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Extraordinary warning to Trump by 10 former Pentagon chiefs (Not to involve military pursuing claims of election fraud)

SilentPanda

SilentPanda

Member
Nov 6, 2017
13,621
Earth
In an extraordinary rebuke of President Donald Trump, all 10 living former secretaries of defense cautioned Sunday against any move to involve the military in pursuing claims of election fraud, arguing that it would take the country into "dangerous, unlawful and unconstitutional territory."
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The 10 men, both Democrats and Republicans, signed on to an opinion article published in The Washington Post that implicitly questioned Trump's willingness to follow his Constitutional duty to peacefully relinquish power on Jan. 20. Following the Nov. 3 election and subsequent recounts in some states, as well as unsuccessful court challenges, the outcome is clear, they wrote, while not specifying Trump in the article.

"The time for questioning the results has passed; the time for the formal counting of the electoral college votes, as prescribed in the Constitution and statute, has arrived," they wrote.
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The 10 former Pentagon leaders also warned in their Post article of the dangers of impeding a full and smooth transition at Defense Department prior to Inauguration Day as part of a transfer to power to President-elect Joe Biden. Biden has complained of efforts by Trump-appointed Pentagon officials to obstruct he transition.
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The opinion article in the Post was signed by Dick Cheney, William Perry, Donald Rumsfeld, William Cohen, Robert Gates, Leon Panetta, Chuck Hagel, Ash Carter, James Mattis and Mark Esper. Mattis was Trump's first defense secretary; he resigned in 2018 and was succeeded by Esper, who was fired just days after the Nov. 3 election.

The Post reported that the idea for writing the opinion piece began with a conversation between Cheney and Eric Edelman, a retired ambassador and former senior Pentagon official, about how Trump might seek to use the military in coming days.
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apnews.com

Extraordinary warning to Trump by 10 former Pentagon chiefs

WASHINGTON (AP) — In an extraordinary rebuke of President Donald Trump, all 10 living former secretaries of defense cautioned Sunday against any move to involve the military in pursuing claims of election fraud, arguing that it would take the country into “dangerous, unlawful and unconstitutional te
apnews.com apnews.com
 
VariantX

VariantX

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,880
Columbia, SC
They don't need to bother to warn Trump, hes not going to read a letter of this. I feel this is a warning more so for everyone else.
 
entremet

entremet

You wouldn't toast a NES cartridge
Member
Oct 26, 2017
59,970
Those are some horrible people signing this but I guess that's where we are.
 
FreezePeach

FreezePeach

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,811
If the generals came out to make a statement of 'we'll follow the people and constitution' after Trump's stunt holding a bible after gassing protesters i think maybe they wont go along with this.
 
Rockstar

Rockstar

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,850
US
tenor.gif
 
Eeyore

Eeyore

User requested ban
Banned
Dec 13, 2019
9,029
Good lord Dick Cheney is better than current Republicans?! I'm sorry I just can't believe that.
 
Man God

Man God

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,300
Back in 2016 after he won the Primary a lot of moderate republicans warned us that they were scared shitless by the stuff Trump said at the security briefings they gave the candidates.
 
Chopchop

Chopchop

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,171
He's not going to read it, and even if he did, he wouldn't listen.

He doesn't care about the country or the constitution. The only thing that would actually stop him would be a threat to drag his ass behind bars or shoot him if he tried this shit.
 
Digital Dinosaur

Digital Dinosaur

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,028
Rita Repulsa's Moon Palace
At this point, I kinda feel this "deeply concerned" theater by so many former this, ex-that, people is going to be trouble down the road.

They're focused on Trump being the villain and talking as if Trump is the one destroying rules, breaking the constitution, etc. And yes, in a sense he is. But the reality is more nuanced and much more critical: Trump is exposing how all these institutions are built on illusions of security and dependability.

When Trump is gone, too many people are going to think the problem is solved. When in reality it's just starting.
 
thisismadness

thisismadness

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,444
Don't matter. There is no appeal to Trump. After congress certifies the result, he is going to try to get the military involved.
 
Laurentius

Laurentius

Member
Apr 18, 2018
818
Trump doesn't care, but it's another signal that the military shouldn't accept any illegal orders from Trump. He doesn't have the backing of the military, which puts a huge damper on his coup wishes.
 
Jam

Jam

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,050
Imagine Dick Cheney telling you that you're going too far.

Most of the big name GOP crazies from years gone have spoken out against Trump. Bolton most recently, it's only really current serving Republicans and total Alt-right figures still defending them at this point isnt it?
 
Chirotera

Chirotera

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
4,268
I just can't imagine the military going through with any of this. Their oath is to the constitution, and not the President. And if they do, we're fucked. It's basically a civil war at that point.
 
Cow Mengde

Cow Mengde

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,697
Who's going to stop him? These guys can talk, but if Trump issues the command, no one will dare to stand up to him.
 
