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.Detective.

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,660
The dream of a four-day work week is no longer unthinkable.

But could it actually be a panacea for a country looking to rebuild a post-corona economy?

That idea recently got a boost when New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern floated it, as a way to help the country as it reopens following the lockdown due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

And it may not be as far-fetched as it would have seemed just a few months ago, before the shutdowns, which brought Canada, New Zealand and many countries around the world to a standstill.

"This is an opportunity to redesign the way we do things to make them better in the long run," said John Trougakos, an associate professor at the University of Toronto's Rotman School of Management.

Prof. Trougakos has been researching how to make workplaces and people healthier and more productive for more than 12 years, and said four-day work weeks could be beneficial.

It's important to look at pros and cons and to be flexible, he said, adding this is a good time to consider new approaches to work.

"More forward-thinking companies should start thinking about it now," he said, noting it's a good time to shake-up preexisting dynamics. "People are open to the fact that change is happening."

The status quo work week of Monday to Friday, 9 a.m. to 5 p.m. roughly dates back to the Industrial Revolution and the Ford assembly line in the early 1900s.

"We've never really changed that," Prof. Trougakos said, noting that an overhaul is overdue. The way people work is more sedentary and digital now and involves a gamut of other changes in the Western world.

And the current model isn't necessarily ideal. Prof. Trougakos estimates that stress and burnout costs North American companies about $3 billion to $6 billion a year.

"There's not a one-size-fits-all solution," he said, but a four-day work week could be a good fit in some cases.

Chris Higgins, professor emeritus at Western University's Ivey Business School, said a compressed four-day work week could be suitable for white-collar employees.

"It's perfect for white collar," Prof. Higgins said. "Everybody will love it."

However, for blue-collar workers the idea of four 10-hour work days a week is more problematic, he said, noting some of them could get more fatigued, leading to more accidents and sick leave.

Still, he estimates that for about 30 or 40 per cent of the population four-day work weeks could be doable and beneficial.

In 2018, Perpetual Guardian, a New Zealand estate planning business, moved to the shortened week and found productivity rose and employees, who had more time for families and hobbies, were happier.

Likewise, Microsoft Japan tested the idea in August 2019 and saw productivity rise by 40 per cent and electricity and paper costs fall.

In the meantime, Prof. Trougakos said Canada is in a transitional phase and if handled well, could emerge with a new workplace culture beneficial for employees and companies.

Being flexible and open to options is an approach that Ardern also supports.

"This is an extraordinary time and we should be willing to consider extraordinary ideas," she said.

So New Zealand, Canada and iirc, The Nordic countries, are potentially looking at and researching this.

nationalpost.com

'Everybody will love it': A four-day work week could help rebuild Canada's economy post-COVID-19, experts say

Could long weekends actually boost productivity, make people happier and help the post-corona recovery? Now's the time to consider options
 

Deleted member 6056

Oct 25, 2017
7,240
Ok...if they move to 4 day work weeks on top of all the rest I'll seriously stop ignoring all the job offers to get me into canada on a work Visa piling up in my inbox. Got a lot of power plant and industrial experience and theyve been trying to catch my eye for a few years with recruiters.
 

shaneo632

Weekend Planner
Member
Oct 29, 2017
28,987
Wrexham, Wales
I work for myself and I'm considering switching to 4-day weeks. It would mean working up to 10 hours a day instead of a maximum of 8, though, which I'm not sure my mind is cut out for every day. I do feel so much more refreshed when I have 3 days off, though.

As I have the freedom to experiment I think I'm gonna try it soon.
 
OP
OP
.Detective.

.Detective.

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,660
Something to keep in mind, and it makes sense that these talks/research are accelerated now, is the oncoming automation factor in the near or not too distant future. Will Monday thru Friday jobs even be a thing or necessity?
 

Deleted member 13645

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
6,052
I work for myself and I'm considering switching to 4-day weeks. It would mean working up to 10 hours a day instead of a maximum of 8, though, which I'm not sure my mind is cut out for every day. I do feel so much more refreshed when I have 3 days off, though.

As I have the freedom to experiment I think I'm gonna try it soon.

You could try doing the schedule that some companies do where they do 9 hours Monday-Thursday, and then have every other Friday off. Might be a happy medium if 10 hours feels too long.
 

lemming

Member
Oct 27, 2017
219
I wished I could be given the option to work 4x8hs and get 80% of my base salary instead of 5x8 or 4x10.
This would imply downsizing consumption habits (to enable this kind of shift), but I feel it is the way to go for better work/life/health balance.
 

kiaaa

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,844
I'd love 4 10s if it wouldn't completely eat into any free time I have M-Th. I'd be leaving work at 4-4:30 which means crazy traffic and I'd be getting to the gym at peak hours. I'd probably have to give up some sleep to make it work. Dunno if having Fridays off is worth it at that point.
 

Evolved1

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,619
Those are the best.

