.
Oh, man, they turn me off big time. Like I can live with them being in certain genres and I think stuff like Dark Souls/Bloodbone might be the only one where I kinda prefer it due to how the story is told, but yeah, nothing beats an established character for me. If you want to go down the customization route, however, I'm also partial to how Mass Effect handled it. But when it's a realistic game or one where the story is a big deal and the MC just doesn't speak... I'm out or at least not nearly as enthralled as I'd otherwise be.

And yeah, for better or worse, this is where we're at: insane AAA production values and a more realistic approach, and mainline FFs won't dial it down. Which is why I've always wanted them to put out a new IP that's a bit cheaper that mimics the PSX style (or really just use spin-offs/other lesser known series they have).
 

TaleSpun

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,449
Oh, man, they turn me off big time. Like I can live with them being in certain genres and I think stuff like Dark Souls/Bloodbone might be the only one where I kinda prefer it due to how the story is told, but yeah, nothing beats an established character for me. If you want to go down the customization route, however, I'm also partial to how Mass Effect handled it. But when it's a realistic game or one where the story is a big deal and the MC just doesn't speak... I'm out or at least not nearly as enthralled as I'd otherwise be.

And yeah, for better or worse, this is where we're at: insane AAA production values and a more realistic approach, and mainline FFs won't dial it down. Which is why I've always wanted them to put out a new IP that's a bit cheaper that mimics the PSX style (or really just use spin-offs/other lesser known series they have).

Yeah, I'm always hoping to see more mid-tier stuff from them that's riding on less. They're getting back into that territory with stuff like NieR and SaGa, so that's really encouraging.

Mass Effect is good shout too. I love Mass Effect. With that or Dragon Age or Witcher, I think you have a good middle ground because you sort of have these semi-defined characters that will only ever react to a given situation in a limited number of ways. That's another dynamic between the player and the lead character as well. The MC isn't silent, but not strictly defined either. A friend and I like to describe it more as you directing in this scenario.
 

Tornak

Member
Feb 7, 2018
8,395
At this point I just want to see more main characters, whether there's a party or not.

We only got to properly see Clive, Joshua and Jill, and two of them have very vanilla designs as they're kids. Seeing Clive's glow-up, can't wait to see the others' post-timeskip designs.

Basically I want the XVI equivalent of this, which was very hype Stella's further downgrade aside:
d7406c3357c3f1b2fe02177c550338c641ddeebfe8a3c44a2597d1c8dffcf3a0.jpg
 

Deleted member 511

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,676
I feel like that Ghost of Tsushima announcement would've been the type of thing to show at a Sony event if it was happening in the next week or two so...yeah. Maybe I'm wrong but it feels like our watch for a new trailer will continue for a while.

R465352dacf9ed113157f679d8eadc91c
 

Chumunga64

Member
Jun 22, 2018
14,285
Comp has done a pretty good job of making people forget how much of a goof Cloud is even before the lifestream event.

I still stand by that the compilation shit (especially advent children) was the worst thing to happen to the FF franchise

not only did it Stain's Cloud and Sephiroth's characters (cloud was saved in the remake but Sephiroth sadly wasn't) it also gave us oil tycoon Barrett
 

Caiops

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,107
Damn Sony holding new footage of FFXVI and Forspoken.

Just let them release a new trailer :(
 

Mifec

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,752
I don't mind Clive's look, looks better than anyone in XV and XIII.
At this point I just want to see more main characters, whether there's a party or not.

We only got to properly see Clive, Joshua and Jill, and two of them have very vanilla designs as they're kids. Seeing Clive's glow-up, can't wait to see the others' post-timeskip designs.

Basically I want the XVI equivalent of this, which was very hype Stella's further downgrade aside:
d7406c3357c3f1b2fe02177c550338c641ddeebfe8a3c44a2597d1c8dffcf3a0.jpg
None of this chars amounted to anything :(

Hopefully the chars that get showcased for 16 end up being involved and fleshed out.
 

Chumunga64

Member
Jun 22, 2018
14,285
I don't mind Clive's look, looks better than anyone in XV and XIII.

None of this chars amounted to anything :(

Hopefully the chars that get showcased for 16 end up being involved and fleshed out.

i honestly don't think any main character aside from clive and joshua were shown

hell, i didn't think jill would be a big character but apparently she is since has art
 

Mifec

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,752
i honestly don't think any main character aside from clive and joshua were shown

hell, i didn't think jill would be a big character but apparently she is since has art
Yeah I assume aside from maybe the people talking in that one room no one there is big enough to matter outside of the prologue.
 

Mifec

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,752
the dragoon showing up looking cool only to be dead in the next scene is peak Yoshi P treatment of dragoons
To be fair it just looks like a mook and they call out dragoons as just a regiment of the imperials. Prolly not a named or important char. Estineien was also treated pretty well tbf
 

Famassu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,186
I feel like that Ghost of Tsushima announcement would've been the type of thing to show at a Sony event if it was happening in the next week or two so...yeah. Maybe I'm wrong but it feels like our watch for a new trailer will continue for a while.

R465352dacf9ed113157f679d8eadc91c
On one hand, sure, but on the other that is exactly the kind of announcement Sony announced prior to their E3 conferences when they still held those.
 

The Last One

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,585
Not sure if the GoT means anything in regards an event happening or not.
 
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