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N64Controller

Member
Nov 2, 2017
8,402
DSP is an acronym for digital signal processing too. Dunno if that was what Phil was going for?

No chance in hell that's what he went for lmao!

Sorry for bringing that up, it just went through my head, the thread was about a shithead being against cancel culture, I read DSP, and my mind somehow went to the shithead I know who uses that acronym.

Yeah bro I'm going to bet it WASN'T what he was going for.

Hey now he was a valedictorian, don't count out the pigroach.
 

Mr Spasiba

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,779
Guess he saw how well it went for Freddy's guy and decided to give it a go lol.

This is funny because it's really the sorta thing you could probably just be like "I don't agree with him as a person blah blah blah" and mostly get away with it without anyone caring. But instead you dive in and somehow get your own subreddit wanting to ban you lmao.
 

Lampa

Member
Feb 13, 2018
3,664
After Subnautica, Kingdom Come deliverance, CD projekt, etc I think we should point at the issue, it's not sporadic when susccesful studios think bigotry is okay.
We can also point out the issue without making generalizations about such vast geographical location.
 
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vbwh

Banned
Jul 24, 2018
53
User Banned (permanent): Dismissing concerns of bigotry over several posts; account in junior phase.
I agree with him that you can endorse someone's work without necessarily endorsing their personality. An artist is not their art, a programmer is not their code. You might personally be unwilling to separate them, and decide not to use/enjoy someone's work based on what you know about its creator. I feel that way about some things, like Quantic Dream's games after learning about David Cage. But I can still choose to praise things that those games did well, without any implication that I endorse Cage.

I also agree that it's important to trust every adult to assess the world around them by themselves, instead of infantilising them by claiming that some things need to be suppressed based on the people behind them. Censorship in general, including fostering an atmosphere where one feels the need to self-censor for fear of disproportionate retaliation, is a bad thing.

As for "cancel culture" (for lack of a better term): It treads a thin line between "holding people accountable" and "mob justice". Sometimes the latter masquerades as the former. I understand having an adverse reaction to it.

For example: Some of the other remarks he's apparently made on reddit are very alarming, completely unreasonable, and definitely make me think less of him.

...but.

I only know he said those things because some people have decided to trawl through his post history, looking for juicy comments to take incendiary screenshots of. These objectionable statements would otherwise have been confined to the tiny audience of the threads they were made in, some of them several years old.

These statements are offensive, but they really don't seem like they need to be my business. He is not in a position of significant power or influence. There is no suggestion that he's caused any harm in any way. No vulnerable people are affected by his statements, however disagreeable they are.

No public service is being performed by digging this stuff up and sharing it with a new audience.
 

Conkerkid11

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
13,990
Oh wow, good on the mods for literally deleting his post for breaking the community guidelines. That must've felt good.
 

Zips

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,917
Holy crap. He really dug himself even deeper from when I last posted in this thread?

What an absolute jackass.
 

SteveWinwood

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,726
USA USA USA
I know this is hardly the most important thing here, but imagine going to bat for not only the clean code guy, but clean code the book (or videos in this case), that thing was at best about to become outdated in 2008, his section with examples of how to short functions is hilariously terrible, and that is the code in a book, not in the real world, I shudder to think just how terrible that code would be in the real world with all the constraints therein.

It's probably time to stop recommending Clean Code @ Things Of Interest (qntm.org)
I read through most of that and at the end there is another book he ends up recommending for slightly more advanced programmers. But I am not a slightly advanced programmer.

What would some recommend for general philosophy for code beginners?
 

falcondoc

Member
Oct 29, 2017
6,272
I agree with him that you can endorse someone's work without necessarily endorsing their personality. An artist is not their art, a programmer is not their code. You might personally be unwilling to separate them, and decide not to use/enjoy someone's work based on what you know about its creator. I feel that way about some things, like Quantic Dream's games after learning about David Cage. But I can still choose to praise things that those games did well, without any implication that I endorse Cage.

