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ZugZug123

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,412
get a toxic 'Steam Community' board to deal with

Yep, that horrible Steam Community boards that the Epic Store exclusive Ashen had to send their users to in order to get technical support and discussions. So terrible and outdated. Why couldn't they have used something more modern like Twitter or Reddit instead of leeching off the storefront they dumped for money after having a page up for a year?
 

Echo1

Banned
Oct 25, 2018
80
Yep, that horrible Steam Community boards that the Epic Store exclusive Ashen had to send their users to in order to get technical support and discussions. So terrible and outdated. Why couldn't they have used something more modern like Twitter or Reddit instead of leeching off the storefront they dumped for money after having a page up for a year?

Developers should not be required to have often toxic boards tied to their game's sale page. No matter how many times users attempt to shame me for having this view, my view will not change. Having an official board (or not) should be a developer decision, not a requirement.
 

Deleted member 2840

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,400
Oh it's THIS guy again, that kept repeating that somehow Steam's Regional pricing is the Devil and yadda yadda.
"Widely abused" here we fucking go.
 

ZugZug123

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,412
Developers should not be required to have often toxic boards tied to their game's sale page. No matter how many times users attempt to shame me for having this view, my view will not change. Having an official board (or not) should be a developer decision, not a requirement.

When they went Epic exclusive they should have taken down their Steam store page (which for the year before they decided to get bribed out of Steam was used to build up hype for their game) and were free to ignore the related Steam community. But once the shit hit the fan and there were no better ways to engage with their customers on technical issues they had to squirrel back to Steam and use this "hated" Steam Community feature.

The handful of developers that were on Steam hyping their unreleased games and bailed for EGS when the moneybag showed up should man up and delete their entire game pages out of Steam. You don't like Steam so much, why are you there then?
 

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,956
When they went Epic exclusive they should have taken down their Steam store page (which for the year before they decided to get bribed out of Steam was used to build up hype for their game) and were free to ignore the related Steam community. But once the shit hit the fan and there were no better ways to engage with their customers on technical issues they had to squirrel back to Steam and use this "hated" Steam Community feature.

The handful of developers that were on Steam hyping their unreleased games and bailed for EGS when the moneybag showed up should man up and delete their entire game pages out of Steam. You don't like Steam so much, why are you there then?

And, additionally, for those developers who are already looking at Steam releases (SuperGiant for example, who all but named Steam as a platform Hades is coming to), the "toxic forums" obviously aren't enough of a disincentive to not release there.
 

Echo1

Banned
Oct 25, 2018
80
Oh it's THIS guy again, that kept repeating that somehow Steam's Regional pricing is the Devil and yadda yadda.
"Widely abused" here we fucking go.

Yes. This guy. Who has smart takes you disagree with, so I'm evil. Got it.

When they went Epic exclusive they should have taken down their Steam store page (which for the year before they decided to get bribed out of Steam was used to build up hype for their game) and were free to ignore the related Steam community. But once the shit hit the fan and there were no better ways to engage with their customers on technical issues they had to squirrel back to Steam and use this "hated" Steam Community feature.

The handful of developers that were on Steam hyping their unreleased games and bailed for EGS when the moneybag showed up should man up and delete their entire game pages out of Steam. You don't like Steam so much, why are you there then?

I understand your argument. I disagree it.
 

Sabin

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,623
Its always entertaining (or sad) to see how user like Echo1 are willingly running into the open knife of anti costumer companies for arbitrary reasons.
 
Oct 25, 2017
5,107
Taiwan
Or do what they are suppose to and appoint actual moderators to their forums?
Some genres do attract a bunch of toxic people, while others don't. One example is the new vegas board. Still active too.
 

DontHateTheBacon

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,383
When they went Epic exclusive they should have taken down their Steam store page (which for the year before they decided to get bribed out of Steam was used to build up hype for their game) and were free to ignore the related Steam community. But once the shit hit the fan and there were no better ways to engage with their customers on technical issues they had to squirrel back to Steam and use this "hated" Steam Community feature.

The handful of developers that were on Steam hyping their unreleased games and bailed for EGS when the moneybag showed up should man up and delete their entire game pages out of Steam. You don't like Steam so much, why are you there then?
Lol. Has a single developer said they "don't like Steam so much?"

Seems like they're just taking the better deal for themselves.

