Final Fantasy VII's Northern Crater was a lame and unworthy final dungeon

[AuthenticM]

The dungeon is mainly composed of rocks and pits. Then there's a weirdly-placed swamp that feels like it's recycled from a cut area.

Compare it to FF6's epic Kefka castle that had the player split their party into three teams that had to cooperate to advance further in the dungeon. Or FF8's metroidvania-lite gothic castle, which had the party fight optional bosses to regain some abilities and commands while exploring beautiful scenery. Or FF9's time-warped fantasy trek.

FF7's final dungeon is lame. That sucks a lot, because FF7 is one of the greatest games ever made. You play all of it up to this point, experiencing this emotional masterpiece, then you get to the final stretch only to be greeted by this mediocrity. And it sucks even more considering that the dungeon that immediately preceded this one was cool.

I really hope that Remake completely rethinks this last dungeon. I would actually be perfectly fine if it replaced it with something completely new.

 

[antitrop]

It's not the worst, but certainly stands out being sandwiched between two FFs with significantly better final dungeons. Between the Northern Crater and the ending being a rather brief cinematic, it feels like they did start to run out of gas at the very, very end.

My absolute least favorite last dungeon in the whole series was definitely FFIII. What a waste of time slog that one is.

 

[Xeno]

You're a lame and unworthy final dungeon.

 

[Professor Beef]

The dungeon is mainly composed of rocks and pits.

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i mean yes of course, you're in a crater. Comparing this to FF6 and Kefka's Castle is dumb because there was no need for the game to introduce a castle at any point.

 

[AuthenticM]

i mean yes of course, you're in a crater. Comparing this to FF6 and Kefka's Castle is dumb because there was no need for the game to introduce a castle at any point.

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Something being diegetically appropriate doesn't absolve it from criticism or from being lame. Also I'm not saying that there should have been a castle there instead.

This is very weird retort, honestly.

 

[hateradio]

I mean, the game was fucking massive.

It had to end at some point.

You're a lame and unworthy final dungeon.

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Let it go.

 

[Dark_Castle]

Disagree, I really like how it's a descend into madness from a seemingly normal mountain and cliffs. The mechanic of placing your own save point is also brilliant.

 

[Y2Kev]

I thought the area has an otherworldly weirdness to it, some creative use of branching paths, an utterly melancholic and upsetting musical theme, some of the best encounters in the game, and great art and monster design.

Maybe you should mosey

 

[Deleted member 23893]

By the time I reached the crater, I was (via the momentum of the plot) ready to go fight Sephiroth.

A sizable dungeon that slowed things down and required you to solve puzzles or whatever, I think might have bogged things down for me.

 

[The Unsent]

It was the right final level for the game, the tone of the game, the injury in the planet, a fucked up part of nature. That said the remake (or sequel?) series might have an expanded version of Sephiroth's Heavenly Lair.

 

[AuthenticM]

I thought the area has an otherworldly weirdness to it, some creative use of branching paths, an utterly melancholic and upsetting musical theme, some of the best encounters in the game, and great art and monster design.

Maybe you should mosey

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I agree with you about the music and the enemies. But I don't recall any otherworldy feeling to the place, outside of the very end right before encountering Jenova, when Cloud jumps from rock to rock at low FPS. On that note, I always wondered if the low FPS was done on purpose to enhance that feeling or if it was just a happy coïncidence.

 

[The Unsent]

Evil castles and palaces are overdone in JRPGs, definitely.

 

[Trigonometrize]

The second half is better than the first. Once you split up the atmosphere changes and you start feeling like you're in this hellish graveyard. The first half where it is just hallways of rocks could be improved, but I do like the enemies and how weird they get. I still don't understand entirely how some of them work.

 

[RagnarokX]

With the way they do that half-assed party splitting thing I'd guess that they originally intended the dungeon to operate like FF6's final dungeon but they abandoned the concept.

It came back in FF8.

 

[lvl 99 Pixel]

I liked it a lot. The music and the descent were very fitting for a final act.