I also agree that it's important to trust every adult to assess the world around them by themselves, instead of infantilising them by claiming that some things need to be suppressed based on the people behind them. Censorship in general, including fostering an atmosphere where one feels the need to self-censor for fear of disproportionate retaliation, is a bad thing.

As for "cancel culture" (for lack of a better term): It treads a thin line between "holding people accountable" and "mob justice". Sometimes the latter masquerades as the former. I understand having an adverse reaction to it.

For example: Some of the other remarks he's apparently made on reddit are very alarming, completely unreasonable, and definitely make me think less of him.

...but.

I only know he said those things because some people have decided to trawl through his post history, looking for juicy comments to take incendiary screenshots of. These objectionable statements would otherwise have been confined to the tiny audience of the threads they were made in, some of them several years old.

These statements are offensive, but they really don't seem like they need to be my business. He is not in a position of significant power or influence. There is no suggestion that he's caused any harm in any way. No vulnerable people are affected by his statements, however disagreeable they are.

No public service is being performed by digging this stuff up and sharing it with a new audience.

What the hell is this? "Lets ignore awful racist, evil shit because someone dug it up?"

Gross
 

Captain of Outer Space

Come Sale Away With Me
Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,475
Seeing that one screenshot of his replies where it cuts off at him starting to talk about Stalin was a pretty good "I don't need to see any more of this shit" moment for me. I'm glad I haven't bought this game after seeing people I like rave about it. I can put more time into the other similar games.
 

Mesoian

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 28, 2017
26,821
Rule number one of indie development. Hire a publicist.

Once you hire that publicist, hire two more.

Fucking clownshoes over there.
 

Mesoian

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 28, 2017
26,821
I agree with him that you can endorse someone's work without necessarily endorsing their personality. An artist is not their art, a programmer is not their code. You might personally be unwilling to separate them, and decide not to use/enjoy someone's work based on what you know about its creator. I feel that way about some things, like Quantic Dream's games after learning about David Cage. But I can still choose to praise things that those games did well, without any implication that I endorse Cage.

I also agree that it's important to trust every adult to assess the world around them by themselves, instead of infantilising them by claiming that some things need to be suppressed based on the people behind them. Censorship in general, including fostering an atmosphere where one feels the need to self-censor for fear of disproportionate retaliation, is a bad thing.

As for "cancel culture" (for lack of a better term): It treads a thin line between "holding people accountable" and "mob justice". Sometimes the latter masquerades as the former. I understand having an adverse reaction to it.

For example: Some of the other remarks he's apparently made on reddit are very alarming, completely unreasonable, and definitely make me think less of him.

...but.

I only know he said those things because some people have decided to trawl through his post history, looking for juicy comments to take incendiary screenshots of. These objectionable statements would otherwise have been confined to the tiny audience of the threads they were made in, some of them several years old.

These statements are offensive, but they really don't seem like they need to be my business. He is not in a position of significant power or influence. There is no suggestion that he's caused any harm in any way. No vulnerable people are affected by his statements, however disagreeable they are.

No public service is being performed by digging this stuff up and sharing it with a new audience.

This ain't it chief.

It's okay to like Factorio and understand that this dude is, by the minute apparently, revealing himself to be at total shitheel.
 

RedMercury

Blue Venus
Member
Dec 24, 2017
17,734
No public service is being performed by digging this stuff up and sharing it with a new audience.
Your whole post is pretty not great but for the sake of brevity, it's good for people to know who they are dealing with so people can make an informed decision on how they choose to treat or interact with that individual.
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,134
What the hell is this? "Lets ignore awful racist, evil shit because someone dug it up?"

Gross
To be fair, he himself wasn't really posting racist shit himself that I noticed, he just got on a weird right wing talking points libertarian trip when it was suggested to him to maybe not promote a resource that is harmful.

The dismissiveness about pedophilia is all him though.
 

Billfisto

Member
Oct 30, 2017
15,174
Canada
I agree with him that you can endorse someone's work without necessarily endorsing their personality. An artist is not their art, a programmer is not their code. You might personally be unwilling to separate them, and decide not to use/enjoy someone's work based on what you know about its creator. I feel that way about some things, like Quantic Dream's games after learning about David Cage. But I can still choose to praise things that those games did well, without any implication that I endorse Cage.