Wish it would be standard or at least a option in the US....

I remember working like that few years back at a different job....was quite nice having 3 full days off.
It is nice. And that's even with having a long commute (1.25 hr each way) added to the 10 hr shift, I still prefer that third day off each week. I wouldn't go back to 8 hr shifts. 3 days off is just better. But I'm single w/o kids though. I could see such long days being difficult on certain families and such. Idk, it's awesome for me.
 

Zekes

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,700
I work for the BC Public Service and we have an additional day off every other week (luckily mine is Friday). It would be hard to go back
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,820
Used to work 2 different jobs that had 4 day work weeks that were 10 hours a day.

Compared to my job now where I work mostly 8 hours 5 days a week it was torture. I guess if your job isn't too intensive it's fine but OMG working at amazon and the tree service was an absolute nightmare. I'd spend that extra weekend day mostly sleeping and recovering from the torture I went through during the week.

Then the feeling of dread I'd get that last weekend night. Fuck that shit. Adjust the pay to let people work 8 hours those 4 days. Fuck that 10 hour bullshit.
 

Moist_Owlet

Banned
Dec 26, 2017
4,148
Honestly 40 hrs a week is too much no matter how it's split up. Make the max 32 hrs per week but give everyone a pay raise so they make the equivalent of 40 hrs a week. Billionaires will hate it but fuck them.
 

Zorg1000

Banned
Jul 22, 2019
1,750
"However, for blue-collar workers the idea of four 10-hour work days a week is more problematic, he said, noting some of them could get more fatigued, leading to more accidents and sick leave."

As a blue collar worker, I fully embrace the idea of a 4 day work week.
 

ScoutDave

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,297
"However, for blue-collar workers the idea of four 10-hour work days a week is more problematic, he said, noting some of them could get more fatigued, leading to more accidents and sick leave."

As a blue collar worker, I fully embrace the idea of a 4 day work week.

I would love it as well. I just dont see how its possible. A lot of our work is between 8-12 hour days and 6 sometimes 7 days a week cause we have schedules to maintain and we have to get projects done before winter and the ground freezes. Cutting our time would mean many projects would drag on a lot longer.
 

Retromess

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Nov 9, 2017
2,039
I work, and have worked, an office job that does 4 10s for over four years now. I love it.

There was a time when this job made me do 5 8s and it sucked. That extra day off is sooooo worth the extra two hours a day, you don't even really notice it.

My current shift is 6am - 4pm and man it feels great getting off that early and having a third weekend day.

(But it's a contact position in the US so eyyyyy no healthcare or benefits or anything to speak of so give and take)
 

Minthara

Freelance Market Director
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
7,903
Montreal
At the very least more Canadian job providers should provide people the option of 4 days at 10 hours or 5 days at 8 hours. In all honesty, we should move away from 40 hours as a whole and push towards 35 hours as standard full time expected work. In a perfect world, those 5 hours of pay that would be missing would instead be spread out over the 35 hours to even it out.

I think giving people a mandatory amount of hours is stupid to begin with.
 

Deleted member 6056

Oct 25, 2017
7,240
I just now finished up a forced16 day straight run that was swing shift daylight to midnight with half the shifts worked 12hours.
During outage last year it was mandatory 6 days no set amount of hours. Minimum 10 but up to 16 hours. I worked something like...68 or 78 days straight before a day off. It was a major outage so there was no ducking it.

Industrial work is do what needs done. It takes YEARS to train folks to be competent backup in these fields and were goin through retirement cycles losing folks. I am one of those guys they gotta make work. Essential was my life before covid.

First chance I get to crossover into instrumentation and control for a regular schedule I'm done with this schedule and never looking back. If canada could pay me my current wage at that 4 day 10hr schedule though I'd be done now and would immigrate.

All this lifestyle because animators arent paid shit and have no rights.
 
OP
OP
.Detective.

.Detective.

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,660
At the very least more Canadian job providers should provide people the option of 4 days at 10 hours or 5 days at 8 hours. In all honesty, we should move away from 40 hours as a whole and push towards 35 hours as standard full time expected work. In a perfect world, those 5 hours of pay that would be missing would instead be spread out over the 35 hours to even it out.

I think giving people a mandatory amount of hours is stupid to begin with.

I need to dig it up, but there was a study a couple years ago(from a company who was also experimenting between 4 day work weeks or 6 hour work days) that showed the total amount of hours definitely had a tangible impact, and not only just the days.

So for example, 6 hours was found to be the most productive period of time where people got the most work done. But it was dependent on the start or finish time. Some folks take a bit longer in the AM to get their "engine" revved to maximum efficiency, so starting 2 hours later, and going for 6 hours was optimal for them. However others saw a drop off in productivity during the last 2 hours of the day. So starting on time, but finishing 2 hours earlier than normal, in a 6 hour work day, was perfect for them.
 

