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Trojita

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,721
So there is a double whammy of diplomatic issues between Poland and Israel. Poland's Prime Minister has cancelled trips to
to Israel following comments by Israeli counterpart Benjamin Netanyahu.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-47272718
Mr Netanyahu was quoted in Israeli media as saying "Poles co-operated with the Germans" during the Holocaust.
He later issued a clarification saying he was not referring to the Polish nation or all Polish people.

and then this happened

https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news...-summit-over-anti-semitism-comments-1.6941574

Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu appointed Katz as interim foreign minister on Sunday. The same day, in an interview to Israel's i24 News Katz said: "I am the son of Holocaust survivors, we will never forgive and never forget, and there were many Poles who collaborated with the Nazis."

He continued to quote former Prime Minister Yitzhak Shamir, saying: "Shamir said that every Pole suckled anti-Semitism with his mother's milk. Nobody will tell us how to express out stance and how to honor the dead."

Poland's prime minister said Monday that if Israel doesn't apologize for comments made by its interim foreign minister on Poland's involvement in the Holocaust, Poland will cancel its participation in the Visegrad summit taking place in Israel on Tuesday.

Morawiecki told reporters Monday that Israel's interim Foreign Minister Yisrael Katz's remarks were "racist and unacceptable" and that "this is not something that can be left without a response."
 

Kolx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,505
Considering how much shit the poles got from Nazis, you can stick that up your rotten ass with every statement coming out of your disgusting mouth you fucking asshole.
 

Amalthea

Member
Dec 22, 2017
5,671
3QHs.gif
 

Ac30

Member
Oct 30, 2017
14,527
London
Fuck you, asshole. Millions of Eastern European's (especially the Poles) were murdered by the Nazi regime.
 

LukeOP

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,749
Weren't many non Jewish Polish people and other Slavs thrown in concentration camps during WW2? Is the Israel government trying to redefine history?
 
Jun 3, 2018
26
User Banned (Permanent): Inflammatory generalisations in a sensitive thread, new account in junior phase
I think there is still a lot of emotional trauma from the Holocaust, even to this day. The fact is while not all Poles collaborated with the Nazis, a very VERY large amount did, and did so with satisfaction.

The comments are wrong, but as a Jew and a third generation Holocaust Survivor, who's entire family were sent to Concentration Camps deported from Poland, fuck Poland's feelings.

Why should I care about their feelings after what happened to six million of my people, Poland is very well documented about their cruelty and times of collaboration with Nazis. Anyone here doubting me should do a google.

Plus I'll leave this here: https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/feb/02/poland-holocaust-free-speech-nazi

'[QUOTE ...What he has in mind is, for example, Jedwabne, where in 1941, one half of the town murdered the other half, the non-Jewish Poles turning on their Jewish neighbours – people they'd known for ever, people they had sat next to in school – eventually herding hundreds of them into a barn and burning it to the ground. All told, they murdered 1,600 people. Only seven of the town's Jews survived....Jedwabne is a singular case, but of the 3.2 million Jews who were murdered in Poland a sizeable number died at the hands not of Nazi Germans but of their fellow Poles. In Hunt for the Jews, the Polish-born historian Jan Grabowski estimates some 200,000 Jews met their end that way. His meticulous mining of the archive revealed a damning picture. Grabowski found case after case of Jews who had escaped the ghettoes and fled into the forests, only to be handed over to the Nazis by the Polish villagers who found them. Some Poles were coerced into taking part in this hunt for the Jews, but others were eager volunteers. The historian found documents that told how Bronisław Przędział, from the village of Bagienica, found two Jews while searching the woods near his home. After he betrayed them, Przędział demanded his reward from the German occupiers: 2kg of sugar. The rate varied. In some places it was 500 złoty for every Jew. Elsewhere it was two coats, formerly worn by Jews, for each Jew brought in. ][/QUOTE]

So yeah, again, let's not pretend that Poland were saints here. They also recently put a new law in Poland regarding their involvement in the Holocaust. They know fully what they did, and instead of owning up they hide away from their history. They can go fuck themselves.
 
Last edited:

Henrar

Member
Nov 27, 2017
1,905
I think there is still a lot of emotional trauma from the Holocaust, even to this day. The fact is while not all Poles coloobrated with the Nazis, a very VERY large amount did, and did so with satisfaction.