 

[MaverickHunterAsh]

I don't dislike it nearly as much as you but I can't entirely disagree either, and yet the music more than makes up for any of its shortcomings IMO. "Judgement Day" is one of the best final dungeon themes ever.

 

[newmoneytrash]

the only bad part of the final dungeon is the weird save point spawning mechanic

 

[SunKing]

I don't dislike it nearly as much as you but I can't entirely disagree either, and yet the music more than makes up for any of its shortcomings IMO. "Judgement Day" is one of the best final dungeon themes ever.

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Even in that area, it's stuck between two superior final dungeon themes with "Last Dungeon" and "The Castle" imo.

 

[Deleted member 12555]

But does every rpg need a tightly designed, puzzle filled, big final dungeon, just because it's the final dungeon? It's exactly what I was looking for, the game already had a lot going on, so I didn't really want a sprawling final area, with story, puzzles and cutscenes spread throughout the dungeon.

It's the end, the music is excellent in its sadness and finality and sets the mood for the area. It gives you time to think about everything that happened up to that point, and that's pretty cool. As said before, enemies are very cool, and the bosses even better. Bizarro Sephiroth theme Whew 💦

 

[RadioJoNES]

I thought it was good, esp with the music.

 

[DeSolos]

I thought it good fit for Jenova being an alien that crashed down. It's also relevant to the calamity they were trying to prevent (meteor).

Apart from its story context, then yeah maybe it's simple compared to others, but I think it was the right place for FF7 to end.

 

[RagnarokX]

I thought it good fit for Jenova being an alien that crashed down. It's also relevant to the calamity they were trying to prevent (meteor).

Apart from its story context, then yeah maybe it's simple compared to others, but I think it was the right place for FF7 to end.

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I guess if you wanted to make it more complex, you could go more in on the The Thing references and have a crashed spaceship in the crater.

Like not like this, but as you explore the caves parts of it are intermingled with wreckage of a spaceship.

There's no way Jenova by itself caused that crater.

 

[ZeoVGM]

It was the perfect setting for a final dungeon, given the build up with everything in the plot. The music as the background for your descent deeper and deeper was incredibly epic.

 

[blonded]

What was the dungeon immediately before this one again?

 

[Unkindled]

It isn't supposed to be a badass dungeon you are in rush to stop Sephiroth aka Meteor.

 

[The Praiseworthy]

I think it's one of the best final dungeons... especially with the epic music gives you the vibes of being at the end of your epic journey:



Still gives me chills and I cannot imagine how it will feels in the Remake.

 

[RagnarokX]

What was the dungeon immediately before this one again?

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Midgar part 2.

 

[thatmustbyogurt]

It's not the worst, but certainly stands out being sandwiched between two FFs with significantly better final dungeons. Between the Northern Crater and the ending being a rather brief cinematic, it feels like they did start to run out of gas at the very, very end.

My absolute least favorite last dungeon in the whole series was definitely FFIII. What a waste of time slog that one is.

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FF9 final dungeon was really dope!

 

[PocketchangeTTV]

It was 100% a slog and I hate it.

 

[Helix]

this is why they are doing Remake. to fix everything we hated and make them perfect lol.

but on a serious note, Wutai was literally a throwaway region to me, but I fully expect the REMAKE team to expand upon the original and make it so much better than it actually was in the OG FF7

 

[Samiya]

nevermind

 

[Gio]

Personally I think it's interesting that a game that starts you in a sophisticated, busy setting ends with a comparatively empty and gloomy final dungeon. Not sure how to articulate it but it adds to the drama, the stakes. It's just you and Sephiroth.

 

[Carn]

It's literally been decades since I played it I think. I never really minded it much. I remember a lot of grinding there, especially against Tonberries.

 

[ket]

Yeah it kinda sucked. Idk why they couldn't just give you save points like normal.