I also agree that it's important to trust every adult to assess the world around them by themselves, instead of infantilising them by claiming that some things need to be suppressed based on the people behind them. Censorship in general, including fostering an atmosphere where one feels the need to self-censor for fear of disproportionate retaliation, is a bad thing.

As for "cancel culture" (for lack of a better term): It treads a thin line between "holding people accountable" and "mob justice". Sometimes the latter masquerades as the former. I understand having an adverse reaction to it.

For example: Some of the other remarks he's apparently made on reddit are very alarming, completely unreasonable, and definitely make me think less of him.

...but.

I only know he said those things because some people have decided to trawl through his post history, looking for juicy comments to take incendiary screenshots of. These objectionable statements would otherwise have been confined to the tiny audience of the threads they were made in, some of them several years old.

These statements are offensive, but they really don't seem like they need to be my business. He is not in a position of significant power or influence. There is no suggestion that he's caused any harm in any way. No vulnerable people are affected by his statements, however disagreeable they are.

No public service is being performed by digging this stuff up and sharing it with a new audience.

Ehhhhhhhhh.

This is some serious "the real bad guys here are the people bringing things to light!" energy.

You talk of "fearing disproportionate response", but in 98% of the cases of "cancel culture" the only real ramifications have been that people are mad at you on the internet for a few days.
 

vbwh

Banned
Jul 24, 2018
53
What the hell is this? "Lets ignore awful racist, evil shit because someone dug it up?"

Well, I can't entirely ignore it now that I know about it. I can't really be on board with someone who seemingly thinks statutory rape is just a term invented by "SJW"s, and sees no issue with teacher/student relationships. I'm concerned that my post will be seen as defending that kind of thing.

Rather I'm questioning the motive for the people digging these posts up. It feels like someone objected to the (perfectly reasonable) opinion originally presented- "I don't/shouldn't care about Uncle Bob's personal beliefs"- and set out to back this up by playing private detective on everything the dev has ever said. Digging up dirt on them, to support an objection to the fair idea that someone's questionable tweets needn't lead to suppression of their opinions on software engineering. And everyone joining in feels like a classic witch hunt- digging through someone's reddit history hoping to find something offensive.

Are you willing to stand by everything you've ever said on every corner of the internet? Does this guy even still believe that shit he posted years ago on an askreddit thread?

it's good for people to know who they are dealing with so people can make an informed decision on how they choose to treat or interact with that individual.

Wube is apparently 21 people now. Before buying Factorio, do I need to find all their social media accounts and comb through them looking for anything nasty? If I find anything, should I spread the word by creating a thread encouraging others to look for more?

It just doesn't seem like a reasonable, proportionate, or healthy thing to do- even if I do find something.
 

Deleted member 11637

Oct 27, 2017
18,204
I agree with him that you can endorse someone's work without necessarily endorsing their personality. An artist is not their art, a programmer is not their code. You might personally be unwilling to separate them, and decide not to use/enjoy someone's work based on what you know about its creator. I feel that way about some things, like Quantic Dream's games after learning about David Cage. But I can still choose to praise things that those games did well, without any implication that I endorse Cage.

I also agree that it's important to trust every adult to assess the world around them by themselves, instead of infantilising them by claiming that some things need to be suppressed based on the people behind them. Censorship in general, including fostering an atmosphere where one feels the need to self-censor for fear of disproportionate retaliation, is a bad thing.

As for "cancel culture" (for lack of a better term): It treads a thin line between "holding people accountable" and "mob justice". Sometimes the latter masquerades as the former. I understand having an adverse reaction to it.

For example: Some of the other remarks he's apparently made on reddit are very alarming, completely unreasonable, and definitely make me think less of him.

...but.

I only know he said those things because some people have decided to trawl through his post history, looking for juicy comments to take incendiary screenshots of. These objectionable statements would otherwise have been confined to the tiny audience of the threads they were made in, some of them several years old.

