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Who is your favourite character?

  • Paul Atreides

    Votes: 336 37.9%
  • Duncan Idaho

    Votes: 246 27.7%
  • Alia Atreides

    Votes: 67 7.6%
  • Leto II

    Votes: 165 18.6%
  • Darwi Odrade

    Votes: 10 1.1%
  • Miles Teg

    Votes: 16 1.8%
  • Other (specify in thread and why)

    Votes: 47 5.3%

  • Total voters
    887

Excuse me

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,012
Started to read Dune again, I started with the second book since it's been around 20 years since I last read it... It wasn't all that. I mean it got pretty good towards the end, where they started to build upcoming events but overall fairly boring. Still long way to God Emperor of Dune and Chapterhouse: Dune that were my favorites 20 years ago (after first book). Will see if they hold up. Second book most certainly didn't, well the other half of the book was fairly good.

I even ordered the dune prequel books by Herbert JR. Never read them but I heard they are good if you are big Dune fan.
Dune: House Atreides (1999)
Dune: House Harkonnen (2000)
Dune: House Corrino (2001)
 

Alice

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,867
Started to read Dune again, I started with the second book since it's been around 20 years since I last read it... It wasn't all that. I mean it got pretty good towards the end, where they started to build upcoming events but overall fairly boring. Still long way to God Emperor of Dune and Chapterhouse: Dune that were my favorites 20 years ago (after first book). Will see if they hold up. Second book most certainly didn't, well the other half of the book was fairly good.

I even ordered the dune prequel books by Herbert JR. Never read them but I heard they are good if you are big Dune fan.
Dune: House Atreides (1999)
Dune: House Harkonnen (2000)
Dune: House Corrino (2001)

Whoever told you they're good definitely has it out for you. Especially if you're a big Dune fan they're mostly trash.
 

THErest

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,091
Started to read Dune again, I started with the second book since it's been around 20 years since I last read it... It wasn't all that. I mean it got pretty good towards the end, where they started to build upcoming events but overall fairly boring. Still long way to God Emperor of Dune and Chapterhouse: Dune that were my favorites 20 years ago (after first book). Will see if they hold up. Second book most certainly didn't, well the other half of the book was fairly good.

I even ordered the dune prequel books by Herbert JR. Never read them but I heard they are good if you are big Dune fan.
Dune: House Atreides (1999)
Dune: House Harkonnen (2000)
Dune: House Corrino (2001)

Second book is my least favorite. It's like an inter-chapter, showing how Dune itself didn't have a "happy" ending while setting up Children of Dune.
God Emperor is my favorite sequel, so kudos to you on that.

Brian Herbert is a hack and a fraud. I wouldn't touch those books again, not even to shred them.
 

Excuse me

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,012
Whoever told you they're good definitely has it out for you. Especially if you're a big Dune fan they're mostly trash.
Well there are big fans and big fans. I read Babylon 5 books and they are trash, but it's still B5 and it's all I can get. So I'm well aware that Herbert JR's books are going to be more or less trash but it's all I can get :( And they at least are somewhat based on Herbert's original manuscripts so maybe there is even little bit of gold there.

edit. BTW was House of Ordos VG thing only? was it mentioned in any Dune books? Kinda odd if they made up entire house instead of using already existing smaller houses.
 
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Alice

Banned
Nov 2, 2017
5,867
Well there are big fans and big fans. I read Babylon 5 books and they are trash, but it's still B5 and it's all I can get. So I'm well aware that Herbert JR's books are going to be more or less trash but it's all I can get :( And they at least are somewhat based on Herbert's original manuscripts so maybe there is even little bit of gold there.

I doubt they are. So many things in them contradict other parts of the actual books...
 

Bora Horza

Member
Oct 27, 2017
478
Scotland
I have the New English Library versions of the original trilogy, but does anyone have the others ones? I am seeing a couple of different versions and not sure which ones to purchase to get the full set. God Emperor of Dune seems to have 2 different versions.
 

Kensuke

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,393
Netherlands
dune.jpg

Saw this edition yesterday in a book store and was very tempted to pick it up. The outer edges of the pages are blue and it looked cool. It was pretty expensive at 40 bux though.
 

FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,856
Metro Detroit
Well there are big fans and big fans. I read Babylon 5 books and they are trash, but it's still B5 and it's all I can get. So I'm well aware that Herbert JR's books are going to be more or less trash but it's all I can get :( And they at least are somewhat based on Herbert's original manuscripts so maybe there is even little bit of gold there.

edit. BTW was House of Ordos VG thing only? was it mentioned in any Dune books? Kinda odd if they made up entire house instead of using already existing smaller houses.
If it's any consolation. I really enjoyed Paul of Dune contrary to all the complaints about the non Sr. books.
 

