Idk his anyone can come from that and think that lol. I can confortably say Sony's launch may be light but the launch window from December 2020 to december 2021 will be pretty busy based on what was shown.
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Eurogamer: Microsoft still hasn't made the case for Xbox Series X
- Thread starter SharpX68K
- Start date
I agree that neither MS nor Sony have made a great case to buy their new console as soon as it launches.
The potential for both has been shown, and there are games coming to both that are absolute must-haves for me.
But, I have seen extended gameplay of games running on an actual PS5, using features that separate this new console from
others before it (Ratchet and Clank), while with MS yesterday, I saw a bunch of trailers, "early looks", etc and really missing
any actual gameplay running on the XSX. My largest issues is that MS spent this entire gen playing catchup from their
disastrous unveiling of the Xbox One. Phil has worked to turn the entire ship around, and I had hoped that starting this fall,
we were going to see the fruits of all his labors.
But yet again, the potential is there, but it's "coming later". I want to reach the point where MS is actually there, releasing big 1st
party games regularly, that take advantage of their new hardware. Right now, that looks to be in about 2 years.
So....I'll probably still buy both next gen systems this fall if I can find them in stock. I always want the new shiny things in
videogames, and GP+BC on Xbox, along with possibly some upgraded last gen games in the next year (like Cyberpunk), make the
case good enough for me...I guess...but I wish I was more excited that I am right now.
One of the games that really made me go WTF yesterday was Forza new game. I only play the Horizon series of that, but hasn't the last Forza game been out for years? Isn't that the only game that studio makes? If so, what in the hell have they been doing since they finished their last game? Why is it "early in development" with a brief trailer showing not much of anything off? Stuff like that drives me crazy. You put all this work in for years to turn things around at MS, and then at next gen launch time, the fruits of those labors are STILL not being shown off in reality. I'm impatient. I want this future vision of first party at MS this year. But again, we wait. The day will come, and then this will probably all be moot going forward, but damn the wait has been crazy for them to get to this point!
The potential for both has been shown, and there are games coming to both that are absolute must-haves for me.
But, I have seen extended gameplay of games running on an actual PS5, using features that separate this new console from
others before it (Ratchet and Clank), while with MS yesterday, I saw a bunch of trailers, "early looks", etc and really missing
any actual gameplay running on the XSX. My largest issues is that MS spent this entire gen playing catchup from their
disastrous unveiling of the Xbox One. Phil has worked to turn the entire ship around, and I had hoped that starting this fall,
we were going to see the fruits of all his labors.
But yet again, the potential is there, but it's "coming later". I want to reach the point where MS is actually there, releasing big 1st
party games regularly, that take advantage of their new hardware. Right now, that looks to be in about 2 years.
So....I'll probably still buy both next gen systems this fall if I can find them in stock. I always want the new shiny things in
videogames, and GP+BC on Xbox, along with possibly some upgraded last gen games in the next year (like Cyberpunk), make the
case good enough for me...I guess...but I wish I was more excited that I am right now.
One of the games that really made me go WTF yesterday was Forza new game. I only play the Horizon series of that, but hasn't the last Forza game been out for years? Isn't that the only game that studio makes? If so, what in the hell have they been doing since they finished their last game? Why is it "early in development" with a brief trailer showing not much of anything off? Stuff like that drives me crazy. You put all this work in for years to turn things around at MS, and then at next gen launch time, the fruits of those labors are STILL not being shown off in reality. I'm impatient. I want this future vision of first party at MS this year. But again, we wait. The day will come, and then this will probably all be moot going forward, but damn the wait has been crazy for them to get to this point!
It was exactly that, Sony had a Ps5 presentation. MS had an Xbox Games one
They were not trying to achieve the same objective
Only examples of that are ratchet and the medium. Launch years have always gone like this but some reason people expected this year to be different lol. Also completely ignoring COVID that shit studios down and forced everyone to be at home for the foreseeable future.
This is the point that a lot of people seem to miss. Both MS and Sony are interested in getting you into their ecosystem, not necessarily selling you hardware. It just so happens that Sony's ecosystem is much more closely tied to their hardware than MS. As stated in countless other threads about Sony games coming to PC: Sony doesn't invest millions of dollars in first party games just for the sake of selling you hardware; those are a trojan horse to get you into their hardware-based ecosystem where you'll buy third party games, which is where Sony makes their real profit.
What sold you on PS5?
For me it was Horizon Forbidden West, but shortly after the event it was said to release in 2021, so I jumped back up on the fence again.