These statements are offensive, but they really don't seem like they need to be my business. He is not in a position of significant power or influence. There is no suggestion that he's caused any harm in any way. No vulnerable people are affected by his statements, however disagreeable they are.

No public service is being performed by digging this stuff up and sharing it with a new audience.


resetera-default-avatar-transparent.png
 

Deleted member 11637

Oct 27, 2017
18,204
You'll need to explain this one to me. Why is the fact that I haven't set an avatar significant?

It's just always funny to see people who've had an account for years and barely post but just can't stop themselves from jumping in a thread to defend shitty behavior. It happens all the time.
 

Kadath

Member
Oct 25, 2017
622
I agree with him that you can endorse someone's work without necessarily endorsing their personality. An artist is not their art, a programmer is not their code.

That's not the point. It's not a simple split between what someone does and their personality. Especially with art, personality is also often expressed in what you're doing.

But it's more the case that people can do both good and bad things. Good people don't do good things ALL the time, obviously. So it makes sense that one can appreciate and value the good things being done, while condemning the bad things.

And maybe help the other person to correct their faults.

The problem with "cancel culture" is all there. The purpose is to identify and isolate the bad apples, with little space left for correction. In this same thread I've seen a few calling that dev a fascist, maybe because it makes him easier to hate.

People saying stupid, bigoted thing should be called out, loud and clear, but the intention should be correction. And a community should be inclusive, not in the sense that it tolerates the bad, but so it does all it's possible to recuperate the bad apples. As long the other side is open for a civil discussion, which is not always the case.

Same as the above, "cancel culture" can be both good and bad. There are truly nasty aspects to it, same as there are important parts that cannot be brushed away.

(and it's the very opposite of "being in the middle". It's about doing precise judgements, and avoid to succumb to the simple "average". It's the longer, more complex path.)
 

Billfisto

Member
Oct 30, 2017
15,174
Canada
Rather I'm questioning the motive for the people digging these posts up. It feels like someone objected to the (perfectly reasonable) opinion originally presented- "I don't/shouldn't care about Uncle Bob's personal beliefs"- and set out to back this up by playing private detective on everything he's ever said. Digging up dirt on this dev, to support an objection to the fair idea that someone's questionable tweets needn't lead to suppression of their opinions on software engineering. And everyone joining in feels like a classic witch hunt- digging through someone's reddit history hoping to find something offensive.

Motivation is definitely important. I agree that this type of behavior can be weaponised (as Mike Cernovich did to try and get back at James Gunn for being vocally anti-Trump), but what exactly are you implying the motive was in this case?

Beyond that, his response wasn't "I don't/shouldn't care about Uncle Bob's personal beliefs". If he'd just left it at that, there wouldn't be much of an issue. You're presenting a sanitized version of what he said to make people appear more ridiculous. His exact immediate response was "take the cancel culture mentality and shove it up your ass."

I think it's fair that such a response would warrant someone going "well, that was bonkers. Is he always like this?'

Wube is apparently 21 people now. Before buying Factorio, do I need to find all their social media accounts and comb through them looking for anything nasty? If I find anything, should I spread the word by creating a thread encouraging others to look for more?

...No? Nobody's saying that.

But this is a discussion forum, and we're discussing that the guy has said some whack things in the past. As several people have said in this very thread, that does colour their opinion of the dev and if they'd be willing to support them. So, it was useful information to them.
 

Micael

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,377
I read through most of that and at the end there is another book he ends up recommending for slightly more advanced programmers. But I am not a slightly advanced programmer.

What would some recommend for general philosophy for code beginners?

Don't really have any recommendations as far as these kinds of books are concerned, in no small part because I'm a bit weary about books that are about general software best practices, outside of surface deep things like say keeping a consistent set of standards for naming things in a project/organization, most of the advice seems to completely ignore the fact what is or isn't best practice can vary quite a bit between languages and even project types.
For example, even within the same language writing C# code in normal business applications is going to look very different than writing C# for say Unity the game engine, same language, but the code that is best for one type of application is very much not best for the other.

