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Cammington

Member
Oct 27, 2017
345
I hope those Renault dollars are proving good for Danny Ric because he's done little to show he's worth it so far. It's really disappointing to see.

I think we'll see a shift in Hamilton's behaviour to Bottas now. He's realised Ferrari aren't a threat and his fight is with his teammate.
 

Menx64

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,774
Yet another boring race. The F1 has to do something else fans will go away. Ferrari is just like ACMila at this point. A gian living in the memories of the old days.
 

Cation

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
3,603
Random stats n facts time.
  • Mercedes: Took their 62nd front row lockout, matching Williams, and now only 1 lockout behind McLaren.
  • Mercedes: 177th win for a Mercedes powered car, now one more the Ford Cosworth.
  • Mercedes: 4th consecutive 1-2 finish, becomes first ever team to do so at the start of season.*
  • BOT: 5th career win.
  • VER: For the 3rd consecutive race he has finished in 4th place.
  • VER: Continues his run of top 4 finishes, that started at Suzuka 2018.
*Note: Ferrari achieved this in the 1952 season, however that run includes the Indy 500, so, uh... Fuck if I know if that counts. :)
I always appreciate your random stats, thanks for posting them :)
 

kasane

Member
Oct 30, 2017
539
Bring back refueling, there might be less overtakes but at least we can actually see drivers drive flat out instead of managing tyres and fuel.
 

TwntyOneTwlv

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,595
Ohio
Edit: whoops double post. Forgot I'm not on reddit

Just caught up with the race. Massive congrats to Merc.

Coming from being total underdogs to Ferrari only a month ago, almost a second off the pace of the Prancing Horses, to winning back-to-back-to-back-to-back 1-2s is a really inspirational story.

It goes to show that hard work and determination can pay off, even when no-one believes in you and everyone is saying you have no chance. Huge kudos.

How much is Sky paying you
 

Razgreez

Banned
Apr 13, 2018
366
Bring back refueling, there might be less overtakes but at least we can actually see drivers drive flat out instead of managing tyres and fuel.

There are so many reasons why going completely flat out all race wouldn't work in the current formula. Engine and drivetrain fatigue, tyre fragility, fuel flow restrictions etc. Refuelling wouldn't fix anything
 

endlessflood

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,693
Australia (GMT+10)
There are so many reasons why going completely flat out all race wouldn't work in the current formula. Engine and drivetrain fatigue, tyre fragility, fuel flow restrictions etc. Refuelling wouldn't fix anything
Refuelling makes the strategy side of things way more interesting. Under the current regs there's almost no strategy.

The downside of course is that it adds an element of danger. Even with a standard supplier you had some teams illegally tampering with the refuelling units to try and gain an advantage. And then you get incidents like the Jos Verstappen one.
 

gutterboy44

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,592
NY
Another trash strategy decision by Ferrari. I can't believe they fucked LeClerc like that. He had a shot if they didn't sacrifice him for Vettel...who ended up doing fuck all.

Edit: The best driver swap that could happen next year would be Vettel <> Hamilton. Lewis going for the ultimate of returning Ferrari to glory and getting a championship with three different teams and Vettel being in his German element with no excuses left.
 

endlessflood

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,693
Australia (GMT+10)
Doesn't refueling remove a lot of the strategy? Most team will calculate the fastest way to reach the end ahead of the race and then it's hard to be flexible when you are running out of fuel.
With refuelling you have another variable (fuel load) instead of only tyre selection. Teams can then control the weight of the car during various points in the race, to affect not only lap times but also tyre wear rates. It also heavily influences pit stop times.

There might be an optimal split, but that can change based on traffic, track position, safety cars, etc., and will also vary between cars/setups. Effectively you can trade speed in one section of the race for another. It also makes it much harder for teams to read what others are doing, and therefore to react.
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,916
Jesus, it's been all Mercedes 1-2 so far. This is getting ridiculous.
On refueling: After the obvious safety hazards it was banned because while it provides another layer of strategy, it results even less on-track action between direct rivals. Chainbear has a good video on this where he reaches the conclusion that mandatory 2 stops could be a good compromise between strategy and on-track action.
 

endlessflood

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,693
Australia (GMT+10)
Jesus, it's been all Mercedes 1-2 so far. This is getting ridiculous.
On refueling: After the obvious safety hazards it was banned because while it provides another layer of strategy, it results even less on-track action between direct rivals. Chainbear has a good video on this where he reaches the conclusion that mandatory 2 stops could be a good compromise between strategy and on-track action.
What on-track action between direct rivals? :p
 

thenexus6

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,308
UK
Happy both Mclaren and Racing Point got points. I thought Leclerc had a really good chance for a second until they messed him up. I'm rooting for Bottas so glad he took the win.