The comments are wrong, but as a Jew and a third generation Holocaust Survivor, who's entire family were sent to Concentration Camps deported from Poland, fuck Poland's feelings.

I would like a source for "a very large number".
 

Kernel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,859
Weren't many non Jewish Polish people and other Slavs thrown in concentration camps during WW2? Is the Israel government trying to redefine history?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Witold_Pilecki

During World War II, Pilecki volunteered for a Polish resistance operation that involved being imprisoned in the Auschwitz concentration camp in order to gather intelligence and later escape.While in the camp, he organized a resistance movement and informed the Western Allies of Nazi Germany's Auschwitz atrocities as early as 1941.He escaped from the camp in 1943 after nearly 2½ years of imprisonment.

Sometimes willingly.
 

Ac30

Member
Oct 30, 2017
14,527
London
I think there is still a lot of emotional trauma from the Holocaust, even to this day. The fact is while not all Poles coloobrated with the Nazis, a very VERY large amount did, and did so with satisfaction.

The comments are wrong, but as a Jew and a third generation Holocaust Survivor, who's entire family were sent to Concentration Camps deported from Poland, fuck Poland's feelings.

Bruh, the Nazis treated the Poles like filth. While some certainly harboured anti-Semetic feelings (like all of Europe at the time really) I'd love to see some stats for that "very VERY large amount" of collaborators seeing as they killed over 2 million non-Jewish Poles.
 

Mockerre

Story Director
Verified
Oct 30, 2017
630
I think there is still a lot of emotional trauma from the Holocaust, even to this day. The fact is while not all Poles coloobrated with the Nazis, a very VERY large amount did, and did so with satisfaction.

The comments are wrong, but as a Jew and a third generation Holocaust Survivor, who's entire family were sent to Concentration Camps deported from Poland, fuck Poland's feelings.

You do understand that Poland was under occupation/divided between Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union during WW2 and that 6 million Poles died during that period? Your family may have been deported from the territory of Poland, but that was not by the will of the legitimate Polish government or people.
 

Kernel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,859
My family helped hide Jews from the Nazis and were almost caught on a number of occasions.

They should read about casualties in Poland and about the Warsaw uprisings if they think the country at large just went along with Hitler.
 
Jun 3, 2018
26
Read this, then we can talk about how the poor poles were under Nazi occupation.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/feb/02/poland-holocaust-free-speech-nazi


'....For this seeks to cast Poles as blameless in the slaughter that took place in their midst, to hand them a "certificate of virginity", in the words of Konstanty Gebert, a journalist for Gazeta Wyborcza whose most recent column dared prosecutors to come after him. "I hereby state," he wrote, "that numerous members of the Polish nation are co-responsible for certain Nazi crimes committed by the Third Reich."
What he has in mind is, for example, Jedwabne, where in 1941, one half of the town murdered the other half, the non-Jewish Poles turning on their Jewish neighbours – people they'd known for ever, people they had sat next to in school – eventually herding hundreds of them into a barn and burning it to the ground. All told, they murdered 1,600 people. Only seven of the town's Jews survived.

Jedwabne is a singular case, but of the 3.2 million Jews who were murdered in Poland a sizeable number died at the hands not of Nazi Germans but of their fellow Poles. In Hunt for the Jews, the Polish-born historian Jan Grabowski estimates some 200,000 Jews met their end that way. His meticulous mining of the archive revealed a damning picture. Grabowski found case after case of Jews who had escaped the ghettoes and fled into the forests, only to be handed over to the Nazis by the Polish villagers who found them. Some Poles were coerced into taking part in this hunt for the Jews, but others were eager volunteers. The historian found documents that told how Bronisław Przędział, from the village of Bagienica, found two Jews while searching the woods near his home. After he betrayed them, Przędział demanded his reward from the German occupiers: 2kg of sugar. The rate varied. In some places it was 500 złoty for every Jew. Elsewhere it was two coats, formerly worn by Jews, for each Jew brought in..'

Go do research.

The history is very clear. The Nazis may have invaded Poland, but the killing of Jews was very much done without Nazis ever laying a helping hand in Poland.
 

FeliciaFelix

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,778
Sounds like the Poles had a case of "surely the party leopards wont eat MY face". But it's been 60 years, I think things have changed.
 

Qikz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,469
Bibi is insane. I still don't understand how he's still in power, but hearing from my Israeli step brother he's the least insane of all of them which is worrying.
 