With that being said, I can wholeheartedly recommend you pick up a functional programming language if you haven't already.
Build some applications with what ever functional programming language you pick up, since at the start you are likely to just translate OOP to what ever functional language you pick up, but over time you will pick up the differences, and start writing more functional code, and you will start to see more and more the advantages it brings.
 

vbwh

Banned
Jul 24, 2018
53
It's just always funny to see people who've had an account for years and barely post but just can't stop themselves from jumping in a thread to defend shitty behavior. It happens all the time.

I guess you "couldn't stop yourself" from checking my profile to see how often I post and how old my account is.

but what exactly are you implying the motive was in this case?
I didn't mean anything deeper than what I said. I don't think the motive was to expose the developer's objectionable viewpoints so as to better allow others to make an informed decision about interacting with them; rather I think the motive was "I don't like the idea this person just posted, I'd better look through their profile to find dirt on them".

His exact immediate response was "take the cancel culture mentality and shove it up your ass."

It's a strong way of saying "I disagree with the philosophy implied by your suggestion re. Uncle Bob", but strong language is typical on reddit.

But this is a discussion forum, and we're discussing that the guy has said some whack things in the past. As several people have said in this very thread, that does colour their opinion of the dev and if they'd be willing to support them. So, it was useful information to them.

If that was useful information, then surely similar information on every other dev would be useful too? If knowing about a developer's personal perspective puts someone off from buying their game, then why should they stop at just taking action on info on this one dev that happens to be brought to their attention?
 

RedMercury

Blue Venus
Member
Dec 24, 2017
17,734
Wube is apparently 21 people now. Before buying Factorio, do I need to find all their social media accounts and comb through them looking for anything nasty? If I find anything, should I spread the word by creating a thread encouraging others to look for more?
Just speaking for myself here but if you wanted to make an informed decision about what you were putting your money behind, sure I don't think there is an issue there. We're talking about publicly made statements, I don't see an issue there. Of course if someone said something awful I think people should know about that so they can be held accountable for it. There's nothing unhealthy about accountability in most circumstances.
 

Mr Spasiba

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,779
If that was useful information, then surely similar information on every other dev would be useful too? If knowing about a developer's personal perspective puts someone off from buying their game, then why should they stop at just taking action on info on this one dev that happens to be brought to their attention?
These posts gotta be at least top three most bizarre defenses of a shitty person of all time. You shouldn't not want to support someone after finding out they're a shitty person because before you found out they were a shitty person you didn't know they were a shitty person, so the knowledge of them being a shitty person shouldn't be taken into consideration because you previously didn't know it.

Absolute galaxy brain.
 

Billfisto

Member
Oct 30, 2017
15,174
Canada
I didn't mean anything deeper than what I said. I don't think the motive was to expose the developer's objectionable viewpoints so as to better allow others to make an informed decision about interacting with them; rather I think the motive was "I don't like the idea this person just posted, I'd better look through their profile to find dirt on them".

Why are you phrasing it as "find dirt"?

It's a strong way of saying "I disagree with the philosophy implies by your suggestion", but strong language is typical on reddit.

It's not a "strong way" of saying that. It was saying something entirely different. It was immediately flying off the handle in a needlessly hostile manner and attacking the person while spontaneously invoking the right-wing spectre of "cancel culture" to avoid actually discussing the matter.

Immediately going to "cancel culture" is a huge red flag.

If that was useful information, then surely similar information on every other dev would be useful too? If knowing about a developer's personal perspective puts someone off from buying their game, then why should they stop at just taking action on info on this one dev that happens to be brought to their attention?

You're being ridiculous. Investigating every developer involved with every game would obviously be ridiculous. People can generally assume that developers maintain a certain baseline of reason and inoffensiveness.