LProtagonist

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
7,561
Really glad I decided to keep going with the Dune books after having read the first one a long while back. I always heard the sequels were bad, but I loved Dune Messiah and I'm enjoying Children of Dune. Will probably take a break to read some other stuff after God Emperor as people say that one is really great, but I'll most likely come back to the last two from Herbert at some point.
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,478
I don't like Messiah much but it introduces a lot of important elements for the rest of the series. The children, gholas, tleilaxu, etc.
 
OP
OP
luca

luca

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,490
Oscar Isaac says Denis has found the intensity and brutality of the books for his movie:

 

Fritz

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,718
Some of the Lynch imagery actually forced them into weird corners. Like the bene Gesserit in Lynch were so good - cruel, formal, ascetic, elegant without being fussy and the TV show versions so flimsy and weird and gaudy. Stillsuits, Atreides architecture and heraldry, so much became definitive - there were low points too, I didn't like the Harkonnen city and interiors (Costumes were interesting tho) and the Sarduakar were probably the only truly inexcusable costume in the whole film.

Giedi Prime seems to be a remnant of Giger's vision. It's not what I would have taken from the books but I think it's kinda effective in being so repulsive. The Sardaukar were trash I agree
 

Biske

Member
Nov 11, 2017
8,253
Just finished Dune. Pretty great ride. Really different kind of book that I expected (not sure what I expected) but it's also very different compared to many in the genre even in terms of character and villains and how things wrap up.

It's interesting how in the end the Harkonnens and folks like the Baron, Feyd and Rabban are just all dipshits easily disposed of, dunno how I really feel about that, by the time Paul gets to taking care of Feyd I much rather would have seen Gurney do it and have that tension. Obviously Paul can't fail and the main meat of the book is a Superman like "what can happen to the people around him tension. So would have been great if Paul's revenge is kept to fucking over everybody, the Empire, the Guild etc and Gurney gets to deal with the Harkonnens.

But I really liked it.
 

Trago

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,600
I have been reading the first book for the very first time lately, and damn, I can't believe I never made time to give it a go. I'm sort of experiencing this phenomenon of noticing how other science fiction properties may have taken inspiration from this book which is insane. I'm a huge Star Wars fan, so I wouldn't be surprised if Lucas was a fan of this book.

I've been reading the book in anticipation of the upcoming film, and I gotta be honest, I'm a little worried because I'm struggling to figure out how Denis will pull it off. Im not very familiar will the production of the film, but there's A LOT that the film is gonna have to establish and make sense for a film audience.

I used to get the sense from fans of the novels that Dune is basically unfilmable, and I'm starting to understand why. That being said, Denis is one of the very best working directors out there.

Maybe they can extend the runtime to three hours.
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,478
Books 1-2-3 are absolutely filmable, pretty hard but the narrative structure isn't messed up
Filming book 4 will never happen for obvious reasons :P
 

AuthenticM

Son Altesse Sérénissime
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
29,970
God-Emperor would work as a limited series, and so would Heretics and Chapterhouse.
 

MadScientist

Member
Oct 27, 2017
917
I still think Dune lends itself better to a TV series where each book is a season (or two). A TV series would allow things to breathe a bit. And when I say TV series, I'm not talking about what SyFy did, but an actual HBO or Netflix well budgeted TV series. I'm just worried movie 1 won't do well and we'll either not get the second half or a much cheaper second movie. I also feel that a well produced TV show would get us to the other books like "Children of Dune" which is probably my second favorite of the series. Doubt we'll get here via movies.
 

Maledict

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,073
Well there are big fans and big fans. I read Babylon 5 books and they are trash, but it's still B5 and it's all I can get. So I'm well aware that Herbert JR's books are going to be more or less trash but it's all I can get :( And they at least are somewhat based on Herbert's original manuscripts so maybe there is even little bit of gold there.

edit. BTW was House of Ordos VG thing only? was it mentioned in any Dune books? Kinda odd if they made up entire house instead of using already existing smaller houses.

Brian Herbert claiming to have 'found' manuscripts in his dads attic outlining those novels will always be a bad joke. It's a lie from start to finish. His books are terrible - please just ignore and avoid them!

if you want more Dune, pick up a copy of the Dune Encyclopedia. It's out of print as Brian H doesn't want it contradicting his shitty novels, and it's non-canon - but Frank Herbert really enjoyed it and it's a fantastic read. That's where House Ordos came from in the first place I think.
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,646
Where do you all think the first movie will break?