VeryHighlander

The Fallen
May 9, 2018
6,376
"Fuck Poland's feelings" oh wow now I've heard everything.

At this point Israel can say and do anything they want. How the fuck did this happen
 

Irminsul

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,034
Jedwabne is a singular case, but of the 3.2 million Jews who were murdered in Poland a sizeable number died at the hands not of Nazi Germans but of their fellow Poles. In Hunt for the Jews, the Polish-born historian Jan Grabowski estimates some 200,000 Jews met their end that way.

[...]

The history is very clear. The Nazis may have invaded Poland, but the killing of Jews was very much done without Nazis ever laying a helping hand in Poland.
According to your own sources 6 % of all Jews killed in Poland were victims of Poles. Your own research thus doesn't support your ridiculous conclusion.
 

Severance

Member
Oct 27, 2017
398
Uh, after the Jews were exterminated the Poles were next. I think sometimes people forget Hitler was waging genocide on the Poles as well. Were there some who helped Nazis? Yes. Just like you can find examples of Jews who assisted the Nazis. All throughout history you will find people who went against their own country and people in the hopes of saving themselves and their family. Never works out, but when all is lost, people will try anything.
 
Oct 25, 2017
2,431
Approximately 1.8 - 2.7 million ethnic Poles (eg Poles of non-Jewish descent) died during World War 2.

Just putting it out there.
 

VeryHighlander

The Fallen
May 9, 2018
6,376
Uh, after the Jews were exterminated the Poles were next. I think sometimes people forget Hitler was waging genocide on the Poles as well. Were there some who helped Nazis? Yes. Just like you can find examples of Jews who assisted the Nazis. All throughout history you will find people who went against their own country and people in the hopes of saving themselves and their family. Never works out, but when all is lost, people will try anything.
Exactly. But we're witnessing a new rewriting of history where even the invaded are being persecuted. It's fucking unreal.
 
Oct 26, 2017
2,237
It is fascinating how the Israeli government has come to be known for being such bigots. "every Pole"... fuck off.

As someone from the UK I am grateful for the Polish people for their fight against the Nazi regime, especially in their contribution in the Battle of Britain. Without them the Nazis would have been successful in their invasion of the British isles and with it the foothold the allies had in Europe would have been gone.
 

higemaru

Member
Nov 30, 2017
4,098
Read this, then we can talk about how the poor poles were under Nazi occupation.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/feb/02/poland-holocaust-free-speech-nazi


'....For this seeks to cast Poles as blameless in the slaughter that took place in their midst, to hand them a "certificate of virginity", in the words of Konstanty Gebert, a journalist for Gazeta Wyborcza whose most recent column dared prosecutors to come after him. "I hereby state," he wrote, "that numerous members of the Polish nation are co-responsible for certain Nazi crimes committed by the Third Reich."
What he has in mind is, for example, Jedwabne, where in 1941, one half of the town murdered the other half, the non-Jewish Poles turning on their Jewish neighbours – people they'd known for ever, people they had sat next to in school – eventually herding hundreds of them into a barn and burning it to the ground. All told, they murdered 1,600 people. Only seven of the town's Jews survived.

Jedwabne is a singular case, but of the 3.2 million Jews who were murdered in Poland a sizeable number died at the hands not of Nazi Germans but of their fellow Poles. In Hunt for the Jews, the Polish-born historian Jan Grabowski estimates some 200,000 Jews met their end that way. His meticulous mining of the archive revealed a damning picture. Grabowski found case after case of Jews who had escaped the ghettoes and fled into the forests, only to be handed over to the Nazis by the Polish villagers who found them. Some Poles were coerced into taking part in this hunt for the Jews, but others were eager volunteers. The historian found documents that told how Bronisław Przędział, from the village of Bagienica, found two Jews while searching the woods near his home. After he betrayed them, Przędział demanded his reward from the German occupiers: 2kg of sugar. The rate varied. In some places it was 500 złoty for every Jew. Elsewhere it was two coats, formerly worn by Jews, for each Jew brought in..'

Go do research.

The history is very clear. The Nazis may have invaded Poland, but the killing of Jews was very much done without Nazis ever laying a helping hand in Poland.
Two populations can be affected by a plague of nationalism. It is entirely possible for Polish people and Jewish people to have both been destroyed by a war without one's trauma taking away from the others'.

I think the main issue is that bibi's government doesn't have a leg to stand on morally since they keep blowing the legs off of Palestinians. Netanyahu really needs to go.
 

