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Exclusive: Tired of Trump, Deutsche Bank games ways to sever ties with the president - sources (Reuters)

Xando

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
27,309
captmcblack said:
Can someone better at finance/banking than me point out if this is a credible interpretation of this? It would seem that he'd still owe the debt in question, just to other entities than Deutsche Bank instead...but probably I'm wrong.
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The value of the loans stay the same. Deutsche Bank takes a loss to get rid of the loans for cheaper.

As the buyer would pay less for the loan they might be up for a cheaper repayment to avoid not getting anything at all but that is speculation. Legally the loan keeps its it value. There is no reduction in debt unless the buyer somehow gives Trump a easy way out.
 
FaceHugger

FaceHugger

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
13,949
USA
Sho_Nuff82 said:
Deutsche brought in Trump (at the protest of most of their own internal watchdogs) under the pretense that he would bring in other "high profile" clients. They then ignored most of their own internal warnings that he was fabricating his assets when asking for loans. They then forgave over $270 million of those shitty loans. Only now, that he's in danger of being jailed for his years of financial crimes, did one of the higher ups say "hey guys maybe it's time to collect".

It's obvious from the start that there are political/financial arrangements with either Trump or his mobbed up friends that made Deutsche the only place that would take him and never break from him.
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I still can't believe they just accepted at face value his claims that his brand is worth $4bn, a figure he pulled out of his ass, when almost all of his properties have historically lost money until sold.

Meanwhile if I want a loan for a $50K BMW the finance manager at some bank goes over my assets and credit history with a fine toothed comb.
 
PanickyFool

PanickyFool

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,947
FaceHugger said:
I still can't believe they just accepted at face value his claims that his brand is worth $4bn, a figure he pulled out of his ass, when almost all of his properties have historically lost money until sold.

Meanwhile if I want a loan for a $50K BMW the finance manager at some bank goes over my assets and credit history with a fine toothed comb.
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At least real estate has historically appreciated.

Buying a 50k depreciating asset while presumably that is somewhere between 1-4 times your annual income is pretty insane.
 
Ether_Snake

Ether_Snake

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
11,306
Xando said:
The value of the loans stay the same. Deutsche Bank takes a loss to get rid of the loans for cheaper.

As the buyer would pay less for the laon they might be up for a cheaper repayment to avoid not getting anything at all but that is speculation. Legally the loan keeps its it value. There is no reduction in debt unless the buyer somehow gives Trump a easy way out.
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No debt repayment is ever guaranteed, otherwise there would be no risk. The ability of renegotiating debts is intrinsic to any loan. The lower one pays to own a debt, the more margin there is on the debtor to renegotiate in their favor. Trump's debt has just become less valuable with the bank's statement, increasing his margin to negotiate repayment.
 
Acidote

Acidote

Member
Oct 26, 2017
4,972
Deutsche Bank is a bunch of thieves too. I don't care if they get burnt by this.
 
captmcblack

captmcblack

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,063
Ether_Snake said:
No debt repayment is ever guaranteed, otherwise there would be no risk. The ability of renegotiating debts is intrinsic to any loan. The lower one pays to own a debt, the more margin there is on the debtor to renegotiate in their favor. Trump's debt has just become less valuable with the bank's statement, increasing his margin to negotiate repayment.
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I mean...of course Trump (the debtor) would *want* to negotiate in their favor, but why would an entity that bought Trump's debt want to do that for him when they could not do that and:

- financially own a US president
- probably wheel and deal based on owning the debt of a US president
- avoid the incredible scrutiny that firms face when they own complex debt of US presidents (which is the main reason DB is probably looking to get out from under those obligations)

That said, it remains possible. I just don't know why it would, in this case.
 
Xando

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
27,309
Ether_Snake said:
No debt repayment is ever guaranteed, otherwise there would be no risk. The ability of renegotiating debts is intrinsic to any loan. The lower one pays to own a debt, the more margin there is on the debtor to renegotiate in their favor. Trump's debt has just become less valuable with the bank's statement, increasing his margin to negotiate repayment.
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Your argument is not entirely correct. Sure the value of his debt might be lower to a buyer from Deutsche but the value stays the same for Trump.

Saying the value of the loan will reduce for Trump is pure speculation that might or might not happen depending on the creditor that takes over the loans. If the creditor demands Trump to repay the full debt he will have to repay the whole debt or default on it. Reducing the debt value requires goodwill that is completely optional and speculation at this point.


Considering the real estate assets he owns repoing his ass is probably a more valuable option than to forgive parts of the loans for someone thats going to jail anyway.
 
