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Escape From Tarkov will not feature female playable characters for "lore reasons" and a lack of animations
- Thread starter LewieP
- Start date
Even star citizen recently added female playable characters, they have a complete different posture, animations, walking animations, heights so they had to change all 100 ships to make them fit. Im glad they did so shame on you ETF
casual reminder that the vast majority of people who are going to play this game would not be able to handle being in a real combat scenario
so check yourself before you wreck yourself defending misogyny
so check yourself before you wreck yourself defending misogyny
Why do males and females even have to have separate animation for soldier movement? It feels like they are talking about stereotypical body movement when they say it's too hard to animate; swaying hips, bouncing boobs etc. But why the hell is that necessery for a war game?
GTA V is a videogame, and it was banned for sale by some of the biggest retailers in Australia solely for the reason you could assault/kill women NPC's...think about that for a second before getting so angsty.
"Even Star Citizen recently added female playable characters"...oh you mean the game that's so far received $250 million fucking dollars in crowdfunding?
What a compelling argument you put forward there, no holes in that whatsoever.
Because the lore is something they chose to act as a restriction. It's not a game engine so they shouldn't cite it as something holding them back because it's somehow immutable. This is without into going into what others have mentioned about "perfection" of the character actions not needing to be necessary. Doing a simple body swap the way thousands of games do from Mass Effect to Dark Souls isn't going to fundamentally ruin the presentation so trying to pin it on budget and resources makes it suspect.
So don't say it's about the deep lore, or that women can't be in combat. It sounds like 1940.
Straight from tweets in OP:
"...and more importantly - the huge amount of work needed with animations, gear fitting etc"
Tweet didn't end to word "lore".
Is "lore" sad excuse? Hell yes it's, but there is more and more important things to it. I'm inclined to believe that bigger deal is resources as Nikita seems to shoot it straight with Tarkov community when it comes to why something is or isn't in.
Edit: He also got pissed off when he got accused of saying that shit about women and combat.
I can maybe see a point with regards to gear fitting as that makes sense, since the dudes in Tarkov are very blocky. As for animations they can pretty much use the same animations...it's not like Tarkov has amazing animations in the first place. Women animating like men would just be one more jank in a sea of jank anyway...but it would be inclusive at the very least.
You don't have to have big boobs, big butt, jiggle physics to add women in the game.
But that whole thing about lore + women not allowed in war and women can't handle it is such a pathetic response by them.
You don't have to have big boobs, big butt, jiggle physics to add women in the game.
But that whole thing about lore + women not allowed in war and women can't handle it is such a pathetic response by them.
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Sooooo....
If Nikita "never said that!" and "totally respects" women in the military, then what are these nebulous "lore reasons" that there are no playable women in the game?
It's a rhetorical question. I'm aware that the lore reasons don't actually exist and they're frantically scribbling down some shitty backstory as we speak to explain why you can't be a girl in their game. But I'm morbidly curious to find out what that shitty backstory turns out to be and how totally respectful it will be to women in combat roles.
Also lol @ "that one employee was reprimanded for blatant misogyny while speaking on behalf of our company in an official capacity." Man I wish I had that kind of job security.
If Nikita "never said that!" and "totally respects" women in the military, then what are these nebulous "lore reasons" that there are no playable women in the game?
It's a rhetorical question. I'm aware that the lore reasons don't actually exist and they're frantically scribbling down some shitty backstory as we speak to explain why you can't be a girl in their game. But I'm morbidly curious to find out what that shitty backstory turns out to be and how totally respectful it will be to women in combat roles.
Also lol @ "that one employee was reprimanded for blatant misogyny while speaking on behalf of our company in an official capacity." Man I wish I had that kind of job security.
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So, do you have a point here or are you just trying to shift the conversation?
Who in their right mind doesn't set aside time and budget to include female character animations in a game that lets you make a custom character?
This is what I'm wondering too. I bet there's very little difference in the posture of professional male vs female runners. I reckon they're just misogynistic pricks and this is their go-to excuse when their real reason is that they think women shouldn't be soldiers (as pointed out in a couple of other interviews people have posted),
EFT doesn't let you customize your character outside of armor you put on.
Probably a dev team lacking any sort of diversity, so it isn't an immediate thought or any kind of priority.
Anyway, as long as they acknowledge that people wish to play as a female avatar and eventually implement it, cool. Just stop with the silly excuses.
Okay, but are you playing a fixed character? Someone with a name?
The best tweet i saw was one that basically said "When you start building your next game, start with the female characters then add the male characters when you have time/budget".
There's literally no good reason (money/business/target markets doesn't count) why the male characters get built/rigged/animated first.
There's literally no good reason (money/business/target markets doesn't count) why the male characters get built/rigged/animated first.
I guess then all the games with fixed protag design outside of clothes is "like Counter-Strike from a million years ago".