ThatCrazyGuy

ThatCrazyGuy

Member
Nov 27, 2017
9,847
Rums and Dick, telling you to chill the fuck out. What a time.

The military allegiance is to the constitution, not the president.
 
Version 3.0

Version 3.0

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,155
Yeah, appeal to Trump's sense of decency or respect for the law/constitution. That'll work.

What these fuckers should be saying is "there will be consequences". Although that isn't true.
 
Skunk

Skunk

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,065
Digital Dinosaur said:
At this point, I kinda feel this "deeply concerned" theater by so many former this, ex-that, people is going to be trouble down the road.

They're focused on Trump being the villain and talking as if Trump is the one destroying rules, breaking the constitution, etc. And yes, in a sense he is. But the reality is more nuanced and much more critical: Trump is exposing how all these institutions are built on illusions of security and dependability.

When Trump is gone, too many people are going to think the problem is solved. When in reality it's just starting.
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I've stated once on this forum already that is it is very worrying that I have largely yet to see many lawmakers on either side discussing legislation/amendments/anything to close off some of the abuses of power/office Trump has exposed, because some of our perceived checks are more like decorum/ceremony rather than actual laws or checks on executive power. What is even worse is, this inaction was already terrifying around election day, when it was largely just Trump. It's absolutely mortifying in light of the past two months and how many Republicans are still supporting Trump in this blatant attempt to subvert democracy. Like *EVEN IF* Trump gets away with everything and we let him fuck off with only a slap on the wrist, something still must be done now that he has exposed all this stuff. Because the right continues to radicalize under the lie that the left is radicalizing, and it now seems blatantly apparent that this is going to become the bare minimum for them if they lose elections; and that's a very real and dangerous threat as more actual right-wing power-holding lawmakers continue to galvanize this mentality... they actually will start attempting and eventually succeed in seizing power at some point in the (possibly very near) future unless we institute stronger checks and balances.
 
djplaeskool

djplaeskool

Member
Oct 26, 2017
19,732
Cow Mengde said:
Who's going to stop him? These guys can talk, but if Trump issues the command, no one will dare to stand up to him.
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Come on, now. There's no Order 66 or anything.
There is this underlying concern among current and former Pentagon staff because they know attempts to dictate unconstitutional commands would result in a complete breakdown of the dynamic between the White House and the military's structure. There would be a massive wave of refusals and resignations before you'd see Generals complying with any sort of unwarranted domestic mobilization. Their oath is to the constitution.

There's this odd far right-wing idea that the military apparatus serves the Presidents every beck and call, and that's just not true.
They do hold extraordinary powers, but when it comes to domestic deployments, that power is greatly muted.
 
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Mariachi507

Mariachi507

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,272
They really want to help, they need to get on conservative media and say this stuff. Trump's cult declared the Post to be fake news years ago.
 
Rendering...

Rendering...

Member
Oct 30, 2017
19,089
Guys, don't give him ideas.

When America's Conscience, AKA Dick Cheney, is concerned about your conduct, you know you're probably doing a no-no.
 
daveo42

daveo42

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,250
Ohio
I mean, he's not going to get Pence to invalidate the election results, the coup by the GOP House and Senate aren't going to give him the election. He's totally gonna try and get the military to overturn the election. He may have installed some petty loyalists at the top, but the actual military personnel are gonna drag him kicking and screaming from the WH...but sadly not into a military prison for treason.
 
Netherscourge

Netherscourge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,903
The moment Justice Roberts swears in Joe Biden with the oath of office on January 20th, Biden becomes Commander in Chief of the entire US military.

Any service members or officers who try to protect Trump or refuse Biden at that point, will be court-martialed and lose whatever pension and benefits they may have accrued, lose rank, face a punitive discharge, fines, not to mention the jail time they'll be looking at.

They will be throwing away whatever service record or hopes they had.
 
TheXbox

TheXbox

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Oct 29, 2017
6,549
Good thing the Praetorian Guard is now responsible for deciding who sits in the Oval Office.
 
Buckle

Buckle

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Oct 27, 2017
41,038
Hes been taking the country into dangerous and unlawful places for years now.
 
Lobster Roll

Lobster Roll

signature-less, now and forever
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Sep 24, 2019
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Netherscourge said:
The moment Justice Roberts swears in Joe Biden with the oath of office on January 20th, Biden becomes Commander in Chief of the entire US military.

Any service members or officers who try to protect Trump or refuse Biden at that point, will be court-martialed and lose whatever pension and benefits they may have accrued, lose rank, face a punitive discharge, fines, not to mention the jail time they'll be looking at.

They will be throwing away whatever service record or hopes they had.
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Aside from that, this is the US military we're talking about here. The military is so far up it's "freedom defending" ass that it would never make itself personally responsible for defying the constitution and putting a dictatorship in place. Commander-in-chief or not, they're not going to make decisions to allow that to happen.
 
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