 

[Vault]

Ultimecia's castle is the best final dungeon

 

[Deleted member 14377]

Personally I think it's interesting that a game that starts you in a sophisticated, busy setting ends with a comparatively empty and gloomy final dungeon. Not sure how to articulate it but it adds to the drama, the stakes. It's just you and Sephiroth.

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Was going to say something similar.

There is so much variety in terms of backdrops, from massive cities, naval bases, under water, mountains, factories etc;

For it to end in the heart of the planet we have been fighting for this whole time, so isolated. Lonely. No more bells and whistles. Just you and the man you've been chasing this whole time, deeper and deeper.

It's simplicity and isolation is nice. There's no crowd of people watching or anything.

 

[signal]

It was cool. The fact that the best grinding location has one of the best tracks in the game (Reunion) playing was a nice touch.

 

[Gio]

Was going to say something similar.

There is so much variety in terms of backdrops, from massive cities, naval bases, under water, mountains, factories etc;

For it to end in the heart of the planet we have been fighting for this whole time, so isolated. Lonely. No more bells and whistles. Just you and the man you've been chasing this whole time, deeper and deeper.

It's simplicity and isolation is nice. There's no crowd of people watching or anything.

Click to shrink...

Well put. The Northern Crater was probably designed that way to contrast with all the environments players had previously explored. It's a deliberate choice meant to evoke sadness and loneliness. Maybe to help people feel how totally alienated Sephiroth is from other people and from life.

 

[rochellepaws]

I liked it, a very intimidating, lonely place with a lot of mystery and secrets. The mechanic of placing your own save point challenged your bravery as well for how deep you wanted to go!

The music made it feel like a finale and the length I think was intentionally to make the player feel weary with the journey to culminate in a "now or never" kind of final boss considering the immediacy of meteor. Which was a lot different to just some enemy sitting in a palace or castle for eternity waiting for your arrival, Sephiroth isn't waiting.

 

[Wireframe]

I really enjoyed it, especially the magic pot area. Judgement day is also low-key one of the best tracks in the original OST.

 

[Shahed]

It was ok.

It just feels underwhelming because the sequel in FFVIII has the best final dungeon in anything ever

 

[Erpy]

Thematically it fit like a glove. You start the game in the heart of civilization, with neon lights, steam vents and urban decay all around you and barely any vegetation. You end the game in the place as far from civilization as possible, with no sign of anyone ever having lived here, no castle, no ruined buildings, just natural formations and caves. Whatever new you're pining for would have difficulty fitting as well as the crater.

 

[NeoBob688]

I agree. Actually my first time through I quit the game at that point and just watched the rest on video.

 

[Dlanor A. Knox]

Yeah it wasn't great.

Ultimecia's castle is still my favorite

 

[Jonathan Lanza]

At least we can agree that VIII didn't deserve a final dungeon as great as Ultimecia's Castle

 

[Wazzy]

The first half with the split paths and swamp are awful and honestly ruin the entire dungeon. The last bit is okay and I would have preferred it just go directly to Jenova.

I'm okay with the final dungeon not being as well designed or as interesting as Ultimecias Castle but it shouldn't have been so boring in the first half.

 

[BhetjaXIV]

The whole end section was not very good imo.

I also don't like the ending, which, in retrospect, is a huge cliffhanger (Meteor, lifestream, zoom on every characters faces, then on Aerith... cut to credits) and it lacks the feeling of acomplishment.

The compilation clarifies what comes after at least.

 

[Kain]

The last part is ok and music is ace. No final dungeon will suck as much as III anyway.

 

[Gold Arsene]

I actually agree, it's very unremarkable.

Feels like you shoulda been in the Lifestream areas longer but it's Jenova and then right to Sephiroth.

Kinda a let down after the pretty hype return to Midgar.

 

[Deleted member 55807]

I don't dislike it nearly as much as you but I can't entirely disagree either, and yet the music more than makes up for any of its shortcomings IMO. "Judgement Day" is one of the best final dungeon themes ever.

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Holy cow, Aerith's theme is in there! =O