Prepaid Game Pass until 2022 is why I buy the XSX. PS5 gets bought when the games I want are out, which isn't at launch.
Microsoft, under Satya Nadella, is a "software and services" company. Services more than software as time goes on. Ten years ago, Windows was their "bread-and-butter." Now they rarely even talk about it on investor calls. They're all cloud this, Azure that, Office subscriptions, etc. Gamepass falls perfectly in-line with MS as currently configured. And it's great, I've been a subscriber to GP (and Ultimate) since day 1 and will keep that going. Not having to pay for any of the games in that show? How cool is that?
But gamers need more than just that, I think. When we get a new, shiny box, we want something (preferably multiple somethings) that will show it off. Nothing in that reveal gave the impression that investing in new hardware from MS is worthwhile. I want to see proof that they're not being held back by their strategy. Show me 4K/60fps comparison videos on YouTube. Show me Infinite on an Xbox One X compared to Infinite on a Series X. Loop in Digital Foundry! Go after the early adopters! Obviously that's not fodder for an hour-long show, and obviously COVID blew up the best-laid plans, but get on it. They have scant time to make a case, otherwise Sony has this new gen locked up. Probably a foregone conclusion anyway, even before this show.
But gamers need more than just that, I think. When we get a new, shiny box, we want something (preferably multiple somethings) that will show it off. Nothing in that reveal gave the impression that investing in new hardware from MS is worthwhile. I want to see proof that they're not being held back by their strategy. Show me 4K/60fps comparison videos on YouTube. Show me Infinite on an Xbox One X compared to Infinite on a Series X. Loop in Digital Foundry! Go after the early adopters! Obviously that's not fodder for an hour-long show, and obviously COVID blew up the best-laid plans, but get on it. They have scant time to make a case, otherwise Sony has this new gen locked up. Probably a foregone conclusion anyway, even before this show.
Agreed, I can easily wait for 2-3 years to get an SX, my X1X and PC will handle Xbox 1st party and my PS5 is gonna be my main platform.
Even with the better specs, at least show what it can do, especially when they have been boasting repeatedly about having the most powerful console.
On the contrary, I still haven't been convinced to not just wait for a PS5 bundle down the line. I'm going to own both next generation, but as somebody who plays many exclusive titles late anyways, I'm still waiting for a reason to leave Gamepass and multiplats on XSX.
They sold Gamepass as a great investment, they are wasting their slogan "most powerful console" in the mud though.
Horizon 2 and Ratchet are definitely next gen looking games.
And when looking at it that way, I think they killed it.
The Series X seems to be a "Do you want it to look it's absolute best?, how about load quicker?" machine, but the message of the show was 100% GamePass
Exacerbating this is this promise of eventual (but largely unseen) Series X exclusives in the pipeline...
In a sense, they are simultaneously threatening current-gen users that they are eventually going to need to upgrade and specifically undermining the utility of the Series X hardware by showing off these current-gen looking 1st party exclusives.
what sold me was that I could see the first year will be really good. Most of the games showed looked very mature in their presentation and the mixes of gameplay/cinematic gameplay angles and in engine renders. I'm betting we see at least 3 sony first party titles in 2021
There are people who seriously believe Microsoft's shareholders are all in on the endgame being as many $5/month Gamepass subs as Microsoft Games Studios can manage, as they spend hundreds of millions to billions on game and hardware development.
I think both companies have work to do with showing stuff but for PS5 I know I am getting at least something tangible in the way of what to expect. Miles Morales might be built off the PS4 game, but the SSD load times, 60fps (or RT) are things that weren't possible on my current Pro. Even with Astro Bot I am getting a smaller experience to show off their new controller.
Series X sounds great on its potential, but I've seen nothing really to sell me on why I need it this holiday when I have a One X. Even a list of BC enhancements that are Series X exclusive would be a push in the right direction. But I can still play Halo Infinite which doesn't seem to be a graphical powerhouse anyways and even something like Yakuza (which I can already buy on 2 consoles I own now) doesn't have explicit Series X enhancements listed beyond Smart Delivery for now. If there are things these games can do on Series X that they won't on current gen (like Miles), then Microsoft needs to show that.
The show presented me with a lot of potential but I guess that doesn't do a lot for me now when it would be great to be wowed by those 12TF in 2020.
Series X sounds great on its potential, but I've seen nothing really to sell me on why I need it this holiday when I have a One X. Even a list of BC enhancements that are Series X exclusive would be a push in the right direction. But I can still play Halo Infinite which doesn't seem to be a graphical powerhouse anyways and even something like Yakuza (which I can already buy on 2 consoles I own now) doesn't have explicit Series X enhancements listed beyond Smart Delivery for now. If there are things these games can do on Series X that they won't on current gen (like Miles), then Microsoft needs to show that.