Also... since when has someone looked at a Steam page to "build hype?" What?
 

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,956
'Anti-consumer' isn't a thing. That's a Gamer term.

It's really not. Gamers have latched onto it (to a disproportionate degree, I would argue), but it's clearly not a "Gamer term". Consumer rights as we know them have been around for almost 100 years: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Your_Money's_Worth

Your Money's Worth: A study in the waste of the consumer's dollar is a 1927 nonfiction book on consumerism written by Stuart Chase and Frederick J. Schlink. It is notable for becoming popular enough to initiate a consumer protection movement.

The authors assert that market forces alone are not producing a market which serves consumers' best interests

argued that marketers of products used unfair practices in order to illegitimately coerce consumers. These practices included outright fraud in misrepresenting the quality and utility of products in advertising, promoting high-pressure sales practices, adding non-functional styling for deceptive purposes, and engineering products for planned obsolescence.[3] The book also critiqued product differentiation on superficial grounds such as when various manufacturers sell nearly identical products but with different advertising and branding because this practice drives sales to benefit the marketer without also equally increasing value to consumers.[3] Also the book complains of lack of standardization, such as when sewing machines require highly specific parts unique to each brand when the parts could have been designed to be universal.[3]

Your Money's Worth recommended that the public be skeptical about advertising claims, make some products at home, support the government in setting product standards, and support the creation of impartial testing research centers.

(quoting is broken a bit on Era)
 

GhostTrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,315
Epic is not a fly by night outfit. They are one of the most successful and most important companies in gaming period - with Unreal Engine and whatnot. Epic is not going to take your money and not give you a game. They aren't into penny antee stuff.

Feature lists are only useful for list wars. Steam has big, big problems that could be solved by culling some of those features, which is what Epic is doing - they have described as much publicity.

Steam also has lots of bloat, lots of garbage from 2004. Stuff like DVD game backups and a built in MP3 player. The entire app feels like a Windows XP time machine. Building something new and modern is a good thing to do.

What happened is that people got used to Steam, accepted it, began to like it. We should recognize that for what it is.



That's a load of misinformed stuff here.
No, features arent a list war. These are stuff people uses when they use a SERVICE.
Focus on this word: S-E-R-V-I-C-E.
And no, these features arent the issue. Reviews or boards aren't issues. They are tools. Sure, some people abuse it. But there's also abuse from devs.

And when you claim Epic fixes these issues of abuse, you're far from the truth:
So far, Epic's policy hasnt been one of fixing, but moving the problem aside and telling devs "Do it elsewhere, we dont want to touch it".
"There are toxic users on forums ? We wont have forums. No forums, no issues. Do it elsewhere." Aka Reddit or Twitter, the most toxic places on the internet.
"There are users abusing reviews (which happens less often than devs abusing it) ? There'll be no reviews if you dont want to. No review, no problem."

Lot of bloats ? How's Steam bloated ? The thing runs on Atom CPUs without pushing the CPU usage too much.
And the feature you list dont even comes off as "bloat" since they introduce no performance penalty.
Why do you complain that people can make DVD backups ?
It's an OPTION. No, it's not bloat. It's more options for people, which doesnt hurt. It can be used to make backups for any kind of drives btw.
The MP3 player isnt some "2004 era Windows era stuff". It was added recently. Dont want it ? Dont use it. If that's some Windows XP era stuff, what's Epic Games Store stuff ? Windows 95 ? Without even a search feature.

Building something new ?
That's where you start not making sense. It's not because it's new that it's good. In fact, considering that the bloat point is wrong, it's not even a problem. It's quite the opposite when your new, 2018 client cant even compete feature wise to the 2013 version of your competitor.

People didnt got "used to Steam". Steam kept improving dramatically. Steam keeps improving.
 

Echo1

Banned
Oct 25, 2018
80
Hey man, if you can live with ignorance, then by all means go ahead, but it doesn't mean you won't be criticized for your completely inaccurate take on all of this, and as a result either ignored or just not taken seriously in the future.

I am saying 'I can live with' the description that poster said: the term exists but gamers use it wrong. I am agreeing with the poster and you are being extremely nasty in response.
 

SmAsH

Member
Oct 25, 2017
122
I am saying 'I can live with' the description that poster said: the term exists but gamers use it wrong. I am agreeing with the poster and you are being extremely nasty in response.