If somebody feels that a developer has done something untoward, or something that may affect if people will want to support them, this can be discussed and people can make their own value judgements.
 

vbwh

Banned
Jul 24, 2018
53
Just speaking for myself here but if you wanted to make an informed decision about what you were putting your money behind, sure I don't think there is an issue there. We're talking about publicly made statements, I don't see an issue there. Of course if someone said something awful I think people should know about that so they can be held accountable for it. There's nothing unhealthy about accountability in most circumstances.

"Publicly made statements" gives the impression of some kind of formal announcement or deliberate publication. A reddit comment is "public", but often only intended to be seen by particular people (in the case of a deep reply chain), members of a certain group or niche, or at least people who have specifically elected to read about particular topics- and at a particular moment in time, with relevant context.

It so happens that the internet is effectively a medium of permanent public record, allowing anyone to scrutinise everyone else's entire histories in minute detail. But that's not really what the environment feels like when you're posting in places like that, right? Reddit comments feel closer to a spoken conversation than they do to something more formal like an email, at least to me. I wouldn't expect to be held accountable for them, especially years later.

(I want to be clear that I in no way endorse the particular reddit comments this dev apparently made.)
 

Antrax

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,342

Addleburg

The Fallen
Nov 16, 2017
5,077
If that was useful information, then surely similar information on every other dev would be useful too? If knowing about a developer's personal perspective puts someone off from buying their game, then why should they stop at just taking action on info on this one dev that happens to be brought to their attention?

Nobody went trawling into Factorio guy's history until he said gave a dumb shit response when someone pointed out a problematic programmer their dev post was promoting. The response wasn't even a milquetoast, "While we disagree with Uncle Bob's views regarding these matters, we do think his programming insight is invaluable and worth sharing on its own," but an immediate jump to cancel culture and telling someone to shove it up their ass.

If other comments from other devs prompted such an investigation, then I'm sure many people would be happy to know their damning pattern of behavior and decide whether or not to support them.

But of course, your whole "point" is an attempt at shifting the topic and essentially going, "But what about everyone else?!"
 

vbwh

Banned
Jul 24, 2018
53
Why are you phrasing it as "find dirt"?

Person A talks about Person C's writings.
Person B suggests that C ought not to be implicitly endorsed, because they are "controversial".
Person A strongly dislikes the idea that they should care about C's "controversy", and writes a rude reply saying as much.
Person B (or perhaps just someone stumbling upon the exchange) decides to search through Person A's post history, looking for anything offensive, and creates tweets/resetera posts with their findings.

Does that last action feel like it's driven by a desire to expose Person A's nature for the sake of the public good?
 

RedMercury

Blue Venus
Member
Dec 24, 2017
17,734
"Publicly made statements" gives the impression of some kind of formal announcement or deliberate publication. A reddit comment is "public", but often only intended to be seen by particular people (in the case of a deep reply chain), members of a certain group or niche, or at least people who have specifically elected to read about particular topics- and at a particular moment in time, with relevant context.
Idk, that's how I treat my comments. Like on Era for instance, people can hide their profile from view, it doesn't "really" hide it but still people have the option and a lot of people take it, I've never hidden my profile and I recognize I'm responsible for all my comments. I wouldn't have an issue sharing my reddit account or whatever else if there weren't Nazis who would love the chance to dox me but my work knows it, my friends know it, I guess for me I don't recognize a distinction between online and "real life" because what you say is what you say at the end of the day. That's you, for better or worse.

I don't think people can compartmentalize to such a degree where the things they say are off limits depending on where they say it in most circumstances, I think it sucks people can be two-faced about stuff like that thinking because they say something where nobody is paying attention it's like it didn't happen.
 

Mr Spasiba

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
1,779
Person A talks about Person C's writings.
Person B suggests that C ought not to be implicitly endorsed, because they are "controversial".
Person A strongly dislikes the idea that they should care about C's "controversy", and writes a rude reply saying as much.
Person B (or perhaps just someone stumbling upon the exchange) decides to search through Person A's post history, looking for anything offensive, and creates tweets/resetera posts with their findings.