The alleged leaked script said

after the water of life scene.

Books 1-2-3 are absolutely filmable, pretty hard but the narrative structure isn't messed up
Filming book 4 will never happen for obvious reasons :P
I don't know about that. Books 2 and 3 are just a bunch of endless talking heads with no real action or excitement. The talk is always about how Dune is unfilmable, but having read all three books recently I think the sequels are much "worse" in that regard. I really don't see how they translate into mainstream blockbusters. At least Dune has a mostly classic Hero's journey.
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,478
The alleged leaked script said

after the water of life scene.


I don't know about that. Books 2 and 3 are just a bunch of endless talking heads with no real action or excitement. The talk is always about how Dune is unfilmable, but having read all three books recently I think the sequels are much "worse" in that regard. I really don't see how they translate into mainstream blockbusters. At least Dune has a mostly classic Hero's journey.
That's possible but also extremely late, what could they even put in a second film ?
Unless it's Jessica's scene, not Paul's.
 

Trago

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,600
I think by "unfilmable", I really mean there's seemingly a lot of material to adapt, and I'm not even finished with the first book.
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,478
I think by "unfilmable", I really mean there's seemingly a lot of material to adapt, and I'm not even finished with the first book.
You also have a lot of shit like the weirding way, the prescient dreams, and mind fuckery that comes later. Especially the water of life scene for Jessica, for instance.
 

RDreamer

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,102
The reason Dune is considered unfilmable is because a lot of main conflict and character growth comes via thought, and that's hard to translate to screen because you need to portray it visually or through dialogue instead.

It also breaks a lot of conventions after the first book and would be hard to translate to a big blockbuster. A lot of set pieces require budget and you don't get that budget without, well...promising excitement. Dune is more contemplative.

But the first book is very filmable. It's pretty damned traditional sci-fi overall.
 

LiQuid!

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,986
After a lifetime of absorbing bits of pieces of Dune thru its adaptations (the film, the Scifi minis and video games) I've finally cracked open the book and read a few chapters. I could see how this would be a bit much if you went in completely unfamiliar with Dune but since I know a lot of what happens up thru the first 4(ish) books and am familiar with a lot of the terminology of the universe, I'm finding it a pretty brisk read. Haven't loved most of Villeneuve's movies, but hard not to get excited for someone taking a crack at adapting this franchise again.

Thanks for that Quinn's Ideas video in the OP too btw. Cool channel that I immediately added to my subs. Really enjoying digging thru a lot of his other videos. They don't seem drawn out or click baity at all. Just the kind of channels I love to support
 

TheXbox

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 29, 2017
6,547
That's possible but also extremely late, what could they even put in a second film ?
They need to worry about making a single film first. In terms of telling a coherent story in the space of two hours, the end of Part II is the most satisfying and the most logical place to end the film (except the end of Part III, of course).
It gives the film enough time to establish the Fremen cast and it fulfills Paul and Jessica's assimilation into the Fremen world. I don't recall any other moments of serious payoff or emotional resonance in Part 2 besides the spice orgy. Everything else is setup and action.

If they ever get around to a second film, I've always maintained that you can adapt Part III of Dune and Dune Messiah in a single feature. Messiah is the shortest novel in the series and Part III is obviously a fragment of one book, but together they complete Paul's tragic arc. Messiah has always felt more like a coda to Dune than a proper sequel anyway; in terms of scope and structure, Children of Dune is the first real follow-up to Dune.
 

FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,856
Metro Detroit
After a lifetime of absorbing bits of pieces of Dune thru its adaptations (the film, the Scifi minis and video games) I've finally cracked open the book and read a few chapters. I could see how this would be a bit much if you went in completely unfamiliar with Dune but since I know a lot of what happens up thru the first 4(ish) books and am familiar with a lot of the terminology of the universe, I'm finding it a pretty brisk read. Haven't loved most of Villeneuve's movies, but hard not to get excited for someone taking a crack at adapting this franchise again.

Thanks for that Quinn's Ideas video in the OP too btw. Cool channel that I immediately added to my subs. Really enjoying digging thru a lot of his other videos. They don't seem drawn out or click baity at all. Just the kind of channels I love to support
I went in cold and yea it takes a while to warm up to what is going on. Just on the first page there are so many names, places, rituals, etc. with strange names that the reader has no context for.
 