Ricciardo definitely feeling the pressure, made a mistake then in panic tried to get back out asap but reversed into Kvyat.. both out of the race and both running in the points at the time.

I caught the Formula E race, and its like watching a video game wow.
 

kafiend

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,249
Refuelling would just push F1 further toward irrelevance tbh.

Maybe when battery tech is better they could replace batteries instead and nerf the charge they get from driving.

Also, I can't think of a single way to make it work, but make the potential battery charge better from driving and have enforced battery swaps between the teams drivers for some hilarious fuckery between teammates.
 

Euler.L.

Alt account
Banned
Mar 29, 2019
906
Another trash strategy decision by Ferrari. I can't believe they fucked LeClerc like that. He had a shot if they didn't sacrifice him for Vettel...who ended up doing fuck all.

Edit: The best driver swap that could happen next year would be Vettel <> Hamilton. Lewis going for the ultimate of returning Ferrari to glory and getting a championship with three different teams and Vettel being in his German element with no excuses left.

I could only see the last laps of the race, what are the people referring to if they talking about Ferrari fucking LeClec over?
 

Deleted member 12317

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,134
I could only see the last laps of the race, what are the people referring to if they talking about Ferrari fucking LeClec over?
They did not, people just don't see he was on a different strategy (starting on mediums) thus thought Ferrari fucked him over when asked him to pit "late".
But in fact he stayed out on his medium less than most and struggled to get a better pace with the softs, (he could even have stayed a couple of lap more on medium instead of pitting twice, but that was for fastest lap).

How can you expect Leclerc to get from 8 to the podium when Mercedes are dominating and Vettel has the same car ? He did his best that's all, he is not driving a faster car than anyone else.
His pace during the first 20 laps was good thanks to the mediums when others had used softs.
 

Dan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,950
I could only see the last laps of the race, what are the people referring to if they talking about Ferrari fucking LeClec over?

People seem to think that Leclerc would have charged through the field and would have not worn down the tyres any differently from midpack in a race that despite predictions actually was high deg rather than low deg. All while running the same tyre strategy as the leaders.
 

Euler.L.

Alt account
Banned
Mar 29, 2019
906
So there was no strange team order to get Vettel ahead of him? I guess not staying out longer on medium is something that falls under the hindsight umbrella.
 

Psychotext

Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,685
Some real hot (and wrong) takes on Leclerc and Vettel this race. lol

Hint... check Leclerc's fucking awful pace on the softs.
 

Antagon

Member
Nov 4, 2017
516
Some real hot (and wrong) takes on Leclerc and Vettel this race. lol

Hint... check Leclerc's fucking awful pace on the softs.

Gasly also seemed to manage the medium tires better; where Leclerc's times dropped off a cliff he seemed to be doing pretty well.

So there was no strange team order to get Vettel ahead of him? I guess not staying out longer on medium is something that falls under the hindsight umbrella.

Wouldn't have helped; he lost tons of times at the end of his stint on mediums as well.
 

Tygre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,100
Chesire, UK
How much is Sky paying you
I just love seeing Ferrari lose.

Maybe when battery tech is better they could replace batteries instead and nerf the charge they get from driving.

Battery hot-swaps at pit-stops could be awesome.

4 tyres and 8 battery packs changed in 2.1 seconds, phwoar.

Some real hot (and wrong) takes on Leclerc and Vettel this race. lol

Hint... check Leclerc's fucking awful pace on the softs.

Yeah, people are not seeming to notice that the Medium was by far the best race tyre.

It's not always as simple as Softer = Faster. I can't really blame people, as Pirelli rubber is a fucking incomprehensible enigma at times, even to people who get paid 6 figures to work it out.
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,916
It's not always as simple as Softer = Faster. I can't really blame people, as Pirelli rubber is a fucking incomprehensible enigma at times, even to people who get paid 6 figures to work it out.
The people who make them have 0 clue how do they act on an actual car. Judging by how off the estimated lap numbers are every single time.
 

nekkid

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,823
Maybe when battery tech is better they could replace batteries instead and nerf the charge they get from driving.