The show presented me with a lot of potential but I guess that doesn't do a lot for me now when it would be great to be wowed by those 12TF in 2020.
I'll agree with this. After the Halo showing I might just hang on to my One X for a bit longer and jump into next gen in 2021. Not something I would have considered before, but there is nothing coming out this fall - from first or third party devs - that can't run on the One X or is convincing me it's time to jump right into next gen.
I don't think MS minds this, but still.
I don't think MS minds this, but still.
Both console makers had unconvincingly showings, there was nothing out there that made you WOW I couldn't have got this on current gen.
If anything, both shows were great pitches for sticking with/getting into PC gaming. Getting 99% of those games (plus much much more) on Steam, getting a gamepass sub, and maaaybe get a PS5 at the end of the gen for those few true PS exclusives that you really care about but still haven't got the Horizon / Death Stranding treatment.
If anything, both shows were great pitches for sticking with/getting into PC gaming. Getting 99% of those games (plus much much more) on Steam, getting a gamepass sub, and maaaybe get a PS5 at the end of the gen for those few true PS exclusives that you really care about but still haven't got the Horizon / Death Stranding treatment.
Yeah, can't disagree with this. It is part of the difference between the two companies philosophy.
I was going to buy both PS5 and XSX day one, and it might still happen, but they'll have to make a pretty strong case for it, because rn I'm just thinking of getting PS5 and keeping my XOX until next year. Don't see much reason to upgrade right away so far.
The only thing Sony have fumbled so far in my opinion is the actual look of the console. Honestly, that has made me rethink my living room and how I can hide it. From a games perspective, I think they've shown quite a few games that have extremely high fidelity albeit not quite the gap from last generation to this one, or ones before.
Microsoft on the other hand are way too focussed on saying that it's the most powerful machine without a single game to actually show it off. It's the whole value proposition for the Xbox One X all over again coupled with just pushing gamepass.
The platform strategy MS is pushing right now is actively convincing people that they don't want a new console, which is fine but it will likely hurt content moving forward.
Microsoft on the other hand are way too focussed on saying that it's the most powerful machine without a single game to actually show it off. It's the whole value proposition for the Xbox One X all over again coupled with just pushing gamepass.
The platform strategy MS is pushing right now is actively convincing people that they don't want a new console, which is fine but it will likely hurt content moving forward.
Yup. in all my studies in computer history this is the age old apple vs MS. Apple believes in a close marriage between hardware and software(which ironically enough the modeled after Sony) and MS has always been about software first and more hardware agnostic. I see The Xbox division just aligning way closer the the companies roots and their personalize hardware is optional.
This is a bad take. The idea that the powers that be at Xbox were saying "hey, Halo Infinite is slipping into next gen. What should we do? Oh, let's just say all of our games will be cross-gen for a while, like this was the plan all along" is ridiculous.
Pretty clearly MS wants to be able to support Gamepass on the widest selection of hardware possible, which includes legacy and next-gen Xbox consoles, PC, and mobile devices via Xcloud. And don't underestimate the role of Xcloud in this. MS's current Xcloud runs exclusively on last-gen Xbox One HW, and they'll only *begin* to upgrade to Series X hardware next year. But that means that the majority of their Xcloud capacity will likely be Xbox One HW for a while. And that's fine for streaming to mobile. But if they want to be able to support 100k people streaming Halo Infinite on Xcloud this winter, it has to run on legacy hardware. Same goes for all of their first-party releases until they've fully upgraded their Xcloud infrastructure to Series X hardware.
At this point in time, it really seems like the XSX is just a product directed only to the hardcore.
In fact I wouldnt be surprised if their strategy banks on Lockhart to sell much more than the XSX in the long run.
While I'm sure they appreciate concern about their business model, I'm sure shareholders, after looking at the profits Office has made moving to a subscription model, aren't as worried.
This was the trend last gen switch too. Last time, if I remember correctly, there were no big AAA games until 1.5-2 years in. There were a couple, smaller experiences, but nothing earth shattering. Third Parties kind of did the business at first, and it seems to be shaping up similarly.
But did they invest so much money in developing the XSX? Genuine question.
Obviously they did spend a lot of money in that area, but how does it compare to their investment in acquisitions and in Game Pass and xCloud?