Richter1887

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
39,146
Netanyahu continues to be trash. Fucking asshole.
Many poles were killed by the nazi regime, many of them being jews as well.

The fact this piece of shit is saying things like that and yet still being supported is disgusting. Fuck him.
 

Potterson

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,408
Well, not every Pole but... a lot of us, for sure.

Just after these news I see many people responding in VERY anti-semitic style on social media. Like, even praising holocaust. "Light" anti-semitism (like using stereotypes about greedy Jews in everyday conversations: "Don't be a Jew") is quite strong in Poland so I'm not VERY mad about this choice of words.

But still. A bit too much.
 

rakhir

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
104
User Banned (Permanent): Anti-semitism generalising the education of Jewish people, low post count account in junior phase
Were there Poles who helped Jews? Sure, but it was rare,
You are such a hateful, ignorant fool. You show exactly how Jews are informed about their history nowadays...
Poles are the biggest group among Righteous among Nations.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Righteous_Among_the_Nations

Poles were killed for helping Jews, but many still did it. Yes, there were parts of the country where this wasn't the case, but this was never the whole nation.

France public gathered their Jews themselves and send them on trains, without Nazis help, but nobody ever seem to talk about this. nothing like that was ever a norm in Poland.
 

VeryHighlander

The Fallen
May 9, 2018
6,376
Netanyahu continues to be trash. Fucking asshole.
Many poles were killed by the nazi regime, many of them being jews as well.

The fact this piece of shit is saying things like that and yet still being supported is disgusting. Fuck him.
Here in this very thread we have people supporting what he said. Not just any place on this internet, but HERE. There's a point where "support" turns into "worship". People will jump through hoops and run through traffic to protect Israel's honor.
 
Thread rules, read before posting

Redcrayon

Patient hunter
On Break
Oct 27, 2017
12,713
UK
Official Staff Communication
There is plenty to discuss here, but that discussion cannot happen if posters are only interested in venting rage and provoking each other. Do not make inflammatory generalizations about whole countries. Do not attack other posters in personal terms. Adhere strictly to the substance of the topic and avoid metacommentary.

Given the potential for this thread to go off the rails, we will be moderating as tightly as necessary to keep things civil.
 

weekev

Is this a test?
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,213
When the rhetoric from supposed leaders is so full of hatred why do we expect followers to be any different? Truly shameful.
 

LukeOP

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,749
So I'm not up to current events between Israel and Poland, but why is Netanyahu prosecuting Poland? It seems out of left field.
 

Deleted member 21012

User requested account closure
Member
Oct 28, 2017
171
Yisrael Katz was not sensible in his affirmation, but you're trying to erase what Jews went through in Poland - being murdered even after WW2, in Kielce, in 1968, the indifference of the Poles to the Ghettos, Jedwabne - and this is a sentence of resentment. There is no amount of numbers or revisionist history you will be able to push when 90% of Polish Jews were exterminated during the Holocaust.

Also, it should be noted that being anti-Semitic and being anti-Nazi could be perfectly come together. Many of the Kielce-like pogroms were not made due to Nazi ideology, but by anti-Semitic feelings and willingness to plunder Jewish property.
 

Deleted member 21012

User requested account closure
Member
Oct 28, 2017
171
So I'm not up to current events between Israel and Poland, but why is Netanyahu prosecuting Poland? It seems out of left field.



Nor Israel or Netanyahu are prosecuting Poland. Warsaw cancelled their part on the Visegrad Meeting that was supposed to be hosted by Israel due to the Israel FM comments.
 

Latpri

Banned
Apr 19, 2018
761
Wasnt Poland complaining recently about the term "Polish Death Camps" being used frequently and they stated it was in an attempt to confuse Polands involvement in the Holocaust
 

Irminsul

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,034
So I'm not up to current events between Israel and Poland, but why is Netanyahu prosecuting Poland? It seems out of left field.
I think it's mostly due to a new law in Poland that basically says Poland had nothing to do at all with the Holocaust and any argument to the contrary is violating that law. It was introduced because the current government of Poland is a bit nationalistic (well, more than a bit) and thus wants to have Poland portrayed in a better light. One example that sparked the initiative behind the law was calling Auschwitz a "Polish Death Camp", which I can actually kind of understand. That doesn't eradicate Poles collaborating with the Nazis and thus the law is still heavily misguided at best, but it's not like Poland as a country had any kind of say in the matter during WW II.
 