Also, I can't think of a single way to make it work, but make the potential battery charge better from driving and have enforced battery swaps between the teams drivers for some hilarious fuckery between teammates.

Refuelling allowed for a weight advantage/pit stop trade off. You wouldn't get that with a battery swap - just yet another procedure for the pit crew to get good at. It wouldn't mix anything up.

But that doesn't mean I think refuelling is a good idea - as I said, it's counter to everything that is going on in the automotive industry.
 

Astandahl

Member
Oct 28, 2017
9,008
Some real hot (and wrong) takes on Leclerc and Vettel this race. lol

Hint... check Leclerc's fucking awful pace on the softs.
Why in the blue hell Leclerc should have pushed after the first pit stop? He had a 25 s ( TWENTY FIVE SECONDS ) gap to Verstappen. He needed to lap around 1.43 each lap to comeback which wasn't possible so he didn't even push. Gasly had to pit and Perez was 35 s behind. He saved the engine as much as possible and went for a fast lap at the end with another set of soft. Of course the medium tyres were the best choice. Leclerc destroyed his race after quali , only chance was SC or using the hard tyres no one tried during the weekend.

And yes he was faster than Seb here in Baku.
 

TheRulingRing

Banned
Apr 6, 2018
5,713
Uh? Ferrari lost to RB as well for 4 years straight so it wasn't just Mercedes. Again the last time Ferrari had a top car and top team was 2007 , 13 years ago.

Ferrari could invest more and should do due to the gap they had compared to Mercedes. They don't because the brand is more powerful than ever all over the world.

Red Bull also poured 100s of millions into F1 and were able to match Ferrari's investment.

You're kidding yourself if you think Ferrari could put themselves back on top on a whim, if only they cared enough to invest!!!!!!

Even now they have enough money to get almost any top talent they want, to do all of the testing permitted under regulations, to get the cream-of-the-crop drivers.

The truth is Mercedes is just functioning on another level in terms of management and leadership.
 

Euler.L.

Alt account
Banned
Mar 29, 2019
906
Without new engine regulations nothing will substantial change.
Also banning factory teams would be an option or introducing rules to reduce the synergy effects of chassis and engine coming from the same company.
 

Astandahl

Member
Oct 28, 2017
9,008
Red Bull also poured 100s of millions into F1 and were able to match Ferrari's investment.

You're kidding yourself if you think Ferrari could put themselves back on top on a whim, if only they cared enough to invest!!!!!!

Even now they have enough money to get almost any top talent they want, to do all of the testing permitted under regulations, to get the cream-of-the-crop drivers.

The truth is Mercedes is just functioning on another level in terms of management and leadership.

What did you say about Mercedes is totally true. So we are back to what i was saying : hiring better employees ( managers , engineers , drivers etc ) , which is what they did in the 90s when Montezemolo gave Ferrari Corse an unlimited budget . They were able to hire the best strategist of the grid ( Brawn ) , the best driver ( Schumacher ) and one of the best engineers of F1 ( Byrne ) on top of many others.

I know that Mercedes is on another level , in fact i laugh when people are surprised that RB and Ferrari are behind or they complain about it.
 

TheRulingRing

Banned
Apr 6, 2018
5,713
What did you say about Mercedes is totally true. So we are back to what i was saying : hiring better employees ( managers , engineers , drivers etc ) , which is what they did in the 90s when Montezemolo gave Ferrari Corse an unlimited budget . They were able to hire the best strategist of the grid ( Brawn ) , the best driver ( Schumacher ) and one of the best engineers of F1 ( Byrne ) on top of many others.

I know that Mercedes is on another level , in fact i laugh when people are surprised that RB and Ferrari are behind or they complain about it.

What I take issue with is your idea that Ferrari could easily be back on top if they wanted to, and the only reason they're not is because they can't be bothered. You're acting as if they're some all-powerful force.

It's not that easy. Ferrari's F1 team basically has an unlimited budget even now.
 

Kalor

Resettlement Advisor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,625
W Series starts this weekend and they announced their presenting line-up earlier.

https://motorsportbroadcasting.com/2019/04/29/w-series-announces-presentation-team/

The all new W Series has announced its on-air presentation team for the inaugural season.