Mesoian

Mesoian

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 28, 2017
26,464
So they're going to buy him out in the form of forgiving a significant amount of that loan so they can be done with him.

That's a win for him guys. This isn't good news.
 
Ether_Snake

Ether_Snake

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
11,306
Xando said:
Your argument is not entirely correct. Sure the value of his debt might be lower to a buyer from Deutsche but the value stays the same for Trump.

Saying the value of the loan will reduce for Trump is pure speculation that might or might not happen depending on the creditor that takes over the loans. If the creditor demands Trump to repay the full debt he will have to repay the whole debt or default on it. Reducing the debt value requires goodwill that is completely optional and speculation at this point.


Considering the real estate assets he owns repoing his ass is probably a more valuable option than to forgive parts of the loans for someone thats going to jail anyway.
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Commercial real-estate in downtown areas is pretty much shot right now, and with no turning point foreseeable.
 
Raxus

Raxus

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,494
Mesoian said:
So they're going to buy him out in the form of forgiving a significant amount of that loan so they can be done with him.

That's a win for him guys. This isn't good news.
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From the sounds of it they are looking to get rid of his loan and make it somebody else's problem. The stitch is nobody is going to want anything that will just be straight up debt.
 
EloKa

EloKa

GSP
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
1,906
This would be the first positive thing that DeutscheBank did in years.
 
Bedlam

Bedlam

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
4,536
Hope Deutsche Bank won't be able to escape any potential investigations with this move. Burn all these crooks down!

(speaking as a German, even)
 

onadesertedisland

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,660
The fact that a foreign entity or individual could buy this debt and then have power over him is dangerous. Another reason he cannot remain president.
 
Garlador

Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
As I've said in the past, may karma give and take from Trump everything he deserves.
 
Glasgow Mega-Snake

Glasgow Mega-Snake

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,963
jelly said:
The thing I don't get about Deutsche Bank, they are dodgy as fuck, get caught all the time, get a slap on the wrists, why haven't the authorities hammered them or sent people to prison?
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They're the biggest bank of Germany with a shitton of political connections.

If they ever go under that could tank the German economy and kickstart a new financial crisis. Nobody wants that, especially now

It sucks, because they really shouldn't get away with their stupidity. The biggest bank of the 4h biggest economy of the world... and also the only bank willing to lend money to Donald Trump when he was bankrupt, because they were that desperate to get into the US market. It's laughable
 
El-Suave

El-Suave

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,831
Should have sold it to Volkswagen or some other German car manufacturer before Trump hopefully loses tonight. It'd be like that company had its very own pee pee tape.
 
AndyD

AndyD

Mambo Number PS5
Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,602
Nashville
FaceHugger said:
I still can't believe they just accepted at face value his claims that his brand is worth $4bn, a figure he pulled out of his ass, when almost all of his properties have historically lost money until sold.

Meanwhile if I want a loan for a $50K BMW the finance manager at some bank goes over my assets and credit history with a fine toothed comb.
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The Apprentice show have him hundreds of millions and credibility, on top of his existing brand. So the "fame" valuation is not zero, not 4B, but a ton of potential. Was anyway.
 
Lunchbox

Lunchbox

ƃuoɹʍ ʇᴉ ƃuᴉop ǝɹ,noʎ 'ʇɥƃᴉɹ sᴉɥʇ pɐǝɹ noʎ ɟI
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,548
Rip City
Ether_Snake said:
People ITT don't seem to get that this favors Trump? Do you know how debts work? The creditor is on the line here, they want to get rid of a load, which means they must find a buyer. Since they are desperate to sell, this favors buyers, not the seller, which means that they have to sell the loan at a lower value than otherwise. The lower the offer, the lower the value of Trump's debt, and the easier it will be for him to strike a deal to repay it to whoever ends up with the loan.



Yes
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Yes but the entity that buys the loan has a more vested interest to get that money from the debtor.
 

Imperfected

Member
Nov 9, 2017
11,737
Maybe instead of setting up yet another barrier to lending for normal people you should have asked literally even the most basic dead-ass questions before giving the man infinity dollars? Like maybe, "Is there literally any chance this gets repaid, ever?"

No, of course not.
 
BrassDragon

BrassDragon

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,154
The Netherlands
Remember, Deutsche Bank was investigated for helping Russia launder 10 billion USD through 'mirror trading', money stolen from Russian citizens. This investigation was considered a slam-dunk case and their officials were interviewed by the FBI. But then the Trump Justice department just stopped pursuing it.

They could have cleaned house any time in the past four years. It's telling they're only making moves now.
 
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