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BlackSalad

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,222
I've always thought that it'd be interesting for a film adaptation to start with God Emperor and move backwards through time and the story. God Emperor is so strange and intriguing that I think prequels explaining how the universe of Dune ended up with the emperor would be a good way to tell the story
 

Tuorom

Member
Oct 30, 2017
10,888
I've always thought that it'd be interesting for a film adaptation to start with God Emperor and move backwards through time and the story. God Emperor is so strange and intriguing that I think prequels explaining how the universe of Dune ended up with the emperor would be a good way to tell the story

But then you don't have the shock of what Leto II does, and what Paul didn't want to do.

I didn't really like Children until Leto II was like you know what will create the Golden Path of humanity? Slipping some trout on my appendages so they create an impermeable and superhuman exoskeleton for me to become a God. That was a real mindfuck tbh, and I wouldn't want that spoiled at the start.

There is a nice progression into what the consequences of prescience are through the novels. It goes from a man becoming a self fulfilling prophecy, to a potential to become an abomination, to prescience being a detriment to human progress. imo no point in trying to change it up despite what the God Emperor proclaims.
 

Biske

Member
Nov 11, 2017
8,253
I just finished Dune Messiah.

I get why people don't like it, and its a very strange novel. Almost pure political plotting, which I don't know what it was like before it came out but must have been STRIKING as fuck to people who loved the first Dune and were expecting something different.

But I actually loved it. You really get a glimpse into how tortured and fucked Paul really is. Having his powers would certainly be a curse.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,384
The reason Dune is considered unfilmable is not because of the monologues, really (thought partly!). It's because the book is written in third person omniscient rather than the more typical third person limited or first person. Third person limited has been the standard for genre fiction for a long time, with first person being less common, but growing in the last few years (especially Young Adult novels, which are now over 50% first person, mostly present).

Dune is sci-fi's big third person omniscient (Hobbit is the same, for fantasy). Being third person omniscient means that we get to see the inside motivations for each character. Normally you only see one person per novel, or more rarely one per scene. In Dune we see inside every person's head in every chapter/scene. Basically we are god and can see everything going on inside them. Unlike the Hobbit where there is a pretty simple story with pretty simple character motivations, Dune has a convoluted political plot so a lot of time needs to be spent on it. You could definitely reduce Dune to a more conventional story and eliminate all of the internal stuff though, it would just be less interesting.

So it's not so much the monologues as the entire internal experience of the characters!
 

Alastor3

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
8,297
Help me get into Dune's book. I love sci-fi but im not used to read long huge books. Plus my attention span is so small nowadays
 

Deleted member 11069

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,001
Brian Herbert claiming to have 'found' manuscripts in his dads attic outlining those novels will always be a bad joke. It's a lie from start to finish. His books are terrible - please just ignore and avoid them!

if you want more Dune, pick up a copy of the Dune Encyclopedia. It's out of print as Brian H doesn't want it contradicting his shitty novels, and it's non-canon - but Frank Herbert really enjoyed it and it's a fantastic read. That's where House Ordos came from in the first place I think.

I wish I could find the Dune Encyclopedia.
This is pretty much the only Book where I keep buying different versions of it. I really want the one that has the old Illustrations in it. Not the Sam Weber stuff.
 

Tuorom

Member
Oct 30, 2017
10,888
Help me get into Dune's book. I love sci-fi but im not used to read long huge books. Plus my attention span is so small nowadays
Try doing a chapter a day before bed. Before you know it you'll be half way through and 600 pages won't feel particularly long. Dune is like a medium sized book I'd say. Long huge books are like 900+ such as Stormlight Archives, Kingkiller Chronicles. I love it.

Dune has a very heavy first like 1/4 where a lot of the worldbuilding is laid out, so once you get past that it follows Paul more closely and becomes faster paced.
 

Vommy

Chicken Chaser
Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,918
Help me get into Dune's book. I love sci-fi but im not used to read long huge books. Plus my attention span is so small nowadays
Take your time. Just like a good meal or drink, don't rush it. It will pick up as soon as you are hooked. Enjoy this great masterpiece :)))
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
We are Teg bro's Bro!

Although I hope that when my deep seated Atreides memories and latent abilities are resurfaced it is not through exquisite pain of a T-Probe torture, but maybe in the aftermath of the next most painful thing. Stubbing my toe on the metal coffee table when getting up early for work, or perhaps kneeling on a lego in the shag carpet in the basement. Or both.