No you are factually incorrect. You keep purporting a certain stance that people are telling you is incorrect. The term is the correct term to use and has been used beyond just "gamers". You keep pushing this angle, out of sheer ignorance. This isn't being nasty, this is me being direct about your incorrect statement. If you don't think taking games off various platforms is being anti-consumer, then I don't know what to tell you.
 

Echo1

Banned
Oct 25, 2018
80
User Banned (Permanent): Consistent trolling after recently being banned for similar behaviour. Account in junior phase.
No you are factually incorrect. You keep purporting a certain stance that people are telling you is incorrect. The term is the correct term to use and has been used beyond just "gamers". You keep pushing this angle, out of sheer ignorance. This isn't being nasty, this is me being direct about your incorrect statement. If you don't think taking games off various platforms is being anti-consumer, then I don't know what to tell you.

Yeah, you are just hostile and wrong and entitled and I won't engage with you anymore.
 

sheaaaa

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,556
I am aware, as a matter of fact, that what I am saying is the case and that there is no complexity to it - just usual Valve incompetence. No geo-location stuff. Can easily prove it.

Prove it then. Change your location from the US to a cheap country and buy a game for cheap with your US credit card.
 

GhostTrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,315
I am saying 'I can live with' the description that poster said: the term exists but gamers use it wrong. I am agreeing with the poster and you are being extremely nasty in response.



They dont use it wrong. You just lowered your standards so low that you got used to it. The whole industry did.
I mean, Online paywall is a thing in this industry. Paying for something that was free and that is supposed to be free.
We saw practices in this industry that would be trashed elsewhere.
 

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,956
They dont use it wrong. You just lowered your standards so low that you got used to it. The whole industry did.
I mean, Online paywall is a thing in this industry. Paying for something that was free and that is supposed to be free.

Yup. Even newspapers allow a certain amount of free articles before you hit a paywall, and journalism is bleeding money.
 

ZugZug123

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,412
Lol. Has a single developer said they "don't like Steam so much?"

Seems like they're just taking the better deal for themselves.

Also... since when has someone looked at a Steam page to "build hype?" What?

You build hype by engaging with a potential 90M eyeballs on Steam. Once you have an upcoming game, you start showing up on queues for people who are OK seeing those, I have a bunch of games on my wishlist that are not yet released. After you get those eyeballs you keep engaging them with Dev updates via Steam and through the Steam communities. That's how the hype is built. Something that would be way harder if they had just built some unknown website of their own. But I'm pretty sure you know about this if you use Steam even in a cursory manner, you just want to dismiss the fact some devs moneyhatted by EGS used Steam and all its features that are non-existent in the EGS to get an audience. Some were most likely targeted to be moneyhatted because of the buzz they were able to create using Steam.
 

Ge0force

Self-requested ban.
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
5,265
Belgium

RionaaM

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,852
It's 2019. I don't know why you people still bother arguing with trolls and misinformed idiots on PC threads. Just put them on ignore and pretend they don't exist.
 

brokenswiftie

Prophet of Truth
Banned
May 30, 2018
2,921
I'm pretty sure you cannot use a US credit card for buying games in the Russian or Indian Store, I've tried using an Oman card on the Indian store and they don't accept
Doesn't work even if you use a VPN
Straight up blatant false information.

You cant even change the store country without a VPN
Echo1 if you get un-banned (which I hope not because you're clearly a troll) I would like you to prove this like you claimed you could easily
 

Deleted member 3208

Oct 25, 2017
11,934
It's 2019. I don't know why you people still bother arguing with trolls and misinformed idiots on PC threads. Just put them on ignore and pretend they don't exist.
Have to admit, sometimes when I see people posting something that looks like a reply without the quote, I'm confused until I see the Show ignored content label on the bottom.
 

Syril

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,895
Boy threads can sure go places when they get one person who constantly insults everyone who disagrees with them.
 

Deleted member 1594

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,762
Just goes to show you... if something can be easily proven, maybe lead with the proof instead of insisting "it can be done for reals I swear" while acting very condescending towards everyone.
 

Deleted member 18944

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
6,944
The recent announcement from Epic Games that it would claim exclusivity on games such as Metro: Exodus and The Division 2 has ignited a fierce debate on whether or not this qualifies as good competition. Many points about how Steam pays developers compared to Epic have taken place, if having games be exclusive to stores is a good thing for the industry, etc. But something that I haven't seen been brought up enough times is just how poorly designed the Epic Games Launcher is, and how it's a major turn off (at least for me).