Lee McKenzie will present the output, with David Coulthard acting as analyst and co-commentator.

Claire Cottingham will serve as lead commentator, whilst Ted Kravitz joins the crew as pit lane reporter.
 

Moss

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,207
I still feel pretty conflicted on the W Series as a concept, but will be sure to check it out. The car specs (Formula 3), should hopefully provide a good standard of racing.
 

nekkid

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
21,823
W Series starts this weekend and they announced their presenting line-up earlier.

https://motorsportbroadcasting.com/2019/04/29/w-series-announces-presentation-team/

So does this run as a support series to F1? Just wondering how it would work with Ted Kravitz's F1 commitments.

I'd be really happy if it did run on an F1 race weekend.

Edit: looks like they're mostly not at the same circuits at all, but they're all in Europe during the European F1 leg (or the summer break) and are on F1 off-weekends.
 
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softtack

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,650
Apparently driveshaft trouble for Gasly, VTEC too powerful it broke the driveshaft.
Wb88QX.gif
 

massivekettle

Banned
Aug 7, 2018
678
Why in the blue hell Leclerc should have pushed after the first pit stop? He had a 25 s ( TWENTY FIVE SECONDS ) gap to Verstappen. He needed to lap around 1.43 each lap to comeback which wasn't possible so he didn't even push. Gasly had to pit and Perez was 35 s behind. He saved the engine as much as possible and went for a fast lap at the end with another set of soft. Of course the medium tyres were the best choice. Leclerc destroyed his race after quali , only chance was SC or using the hard tyres no one tried during the weekend.

And yes he was faster than Seb here in Baku.

He tried pushing but the soft just wasn't a good race tyre that day. He only managed a 1:43 lap with brand new softs, full PU mode, and on fumes, whilst the drivers with worn mediums (30+ laps) were able, under similar circumstances (PU mode and fumes) to easily lap in the low to mid 1:44s.
 

chuckddd

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,075
One thing I don't understand from the weekend. How do you rebuild a car and put new tires on without breaking parc ferme?
 

DaveLong

Member
Nov 2, 2017
1,199
Not to mention , incredibly dangerous.
This comment is ridiculous. I'm sorry. Refuelling is not "incredibly dangerous". Is it more dangerous than not doing it? Yes. Is it going to cause people to get lit on fire every race as implied by "incredibly dangerous"? Hell to the no.

IndyCar does it every single weekend with sub ten second stops. NASCAR as well with slower stops and effing gas cans! Stop this nonsense.

It's auto racing. It is inherently dangerous. Full stop.
 

AlphaMale

Member
Dec 21, 2017
424
This comment is ridiculous. I'm sorry. Refuelling is not "incredibly dangerous". Is it more dangerous than not doing it? Yes. Is it going to cause people to get lit on fire every race as implied by "incredibly dangerous"? Hell to the no.
IndyCar does it every single weekend with sub ten second stops. NASCAR as well with slower stops and effing gas cans! Stop this nonsense.
It's auto racing. It is inherently dangerous. Full stop.

I agree with this, and agree that refueling will add an extra element to the strategy in the sport. I think refueling with the combination of a 'lollipop man', eager to release the driver, made it a potentially dangerous mix.
 

Tygre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,100
Chesire, UK
This comment is ridiculous. I'm sorry. Refuelling is not "incredibly dangerous". Is it more dangerous than not doing it? Yes. Is it going to cause people to get lit on fire every race as implied by "incredibly dangerous"? Hell to the no.

IndyCar does it every single weekend with sub ten second stops. NASCAR as well with slower stops and effing gas cans! Stop this nonsense.

It's auto racing. It is inherently dangerous. Full stop.

Yeah, anyone concerned about safety in motorsport should watch an Indycar race and realise how fucking safe F1 pit-stops are by comparison.

I'm amazed people aren't killed every Indy race considering the clown show that goes on in the pits.
 

DaveLong

Member
Nov 2, 2017
1,199
Yeah, anyone concerned about safety in motorsport should watch an Indycar race and realise how fucking safe F1 pit-stops are by comparison.

I'm amazed people aren't killed every Indy race considering the clown show that goes on in the pits.
This is also ridiculous.

There are three times as many bowling pins waiting for every F1 stop and about six guys per team exposed on the pit wall. The speeds on entry are the same. Are you really going to have this debate?
 
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