"As Stinkles lay coiled on the shag carpet, the rectilinear imprint of the preternaturally sharp lego block still outlined in visceral crimson lines on his alabaster Atreides knee, he howled a primal stream of physically impossible curse words. Through the fog of pain, he could vaguely make out the retort of the Honored Matre, Mrs. Stinkles "Bashar Stinkles, you cannot say those words in front of little Stinkles. She will be traumatized by this. You're going to put her in therapy before she's even in middle school. And those swears don't even make sense. You can't do that with a butthole and there's no such thing as a Dong-kebab."

The Bashar Stinkles ignored the vile witch's Voice powerful command, concentrating purely on surviving this Lego. His toes still throbbed from its unexpected collision with the ugly metal coffee table, and even through the lens of the yellow plastic block's evil ministrations, his foot felt like a bag of broken Fabergé eggs and human teeth, crying from the deepest pit of hell.

But somewhere, a still voice called to him through the ages and the agony. Quiet at first, fainter than the witch upstairs, but growing in power. He became aware at once of a series of choices ahead, each an infinite corridor, like a hall of mirrors presented by something deep in his genetic memory. "Man up" it said, "Rise now Stinkles. Take the righteous path."

When the two pajama shrouded Witches - the girl and her mother, watched Stinkles rise from his pain prison, his movements were a smooth blur of motion and colorfully implausible Scottish swearing. Even with their Honored Matres training and reflexes, they were too slow to stop his ferocious tirade, as he clutched his knee and foot, hopping at supernatural speed around the room, invoking the Litany Against Fear, "I must not kneel. Legos are in the rug. Legos are the dad-killer. I shall wear slippers, step carefully and look for blocks. Let the Lego pass under me. And only I shall emerge. Human."

At the speed Stinkles moved, the witches heard only "Slippin-Rippin-Dang-Fang-Rotten-Zarg-A-Barg-A-Ding-Dong!!!!"

By the time Stinkles exited the Honored Matres modest single family home, the interior was a charnel house of bacon smells and dirty breakfast dishes.
 

Deleted member 11069

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,001
Although I hope that when my deep seated Atreides memories and latent abilities are resurfaced it is not through exquisite pain of a T-Probe torture, but maybe in the aftermath of the next most painful thing. Stubbing my toe on the metal coffee table when getting up early for work, or perhaps kneeling on a lego in the shag carpet in the basement. Or both.

"As Stinkles lay coiled on the shag carpet, the rectilinear imprint of the preternaturally sharp lego block still outlined in visceral crimson lines on his alabaster Atreides knee, he howled a primal stream of physically impossible curse words. Through the fog of pain, he could vaguely make out the retort of the Honored Matre, Mrs. Stinkles "Bashar Stinkles, you cannot say those words in front of little Stinkles. She will be traumatized by this. You're going to put her in therapy before she's even in middle school. And those swears don't even make sense. You can't do that with a butthole and there's no such thing as a Dong-kebab."

The Bashar Stinkles ignored the vile witch's Voice powerful command, concentrating purely on surviving this Lego. His toes still throbbed from its unexpected collision with the ugly metal coffee table, and even through the lens of the yellow plastic block's evil ministrations, his foot felt like a bag of broken Fabergé eggs and human teeth, crying from the deepest pit of hell.

But somewhere, a still voice called to him through the ages and the agony. Quiet at first, fainter than the witch upstairs, but growing in power. He became aware at once of a series of choices ahead, each an infinite corridor, like a hall of mirrors presented by something deep in his genetic memory. "Man up" it said, "Rise now Stinkles. Take the righteous path."

When the two pajama shrouded Witches - the girl and her mother, watched Stinkles rise from his pain prison, his movements were a smooth blur of motion and colorfully implausible Scottish swearing. Even with their Honored Matres training and reflexes, they were too slow to stop his ferocious tirade, as he clutched his knee and foot, hopping at supernatural speed around the room, invoking the Litany Against Fear, "I must not kneel. Legos are in the rug. Legos are the dad-killer. I shall wear slippers, step carefully and look for blocks. Let the Lego pass under me. And only I shall emerge. Human."

At the speed Stinkles moved, the witches heard only "Slippin-Rippin-Dang-Fang-Rotten-Zarg-A-Barg-A-Ding-Dong!!!!"

By the time Stinkles exited the Honored Matres modest single family home, the interior was a charnel house of bacon smells and dirty breakfast dishes.

haha. The lego litany brought this home where all the quality shit post live in harmony.