Edit: In ETF case you either are "BEAR" or "USEC", games two factions with both having single character model with zero face etc. modification options
User banned (2 months): sexism and condescension over a series of posts
Business and target markets don't count as a good reason? We don't live in a communist utopia yet buddy. That's a primary factor. Imagine tailoring your game to a vocal minority who don't actually play their type of game much in the first place.
This is the price they pay for their game finally blowing up I guess.
It's more the general attitude of attributing female characters, and or female protagonists as an after thought that I find incredibly tiring. Or lame excuses like lore or women can't be delinquents (in regards to Persona 5) etc.
wow this is so much worse than it seemed. the fuck kind of alternate reality are they living in.
I'm guessing there's a culture difference as the developers are in Russia.
You're surprised people are reacting to misogynistic excuses? And not once but twice. Kinda muddies the waters a tad, regardless if they say it's ultimately down to resources, don't you think?
To be clear, I think the point here is that if managed properly, it definitely doesn't cost "too much".
But it has a cost and if the point is to imply otherwise, I'm baffled. Adding ANYTHING has a cost, especially if they mismanaged and didn't plan for it.
Yes I know they should definitely get flak if they didn't because duh, why exclude women characters in the first place?
But it does have a cost, it's just a negligible one if planned properly.
these bros need to go back to school, stat.
I'm particularly ticked off by their reasoning given...
Great game, shitty statement. In beta status one player model is quite ok, but on launch they should add a female model an customization options.
Maybe the studio doensn't even care about the player model. The only time i see my strange looking bear pmc is when he gets killed and stripped of his armor.
Maybe the studio doensn't even care about the player model. The only time i see my strange looking bear pmc is when he gets killed and stripped of his armor.
From checking reddit, the community is pretty garbage.
Congrats on having a take worse than the dev's.
I met some people from the dev team in a couple of conferences (I think one was GDC) and they always gave me some weird vibe, sadly my reservations seem to be justified...
The take was already bad by itself, but the edit is what makes this post so truly bad.
Women in combat aren't children. They're trained soldiers. This isn't a very difficult concept.
So it's either A) "We don't think women can handle war as good as men" or B) "We're too lazy to do animations for female models)" or C) "Both", I'm guessing C.
Wow.. if I had a wall of shame I would frame this and hang it up there.
Wow.. if I had a wall of shame I would frame this and hang it up there.
Ok - every time I re-read your post I see more impilcit assumptions you're making, which are just bad views to have, so I made a list to try and work through them:-
Umm no they don't - there are lots of morally dubious, outright dodgy and indeed illegal businesses and target markets...so the simple fact that you can make money is not a good reason for doing anything.
1. There's a big difference between suggesting that business/money can be a bad reason to do something, and advocating for communism in one form or another.
2. Capitalism generally works but isn't great, and needs a lot of other systems bolted on top to stop it going completely bonkers.
3. I'm not sure why you called me buddy? was it meant in a friendly arm round the shoulder way, or a menacing "shut up buddy!" kind of way?
1. Which vocal minority? people who want women to stop being under-represented in games? Or women themselves? or some other minority?
2. Depending on the answer to 1, your assumption that someone in "vocal minority" doesn't play that type of game, is pretty shitty. You're either generally implying that men who want women to be represented, tend not to place this type of game...or that women don't play them*
1. What price are they paying exactly? So far the only thing that's happened to them is some awkward questions and possibly some people not buying their game....plenty of people are still buying it
2. There's an undertone of "my special thing is now popular and i don't like it being criticised" but I may be reading too much into your post...it feels like it comes across that way though.
*I missed out some sets of people here, e.g. non-binary folk in general and women who don't care about women being under-represented in games...but I wasn't clever enough to figure out a way to include them all and keep it readable!
It's a fictional video game and not an actual war so I don't understand what the point of this argument is
Plenty of miltary games have playable women, I mean ffs this is the current icon for Modern Warfare
lol. You flat out say deciding x for marketing/money doesn't count as a valid reason to do something. They have done nothing illegal or dubious, it's a small game with limited resources. Are you aware how ridiculous what you are saying is?
You're basically just saying - this is completely unacceptable because I'm not going to factor in the most important thing because subjectively I don't think that's valid. Absolute insanity. It is a good reason and you made a very stupid comment which I felt the need to reply to.
Also it's not an assumption. It's a fucking fact that the astronomically large percentage of people into games like Tarkov are male. Just like if you go to any sort of super serious airsoft shooting thing, it's all dudes. Dudes love this shit. Ladies not so much. Some do sure but it's just nonsense to say otherwise. I don't disagree it sucks for the minority of women who do enjoy this stuff that they don't feel represented, but this is a small studio and it's just not a big deal in this instance.
And I don't play tarkov and tired of this genre after the eary days of dayz. Not protective of it at all.