Maybe the cash invested in the R&D for XSX is nothing compared to this (I have no clue, just throwing out some ideas).
What I mean is that for the last few years, their motto has always been about offering as many options as possible. And XSX is nothing more than one of these options (along with xCloud and Lockhart).
And since they decided (perhaps for the last time?) to offer the "high-end home console" option, they might just as well go for the most powerful one (because why not) and advertise it as such.
Because no matter how their early/cross-gen 1st party may "disappoint", nothing will ever change the fact that XSX is the most powerful console (by a slight margin, sure) and will be the place where all 3rd party games will run best - that's a fact and they would be stupid not to tout it.
... that said, while it's easy to imagine this strategy is hard to market, they absolutely need to work on the messaging.
edit:
saying "they screwed up and lost a future customer, I'm just keeping my Game Pass subscription on my X1/PC until further notice!" is really, really strange to me. That's a win for MS. It was clearly a show about Game Pass. Underwhelming and a bit frustrating, but centered around Game Pass. Compare it side by side with the PS event and it's obvious one of them was selling a console, the other one was selling a service.
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Were in a pandemic, resources are more scarce, other things have been prioritized. I don't think it's fair to not consider the context. We already knew demos and presentations take A LOT of work before any of this. Every game shown will have a full preview cycle full of a variety of trailers and gameplay showing off every aspect and feature of the game before launch, and then some.
The Souls games aren't for me so it doesn't even register on my radar.
As for the others, I thought Spiderman was fine, Horizon was fine, and Ratchet and Clank was underwhelming. Insomniac's games are usually pretty and I won't deny that, but they're a little too button mashy for my tastes. I stand by my case that none of these are (FOR ME) a surefire reason to buy into a $400+ console. These games will all be waiting for me if I choose to wait a year.
No they said series x will get an update, they just said both will get an update. Also your second doesn't make any sense to what I was implying. I meant that if people see the compromises they have to make to run on one x or one s, than hat alone might make them switch over.
I think what Sony's shown so far has been pretty good but not "Holy shit I need a PS5 now!" good. Difference is MS has a lot more to prove right now since their first party hasn't been in a good state since the Kinect days. Naturally people are gonna give Sony the benefit of the doubt.
Did Horizon show gameplay though? It was just a trailer wasnt it? Granted Ratchet showed gameplay, just not my kind of game.
You don't actually believe that all of those titles are going to make it out in the first year, without a single delay do you?
Don't get me wrong, Sony delaying games for the betterment of the game is one of their strengths, but let's not pretend that they don't do it often.
The lack of games, unique games and gameplay hurts them more than anything, but I truly believe them making every single exclusive on PC is a mistake. It's good for PC people, but what's the incentive for new hardware when all of their games still work on their old console and or a PC?
mid Lockheart is real, that will be another thing to add into the confusion.
Phil is a good dude with vision, but I'm no I sure this is how it's done.
mid Lockheart is real, that will be another thing to add into the confusion.
Phil is a good dude with vision, but I'm no I sure this is how it's done.
Jeff Grub in his checklist showed August for a second show/state of play by Sony and possibly Microsoft. Would not be surprised since they have been drop feeding info, that they have it within first to second week of August.
Maybe I'm just losing interest in gaming, but I was much more excited in 2013 for the next-gen than I am now.
I'm just going off what's been said but a delay could obviously happen.
There never really has been a case to switch to a new console at launch. EG is just being emo again.
Both consoles are incredible upgrades and the case for owning one will become clear DURING the next gen.
That being said "all the games shown are on GP day one".... WTF is EG smoking? The price you save on buying full priced games alone is worth the price of a next gen console.
Both consoles are incredible upgrades and the case for owning one will become clear DURING the next gen.
That being said "all the games shown are on GP day one".... WTF is EG smoking? The price you save on buying full priced games alone is worth the price of a next gen console.
Personally, I expect every Sony first party game they showed last month to be out by Holiday 2021. Everything they showed was by teams that haven't put out a game in years except maybe Insomniac (which must be busting their ass to have 2 launch window showcase titles so soon after Spider-Man 2018)
On a rational level the quanity diversity of games with amazing teams behind them they showed is so over the top.
on an emotional level they just did not deliver a clear message or showed any details to excited or make people talk about it.
but the offering Microsoft is preparing for next years and all of it under gamerpass is just insane and a value that is beyond ridiculous
on an emotional level they just did not deliver a clear message or showed any details to excited or make people talk about it.
but the offering Microsoft is preparing for next years and all of it under gamerpass is just insane and a value that is beyond ridiculous