Darryl M R

The Spectacular PlayStation-Man
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,721
I'm really going to end up relocating to Canada in the future, aren't I?

Sigh..
 

Zorg1000

Banned
Jul 22, 2019
1,750
I would love it as well. I just dont see how its possible. A lot of our work is between 8-12 hour days and 6 sometimes 7 days a week cause we have schedules to maintain and we have to get projects done before winter and the ground freezes. Cutting our time would mean many projects would drag on a lot longer.
True but I guess an ideal scenario if a 4 day work week becomes standard would be increased concessions for people working Friday or Saturday. Like maybe Friday automatically becomes time and a half (even if you didn't work 40 hours yet) and Saturday became double time.

Idk how feasible that exact scenario would be, just throwing out ideas.
 

ScoutDave

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,297
True but I guess an ideal scenario if a 4 day work week becomes standard would be increased concessions for people working Friday or Saturday. Like maybe Friday automatically becomes time and a half (even if you didn't work 40 hours yet) and Saturday became double time.

Idk how feasible that exact scenario would be, just throwing out ideas.

Yeah its definitely interesting to think about for us blue collar folk. I agree it would be cool. Im having a hard time thinking how feasible it would be. Hopefully they have some plans for such a thing so we dont get "left behind" so to speak.
 

Zorg1000

Banned
Jul 22, 2019
1,750
I need to dig it up, but there was a study a couple years ago(from a company who was also experimenting between 4 day work weeks or 6 hour work days) that showed the total amount of hours definitely had a tangible impact, and not only just the days.

So for example, 6 hours was found to be the most productive period of time where people got the most work done. But it was dependent on the start or finish time. Some folks take a bit longer in the AM to get their "engine" revved to maximum efficiency, so starting 2 hours later, and going for 6 hours was optimal for them. However others saw a drop off in productivity during the last 2 hours of the day. So starting on time, but finishing 2 hours earlier than normal, in a 6 hour work day, was perfect for them.
So would a middle ground of starting 1 hour later and ending 1 hour earlier be the best option?
 

kiaaa

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,844
"However, for blue-collar workers the idea of four 10-hour work days a week is more problematic, he said, noting some of them could get more fatigued, leading to more accidents and sick leave."

As a blue collar worker, I fully embrace the idea of a 4 day work week.

Yeah, my problem with 4 10s would not be fatigue.
 

Syranth

Member
Oct 28, 2017
962
You could try doing the schedule that some companies do where they do 9 hours Monday-Thursday, and then have every other Friday off. Might be a happy medium if 10 hours feels too long.
I have that type of job. It works really well so long as they let you manage your time where you can stop at 80 hours.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,710
I love the idea but I know my work would just bleed into the new day off and I'd end up working more hours for no extra pay. Attorney. But for others it sounds fantastic.
 

Elfgore

Member
Mar 2, 2020
4,564
Ok...if they move to 4 day work weeks on top of all the rest I'll seriously stop ignoring all the job offers to get me into canada on a work Visa piling up in my inbox. Got a lot of power plant and industrial experience and theyve been trying to catch my eye for a few years with recruiters.
If this happens I'd double my attempts to move to Canada.
 

BadWolf

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,148
So... is there an actual chance of this happening or is this just wishful thinking?
 

Heshinsi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,092
We've been 4/3 at my work place for over a year and half now, and it's been great. Time to get the rest of the country on board.
 

Dreavus

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Jan 12, 2018
1,728
So... is there an actual chance of this happening or is this just wishful thinking?

Reading the article, they're just floating ideas. Basically New Zealand Mentioned it and some Canadian professors think it could help, and people are open to changes like this because of the pandemic. I'd have liked to see something a little more concrete but I guess you have to start somewhere. Now is the time for these kind of shifts for sure.
 

BadWolf

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,148
Reading the article, they're just floating ideas. Basically New Zealand Mentioned it and some Canadian professors think it could help, and people are open to changes like this because of the pandemic. I'd have liked to see something a little more concrete but I guess you have to start somewhere. Now is the time for these kind of shifts for sure.

Thanks, fingers crossed I guess :/
 

Feep

Lead Designer, Iridium Studios
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,596
I'm currently running my team at four tens. Seems to be popular, though if people want to do five eights I have no problem with that. So far, no one has taken the option.
 

subpar spatula

Refuses to Wash his Ass
Member
Oct 26, 2017
22,084
imagine working 8 hours a day for 5 days straight and then someone says,"hey, how about you work 10 hours a day for 4 days! wouldn't that be better?" no. it would not. cut down on overall hours, keep the same pay, hire more people. stop overworking individuals. most people sit around doing nothing all day anyway.
 

Zoe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,238
10 hour days suck, and productivity definitely takes a hit in my office.
 

vivftp

Member
Oct 29, 2017
19,753
Hell yeah! And give us universal basic income too! šŸ˜ƒ

... And let me keep working from home too!