Does that last action feel like it's driven by a desire to expose Person A's nature for the sake of the public good?
The way you make linking someone's public statements sound like a dirty cop breaking into someone's house without a warrant and planting evidence is delightful
 

entrydenied

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
7,643
PSA 1 : Cancel Culture does not exist in the form that bigots think it does

PSA 2 : Nobody is going through the entirety of the Internet to find out if someone said something wrong or offensive. The thing with bigots is that they will inevitably out themselves to be one and why should we stop anyone from pointing them out?

PSA 3: The Internet is real life, it is 2021, not 2001. Things said and done online affects people.
 

vbwh

Banned
Jul 24, 2018
53
Nobody went trawling into Factorio guy's history until he said gave a dumb shit response when someone pointed out a problematic programmer their dev post was promoting. The response wasn't even a milquetoast, "While we disagree with Uncle Bob's views regarding these matters, we do think his programming insight is invaluable and worth sharing on its own," but an immediate jump to cancel culture and telling someone to shove it up their ass.

If other comments from other devs prompted such an investigation, then I'm sure many people would be happy to know their damning pattern of behavior and decide whether or not to support them.

But of course, your whole "point" is an attempt at shifting the topic and essentially going, "But what about everyone else?!"

If the dev felt strongly about it, why should they be obliged to write a milquetoast reply? Their strong reply, while rudely phrased, was not in itself abhorrent or insane or otherwise worthy of launching a "post history investigation" over.

My point was an attempt at expressing why I find this approach to internet arguments to be absurd, and to explain why I understand the dev's "cancel culture" concern even though I hate both (a) that term and its use by certain groups and (b) other stuff the dev has said.
 

RetroRunner

Member
Dec 6, 2020
4,950
We can also point out the issue without making generalizations about half a continent.
I think calling Eastern Europe half a continent and by extension Europe a continent is in itself problematic, I understand its been taught in schools a long time but the only reason anyone calls Europe a continent is because a bunch of white people don't like that they're part of the same continent as Asia(hence it actually being Eurasia).
 

Het_Nkik

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,421
If the dev felt strongly about it, why should they be obliged to write a milquetoast reply? Their strong reply, while rudely phrased, was not in itself abhorrent or insane or otherwise worthy of launching a "post history investigation" over.

My point was an attempt at expressing why I find this approach to internet arguments to be absurd, and to explain why I understand the dev's "cancel culture" concern even though I hate both (a) that term and its use by certain groups and (b) other stuff the dev has said.
He doesn't have to issue an apology, especially if he's not sorry. And people have the right to think his response was super shitty and worth looking into his very public history for similar shittiness. "Cancel culture" is just people not wanting to give dirtbags the time of day.
 

Jakenbakin

"This guy are sick" and Corrupted by Vengeance
Member
Jun 17, 2018
11,957
If the dev felt strongly about it, why should they be obliged to write a milquetoast reply? Their strong reply, while rudely phrased, was not in itself abhorrent or insane or otherwise worthy of launching a "post history investigation" over.

"Hey this guy you're suggesting we listen to is a bigot btw."

"No fuck you fuck cancel culture shove it up your ass."

Idk man that's a pretty damning scenario that reflects a lot of the developers opinions very quickly, and very much so warrants the meager attention that is checking someone's publicly facing profile and see if this conduct is part of a pattern.
 

admiraltaftbar

Self-Requested Ban
Banned
Dec 9, 2017
1,889
He must have suffered brain damage from extreme G-Force going from 0 to Stalin to Ron Paul like that.
It's funny when people try to act like Ron Paul is somehow outside the right or left of American politics (he's definitely a republican even if he suggests people should be able to smoke weed or whatever). Also extra funny because he's also a racist shithead.
 

Mesoian

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 28, 2017
26,821
If that was useful information, then surely similar information on every other dev would be useful too? If knowing about a developer's personal perspective puts someone off from buying their game, then why should they stop at just taking action on info on this one dev that happens to be brought to their attention?

I mean you say that as if it's 1.) not available, and 2.) doesn't happen all the time.

The FNAF guy just "retired" (got bounced from his own company) after it was discovered that he was donating thousands of dollars to the GOP.
 
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