While I'm not saying that Steam is the pinnacle of launcher design, it does currently take the cake for being the best of the bunch, and if Epic plans to take Steam on, it should at least incorporate better design language and UI. As a result of installing some games for a LAN party only available on the Epic Game Launcher, I've run into a lot of issues with it, and I have a list.

  • NO SEARCH BAR IN THE FUCKING STORE????????????????
  • The store layout is really loud and has too much information in thrown in front of the user with too many differing colors. It's disorienting.
  • The "Home" and "Epic Games" buttons at the top go to the same place
  • The Library tab has a nice layout of your games, but there aren't any options to start the games with special parameters like you could with steam
  • The Library tab doesn't offer any different layouts to view (like a list)
  • THERE'S NO FUCKING SEARCH BAR IN THE LIBRARY TAB, HELLO?
  • The friends tab is actually just a pop out window, and this is annoying. Steam does it too.
  • When you hover over your status, you can't change it. You have to click on it.
  • Only two options for status - Online and Away. Where is the offline status?
  • Managing display name is done through external website
  • No communities tab for any of the games
  • No review section for games
  • No profile customization
Epic's game launcher has been around for a while now, so having basic functionality like a search bar and offline statuses, a way to submit user reviews, and more, shouldn't be slept on and should have already been in the launcher itself. It's cool that Epic is giving developers a better revenue deal, but lacking basic features makes me not want to use the launcher at all, and if others feel the same, that's bad news bears for those exclusive titles.

Are there any issues with the current launcher that you have that I haven't listed?
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,497
A few developments on the backend stuff of EGL - First, regional pricing additions:



Some users are still reporting weird pricing and additional processing fees, but:

fOeFwj1.jpg


Additionally, Tim Sweeney has stated that offline mode is in the works:



Both of these are small but very important steps!

EDIT: It should also be noted that, according to several posters EGL has regional pricing in their area while Steam does not. That is precisely the sort of thing I feel Epic should do to make their service attractive over Steam. If they're able to work out getting access to marketplaces that currently can't purchase from their store at all, then that's a major criticism completely addressed.
 
Last edited:

Deleted member 42

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
16,939
god exactly how much shit are they freaking working on

this is like rapid-fire weird, really slipshod kinda deal
 

Pixieking

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,956
At this point, I'd be tempted to buy from the Epic Store if a) they didn't have full-exclusives, and b) I could request a Steam key for those games that are on Steam (or will be on Steam in the future). Basically, get rid of the shit exclusives and be a combination of Origin and Humble. Because quite honestly, I'd want Steam for Offline mode if nothing else, and with no timetable for when that is going live...
 

texhnolyze

Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,175
Indonesia
Is the EGS store really doesn't work in offline mode? That's something, especially since they're selling lots of single player games now. I get it that they developed it with Fortnite, an online game, in mind. But now things have changed.
 

Gabbo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,567
god exactly how much shit are they freaking working on

this is like rapid-fire weird, really slipshod kinda deal
Wasn't that one of the biggest complaints at launch, that it was so barren feature wise? I mean, they're jumping all over the place, but it's been what, a month and a few days? It's rapid progress in this space.
 

Deleted member 42

user requested account closure
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
16,939
Wasn't that one of the biggest complaints at launch, that it was so barren feature wise? I mean, they're jumping all over the place, but it's been what, a month and a few days? It's rapid progress in this space.

I'd say it was either the main complaint or the 2nd main one after the exclusive stuff
 

Marukoban

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
2,298
I'd say it was either the main complaint or the 2nd main one after the exclusive stuff

The store layout is also damn terrible, probably the worst for video game digital store by far.
All the icons and information are so jumbled up that it's hard to make out the information and which info correlate to which game.
 
Nov 8, 2017
13,111
god exactly how much shit are they freaking working on

this is like rapid-fire weird, really slipshod kinda deal

It's extremely clear the business / dealmaking side of things is well ahead of the technical / implementation side. The epic store has been around for ages but the plans to pivot it into a service that will challenge steam must have been comparably recent since a lot of the deals seem like the ink is barely dry and the store + client has an embryonic feature set. You can rush deals, but it takes much, much longer to build out your features.