LukeOP

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,749
I think it's mostly due to a new law in Poland that basically says Poland had nothing to do at all with the Holocaust and any argument to the contrary is violating that law. It was introduced because the current government of Poland is a bit nationalistic (well, more than a bit) and thus wants to have Poland portrayed in a better light. One example that sparked the initiative behind the law was calling Auschwitz a "Polish Death Camp", which I can actually kind of understand. That doesn't eradicate Poles collaborating with the Nazis and thus the law is still heavily misguided at best, but it's not like Poland as a country had any kind of say in the matter during WW II.

Now things are making sense. I don't see this deescalating anytime soon given the rise of nationalism in Poland.

Shit is going to get bad.
 

kambaybolongo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,029
The comments in this thread so far, compared to the Ilhan Omar thread, shine a really harsh light on this forum. His comments are disgusting and no foreign minister should be allowed to keep their job after saying something like that.
 

Sykdom

Banned
Feb 12, 2019
993
California
What else were the poles capable of doing, nearly every western country had a hand in the holocaust if not indirectly in their laws on accepting refugees. I have old family in France still and they hid "jews" (it really didnt matter what (religion/race/creed) you were at that point, pick something and they'd kill you for it. It was just about helping your fellow man survive).


I always felt like this scene summed up how the western powers handled the holocaust.
 

gaugebozo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,827
Of course there was anti-Semitism in Europe at that time, but painting Poland as willing Nazi collaborators is incredibly insulting considering Polish contributions to fighting the Nazis, and the personal sacrifices of millions of Poles.

My grandfather was the US liaison to the Polish Army. His job was to smuggle Polish troops who had been conscripted into the German Army out of occupied Poland so they could fight for the Allies. He personally ran a safe house and saw people literally crawl in starving but eager to fight the Nazis. Tens of thousands of Poles left the German Army at great personal risk and went on to fight in the North Africa campaign, Monte Casino, and other places in Europe. Something like half a million Poles fought for the Allies.
 

Kain

Unshakable Resolve - One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
7,599
I remember there were documents in the Auschwitz museum that detailed how all the polish should be eradicated through gettos and famine and how the USSR and Germany would divide the land and would repopulate it with their people. They started to do both but the resistance was fierce, thankfully.

So yeah.
 

Noodle

Banned
Aug 22, 2018
3,427
Considering how much shit the poles got from Nazis, you can stick that up your rotten ass with every statement coming out of your disgusting mouth you fucking asshole.

This is more a case of LetThemFight.gif. Poland's far-right government has introduced a law that "criminalises the false attribution to the Polish state or nation of complicity in the crimes committed by Nazi Germany during the Holocaust" and used it to target academics in a bid to white-wash their history.

https://www.resetera.com/threads/po...tide-of-abuse-against-auschwitz-museum.40925/
 

GaimeGuy

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,092
What the fuck?

Millions of non-jewish poles dies at the hand of the nazis, as did millions of jewish poles. In fact, I think only Belarus lost a higher % of its population in WW2. Poland suffered massively, and it's direspectful to Polish Jews to not count them among the Poles killed.

Regardless of the fuckery going on today with the right wing governments in poland and Israel, this is just tactless
 

Gundahar

Member
Oct 27, 2017
25
Europe
Polish nationalism of the 1930s and 1940s was often quite racist (and to some extent still is). That's why Jedwabne, Kielce, Radziłów, Szczuczyn, Wąsosz & other Polish-led pogroms against Jews happened. And that's why Narodowe Siły Zbrojne, Obóz Narodowo-Radykalny ABC, Ruch Narodowo-Radykalny Falanga & similar organizations murdered Jewish people.
No whitewashing of history can change that.
 

Baji Boxer

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,376
You are such a hateful, ignorant fool. You show exactly how Jews are informed about their history nowadays...
Poles are the biggest group among Righteous among Nations.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Righteous_Among_the_Nations

Poles were killed for helping Jews, but many still did it. Yes, there were parts of the country where this wasn't the case, but this was never the whole nation.

France public gathered their Jews themselves and send them on trains, without Nazis help, but nobody ever seem to talk about this. nothing like that was ever a norm in Poland.
Also can't forget American company IBM's role:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_during_World_War_II
 

jeelybeans

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,948
Really upsetting when the holocust wasn't that long ago and Zionists today use it to sow seeds of hate...